Economy Jobs:4-6-07 Duke mythbusting study shows hiring of foriegn Engineers all about Corporations saving money

[Bowfinger]

Originally posted by: Train

Originally posted by: Bowfinger
...
That means we're still more than 7 million jobs short of where we started
...

7 Million ? thats some hella math you got going there! Whats the unemployment rate again? Oh yeah, lower than it ever was under Clinton.

Get back to me after you've taken basic Math and Economics courses. Reading an objective, well-researched article about our current employment situation would also be helpful. (And for the record, your comment about Clinton's unemployment rate is intentionally deceptive. This is also known as a lie.)

 

[charrison]

Originally posted by: Bowfinger

Originally posted by: Train

Originally posted by: Bowfinger
...
That means we're still more than 7 million jobs short of where we started
...

7 Million ? thats some hella math you got going there! Whats the unemployment rate again? Oh yeah, lower than it ever was under Clinton.

Get back to me after you've taken basic Math and Economics courses. Reading an objective, well-researched article about our current employment situation would also be helpful. (And for the record, your comment about Clinton's unemployment rate is intentionally deceptive. This is also known as a lie.)

Actually todays unemployment rate is about the same as when clinton entered his 2nd term.

 

[Bowfinger]

Originally posted by: charrison

Originally posted by: Bowfinger

Originally posted by: charrison

Originally posted by: Bowfinger

Originally posted by: burnedout
More positive job news:

US intelligence agencies face staffing shortage
[ ... ]
Best Buy currently hiring 100-120 in Springfield, OR

That is certainly an encouraging list. By my rough, in-my-head tally, that's somewhere around 13,000 new jobs. Great news!

... but ...

We lost somewhere around 3 million jobs during the first 3 years or so of the Bush administration. I believe we are finally back under a million net jobs lost, maybe even down to 500K or so. Unfortunately, on the average, those jobs do not pay as much as the jobs lost. Many full-time jobs were replaced with part-time jobs. In short, the new jobs aren't as good as the jobs lost.
[ charrison: ] This has debunked by factcheck.org and posted here many times. BUt that does not stop you libs from parroting false data.

I call BS. Please back up your claim, because it contradicts every non-Bush report I remember.

[ charrison: ] linkage

I think we can put this one away. However I have no doubt, you and other will continue false claims. Wages are up, after inflation since Bush took office.

ROFL. Did you read you own link?

• 
  "Since Bush took office, the middle-income group has declined by 1.2 percentage points , and now constitutes less than 45% of all households.
  
  "At the same time, households with less than $25,000 in income have grown by 1.5 percentage points, and now make up 29% of all households. So a large number of households have slipped out of the middle group and into the lower-income range over the past three years.
  
  "Furthermore, that process did not stop in 2003 despite the resumption of job growth in September and 4.4% growth in the economy as measured by Gross Domestic Product. The middle-income group lost 0.4 percentage points in 2003."
  
  
  "But even so, median income has declined by $1,535 since Bush took office , or 3.4 percent. And while the decline leveled off last year and may even be climbing again in 2004, most households are clearly worse off economically now than they were when the President was sworn in."
  
  
  "Another indication that the middle class continued to shrink in 2003 is the increase in the number and percentage of persons living in poverty. According to the Census Bureau, the number of people living below the official poverty line grew by 1.3 million in 2003, to 35.9 million. That's nearly 4.3 million more poor persons than when Bush took office , an increase of nearly 14%."
  
  
  "We of course can't say what the Census Bureau figures will say next year about what is happening to income and poverty rates in 2004. We do know that employment has been growing all year, so more people have jobs. Average wages are rising, too. But prices have been rising even faster -- especially for food, health care and fuel."
  
  
  "On the other hand, we do know that another 1 million persons were without health insurance in 2003. Since Bush took office, the number without health insurance has grown by 5.2 million, to 45 million."

And finally, to directly address your claim, "Wages are up, after inflation since Bush took office.", here is what your article says:

• "It is true that over the past year those hourly earnings have not kept pace with inflation, so "real" wages (adjusted for higher prices) have indeed fallen over the past 12 months. In that sense Kerry was correct."

Yep, I'd say that puts it to rest.

Even worse, the break-even point for the U.S. job market is adding about 140,000 jobs per month. This is necessary to keep pace with a growing population as new people enter the job market. In order to maintain the same relative level of employment as when Bush started, we needed to add about 6.7 million jobs. That means we're still more than 7 million jobs short of where we started. Those 13,000 new jobs you list fill less than three days worth of demand.

[ charrison: ] Well bls keeps reporting that more people are employed today, than 4 years ago. Once again, parroting false data

We discussed this many times before. You continue to offer the same deceptive stats in a misguided compulsion to divert any criticism of the Bush administration. The BLS Household Survey counts a person as "employed" if they worked even one hour during the survey period. Neighbor give you $5 to watch her kids? Congratulations, in the Bushies' brave new world of rightspeak, you are now employed! Don't spend it all in one place.

:roll:

[ charrison: ] You right and you still continue to ignore the data. More people are still employed today. The BLS has always reported those that at working and those that are marginally attached to jobs. These numbers have not radically changed and still well below 30 year averages.

Please back this up. The BLS survey stats I've checked don't differentiate between the people who still have full-time jobs and the people who are now underemployed, grabbing a few bucks here and there through odd jobs, That is the whole point.

Yes, it is good news. It is also scarcely a drop in the bucket.

While the bucket may not be running over like it was when it was powered by a bubble economy, it is surely more than a drop.

I agree the economy continues its slow, faltering recovery. It is much better than it was two years ago. In absolute terms, however, it is still quite weak, and it is not out of danger by any means.

This economy is not faultering, it is doing quite well.

With all due respect, please read all the words. I said the recovery is faltering. Some months the economy's stats are good; others they're bad. This is the definition of "faltering".

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: Train

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
...
Don't worry, I'll be knocked offline at least during the day as this job contract is ending in exactly 1 month.

Still looking for a new job.

you get contracts to post on P&N all day? sheesh

Oh that's right, some folks still don't get the concept of multiple windows open at once.

 

[charrison]

linkage

wages up 2.5% aftter inflation since 2001.

A final note: Readers may wonder how household incomes can be down 3.4% under Bush if wages are up 2.5%. That seems contradictory, but it isn't. The wage figures (hourly earnings) cover only about 80% of the private-sector workforce, excluding supervisors, managers and all government employees, self-employed persons and business owners. And even more importantly, the Census figures on household income include not only wages but income from many other sources, including interest and dividends, bonuses, and earnings from self-employment and owner-operated businesses.

It is you who should be reading the entire article, not cherry picking bits.


linkage
according to bls...
Employment participation is less than 1% different than it was 4 years ago.

in 2000 there was 136M employed
today that number is 138M employed.

which is far greater than the 126M employed in 1996, when the employment rates were about the same.



Most economic indicators are good.

 

[gutharius]

Originally posted by: CADsortaGUY

IMO, people should always be looking. Complacency is what gets a lot of people in trouble.

CsG

Like a page from "Lessons learned over and over again in my life" by gutharius.

 

[ajf3]

Hey - if you don't like Bush don't vote for him next time... just quit whining about it until then

 

[burnedout]

**Breaking News**

U.S. Service Sector Sees Gains in December

[...]

The Institute for Supply Management reported that its non-manufacturing index for the final month of 2004 moved up to 63.1, from 61.3 in November and 59.8 in October. Economists had expected to see a December reading of 61.0.

The non-manufacturing index is comprised mostly of services, which represent by a wide margin the largest part of the U.S. economy.

Survey readings above 50 point to growth.

With the best gain since July, the report noted that "many of members' comments regarding business in December indicate continued positive business conditions but with continued concern for inflationary pressures." . . . . . .

**Film at Eleven**

 

[dmcowen674]

1-5-2005 Concern about the US economy has prompted one of the world's leading media companies to scale back its forecast for US and global advertising growth during 2005.

The move by Carat showed how worried marketing executives have become recently over the economic health of the US.

 

[burnedout]

U.S. Wages, in a Turnaround, May Outpace Inflation - Bloomberg

 

[burnedout]

Employers to seek more college grads - Tampa Tribune

. . . . The increase is mostly from pent-up demand from employers who need more workers after keeping a lid on new hires, trimming their work force through layoffs and trying to exact more work from a shrinking employee base, said Phil Gardner, director of the Collegiate Employment Research Institute at Michigan State.

"They're telling us they haven't hired in four years, and this is the year they really need to hire,'' Gardner said.

Employers also will need to add workers to replace the first wave of retiring baby boom workers, said Rick Cobb, executive vice president with international out-placement firm Challenger, Gray & Christmas, based in Chicago.

"That major void is going to hit most major corporations in the next two to eight years,'' Cobb said.

The National Association of Colleges and Employers also predicts 2005 will be a better year for college graduates entering the job market than the past few years. . . . .

 

[burnedout]

Illinois to add 65,000 - 75,000 jobs in 2005

. . . . State labor economists project that Illinois will add 65,000 to 75,000 jobs in 2005, up from the 45,000 to 50,000 new positions expected to be added this year, department Director Brenda Russell said in an interview Thursday. ?Illinois is ahead of most of the country in construction and leisure and hospitality,? Ms. Russell said. . . .

 

[burnedout]

A little more positive job news

Bobcat to create 100 new jobs in Bismarck, ND

Veneer plant expected to add 50-100 new jobs in Ketchikan, AK

Ferro Works to bring 25 new jobs to Steubenville, OH

Tobyhanna Army Depot in PA plans to hire as many as 500 in 2005

AXA to add 300 jobs in Syracuse, NY

Cypress Gardens in FL adding 100 more employees

Lowe's in Hibbing, MN expected to add upwards of 125 new jobs

Nissan, Baxter Enterprises and Unique Functional Products adding 180 employees in Franklin County, TN

MasterBrand Cabinets, Inc. in Richmond, IN plans to add 80 hourly employees to its third shift production crew during the next few months

W.L. Gore & Associates to expand Flagstaff, AZ operation over next 1.5 years and add 80 new manufacturing jobs

Amstar LLC to add about 60 jobs in Fort Wayne, IN

North Arundel Hospital to add 137 beds and 300 jobs in Annapolis, MD

Autoliv to invest $37 million in Whitley County, IN plant and add 678 positions by 2009

American Southeast Airlines hiring 10 agents in Charlotte, NC; interview on January 6

Heidtman Steel Products Inc. will invest $12 million in plant outside of Butler, IN and hire 50 averaging $15 per hour

By the way, steel is making a slight comeback. My daughter's shares of Insteel Industries Inc. increased from 74 cents to $14.66 per share during 2004

Whole Foods hiring more than 100 workers in Thousand Oaks, CA

New Jersey will hire 100 more state troopers than planned

Aisen Automotive Casting plant expected to create 400 jobs in Oak Ridge, TN by 2007

 

[burnedout]

Knoxville, TN area seeing manufacturing growth - Knoxville News Sentinel

Manufacturing growth

Industry continues to expand in Knox region

By ROGER HARRIS, harrisr@knews.com
January 6, 2005

Once a month Jack Ready, manager of the Carlisle Tire & Wheel Co. plant in Clinton, sits down with a group of employees to brainstorm ideas for trimming the cost of making tires.

No idea is too small to consider, said Ready, who has managed Carlisle's sprawling 330,000-square-foot manufacturing and 210,000-square-foot warehouse complex in the Eagle Bend Industrial Park for nearly 10 years.

"An idea may save only 10 cents an hour, but it all adds up," Ready said Wednesday. "We're making 11,000 tires daily when we're at full capacity."

Controlling costs is a must if Carlisle is going to compete with plants in Southeast Asia, where labor is cheap. So far, Carlisle is more than holding its own. Last year, the Clinton plant added 220 new jobs, pushing its total payroll to 600 workers.

Ready may add another 400 jobs over the next couple of years if the Charlotte, N.C.-based company approves a three-phase, $60 million expansion of the Clinton plant.

"Demand for our tires continues to grow, and there are new markets we could get into and new tires we could make," Ready said.

Carlisle's board of directors also is looking at China for a possible expansion, however. A decision is expected by March.

Carlisle isn't the only Knoxville-area manufacturer affected by competition from Southeast Asia and other countries where labor costs are low. The region has lost thousands of textile jobs in recent years as manufacturers shifted jobs overseas or went bankrupt partly because of foreign competition.

Despite the increased threat from foreign manufacturers, the Knoxville region has seen its share of manufacturing successes, according to a recently released report by the Knoxville Area Chamber Partnership.

In 2004, 19 companies, 16 of them manufacturers, invested more than $283.3 million on expansions or creation of new businesses in the six-county Knoxville Metropolitan Statistical Area, the chamber partnership reported.

Along with the capital investment, the companies expect to create 2,241 jobs over the next few years. . . .

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Breaking old news!

Median Household Income

2000
$44,853

2003
$43,318

Change Under Bush
-$1,535

-3.4%

Factcheck.org.


Everyone can cut and paste the want ads, or layoff news.

What counts is

1) What jobs are being lost

2) What jobs are replacing them.

3) What is the pay you are likely to receive if you have to find a new job. Is is a "quality" job, or flipping burgers or some such. Going to Lowes after working in engineering is not a lateral move.


That is what counts. Pretty much all else is obfuscation.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: WinstonSmith
Breaking old news!

Median Household Income

2000
$44,853

2003
$43,318

Change Under Bush
-$1,535

-3.4%

Factcheck.org.


Everyone can cut and paste the want ads, or layoff news.

What counts is

1) What jobs are being lost

2) What jobs are replacing them.

3) What is the pay you are likely to receive if you have to find a new job. Is is a "quality" job, or flipping burgers or some such. Going to Lowes after working in engineering is not a lateral move.


That is what counts. Pretty much all else is obfuscation.

"Pretty much all else is obfuscation."

That is what a certain poster is the master of.

Navy ship building cutbacks just resulted in the loss of 2,500 jobs today down here in New Orleans Avondale Ship Yard and Ingles Ship Yard in Mississippi.

I'm surprised they have begun to cut back on building Navy ships.

 

[burnedout]

Originally posted by: WinstonSmith

[..]

That is what counts. Pretty much all else is obfuscation.

Ummm, OK. So companies (i.e. dot coms), realizing neither profit nor operating with effective business plans, and financed by speculative investors which in turn created a tight labor market and drove these wages up, isn't some sort of obfuscation either? Gotcha.

 

[burnedout]

Meanwhile, I found this interesting piece of data:

Long-term unemployed (12 months or more) as % of total unemployed, 2002

U.S.======8.6%
Britain====23.1%
Japan====30.8%
France====33.8%
Germany==47.9%
Italy=====59.2%

Source: OECD

 

[burnedout]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

[...]

Speaking of new, more than half of U.S. employees are slated to look for new jobs (normally only a 10% turnover) because of lousy pay increases and Employer mistreatment (especially in regards to Health).


1-4-2005 Economy spurs some to seek new jobs

[...]

(How can that be??? The experts in P&N swear that wage increases have been huge, they have been bragging about awesome salary increases all the time)

"In 2005, companies that don't take care of their employees are going to see people leave," says Marc Lewis, North American president of Morgan Howard Worldwide, an executive search firm.

=========================================================
Good, the ton of SOB Corp Execs that have treated employees like this deserve whatever ilk comes their way.

By the way, allow me to address this little rant.

The recovering economy is a key reason for the high level of job searching according to Tony Lee from CareerJournal.com, "During a poor economy, employees tend to stay put. As the economy improves, interest in jumping ship rises dramatically among employees who are ready to earn more money and find enhanced opportunities for advancement." . . . .

Text

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: burnedout

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

[...]

Speaking of new, more than half of U.S. employees are slated to look for new jobs (normally only a 10% turnover) because of lousy pay increases and Employer mistreatment (especially in regards to Health).


1-4-2005 Economy spurs some to seek new jobs

[...]

(How can that be??? The experts in P&N swear that wage increases have been huge, they have been bragging about awesome salary increases all the time)

"In 2005, companies that don't take care of their employees are going to see people leave," says Marc Lewis, North American president of Morgan Howard Worldwide, an executive search firm.

=========================================================
Good, the ton of SOB Corp Execs that have treated employees like this deserve whatever ilk comes their way.

By the way, allow me to address this little rant.

The recovering economy is a key reason for the high level of job searching according to Tony Lee from CareerJournal.com, "During a poor economy, employees tend to stay put. As the economy improves, interest in jumping ship rises dramatically among employees who are ready to earn more money and find enhanced opportunities for advancement." . . . .

Text

So much for your "Recovering Economy":

Jobless number wrong again (Big Surprise :roll: ) , Holiday Season dissapointment for Retailers

1-6-2005 US Jobless Claims Surge, Retailers Mixed

Initial U.S. jobless claims surged unexpectedly last week, taking claims to their highest level since late September, but analysts shrugged off the large jump as a holiday-related blip.

The number of Americans filing first-time claims for state unemployment insurance aid rose 43,000 to 364,000 in the week ended Jan. 1, up from a revised 321,000 in the previous week, the Labor Department (news - web sites) said.

It was the largest one-week gain in nearly three years and far surpassed Wall Street expectations for a rise to 331,000 from the originally reported 326,000 in the prior week.

"This was not a good period for retailers or shoppers," said Kurt Barnard, president of industry forecaster Retail Consulting Group. "We saw a dearth of exciting, new items."

But analysts said the season, which represents about 23 percent of annual retail sales, would have been worse if retailers had not cut prices, triggering a late rush to stores, and without the growth in online and gift card sales.

 

[burnedout]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

So much for your "Recovering Economy":

Jobless number wrong again (Big Surprise :roll: ) , Holiday Season dissapointment for Retailers

1-6-2005 US Jobless Claims Surge, Retailers Mixed

From the link you provided:

A Labor Department analyst said the rise was partly due to difficulties with seasonal adjustments for the holiday, and economists said the data did not alter their outlook for healthy hiring in December. . . .
. . . . .

Analysts stressed the volatility of the jobless claims report, especially around the holidays.

"This week was the end of New Year's Eve and we always have trouble adjusting for holidays. This year Christmas was also on a weekend," said Anne Parker Mills, head of foreign exchange research at Brown Brothers Harriman in New York.

"If you look at the four-week moving average, the level remains consistent with comfortable gains in the jobs number. It does not do anything to change consensus expectations for a gain of 175,000 jobs tomorrow," Mills said, referring to the Labor Department's December employment report, due for release on Friday.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: burnedout

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

So much for your "Recovering Economy":

Jobless number wrong again (Big Surprise :roll: ) , Holiday Season dissapointment for Retailers

1-6-2005 US Jobless Claims Surge, Retailers Mixed

From the link you provided:

A Labor Department analyst said the rise was partly due to difficulties with seasonal adjustments for the holiday, and economists said the data did not alter their outlook for healthy hiring in December. . . .
. . . . .

Analysts stressed the volatility of the jobless claims report, especially around the holidays.

"This week was the end of New Year's Eve and we always have trouble adjusting for holidays. This year Christmas was also on a weekend," said Anne Parker Mills, head of foreign exchange research at Brown Brothers Harriman in New York.

"If you look at the four-week moving average, the level remains consistent with comfortable gains in the jobs number. It does not do anything to change consensus expectations for a gain of 175,000 jobs tomorrow," Mills said, referring to the Labor Department's December employment report, due for release on Friday.

Ah yes, adjust, adjust, adjust.

That's all this Regime and followers have been able to do. Been getting away with it too, have to give credit where credit is due. They are masterful at "adjusting" numbers their way. Including the Regime Parrots on here.

Clap clap clap.

 

[NeoV]

Can we please stop having links to Best Buy and Lowe's store openings, that are creating all these new great jobs? These are the same jobs that Cad makes fun of in other posts!

 

[CADsortaGUY]

Originally posted by: NeoV
Can we please stop having links to Best Buy and Lowe's store openings, that are creating all these new great jobs? These are the same jobs that Cad makes fun of in other posts!

:roll: I made fun of them? I sure hope you have proof of this. If not then please return to your bridge with this:

CsG

 

[burnedout]

Originally posted by: NeoV
Can we please stop having links to Best Buy and Lowe's store openings, that are creating all these new great jobs? These are the same jobs that Cad makes fun of in other posts!

What's wrong with these jobs? Oh, that's right, these jobs a) are not glamorous; b) "don't pay enough for me"; c) "teh eval" corporation.

Anecdotally speaking:

- My youngest brother, who is 24, works for Publix in Orlando, FL. He started as a stock boy in the grocery industry 6 years ago. Currently, he's a produce manager. Aside from his $39,000/yr. salary, health, dental, tuition assistance, he's also privy to profit sharing in the form of company stock. His current holdings in Publix exceed $7,000.

- A relative retired from Wally World in Louisville, KY after 20 something years. In addition to her 401K, I think she has over $100K in Wal-Mart company stock.

- A friend of mine, a single mother, has worked at the same Wally World in Tazewell, TN for over 20 years. She loves her 401K, benefits and company stock plan.

- My ex-old lady works at that same store stocking shelves. While the $6.25/hr she earns isn't great, after working 18 years as a waitress with no benefits, she calls the Wally World job "the best job I've ever had".

Different strokes for different folks.