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DVD burners, too soon to buy?

Y

yeedog

Senior member
Hi all.

I was wodnering if DVD burners are at a point where it would be good to buy one? I was looking at that new sony that can do +-r and rw. That seems like the best thing to cover which ever format that get's adopted.

Is the technology up to par or is it still too new to really be of value yet? I have a use for one, so it's not really a situation of buying it and not using it. I just want want to make sure that if i buy one it will be good to use for atleat a couple years, even tho it would be really slow.

Do you think something revolutionary is going to come out in the next month or so with DVD burning that will warrent a wait.

how long does it take to burn a full DVD with + r and -r? What speed (time of buring) do you predict that DVD burning will peak out at? I mean it can't buring it all in 1 second. So they have to be some minumim time it takes to complete.

Will DVD burners that can burn a DVD like commercial DVDs and hold 9.2 GB on one side be comming out soon? That's probably a fear, if i get a burner now, i don't want to be out of luck say next summer when a new DVD burner comes out that can burn a 9.2GB dvd.

So if that technology is a couple years off still, then it could be worth it to get a DVD burner now.

Thanks for your help!

--Brian
 
just like cd burners, dvd burners are going to get faster and faster until they reach a limit. you may want to wait until 1 format becomes the standard and the burning speed increases.
 
hmm thanks...

When do you think one format would become the "standard"? Are we still a few years off from that?

I'm not into throwing cash away, but i was thinking it would be great to burn all these movies i make with my DV cam to dvd, insead of VCD. Also recording TV shows and making a DVD of a a bunch of episodes to watch.

Plus the aspect of backup is cool as i d/l alot of live and legal music from taper friendly bands in high qauaity SHN format (~800 MB a show). Thus if i could burn 5-6 shows in SHN format on a DVD instead of 2 CD's per show, i could save alot of space.

Oh well i'll have to wait and see i guess.
 
I think dvd burners are a waste of money right now. The only good use for them now is to make copies of movies, but this isn't as simple as burning MP3's. You have to get decrypting software (DeCss), and it takes like 6-7 hours to decrypt a DVD movie. If you want to burn the movie in full mpeg 4 quality, you will have to put it on multiple DVD-R's, which means you have to get software to split the file. Then when you factor in the high cost of DVD-R's, it's better to just rent the movie!

I don't understand why people would buy a DVD burner just to backup data onto DVD. Why not just put that data onto multiple CD-R's; they are a fraction of the price and just as effective. I was excited about DVD burners when I first heard about them, but the more I learned, the more turned off I became.

In the future applications will probably be distrubuted on DVD as opposed to CD, but until then, just stick to CD-R.
 
Originally posted by: Nirvana1979
I think dvd burners are a waste of money right now. The only good use for them now is to make copies of movies, but this isn't as simple as burning MP3's. You have to get decrypting software (DeCss), and it takes like 6-7 hours to decrypt a DVD movie. If you want to burn the movie in full mpeg 4 quality, you will have to put it on multiple DVD-R's, which means you have to get software to split the file. Then when you factor in the high cost of DVD-R's, it's better to just rent the movie!

I don't understand why people would buy a DVD burner just to backup data onto DVD. Why not just put that data onto multiple CD-R's; they are a fraction of the price and just as effective. I was excited about DVD burners when I first heard about them, but the more I learned, the more turned off I became.

In the future applications will probably be distrubuted on DVD as opposed to CD, but until then, just stick to CD-R.
Click to expand...

umm there are many good uses for them now, jsut because you would make ilegal copies of dvds and not buy them doens't mean others would.

Well as i said before i would put the movies I make with my DV cam on to DVD along with making compilations of TV performances on to DVD. Things that are not available on DVD. I wouldn't rip dvds as i would just buy them.

Data back up is easy. Would i rather have 2,000 CDs lying around or 400 DVDS? I'd choose the 400 dvds wouldn't you?

Maybe it's not for everybody, but you ever collected live and leagal audience recordings for bands the cd's pile up fast! A show is 2 CD's to back up in SHN format. And there are many many many bands that you can d/l on the net. Some bands have been touring for 10 years+. That can easily be 700 shows right there and that is just one band.

I have vaild reason for wanting one, the question was if the technology is up to snuff to warrent buying one now or to wait.


 
Originally posted by: Nirvana1979
I think dvd burners are a waste of money right now. The only good use for them now is to make copies of movies, but this isn't as simple as burning MP3's. You have to get decrypting software (DeCss), and it takes like 6-7 hours to decrypt a DVD movie. If you want to burn the movie in full mpeg 4 quality,
Click to expand...

DVD's are mpeg 2 not mpeg 4, also storing lots of data on DVD's is easier specially when you get sick of burning tons of cd-r's.

I'm waiting though because there going to get cheaper and faster.
 
exatcly 1 dvd with 4.7 GB of data is much better then 6 CDs.

You will eventually burn that 1 DVD faster than you can burn those 6 CD's too i bet.
 
You have to get decrypting software (DeCss), and it takes like 6-7 hours to decrypt a DVD movie. If you want to burn the movie in full mpeg 4 quality, you will have to put it on multiple DVD-R's, which means you have to get software to split the file. Then when you factor in the high cost of DVD-R's, it's better to just rent the movie!

I don't understand why people would buy a DVD burner just to backup data onto DVD. Why not just put that data onto multiple CD-R's
Click to expand...

1. It takes 10 minutes to rip a DVD movie.

2. DVD movies are MPEG-2, not MPEG-4.

3. It would take 2 DVD-Rs to backup a DVD movie, or you could get it to fit on a single disc with a little work. (just keeping the movie)

4. DVD-R are pretty chep these days, and considering they're equal in size to almost 7 CD-R discs, they're not expensive.

5. If you have a lot of stuff to back up, DVD-Rs will take 1/7 the space of CD-Rs.
 
I think right now it would be more reasonable to buy a few massive 200GB hard drives for extra storage rather than a DVD Burner. The media is just too expensive right now.
 
If you have a use for a DVD burner, and the current drives are priced at a point that makes it worth it to you to make use of the burner, why not get one?

The Sony will cover all your bases (except DVD-RAM, who cares about that anyway?), and it is not terribly expensive, either. And blank media is not THAT expensive. Write-once DVD's are about $3 each, and RW DVD's are a little more than that. I don't think that's a lot, I remember when blank CD-R's cost $10/each, LOL.

I use my HP DVD200i (+R/RW) to back up data, make DVD's out of camcorder DV, etc.

I haven't heard of anyone coming out with DVD-9 (dual-layer) recorders anytime soon. No, make that anytime at all. The only thing you can count on is that the drives will get cheaper and faster, but you could wait forever if you are waiting for cheaper and faster, know what I mean. At some point you have to decide if the technology is usefull and when the price makes it worth it FOR YOU.
 
I just bought a stack of 100 good quality DVD-Rs for $80.00. If you compare the storage amount to CD-Rs, they are cheaper.
I have used them to back-up my PS2 games, and for converting my old VHS tapes to DVD.
The only reason that I would hold off right now is because the writers will be able to do 4X as soon as the media is available. Also I read that LiteOn will be comeing out with a writer next year. 😉

fishingeek
 
If you have a use for a DVD burner, and the current drives are priced at a point that makes it worth it to you to make use of the burner, why not get one?
Click to expand...
Agreed.

The Sony will cover all your bases (except DVD-RAM, who cares about that anyway?), and it is not terribly expensive, either.
Click to expand...
As I've said before, the Sony simply duplicates the same functions. +R pretty much does the same thing as DVD-R, and +RW pretty much does the same thing as DVD-RW. DVD-RAM is OTOH unique. It allows OS-level drag and drop support, like a great big zip disk, without need for extra packet writing drivers to muck up the OS and burning software. Now, this may not be useful for some people, but it's very useful for others. ie. I'd only buy the Sony if it offered other advantages like faster speed or lower price.

I think dvd burners are a waste of money right now. The only good use for them now is to make copies of movies, but this isn't as simple as burning MP3's. You have to get decrypting software (DeCss), and it takes like 6-7 hours to decrypt a DVD movie. If you want to burn the movie in full mpeg 4 quality, you will have to put it on multiple DVD-R's, which means you have to get software to split the file. Then when you factor in the high cost of DVD-R's, it's better to just rent the movie!

I don't understand why people would buy a DVD burner just to backup data onto DVD. Why not just put that data onto multiple CD-R's; they are a fraction of the price and just as effective. I was excited about DVD burners when I first heard about them, but the more I learned, the more turned off I became.
Click to expand...
Uh. Most of us don't buy this stuff to pirate movies. CD-Rs are cheap, but you should realize that 1 DVD-R holds 6-7 CD-Rs. CD-Rs for some people (like me) just don't cut it anymore. They're even worse when you're backing up video segments.

By the way, my laptop on order comes with a software DVD install disc. I'll need a DVD burner simply to back up the disc. 😛

I think right now it would be more reasonable to buy a few massive 200GB hard drives for extra storage rather than a DVD Burner.
Click to expand...
Use both. Hard drives for local ongoing backups and DVD for off-site storage. ie. Burn the important stuff to some sort of DVD format and then try to remember to store those somewhere away from my computer. My digital pix and stuff are very important to me.

By the way, for copying TV shows off the air: It's much better to just get a standalone recorder. I have one of these as well, and it's awesome. It's just like a VCR, with MPEG-2 encoding in real-time and excellent quality (as long as you use high bitrates). Doing this sort of stuff with a PC-based system would be a big pain in the @ss.
 
Originally posted by: Eug

By the way, for copying TV shows off the air: It's much better to just get a standalone recorder. I have one of these as well, and it's awesome. It's just like a VCR, with MPEG-2 encoding in real-time and excellent quality (as long as you use high bitrates). Doing this sort of stuff with a PC-based system would be a big pain in the @ss.
Click to expand...

true, but those stand alone DVD players/recorders are like 900 dollars right now as i saw at best buy. To much for me at this point, but i would love one when they get into the $300 range. Plus i don't really mind bringing it into my computer. I have a system dowm pretty good recording directly to my DV cam, then firewire into my computer, edit out commercials and other jazz encode into VCD. now i would just encode into DVD, but everything else is still the same.

So i'm really fancnying that Sony model, maybe for christmas if i'm lucky 😀
 
Originally posted by: yeedog

true, but those stand alone DVD players/recorders are like 900 dollars right now as i saw at best buy.
Click to expand...
Panasonic DMR-E30 standalone DVD-RAM/DVD-R recorder with progressive scan $521.95 at ecost.com.

I have one of these. It rulez. 😀 The one you saw probably is either the Philips, or else the Panasonic one with the built-in 40 GB hard drive.

The coolest feature is recording and watching something off the SAME DVD-RAM at the same time. ie. I set the machine to record a show at 8 pm to 9 pm. I arrive home at 8:15 pm and wanna watch the show. No problem.... I just press play and start watching it, while it's still recording.

Later on I can load it into my PC for conversion to another video type or editing. Very cool.
 
I remember paying $200 for a Plextor 12/10/32A granted I got a great deal (most people were paying $300) and the Plextor was awesome.

Now a days you can buy a 48x CD-RW for $20.

I'm going to wait, a long long time (at least 2-3 years).
 
I also remember paying over $200 for a 8X Plextor and trying to find cdrs under a $1 a piece. The 12x drives were still a couple of months off.

Well ~1 year later the cdrs dropped to pennies and the 12x models were also dropping like a rock. So give the dvd-+=r a year and they will also be dirt cheap. I also read somewhere that Toshiba has a DVD recorder coming out in Japan for about $200 ameican and it is 8x. This will force all the other companies to follow. By next xmas, everyone will be looking for an 8x or 16x dvd recorder and the recordables will be around a $.25 each, IMO.
 
Originally posted by: optoman
I also remember paying over $200 for a 8X Plextor and trying to find cdrs under a $1 a piece. The 12x drives were still a couple of months off.

Well ~1 year later the cdrs dropped to pennies and the 12x models were also dropping like a rock. So give the dvd-+=r a year and they will also be dirt cheap. I also read somewhere that Toshiba has a DVD recorder coming out in Japan for about $200 ameican and it is 8x. This will force all the other companies to follow. By next xmas, everyone will be looking for an 8x or 16x dvd recorder and the recordables will be around a $.25 each, IMO.
Click to expand...

I think you're about right. I'm also waiting for the DVD standards to be FINALIZED for both DVD Burners and home DVD Players.
 
Originally posted by: Eug
Originally posted by: yeedog

true, but those stand alone DVD players/recorders are like 900 dollars right now as i saw at best buy.
Click to expand...
Panasonic DMR-E30 standalone DVD-RAM/DVD-R recorder with progressive scan $521.95 at ecost.com.

I have one of these. It rulez. 😀 The one you saw probably is either the Philips, or else the Panasonic one with the built-in 40 GB hard drive.

The coolest feature is recording and watching something off the SAME DVD-RAM at the same time. ie. I set the machine to record a show at 8 pm to 9 pm. I arrive home at 8:15 pm and wanna watch the show. No problem.... I just press play and start watching it, while it's still recording.

Later on I can load it into my PC for conversion to another video type or editing. Very cool.
Click to expand...


Wow nice i didn't think they were that low in price. I don't remember what i saw at best buy, but the $520 is still a high price for me since i'm just a college student. It's good to know that they are getting cheaper tho.

So now can you connect your computer to those stand alone units so you can burn to dvd from your computer? Thus making copies of moves i take with my DV Cam for others to have with fancy menus and all. I would think no as that's why we have DVD burners for the computer.

Tho just having a unit like this one would be great for VHS -> DVD conversions. One could get it to DVD format easily and then copy the files on to the computer to edit or make fancy menus if there will be more then 1 movie on the dvd. Then burn it witha burner or maybe even be able to burn with that DVD player/recorder.

A question about the recording times on that panasonic site. Are all those quality formats DVD or is it just SP?

I agree with what the others say that this time next year we will be swimming in DVD burners galore, tho 1 years is a long time to wait! lol
 
DVD burners will probably never hit 9.2 GB on one side. cuz these are dual layer DVDs, which take more expensive machines to accomplish which require a more controlled environment than that of a PC.

now is the time to start considering DVD writers. with sony's new drive, and dropping prices, it;s time for mid-paced adopters to start buying them up. and they are. mid-paced adopters being those who dont buy when a product is new... DVD writers have dropped by around 50% from when they started shipping on mass. the first DVD-RAM drives being around $600.

it does take a good long time to write to a DVD... at 1xDVD, it will take about an hour to fill a 4.6 GB disc.

1x is about 1300 to 1350 KB/s, that's for read and write (any format).
2.4x is about 3000 to 3240 KB/s
4x is about 5200 to 5400 KB/s

1x is common (if no speed is labeled, it's 1x), 2.4x is not as common, 4x is very new (+rw, +r only i think, HARD TO FIND).

the fastest CDR burner can only manage 650MB in about 2 to 3 mins. or 4 to 6 mins for 1300MB. so that's like 360 seconds for 1300MB. burning at DVD 1x, it will take roughly 1000 seconds to burn 1300MB. so, fastest CDR beats 1x DVD+-R/W. but at 4x, it takes 250 seconds to burn 1300, which is slightly faster. only few drives do 4x DVD.

--

the technology is not a few years off. in fact, in a few years, DVDs may go away. DVD was obsolete when it came out, low res compared to HDTV.
 
If you really want a DVD burner, you should perhaps wait for the TEAC DVR-50E drive. It is supposedly a rebadged Pioneer DVR-A05 and it will supposedly retail for around $199 (that is the price it is currently being sold in Japan). Here is the link.
 
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