Drop a bullet vs. Shoot a bullet

[RedRooster]

Originally posted by: LeiZaK
not enough information

What else do you need?
These two idiots are arguing about it here, and I have to shut one of them up. :laugh:

 

[91TTZ]

Originally posted by: gigapet

Originally posted by: Kyteland
The dropped one. Since the earth is a sphere, and not flat, the fired bullet will actually have farther to fall than the dropped one.

Note that this assumes that it is fired in a vacuum.

gravity doesnt change because the earth is curved. four feet from the ground in LA is the ssame distance as it is in maine

No, he has a point there. While the gravity is the same, if you held a long, straight ruler out in front of you, level, the farther it extends, the higher it would be off the ground (since the ruler is straight and the Earth curves).

So the bullet would have to fall farther since the earth's surface is not flat.

 

[Kyteland]

Originally posted by: RaynorWolfcastle

Originally posted by: Kyteland
The dropped one. Since the earth is a sphere, and not flat, the fired bullet will actually have farther to fall than the dropped one.

Note that this assumes that it is fired in a vacuum.

LOL, you want to ignore air resistance and the fact that terrain isn't flat but you want to take into account the fact that the Earth's surface is curved?

You must be a mathematician or a physicist

DING DING DING DING DING DING DING DING DING!

 

[neutralizer]

Ideally, the same time since both experience the same acceleration due to gravity and will have the same velocity in the y direction.

 

[gigapet]

Originally posted by: 91TTZ

Originally posted by: gigapet

Originally posted by: Kyteland
The dropped one. Since the earth is a sphere, and not flat, the fired bullet will actually have farther to fall than the dropped one.

Note that this assumes that it is fired in a vacuum.

gravity doesnt change because the earth is curved. four feet from the ground in LA is the ssame distance as it is in maine

No, he has a point there. While the gravity is the same, if you held a long, straight ruler out in front of you, level, the farther it extends, the higher it would be off the ground (since the ruler is straight and the Earth curves).

So the bullet would have to fall farther since the earth's surface is not flat.

so at some point during the journey of the bullet the rate at which it falls is equal or less than zero?

 

[Kyteland]

Originally posted by: 91TTZ

Originally posted by: gigapet

Originally posted by: Kyteland
The dropped one. Since the earth is a sphere, and not flat, the fired bullet will actually have farther to fall than the dropped one.

Note that this assumes that it is fired in a vacuum.

gravity doesnt change because the earth is curved. four feet from the ground in LA is the ssame distance as it is in maine

No, he has a point there. While the gravity is the same, if you held a long, straight ruler out in front of you, level, the farther it extends, the higher it would be off the ground.

So the bullet would have to fall farther since the earth's surface is not flat.

Very good.

What I'm curious about is the affect from air resistance. That would be different for every shape of bullet. Is there any kind of shear that forces it up/down? A Jet can lift off the ground when moving fast enough and the flaps are in the right position. Can something similar happen to a bullet before air resistance slows it substantialy?

I honestly have no idea.

 

[Saulbadguy]

Which way is the gun pointed?

 

[RaynorWolfcastle]

Originally posted by: gigapet

Originally posted by: 91TTZ

Originally posted by: gigapet

Originally posted by: Kyteland
The dropped one. Since the earth is a sphere, and not flat, the fired bullet will actually have farther to fall than the dropped one.

Note that this assumes that it is fired in a vacuum.

gravity doesnt change because the earth is curved. four feet from the ground in LA is the ssame distance as it is in maine

No, he has a point there. While the gravity is the same, if you held a long, straight ruler out in front of you, level, the farther it extends, the higher it would be off the ground (since the ruler is straight and the Earth curves).

So the bullet would have to fall farther since the earth's surface is not flat.

so at some point during the journey of the bullet the rate at which it falls is equal or less than zero?

To give you an extreme case, why don't satellites fall to the ground (ignoring the occasional boosts, necessary because of air resistance)?

 

[91TTZ]

Originally posted by: neutralizer
Ideally, the same time since both experience the same acceleration due to gravity and will have the same velocity in the y direction.

Yes, but since the Earth is round, the farther the bullet travels, the more curvature the Earth will have under it.

Remember, the barrel is pointing in a straight line... it's not actually completely level with the Earth's surface.

For this question to get the answer he wants:

1. Gravity must still exist
2. There must be a vacuum
3. The earth must be flat.

 

[spacejamz]

can someone explain in layman's terms why the bullet fired from the gun travels at the same speed as the bullet that is simply dropped?

The charge expelling the round out of the barrel would seem to increase the velocity of the round...(the term muzzle velocity also comes to mind)...

Thanks..

 

[Alchemist99]

I would think velocity would have some resistance to gravity, objects in motion etc, but I have no knowledge of physics.


Edit: for grammer

 

[stringcheeseincident]

Originally posted by: Saulbadguy
Which way is the gun pointed?

hopefully towards his face

 

[neutralizer]

Originally posted by: spacejamz

can someone explain in layman's terms why the bullet fired from the gun travels at the same speed as the bullet that is simply dropped?

The charge expelling the round out of the barrel would seem to increase the velocity of the round...(the term muzzle velocity also comes to mind)...

Thanks..

The reason the bullet drops is because of gravity. Since gravity pulls in one direction, down. The velocity of both bullets is pulled the same amount because they are dropped from the same height.

 

[jjzelinski]

Why would velocity have any effect on gravity? The only way I think it might is through a very a subtly increase in air resistance as the bullet compresses it during it travel.

 

[gigapet]

Originally posted by: RaynorWolfcastle

Originally posted by: gigapet

Originally posted by: 91TTZ

Originally posted by: gigapet

Originally posted by: Kyteland
The dropped one. Since the earth is a sphere, and not flat, the fired bullet will actually have farther to fall than the dropped one.

Note that this assumes that it is fired in a vacuum.

gravity doesnt change because the earth is curved. four feet from the ground in LA is the ssame distance as it is in maine

No, he has a point there. While the gravity is the same, if you held a long, straight ruler out in front of you, level, the farther it extends, the higher it would be off the ground (since the ruler is straight and the Earth curves).

So the bullet would have to fall farther since the earth's surface is not flat.

so at some point during the journey of the bullet the rate at which it falls is equal or less than zero?

To give you an extreme case, why don't satellites fall to the ground (ignoring the occasional boosts, necessary because of air resistance)?

It is always in a state of falling it doesnt hit the ground because there is no...ground to hit because its in outer space....

 

[Gravity]

Originally posted by: fs5
do your own homework.

ya

 

[stevens]

Im pretty sure that the spin put on the bullet by the rifling of the barrel will keep it in the air longer. But if rifling is not a factor, they will hit the ground at the same time.

 

[Leros]

Originally posted by: spacejamz

can someone explain in layman's terms why the bullet fired from the gun travels at the same speed as the bullet that is simply dropped?

The charge expelling the round out of the barrel would seem to increase the velocity of the round...(the term muzzle velocity also comes to mind)...

Thanks..

They are talking about the vertical speed of the bullet. Assuming the bullet is fired perfectly parallel to the ground, it will have no downward forces, besides gravity. The bullet being dropped had no downward forces, except gravity.

Does that explain it to you?

 

[Confused]

They both reach the ground at the same time.

 

[91TTZ]

Originally posted by: gigapet

so at some point during the journey of the bullet the rate at which it falls is equal or less than zero?

That depends on the speed.

1. Both objects will accelerate towards the Earth at the same rate.

2. The stationary object will fall straight down, impacting the Earth directly under it

3. The speeding bullet will arc, with an orbit (trajectory) dictated by gravity's strength and the bullet's speed. On Earth, the speeding bullet will still impact the Earth's surface since the trajectory will take the bullet in a descending orbit that drops below the Earth's surface. It will hit.

4. However, if you shot the bullet at 17,500 miles per hour, the bullet would never touch the ground, since its rate of descent will match the curvature of the Earth. It would always be "falling" and never hit the ground, since the ground it's vertically falling towards is constantly curving away from it, due to the horizontal speed.

 

[spacejamz]

Originally posted by: neutralizer

Originally posted by: spacejamz

can someone explain in layman's terms why the bullet fired from the gun travels at the same speed as the bullet that is simply dropped?

The charge expelling the round out of the barrel would seem to increase the velocity of the round...(the term muzzle velocity also comes to mind)...

Thanks..

The reason the bullet drops is because of gravity. Since gravity pulls in one direction, down. The velocity of both bullets is pulled the same amount because they are dropped from the same height.

that still doesn't make sense...the bullet being fired would have a faster rate of acceleration than the bullet dropped...

 

[MrDudeMan]

Originally posted by: gigapet

It is always in a state of falling it doesnt hit the ground because there is no...ground to hit because its in outer space....

no its because their orbit is giving them a velocity that is throwing them away from earth at all times, but since gravity holds it in, they stay in orbit without much decay.

 

[PricklyPete]

Originally posted by: gigapet
barring no air resistance and gravity remains constant they hit the ground at the exact same time.

 

[91TTZ]

Originally posted by: stevens
Im pretty sure that the spin put on the bullet by the rifling of the barrel will keep it in the air longer. But if rifling is not a factor, they will hit the ground at the same time.

Wrong. That has nothing to do with it. Whether a horizontal or rotational direction exists, the vertical motion will stay the same.

 

[Rogue]

All of you are full of $hit. Let's remember that the sound of a rifle or gun firing consists of two things, the explosion from the powder in the casing which accelerates the bullet well beyond terminal velocity and the sound of the round actually accelerating past the speed of sound which happens almost simultaneously. Now, maybe I'm way off here, but last I checked, the average bulled fired from a gun is a hell of a lot faster than something dropped from anywhere.