eBay / PayPal solution

[Grasshopper27]

I've got a simple solution to the problem of people not paying on eBay.

Just have people put their credit card numbers into eBay when bidding. If you win the item, the cost is charged automaticly. You win it, you bought it, period.

😀

This is so simple, I cannot figure out why on Earth eBay doesn't at least make it an option for sellers.

Grasshopper

 

[dafatha00]

Some people don't have credit cards. If Ebay required every bidder to use a credit card, they'd certainly lose a lot of commission.

 

[spyordie007]

I agree that would be nice, however I dont know that I would use ebay any more if they had that practice.

You already have to have a credit card to use the service and sell items.

My guess it's one of those slopes they are trying to avoid...

-Spy

 

[PsychoAndy]

Originally posted by: grasshopper26
I've got a simple solution to the problem of people not paying on eBay.

Just have people put their credit card numbers into eBay when bidding. If you win the item, the cost is charged automaticly. You win it, you bought it, period.

😀

This is so simple, I cannot figure out why on Earth eBay doesn't at least make it an option for sellers.

Grasshopper

I'll be back in a bit to shoot that idea down.

-PAB

 

[Grasshopper27]

Originally posted by: dafatha00
Some people don't have credit cards. If Ebay required every bidder to use a credit card, they'd certainly lose a lot of commission.

Ok, how about a checking account?

Grasshopper

 

[crab]

So what happens when the seller never ships?

 

[PsychoAndy]

Originally posted by: grasshopper26

Originally posted by: dafatha00
Some people don't have credit cards. If Ebay required every bidder to use a credit card, they'd certainly lose a lot of commission.

Ok, how about a checking account?

Grasshopper

Hmm. Reg-e transactions...

-PAB

 

[dude8604]

Originally posted by: dafatha00
Some people don't have credit cards. If Ebay required every bidder to use a credit card, they'd certainly lose a lot of commission.

They do require a credit card for bidders!!!

 

[Grasshopper27]

Originally posted by: crab453
So what happens when the seller never ships?

You file a complaint and get your money back from eBay. The seller is required to provide a valid tracking number to keep payment.

Grasshopper

 

[spyordie007]

I never feel "safe" giving any more information out about myself than is absolutly needed. I tend to shy away from any companies that require a large amout of information about me to use their service.

For example Hollywood video now requires that they have both your drivers licence and your credit card on file just to check out videos. I dont go there anymore and check everything out from netflix which only requires a credit card and a shipping address. If Hollywood video had only asked a little less of me (the customer) than they wouldnt have ever lost me as a customer.

-Spy

 

[crystal]

Originally posted by: grasshopper26
I've got a simple solution to the problem of people not paying on eBay.

Just have people put their credit card numbers into eBay when bidding. If you win the item, the cost is charged automaticly. You win it, you bought it, period.

😀

This is so simple, I cannot figure out why on Earth eBay doesn't at least make it an option for sellers.

Grasshopper

This is only for "good" sellers. What happen if some one just post all kind of items with intention to commit faults/crimes. Just list a lot of stuffs for cheap. Sell them fast and then run. Just happen a few times and the whole things will become so rotten that no one will use it anymore. Listing fees will goes up because ebay will have a higher liability. BTW, I had to file a complains against a seller because he did not shipped the item. The judgement is in my favior, but I still didn't not get my money (minus $25) back. This auction was the ended in june and now it is a week into nov. and my refunded money is still in limbo somewhere.

 

[PsychoAndy]

Originally posted by: grasshopper26
I've got a simple solution to the problem of people not paying on eBay.

Just have people put their credit card numbers into eBay when bidding. If you win the item, the cost is charged automaticly. You win it, you bought it, period.

😀

This is so simple, I cannot figure out why on Earth eBay doesn't at least make it an option for sellers.

Grasshopper

Alright, you want to mandatorily incorporate credit card payment for all sellers.

#1. Whos gonna pay the 2% to Visa/MC international.
#2. What happens in a chargeback/dispute resolution case?
#3. Stolen/Fraudulent use of card numbers. What do we do there?

Another thing. Shipment title and risk of loss. Who's going to be responsible if USPS or UPS, or FedEx dosent deliver. If a damage claim is filed, where does the money go? Is it an irreplaceable item?

A lot of people dont have credit cards. What do you propose there? You want to run EFT's and follow the FDIC regulations governing Reg-E transactions. Ok, in that case what happens when we have a delivery failure or a damage issue.

In regard to product delivery: Acts of god, war, government confiscation, U.S. Export Control regulated items? What do we do there if a conflict arises the buyer pays automatically in some form or another?

Dispute resolution seems like a good idea. Who does it? Where? What states governing laws take precedence? How so? Legally binding? If so, who executes it and carries it out?

What happens in regard to cancellation? What if theres a listing error and someone uses buy it now? What if theres a product change? Availabilty change? What do we do there. The second a transaction is run, Visa/MC International gets their share.

I'll probably have more criticisms later.

-PAB

 

[Grasshopper27]

Originally posted by: crystal

This is only for "good" sellers. What happen if some one just post all kind of items with intention to commit faults/crimes. Just list a lot of stuffs for cheap. Sell them fast and then run. Just happen a few times and the whole things will become so rotten that no one will use it anymore. Listing fees will goes up because ebay will have a higher liability. BTW, I had to file a complains against a seller because he did not shipped the item. The judgement is in my favior, but I still didn't not get my money (minus $25) back. This auction was the ended in june and now it is a week into nov. and my refunded money is still in limbo somewhere.

It is on a credit card, per VISA/MC/AMEX rules, you get your money back, period.

It is the responsiblity of the seller to provide tracking information on the shipment.

Grasshopper

 

[PsychoAndy]

Originally posted by: grasshopper26

Originally posted by: crystal

This is only for "good" sellers. What happen if some one just post all kind of items with intention to commit faults/crimes. Just list a lot of stuffs for cheap. Sell them fast and then run. Just happen a few times and the whole things will become so rotten that no one will use it anymore. Listing fees will goes up because ebay will have a higher liability. BTW, I had to file a complains against a seller because he did not shipped the item. The judgement is in my favior, but I still didn't not get my money (minus $25) back. This auction was the ended in june and now it is a week into nov. and my refunded money is still in limbo somewhere.

It is on a credit card, per VISA/MC/AMEX rules, you get your money back, period.

It is the responsiblity of the seller to provide tracking information on the shipment.

Grasshopper

Right....and if UPS is UPS and they lose it or break it......

-PAB

 

[PsychoAndy]

Originally posted by: grasshopper26

Originally posted by: crystal

This is only for "good" sellers. What happen if some one just post all kind of items with intention to commit faults/crimes. Just list a lot of stuffs for cheap. Sell them fast and then run. Just happen a few times and the whole things will become so rotten that no one will use it anymore. Listing fees will goes up because ebay will have a higher liability. BTW, I had to file a complains against a seller because he did not shipped the item. The judgement is in my favior, but I still didn't not get my money (minus $25) back. This auction was the ended in june and now it is a week into nov. and my refunded money is still in limbo somewhere.

It is on a credit card, per VISA/MC/AMEX rules, you get your money back, period.

It is the responsiblity of the seller to provide tracking information on the shipment.

Grasshopper

Also: Disputing a charge dosent give you your $ back. If the merchant can back the charge accordingly, they get paid.

-PAB

 

[spyordie007]

Originally posted by: PsychoAndy

Originally posted by: grasshopper26
I've got a simple solution to the problem of people not paying on eBay.

Just have people put their credit card numbers into eBay when bidding. If you win the item, the cost is charged automaticly. You win it, you bought it, period.

😀

This is so simple, I cannot figure out why on Earth eBay doesn't at least make it an option for sellers.

Grasshopper

Alright, you want to mandatorily incorporate credit card payment for all sellers.

#1. Whos gonna pay the 2% to Visa/MC international.
#2. What happens in a chargeback/dispute resolution case?
#3. Stolen/Fraudulent use of card numbers. What do we do there?

Another thing. Shipment title and risk of loss. Who's going to be responsible if USPS or UPS, or FedEx dosent deliver. If a damage claim is filed, where does the money go? Is it an irreplaceable item?

A lot of people dont have credit cards. What do you propose there? You want to run EFT's and follow the FDIC regulations governing Reg-E transactions. Ok, in that case what happens when we have a delivery failure or a damage issue.

In regard to product delivery: Acts of god, war, government confiscation, U.S. Export Control regulated items? What do we do there if a conflict arises the buyer pays automatically in some form or another?

Dispute resolution seems like a good idea. Who does it? Where? What states governing laws take precedence? How so? Legally binding? If so, who executes it and carries it out?

What happens in regard to cancellation? What if theres a listing error and someone uses buy it now? What if theres a product change? Availabilty change? What do we do there. The second a transaction is run, Visa/MC International gets their share.

I'll probably have more criticisms later.

-PAB

 

[Grasshopper27]

Alright, you want to mandatorily incorporate credit card payment for all sellers.

No, I want it to be an option for the seller. The old system could remain, but if the seller wished, this could be a choice when he creates the auction.

#1. Whos gonna pay the 2% to Visa/MC international.

The seller, the seller always pays this. Cost of doing business. If you're selling a $500 notebook and you're upset about paying VISA $10, you're missing the big picture...

#2. What happens in a chargeback/dispute resolution case?

If you have not shipped the item, you don't get to keep the money. If you have, you have a tracking number.

#3. Stolen/Fraudulent use of card numbers. What do we do there?

VISA/MC/AMEX covers this, the seller still gets paid.

Another thing. Shipment title and risk of loss. Who's going to be responsible if USPS or UPS, or FedEx dosent deliver. If a damage claim is filed, where does the money go? Is it an irreplaceable item?

Insure the shipment. The payment goes to the seller, the seller refunds. The seller is ultimatly responsible for delivering the goods to the buyer.

A lot of people dont have credit cards. What do you propose there? You want to run EFT's and follow the FDIC regulations governing Reg-E transactions. Ok, in that case what happens when we have a delivery failure or a damage issue.

You have to have a credit card to bid on eBay already. If you don't have a credit card, get one. Anyone in America can get one. Get a $200 secured card, or a Visa Check Card from your bank. Anyone who owns a computer can get a credit card, that is no excuse.

[/quote]
In regard to product delivery: Acts of god, war, government confiscation, U.S. Export Control regulated items? What do we do there if a conflict arises the buyer pays automatically in some form or another?
[/quote]

It is the responsibility of the seller to deliver the goods. This is basic business practice.

What happens in regard to cancellation? What if theres a listing error and someone uses buy it now? What if theres a product change? Availabilty change? What do we do there. The second a transaction is run, Visa/MC International gets their share.

If a refund is issued, VISA/MC/AMEX also refunds their share. The buyer gets all his money back.

The seller always has the option to refund the buyer, either before or after he ships. All he needs to do is log in and click a button that says "refund". The buyer gets his money back.

Grasshopper

 

[Grasshopper27]

Originally posted by: PsychoAndy

Also: Disputing a charge dosent give you your $ back. If the merchant can back the charge accordingly, they get paid.

-PAB

Depends on who you have the credit card with to some extent.

With AMEX, you get your money back, period. They will do this a limited number of times, even if the seller can prove the charge was legit. They have the best customer service in the business.

Visa/MC can be more hit and miss. Citibank will credit back to you, CapitalOne might not.

It shouldn't have to be said, but I'll say it anyway. Don't spend more money on eBay than you can afford to lose.

Grasshopper

 

[Grasshopper27]

Originally posted by: PsychoAndy

Right....and if UPS is UPS and they lose it or break it......

-PAB

Don't use UPS (United Package Smashers) then...

😀

That is why you insure the package.

Grasshopper

 

[crystal]

Originally posted by: PsychoAndy

Originally posted by: grasshopper26

Originally posted by: crystal

This is only for "good" sellers. What happen if some one just post all kind of items with intention to commit faults/crimes. Just list a lot of stuffs for cheap. Sell them fast and then run. Just happen a few times and the whole things will become so rotten that no one will use it anymore. Listing fees will goes up because ebay will have a higher liability. BTW, I had to file a complains against a seller because he did not shipped the item. The judgement is in my favior, but I still didn't not get my money (minus $25) back. This auction was the ended in june and now it is a week into nov. and my refunded money is still in limbo somewhere.

It is on a credit card, per VISA/MC/AMEX rules, you get your money back, period.

It is the responsiblity of the seller to provide tracking information on the shipment.

Grasshopper

Also: Disputing a charge dosent give you your $ back. If the merchant can back the charge accordingly, they get paid.

-PAB

Tracking number don't mean a thing. It is just a nice thing to have. Say, I sell an item for $xxx amount and you get a tracking number from me. When you got it, it contains an empty box. How can you prove to your credit card that you didn't get anything from me. I could tie you in paper trails for months (if I even bother to communicate with you after the transaction). Remember I don't need to use what ever account too long. Just long enough to get the money, cut and run. BTW, PAB have a great lists.

 

[Grasshopper27]

Originally posted by: crystal

Tracking number don't mean a thing. It is just a nice thing to have. Say, I sell an item for $xxx amount and you get a tracking number from me. When you got it, it contains an empty box. How can you prove to your credit card that you didn't get anything from me. I could tie you in paper trails for months (if I even bother to communicate with you after the transaction). Remember I don't need to use what ever account too long. Just long enough to get the money, cut and run. BTW, PAB have a great lists.

Sure, but all of that is true with all the other payment methods as well...

Grasshopper

 

[PsychoAndy]

Originally posted by: grasshopper26

Originally posted by: PsychoAndy

Also: Disputing a charge dosent give you your $ back. If the merchant can back the charge accordingly, they get paid.

-PAB

Depends on who you have the credit card with to some extent.

With AMEX, you get your money back, period. They will do this a limited number of times, even if the seller can prove the charge was legit. They have the best customer service in the business.

Visa/MC can be more hit and miss. Citibank will credit back to you, CapitalOne might not.

It shouldn't have to be said, but I'll say it anyway. Don't spend more money on eBay than you can afford to lose.


Grasshopper

AMEX operates like every other lender. I've made disputes and I have been afforded an initial credit as a courtesy, however they have rebilled before.

VISA/MC/AMEX covers this, the seller still gets paid.

Wrong. I've seen merchants burned.

Insure the shipment. The payment goes to the seller, the seller refunds. The seller is ultimatly responsible for delivering the goods to the buyer.

When I say you need to file a claim......who goes out of pocket? You cant keep a seller from getting his # because of a service failure out of their control.

You have to have a credit card to bid on eBay already. If you don't have a credit card, get one. Anyone in America can get one. Get a $200 secured card, or a Visa Check Card from your bank. Anyone who owns a computer can get a credit card, that is no excuse.

Wrong. All you need is an e-mail.

UPS has been known to deny claims before. Not an uncommon practice in insurance.

-PAB

 

[Grasshopper27]

AMEX operates like every other lender. I've made disputes and I have been afforded an initial credit as a courtesy, however they have rebilled before.

I've used Amex for years, had to chargeback a few things, never had a problem.

Wrong. I've seen merchants burned.

Perhaps that was just a poor merchant account company? I know cases of the merchants being paid, so go figure. 🙂

When I say you need to file a claim......who goes out of pocket? You cant keep a seller from getting his # because of a service failure out of their control.

Sure you can, that is part of the risk the seller takes. Same holds true for the big mail order companies as well.

Wrong. All you need is an e-mail.

Last time I checked, they wanted a credit card, did they change that?

UPS has been known to deny claims before. Not an uncommon practice in insurance.

I don't use UPS, PITA company if you have problems. I use either the post office or FedEx.

PAB, it sounds like you should stay away from eBay, all those risks seem too much for you. You want safe? Stay away from buying and selling on-line. 😉

Grasshopper

 

[PsychoAndy]

Originally posted by: grasshopper26

AMEX operates like every other lender. I've made disputes and I have been afforded an initial credit as a courtesy, however they have rebilled before.

I've used Amex for years, had to chargeback a few things, never had a problem.

Wrong. I've seen merchants burned.

Perhaps that was just a poor merchant account company? I know cases of the merchants being paid, so go figure. 🙂

When I say you need to file a claim......who goes out of pocket? You cant keep a seller from getting his # because of a service failure out of their control.

Sure you can, that is part of the risk the seller takes. Same holds true for the big mail order companies as well.

Wrong. All you need is an e-mail.

Last time I checked, they wanted a credit card, did they change that?

UPS has been known to deny claims before. Not an uncommon practice in insurance.

I don't use UPS, PITA company if you have problems. I use either the post office or FedEx.

PAB, it sounds like you should stay away from eBay, all those risks seem too much for you. You want safe? Stay away from buying and selling on-line. 😉

Grasshopper

The reasoning behind a merchant getting burned on a hot CC is that they dont have physical evidence other than a bunch of ones and zeros floating around in cyberspace. I've seen merchants lose money because they physically CANT support the claim.

Fact of the matter is that AMEX does offer courtesy credits, however it is the merhant's option to provide a credit in the event of a chargeback.

Ok, seller has to go out of pocket. What if its a high value item that is specially ordered? If you call in an order for $20,000 in RAM, I order it on a net 30, you pay me and I ship it, and the plane crashes. Where does the line get drawn? You really shouldnt hold someone responsible for something that isnt even under their control. Lets say a bank robber shoots and kills a teller. Who do we hold responsible? The merchant that sold him the gun, the UPS driver that delivered it, the paper company that made the box it came in, the brass miner that mined the materials to make the ammo? That argument is really moot, so I'll leave it at that.

All you need is an e-mail. Thats the minnum requirement and thats all I've seen. Besides, if I need to bring legal action, they wont relase the info anyways.

All shippers review claims accordingly and take a fair amount of time to do so. Sometimes strong physical evidence is required to sustain one. I've had claims reviewed and denied before. In all cases, took several weeks to complete.

I've sold enough to have 95% of the fraud purported by buyers happen to me. As for the 5%, I've avoided that by learning from others.

Seller fraud is unilateral. Buyer pays. Seller fails to give them the indicated product. Buyer fraud has much more forms and types.

-PAB

 

[Imdmn04]

ID verifiying should be REQUIRED for both the sellers and the BUYERS, this doesnt force payment like your solution. But at least you can be sure that he/she is a legitimate bidder and not someone trying to attempt fraud.