ebay is a scammer paradise. I just lost $2000 because of them

Markfw

Moderator Emeritus, Elite Member
May 16, 2002
25,394
14,356
136
So. I listed a EPYC 7742 ES CPU/motherboard/128 gig of ram for $1500 and I accepted an offer for $1400 from a user. I got like $1200 net after shipping and fees. So they ask for a return, since it is "not as described". They did not accept that ES stood for engineering sample. EVERYBODY on ebay lists CPUs as ES all the time. Anyway, so I contest the return. They still take the buys side. So I create the shipping label for return and send it as an ebay message to the buyer.

So.... First, ebay deducts not only what I got , but the entire sales price of $1400 plus $20 shipping from me (double fees). I provided the return shipping label on the 8th. I called them today to say can they get the user to return the item and they say "no, you should have provided the label by the 6th". The user can keep the hardware.

So ebay gets double fees on a $1400 item, plus the user gets a $1400 piece of hardware for free. All because they believe his lying stupid ass. Its a scammers paradise.

Never sell on ebay ever again.
 

Charmonium

Diamond Member
May 15, 2015
8,642
2,237
136
I don't doubt that you got screwed. I'll just say that back when I used to buy ES chips, a lot of the sellers must have had the same problem since they would display a prominent caveat on the listing saying something like "this is an engineering sample."

If you do decide to try ebay again, it might help to also describe some of the issues you can experience with an ES chip such excessive heat.

edit: there are a lot of newbies out there trying to save some money while upgrading their crunching farm (BOINC related distributed computing projects).
 

Pohemi

Diamond Member
Oct 2, 2004
8,437
10,455
146
Ebay will always always always side with the buyer. It's all about buyer protection...they could give two ***** about the sellers.

This is why I stopped using it a long time ago (15 years? maybe more). Too many listings of expensive items and getting screwed around by supposed buyers, only to get told by ebay to pound sand. I'm told by friends who still use it that it's only gotten worse.

Sorry to hear about your problems on there.
 

Markfw

Moderator Emeritus, Elite Member
May 16, 2002
25,394
14,356
136
I don't doubt that you got screwed. I'll just say that back when I used to buy ES chips, a lot of the sellers must have had the same problem since they would display a prominent caveat on the listing saying something like "this is an engineering sample."

If you do decide to try ebay again, it might help to also describe some of the issues you can experience with an ES chip such excessive heat.

edit: there are a lot of newbies out there trying to save some money while upgrading their crunching farm (BOINC related distributed computing projects).
If you look at the DC forum, this chip was running at 100% load for years 24/7/365 at temps under 70c. This only had to do with ebay taking the word of a scammer.
 

GodisanAtheist

Diamond Member
Nov 16, 2006
6,591
6,815
136
Dayum, that's a miserable story. As a buyer (and never seller) on eBay I've always tried to fly true.

I've had to return hardware before that was listed as working but was actually broken (folks might remember my 3080 story while putting together my sig PC) but I've always tried to be a "good citizen" of eBay.

In that case I even left a review saying the seller likely didn't know the card was broken because it passed boot and even some tests before failing (it looked like a small time PC shop). The seller was able to get my neutral review removed by eBay somehow. No biggie, but they looked out for the seller's rep in that case.

Really chaffes my nuts to read stuff like this with buyers being crooks.

The idea that a buyer can just keep the parts without having to return them because a shipping label went out a few days late is absolutely bonkers.
 

Markfw

Moderator Emeritus, Elite Member
May 16, 2002
25,394
14,356
136
Dayum, that's a miserable story. As a buyer (and never seller) on eBay I've always tried to fly true.

I've had to return hardware before that was listed as working but was actually broken (folks might remember my 3080 story while putting together my sig PC) but I've always tried to be a "good citizen" of eBay.

In that case I even left a review saying the seller likely didn't know the card was broken because it passed boot and even some tests before failing (it looked like a small time PC shop). The seller was able to get my neutral review removed by eBay somehow. No biggie, but they looked out for the seller's rep in that case.

Really chaffes my nuts to read stuff like this with buyers being crooks.

The idea that a buyer can just keep the parts without having to return them because a shipping label went out a few days late is absolutely bonkers.
To confirm 2 days late ! and he gets to keep $1400 worth of hardware. I would dispute that, but I have deleted my account and all messages as of now.
 

Hans Gruber

Platinum Member
Dec 23, 2006
2,066
1,043
136
Did the buyer who didn't want an ES chip refuse to return the product? Or are you assuming they will not return the product after sending them a return label for the CPU/MB/RAM? Did the buyer say thanks for the goods and I will not be returning the items with the prepaid return slip?
 

Markfw

Moderator Emeritus, Elite Member
May 16, 2002
25,394
14,356
136
Did the buyer who didn't want an ES chip refuse to return the product? Or are you assuming they will not return the product after sending them a return label for the CPU/MB/RAM? Did the buyer say thanks for the goods and I will not be returning the items with the prepaid return slip?
The buyer is a scumbag. I sent him the label and asked him to return things AFTER he had been refunded fully. Since we had arguments during the return discussion, I saw no reason to ask him a second time to return things, and when I asked ebay to ask him they said " he can keep it if he does not wish to return it"
 
  • Wow
Reactions: igor_kavinski

Charmonium

Diamond Member
May 15, 2015
8,642
2,237
136
when I asked ebay to ask him they said " he can keep it if he does not wish to return it"
That's some bullshit right there.

It might be worth trying once or twice more since I don't see how that can be official ebay policy. At least I hope not.

It sounds more like a lazy customer rep.
 
  • Like
Reactions: igor_kavinski

Markfw

Moderator Emeritus, Elite Member
May 16, 2002
25,394
14,356
136
That's some bullshit right there.

It might be worth trying once or twice more since I don't see how that can be official ebay policy. At least I hope not.

It sounds more like a lazy customer rep.
I think the words were "work it out with the buyer. Maybe he will return it, but he does not have to".

$1400 worth of hardware that works fine ? and you are not required to return it ? Yea right..... I will return it to be a nice guy after I screwed you out of $1400
 

BoomerD

No Lifer
Feb 26, 2006
62,481
10,820
136
I’m sorry you got fucked…but, damn man…you’ve been around long enough to know better than to use eBay. It’s a fckn scammer’s paradise.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Markfw

Charmonium

Diamond Member
May 15, 2015
8,642
2,237
136
Forum buy/sell threads are a better choice than ebay but with that, you're leaving cash on the table.

I don't know this for a fact, but my perception has always been that such places don't really give you the chance to get full market value. People are expecting a more of a "deal."

But it wouldn't be the first time that I've been wrong.
 

Red Squirrel

No Lifer
May 24, 2003
67,010
11,940
126
www.anyf.ca
Wow that totally blows. But yeah not the first time I hear a horror story like that with Ebay. They always side with the buyer no matter what even if they are in the wrong. For a big ticket item like that I'd probably stick to selling locally, for cash in hand.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Pohemi

Hans Gruber

Platinum Member
Dec 23, 2006
2,066
1,043
136
I am curious what the ebay buyers reputation rating was and the count of their ebay transactions. Was this a new buyer who intended to scam the seller from the outset?
 

Pohemi

Diamond Member
Oct 2, 2004
8,437
10,455
146
Pass it on to the trollhunters group, maybe? It's a hard one because it's Ebay that okay'd it. He's a piece of crap scammer, yeah. But they (Ebay) enabled it.
 

Torn Mind

Lifer
Nov 25, 2012
11,512
2,613
136
I do hope in the description, it said engineering sample.

Having just "ES" in the title could be sufficient grounds for someone to say they simply did not understand the meaning of the term.

Or did they chip itself have any indication that it was an engineering sample.

If you want possession of the item, replevin/detinue might be a case of action in a particular state.


Also, welcome to land of abitration adjudication.


Only small claims has an exemption.

So if it's a big ticket item(above 5000), it's arbitration, no court.
 

Red Squirrel

No Lifer
May 24, 2003
67,010
11,940
126
www.anyf.ca
I guess it's too late now, but would be fun to pull something like this off to the scammer:


That story jarrs me out every time I read it.
 
  • Haha
Reactions: Ken g6 and Pohemi
Nov 17, 2019
10,528
6,293
136
Abbreviations like 'ES' mean nothing to me. Are you even supposed to sell 'samples'? There used to be language in their terms prohibiting that.

My limit there is around $50, buying or selling. I think I've gone over that a couple of times when buying from long established sellers who are also retailers. I won't list anything over that, or that I can't afford to lose.

Years ago, when I was selling, I kept funds in an intermediate bank account. If something sold and the money went there, I immediately moved it to another account to prevent clawbacks.

For the amount you're talking, I would seriously consider Small Claims Court, but you'll have to be very certain of your case and the abbreviation thing alone could sink you.
 

Ken g6

Programming Moderator, Elite Member
Moderator
Dec 11, 1999
16,205
3,766
75
Are you even supposed to sell 'samples'? There used to be language in their terms prohibiting that.
Yeah, I think it remains property of the manufacturer. So that would mean you bought stolen property, tried to sell stolen property, and you're not entitled to anything.

So never buy ES or QS (Qualification Sample, I think) electronics.
 

Torn Mind

Lifer
Nov 25, 2012
11,512
2,613
136
Yeah, I think it remains property of the manufacturer. So that would mean you bought stolen property, tried to sell stolen property, and you're not entitled to anything.

So never buy ES or QS (Qualification Sample, I think) electronics.
The court system may not necessarily care about that. Because if someone takes it from you, then you cannot do the technical duty of giving back the item to the manufacturer.

The action for laymen in the lower court is often called replevin if it's possession of the item that is sought.
 
Nov 17, 2019
10,528
6,293
136
Plaintiff: I sold an item.

Defendant: It was a sample.

Judge: Did you have clear ownership of this sample before you sold it?

Plaintiff: ... ummm, I bought it from someone ....
 
  • Like
Reactions: Ken g6

Shmee

Memory & Storage, Graphics Cards Mod Elite Member
Super Moderator
Sep 13, 2008
7,343
2,390
146
This is not good. I would try several things...first, keep complaining to ebay, and don't stop. You may get someone who helps eventually, and if not, you might be able to threaten legal action. Also, you know where the buyer lives. You could mess with him if not too far, or simply tip off the local authorities on him, and let them handle it. Also you may be able to take the buyer himself to court. Also you could get paypal involved, if you used that. They might be able to undo the refund.

If you need help with this, I would contact your lawyer and ask them for help with the next step. Seems worth it for a $1000+ item.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Pohemi