Driving through Texas can be hazardous to your wallet if you're black

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halik

Lifer
Oct 10, 2000
25,696
1
81
Originally posted by: Phokus
Originally posted by: Ronstang
Did they really target mostly Black people or were they more likely to fall for this shit and comply?

I'm pretty sure they're more used to getting harassed by the police. A white motorist would probably have his lawyer on speed dial.

No,
black or white you have the same option to raise a lawyer shit storm if something like that happens.

I would guess that black people are more scared of the police, so they can be pushed to play along? I'd guess it's an income and education thing more than anything else - if the cops tried that on someone like Tiger Woods, he'd a bus full of lawyers on the premise within 10mins.
 

manowar821

Diamond Member
Mar 1, 2007
6,063
0
0
Originally posted by: Ocguy31
Walking through parts of LA and every other big city at night is dangerous if you are white.

Walking through certain parts of town as a Mexican can get you killed by a black.


Racism is everywhere, on all sides.

Except the racism in this case is being acted on by SUPPOSEDLY highly-respectable members of society who we place our trust in. This isn't just disgusting like most racism, in this case it's something we SHOULD be able to act on. Just fire the pigs who do it and black-flag them from ever having a position of authority again.
 

CitizenKain

Diamond Member
Jul 6, 2000
4,480
14
76
Originally posted by: JeffreyLebowski
Originally posted by: 0marTheZealot
Originally posted by: Ocguy31
Walking through parts of LA and every other big city at night is dangerous if you are white.

Walking through certain parts of town as a Mexican can get you killed by a black.


Racism is everywhere, on all sides.

Those are private citizens acting in a bad manner.

This are state officials committing a crime.

The difference is subtle, but it's there.

And secondly, just because racism exists is no reason to accept it. Cancer exists, we should just accept our fate yes?


Here in is the main culprit behind racism. Idiots like you. So you say those are private citizens acting in a bad manner. They're killing people. Last I checked it's a crime, BUT if you're black, you can kill a white person and it's not a hate crime, if you're white, it automatically becomes a hate crime if you kill a black guy.

Racism exists, and will always exist as long as there is more than one race.
What I want to know is why were these people driving with that much cash on hand?
I can understand going to the casinos and winning a few hundred bucks, but shit, those cops must be clairvoint if they can seem to stop every car that has a black person in it with thousands of dollars of valuables with them. Hell I don't think I have more than $30 worth of stuff in my truck. Now the $600 gun on my hip might make them reconsider trying to shake me down.

Yea, you crying all over it would make it hard to confiscate from you.
 

Fern

Elite Member
Sep 30, 2003
26,907
174
106
Originally posted by: Phokus
-snip-
Republicans: Now that Barack Obama is president, there's no such thing as racism anymore, get over it!

Democrats: :roll:

No but seriously, a lot of Texas is racist as hell.

I haven't been to TX in a long, long time, but I was there back in the late 70's and my firm impression at that time was that the racism that did exist was targeted at Hispanics, not Blacks. That's what even the black people I met said.

So, while I think claims of racism, while natural given the info in the article, are a bit premature.

From reading the article there was at least one other person given the 'shake-down' treatment who wasn't black.

No way to tell if they are targeting blacks or not. I rather suspect they are 'equal opportunity' shake-down artists.

Might just be that not so many white people either fall for it or carry large amounts of cash - that's what credit cards are for. I suspect CC's are a little less common for certain segments of the black community.

Lord only knows how many Hispanics were shaken down. Around here they carry large amounts of cash (no CCs) and aren't unacustomed to cops shaking them down - they aint' gonna complain. Geesh, the cops may even pocket the 'goodies' leaving behind no records at all.

Again, this strikes me as racketeering and I hope the feds get on it.

Fern
 

SagaLore

Elite Member
Dec 18, 2001
24,036
21
81
Originally posted by: Phokus
Republicans: Now that Barack Obama is president, there's no such thing as racism anymore, get over it!

Why would you post this? Do you seriously think this is useful commentary for the topic?
 

0marTheZealot

Golden Member
Apr 5, 2004
1,692
0
0
Originally posted by: JeffreyLebowski
Originally posted by: 0marTheZealot
Originally posted by: Ocguy31
Walking through parts of LA and every other big city at night is dangerous if you are white.

Walking through certain parts of town as a Mexican can get you killed by a black.


Racism is everywhere, on all sides.

Those are private citizens acting in a bad manner.

This are state officials committing a crime.

The difference is subtle, but it's there.

And secondly, just because racism exists is no reason to accept it. Cancer exists, we should just accept our fate yes?


Here in is the main culprit behind racism. Idiots like you. So you say those are private citizens acting in a bad manner. They're killing people. Last I checked it's a crime, BUT if you're black, you can kill a white person and it's not a hate crime, if you're white, it automatically becomes a hate crime if you kill a black guy.

Racism exists, and will always exist as long as there is more than one race.
What I want to know is why were these people driving with that much cash on hand?
I can understand going to the casinos and winning a few hundred bucks, but shit, those cops must be clairvoint if they can seem to stop every car that has a black person in it with thousands of dollars of valuables with them. Hell I don't think I have more than $30 worth of stuff in my truck. Now the $600 gun on my hip might make them reconsider trying to shake me down.


Addressing paragraph #1, I never condone the actions of either people. I simply pointed out the subtle differences. Secondly, black men can be charged with hate crimes if the intent is shown to be motivated by race (or other buzz words in the law). A white man killing a black man is not automatically a hate crime, but if there are other factors, then it can be elevated to a hate crime. As an aside, I dislike the idea of hate crimes simply because it is legislating thought.

Secondly, there is no law against carrying large amounts of cash and believe it or not, many people don't have bank accounts. This is blaming the victim and is no different than blaming a woman for getting raped because she was dressed a certain way. Finally, brandishing your gun is the quickest way to a closed casket funeral when confronted by police, so yea, it will make them think twice about getting your truck/stuff because now it's a shooting scene and not a traffic stop.
 

JD50

Lifer
Sep 4, 2005
11,929
2,931
136
I love how the OP's only comment on the article was a strawman about Republicans. Is this what passes for the required commentary in the OP these days?
 

nobodyknows

Diamond Member
Sep 28, 2008
5,474
0
0
Originally posted by: Phokus
Originally posted by: Jaskalas
Originally posted by: Phokus
Originally posted by: Ocguy31
Walking through parts of LA and every other big city at night is dangerous if you are white.

Walking through certain parts of town as a Mexican can get you killed by a black.


Racism is everywhere, on all sides.

Luckily, the police leave white people alone.

Are you suggesting all the police are white?

No they just treat people different based on things like race and age.

And of course if they are caught with drugs on them or not.
 

Balt

Lifer
Mar 12, 2000
12,673
482
126
Originally posted by: bamacre
Corrupt police aren't just in Texas...

http://www.baltimoresun.com/ne...4feb04,0,7029669.story

The federal suit is the second filed since March in U.S. District Court in Baltimore alleging "widespread and persistent" civil rights violations by police officers who belonged to an elite "Special Enforcement Team" that worked mainly in the southeastern part of the city.

Damn you, McNulty.
 

Estrella

Senior member
Jan 29, 2006
900
0
76
Originally posted by: Phokus
http://www.latimes.com/news/na...09mar11,0,507135.story

A lawsuit alleges that the town's police pull over motorists -- especially African Americans -- and extort money and valuables by threatening criminal charges or worse.
By Howard Witt
March 11, 2009
Reporting from Tenaha, Texas -- You can drive into this dusty fleck of a town near the Texas-Louisiana state line if you're African American, but you might not be able to drive out of it -- at least not with your car, your cash, your jewelry or other valuables.

That's because the police here allegedly have found a way to strip motorists, many of them black, of their property without ever charging them with a crime. Instead they offer out-of-towners a grim choice: Sign over your belongings to the town, or face felony charges of money laundering or other serious crimes.



* Crime or no crime, motorists pay
Crime or no crime, motorists pay

More than 140 people reluctantly accepted that deal from June 2006 to June 2008, according to court records. Among them were a black grandmother from Akron, Ohio, who surrendered $4,000 in cash after Tenaha police pulled her over, and an interracial couple from Houston, who gave up more than $6,000 after police threatened to seize their children and put them into foster care, the court documents show. Neither the grandmother nor the couple were charged with or convicted of any crime.

Officials in Tenaha, along a heavily traveled state highway connecting Houston with several popular gambling destinations in Louisiana, say they are engaged in a battle against drug trafficking, and they call the search-and-seizure practice a legitimate use of the state's asset-forfeiture law. That law permits local police agencies to keep drug money and other property used in the commission of a crime and add the proceeds to their budgets.

"We try to enforce the law here," said George Bowers, mayor of the town of about 1,100 residents, where boarded-up businesses outnumber open ones and City Hall sports a broken window. "We're not doing this to raise money. That's all I'm going to say at this point."

But civil rights lawyers call Tenaha's practice something else: highway robbery. The attorneys have filed a federal class-action lawsuit seeking unspecified damages and a halt to what they contend is an unconstitutional perversion of the law's intent, used primarily against African Americans who have done nothing wrong.

Tenaha officials "have developed an illegal 'stop and seize' practice of targeting, stopping, detaining, searching, and often seizing property from apparently nonwhite citizens and those traveling with nonwhite citizens," asserts the lawsuit, which was filed in U.S. District Court in the Eastern District of Texas.

The property seizures are not happening just in Tenaha. In southern parts of Texas near the Mexican border, for example, Latinos allege that they are being singled out.

According to a prominent Texas state legislator, police agencies across the state are wielding the asset-forfeiture law more aggressively to supplement their shrinking operating budgets.

"If used properly, it's a good law-enforcement tool to see that crime doesn't pay," said Democratic state Sen. John Whitmire, chairman of the Senate's Criminal Justice Committee. "But in this instance, where people are being pulled over and their property is taken with no charges filed and no convictions, I think that's theft."



Money, minorities

David Guillory, an attorney in nearby Nacogdoches who filed the federal lawsuit, said he combed through Shelby County court records from 2006 to 2008 and discovered nearly 200 cases in which Tenaha police seized cash and property from motorists. In about 50 of the cases, suspects were charged with drug possession.

But in 147 others, Guillory said the court records showed, the police seized cash, jewelry, cellphones and sometimes even automobiles from motorists but never found any contraband or charged them with any crime. Of those, Guillory said he managed to contact 40 of the motorists directly -- and discovered that all but one of them were black.

"The whole thing is disproportionately targeted toward minorities, particularly African Americans," Guillory said. "Every one of these people is pulled over and told they did something, like, 'You drove too close to the white line.' That's not in the penal code, but it sounds plausible. None of these people have been charged with a crime; none were engaged in anything that looked criminal. The sole factor is that they had something that looked valuable."

In some cases, police used the fact that motorists were carrying large amounts of cash as evidence that they must have been involved in laundering drug money, even though Guillory said each of the drivers he contacted could account for where the money had come from and why they were carrying it -- such as for a gambling trip to Shreveport, La., or to purchase a used car from a private seller.

Once the motorists were detained, the police and the Shelby County district attorney quickly drew up legal papers presenting them with an option: Waive their rights to their cash and property or face felony charges for crimes such as money laundering -- and the prospect of having to hire a lawyer and return to Shelby County multiple times to contest the charges in court.



Apparently routine

The process apparently is so routine in Tenaha that Guillory discovered pre-signed and pre-notarized police affidavits with blank spaces left for an officer to fill in a description of the property being seized.

Jennifer Boatright, her husband and two young children -- a mixed-race family -- were traveling from Houston to visit relatives in East Texas in April 2007 when Tenaha police pulled them over, alleging that they were driving in a left-turn lane.

After searching the car, the officers discovered what Boatright said was a gift for her sister: a small, unused glass pipe made for smoking marijuana. Although they found no drugs or other contraband, the police seized $6,037 that Boatright said the family was carrying to purchase a used car -- and then threatened to turn their children, ages 10 and 1, over to Child Protective Services if the couple didn't agree to sign over their right to their cash.

"It was give them the money or they were taking our kids," Boatright said. "They suggested that we never bring it up again. We figured we better give them our cash and get the hell out of there."

Several months later, after Boatright and her husband contacted an attorney, Tenaha officials returned their money but offered no explanation or apology. The couple remain plaintiffs in the federal lawsuit.

Except for Tenaha's mayor, none of the defendants in the federal lawsuit, including Shelby County Dist. Atty. Lynda Russell and two Tenaha police officers, responded to requests for comment about their search-and-seizure practices. Lawyers for the defendants also declined to comment, as did several of the plaintiffs in the lawsuit.

But Whitmire says he doesn't need to await the suit's outcome to try to fix what he regards as a statewide problem. On Monday, he introduced a bill in the state Legislature that would require police to go before a judge before attempting to seize property under the asset-forfeiture law -- and ultimately Whitmire hopes to tighten the law further so that law-enforcement officials will be allowed to seize property only after a suspect is charged and convicted in a court.

"The law has gotten away from what was intended, which was to take the profits of a bad guy's crime spree and use it for additional crime fighting," Whitmire said. "Now it's largely being used to pay police salaries -- and it's being abused because you don't even have to be a bad guy to lose your property."

Republicans: Now that Barack Obama is president, there's no such thing as racism anymore, get over it!

Democrats: :roll:

No but seriously, a lot of Texas is racist as hell.

A lot of RURAL Texas is racist as hell.
 

Robor

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
16,979
0
76
Originally posted by: JeffreyLebowski
Here in is the main culprit behind racism. Idiots like you. So you say those are private citizens acting in a bad manner. They're killing people. Last I checked it's a crime, BUT if you're black, you can kill a white person and it's not a hate crime, if you're white, it automatically becomes a hate crime if you kill a black guy.

BS.

Originally posted by: JeffreyLebowski
Racism exists, and will always exist as long as there is more than one race.
What I want to know is why were these people driving with that much cash on hand?
I can understand going to the casinos and winning a few hundred bucks, but shit, those cops must be clairvoint if they can seem to stop every car that has a black person in it with thousands of dollars of valuables with them. Hell I don't think I have more than $30 worth of stuff in my truck. Now the $600 gun on my hip might make them reconsider trying to shake me down.

Classic example of internet tough guy.

 

alchemize

Lifer
Mar 24, 2000
11,486
0
0
Originally posted by: JD50
I love how the OP's only comment on the article was a strawman about Republicans. Is this what passes for the required commentary in the OP these days?
It's Phokus, the "libertarian", what do you expect?
 

rasczak

Lifer
Jan 29, 2005
10,437
23
81
Originally posted by: Schadenfroh
This reminds me of a trip to Mexico that one of my cousin's friends went on (~1980s).

MPO = Mexican Police Officer
CF = Cousin's Friend

Pulled over by Mexican police, police officer walks up:
MPO: I really like my new truck.
CF: ???
MPO: This really is a nice truck and I am going to enjoy it very much.
CF: Uhh, this is my truck
MPO: No greengo, you do not understand... this is my truck
CF: So, what will it take for me to keep my truck? Some cash?
MOP: Yes

this is why i don't go to tijuana or mexico for that matter.
 

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
39,911
33,562
136
Originally posted by: Ocguy31
Walking through parts of LA and every other big city at night is dangerous if you are white.

Walking through certain parts of town as a Mexican can get you killed by a black.


Racism is everywhere, on all sides.

There has never been a story of police targeting white people only. False argument.

BTW - Those sections of LA are hazardous for black people too.

 

alchemize

Lifer
Mar 24, 2000
11,486
0
0
Originally posted by: HomerJS
Originally posted by: Ocguy31
Walking through parts of LA and every other big city at night is dangerous if you are white.

Walking through certain parts of town as a Mexican can get you killed by a black.


Racism is everywhere, on all sides.

There has never been a story of police targeting white people only. False argument.

BTW - Those sections of LA are hazardous for black people too.
Phish concert? :)

 

Linflas

Lifer
Jan 30, 2001
15,395
78
91
OP title:
Driving through Texas can be hazardous to your wallet if you're black

Tenaha area 4.0 sq mi , population 1,046.

Texas area 268,820 sq mi, population 24,326,974

Pretty sure that 99.9% of blacks or any other race can drive through Texas and not even be aware there is a place called Tenaha so it is hardly "hazardous to your wallet" driving through Texas if you are black or any other hue.
 

Pliablemoose

Lifer
Oct 11, 1999
25,195
0
56
I do not condone the confiscation laws or entrapment or the virtual highway robbery that may be going on there, but, I have to wonder why these people paid up rather than go to court? Hmmm...
 

jonks

Lifer
Feb 7, 2005
13,918
20
81
Originally posted by: Pliablemoose
I do not condone the confiscation laws or entrapment or the virtual highway robbery that may be going on there, but, I have to wonder why these people paid up rather than go to court? Hmmm...

Yeah, that grandmother was probably smuggling illegal adult diapers. Jesus christ. You do know that many loan and job applications ask if people were ever arrested or charged with a crime even if ultimately acquitted? And they did go to court, they're suing now.
 

nobodyknows

Diamond Member
Sep 28, 2008
5,474
0
0
Originally posted by: Pliablemoose
I do not condone the confiscation laws or entrapment or the virtual highway robbery that may be going on there, but, I have to wonder why these people paid up rather than go to court? Hmmm...

Obviously because they were caught red handed with drugs.
 

nobodyknows

Diamond Member
Sep 28, 2008
5,474
0
0
Originally posted by: jonks
Originally posted by: Pliablemoose
I do not condone the confiscation laws or entrapment or the virtual highway robbery that may be going on there, but, I have to wonder why these people paid up rather than go to court? Hmmm...

Yeah, that grandmother was probably smuggling illegal adult diapers. Jesus christ. You do know that many loan and job applications ask if people were ever arrested or charged with a crime even if ultimately acquitted? And they did go to court, they're suing now.

Are you really this gullible?

 

jonks

Lifer
Feb 7, 2005
13,918
20
81
Originally posted by: nobodyknows
Originally posted by: jonks
Originally posted by: Pliablemoose
I do not condone the confiscation laws or entrapment or the virtual highway robbery that may be going on there, but, I have to wonder why these people paid up rather than go to court? Hmmm...

Yeah, that grandmother was probably smuggling illegal adult diapers. Jesus christ. You do know that many loan and job applications ask if people were ever arrested or charged with a crime even if ultimately acquitted? And they did go to court, they're suing now.

Are you really this gullible?

I don't know what that means, I tried to look it up but it wasn't on wikipedia.

Are you denying that cops apparently blackmailed motorists for cash, jewelry, cellphones, cars in exchange for letting them walk?
 

nobodyknows

Diamond Member
Sep 28, 2008
5,474
0
0
Originally posted by: jonks
Originally posted by: nobodyknows
Originally posted by: jonks
Originally posted by: Pliablemoose
I do not condone the confiscation laws or entrapment or the virtual highway robbery that may be going on there, but, I have to wonder why these people paid up rather than go to court? Hmmm...

Yeah, that grandmother was probably smuggling illegal adult diapers. Jesus christ. You do know that many loan and job applications ask if people were ever arrested or charged with a crime even if ultimately acquitted? And they did go to court, they're suing now.

Are you really this gullible?

I don't know what that means, I tried to look it up but it wasn't on wikipedia.

Are you denying that cops apparently blackmailed motorists for cash, jewelry, cellphones, cars in exchange for letting them walk?

Yes, I deny that. It was the city doing it. :p

Why would anybody turn over thousands of dollars if they weren't caught red handed?

Now if you want to get "all uppity" about oit then complain about racial profiling but to act as if these people weren't soing something wrong is dishonest.
 

alchemize

Lifer
Mar 24, 2000
11,486
0
0
Was "grandma" carrying thousands of dollars?

edit:

After searching the car, the officers discovered what Boatright said was a gift for her sister: a small, unused glass pipe made for smoking marijuana. Although they found no drugs or other contraband, the police seized $6,037 that Boatright said the family was carrying to purchase a used car -- and then threatened to turn their children, ages 10 and 1, over to Child Protective Services if the couple didn't agree to sign over their right to their cash.

They probably were involved in the drug trade, but seizures like this are bullshit and deny due process. While not exclusive to Clinton, you can primarily thank him for the whole seizure mentality that exploded under his watch.
 

jonks

Lifer
Feb 7, 2005
13,918
20
81
Originally posted by: nobodyknows
Originally posted by: jonks
Originally posted by: nobodyknows
Originally posted by: jonks
Originally posted by: Pliablemoose
I do not condone the confiscation laws or entrapment or the virtual highway robbery that may be going on there, but, I have to wonder why these people paid up rather than go to court? Hmmm...

Yeah, that grandmother was probably smuggling illegal adult diapers. Jesus christ. You do know that many loan and job applications ask if people were ever arrested or charged with a crime even if ultimately acquitted? And they did go to court, they're suing now.

Are you really this gullible?

I don't know what that means, I tried to look it up but it wasn't on wikipedia.

Are you denying that cops apparently blackmailed motorists for cash, jewelry, cellphones, cars in exchange for letting them walk?

Yes, I deny that. It was the city doing it. :p

Why would anybody turn over thousands of dollars if they weren't caught red handed?

Now if you want to get "all uppity" about oit then complain about racial profiling but to act as if these people weren't soing something wrong is dishonest.

Why did the state return thousands of dollars if it wasn't wrongfully seized? Can play this game all day.

What if a student told her professor she wanted $5,000 or she'd tell people he sexually assaulted her one night during a private tutoring session, when she actually seduced him? I mean, he was innocent, it's not like just being accused of something can have a negative impact on your life or career...

They threatened an interracial couple by saying they'd take their fucking kids away from them. You wouldn't give in at that point if all they wanted was a few thousand dollars and you believed there was a chance the fucking redneck courts might actually back up the cops?
 

nobodyknows

Diamond Member
Sep 28, 2008
5,474
0
0
Originally posted by: jonks
Originally posted by: nobodyknows
Originally posted by: jonks
Originally posted by: nobodyknows
Originally posted by: jonks
Originally posted by: Pliablemoose
I do not condone the confiscation laws or entrapment or the virtual highway robbery that may be going on there, but, I have to wonder why these people paid up rather than go to court? Hmmm...

Yeah, that grandmother was probably smuggling illegal adult diapers. Jesus christ. You do know that many loan and job applications ask if people were ever arrested or charged with a crime even if ultimately acquitted? And they did go to court, they're suing now.

Are you really this gullible?

I don't know what that means, I tried to look it up but it wasn't on wikipedia.

Are you denying that cops apparently blackmailed motorists for cash, jewelry, cellphones, cars in exchange for letting them walk?

Yes, I deny that. It was the city doing it. :p

Why would anybody turn over thousands of dollars if they weren't caught red handed?

Now if you want to get "all uppity" about oit then complain about racial profiling but to act as if these people weren't soing something wrong is dishonest.

Why did the state return thousands of dollars if it wasn't wrongfully seized? Can play this game all day.

What if a student told her professor she wanted $5,000 or she'd tell people he sexually assaulted her one night during a private tutoring session, when she actually seduced him? I mean, he was innocent, it's not like just being accused of something can have a negative impact on your life or career...

They threatened an interracial couple by saying they'd take their fucking kids away from them. You wouldn't give in at that point if all they wanted was a few thousand dollars and you believed there was a chance the fucking redneck courts might actually back up the cops?

If I was in the right and had done nothing wrong I would never let them intimidate me. Maybe they could fuck me over, Maybe but they couldn't but I'd make it plain as day that paybacks can be hell.