Drinking laws

[tommywishbone]

It's just another case on the Man keeping the people down. No drinking. No smoking. No nothing. Oh, and I think .08 is way too low. I scored 1570 on my SAT's while I was at least .10.

 

[Agnostos Insania]

Originally posted by: GoPackGo

so the driver goes from being driven normally, to the driver going to the other side of the road...and hitting a car head on at lets say 25mph or so? so i let my family drive a vehicle with NO airbags, No seatbelts and no crumple zone?

There you go, folks. It's okay to drink and drive because of airbags and seatbelts. It must be fine to go 100mph in a 20mph zone too. My god you anti-DUI law people are vile, despicably selfish people. As long as you can drink and party who cares if innocent people are put in danger.

Forget driving school, there should be morality tests for getting a license.

 

[msparish]

I really don't have much sympathy (coming from someone who's father in law has spent 5 out of the last 6 years in jail for repeated DUIs). The law is so simple, you drink, you don't drive. Everyone knows it, and it is so easy to follow. If you want to have more than a drink or two, get a designated driver. If you can't get a driver (or walk home, etc.) only have a drink or two. Why put yourself in the position to have legal trouble regardless of whether you feel the law is fair or not?

 

[AntaresVI]

Originally posted by: Agnostos Insania
there should be morality tests for getting a license.

It's rare that you can pinpoint the moment when one goes from having an opinion to beign a raving lunatic.

 

[judasmachine]

silly as many will find it, drinking and driving laws are there for a reason, and they are tough for the same reason. the reason being that too many people's lives are messed up by those who choose to drink and drive. it's not that hard to get a designated driver. sure it's no fun to be the dd, but come on it's better than dying or going to the pokey.

 

[GoPackGo]

Originally posted by: Agnostos Insania

Originally posted by: GoPackGo

so the driver goes from being driven normally, to the driver going to the other side of the road...and hitting a car head on at lets say 25mph or so? so i let my family drive a vehicle with NO airbags, No seatbelts and no crumple zone?

There you go, folks. It's okay to drink and drive because of airbags and seatbelts. It must be fine to go 100mph in a 20mph zone too. My god you anti-DUI law people are vile, despicably selfish people. As long as you can drink and party who cares if innocent people are put in danger.

Forget driving school, there should be morality tests for getting a license.

So a cop lets a guy by driving at 100 mph in a 20 mph zone?

I just don't think a blood alcohol level is a fair test. Find a real fair test to determine if someone is able to make it home from the bar. If they fail, then they can be busted.

Tell me, lets say i have been up 36 hrs straight, but have one beer in my system. Its the middle of the night and I am driving home and fall asleep. I crash into another car. I kill everyone including myself. Was the crash caused by alcohol? of course not. But the ME does the old blood test and they will say its another case of drunken driving....

 

[Stonehawk]

I hesitate to step into the pit that is P&N normally, but this is a rare exception....

So, OP, you feel that it is OK for someone who has a few drinks (but knows their limits) to go ahead and "get their car home".

Right?

Well then, you should have no problems with the following scenarios:

Airline pilot tipping a few back before flying you overseas, after all he knows his limits and he is a good pilot.

Doctor slamming a beer before performing heart surgery on your mom, after all nothing has happened yet right?

EMT's having a beer cooler on the rig, after all, it isn't a problem if they just have a few, right?

Any and all of these above scenarios are possible under your OP, right? If not, why do you exclude them and not your ordinary driver? The above people are responsible for other people though, right? Are you not responsible for other people when you drive? Insurance companies think you are. Otherwise your insurance would not go up in a no fault accident, right?

If you are therefore responsible for other people when you drive, how can you drink and drive with no penalty, but the above people cannot drink and do their job?

*steps out of pit quickly, lest the vipers pull me down*

EDIT: spelling problems, to early in the morning

 

[ahurtt]

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy

Originally posted by: Tab
Nobody is drunk at .08 but you're driving is impaired, trust me. There is a reason many states have gone form .1 to .08.

Yes there is. It's called Mothers Against Drunk Driving.

It's not based on any kind of science. I read an article a few weeks ago that made an interesting observation. After the national limit was set at .10 drunk driving accidents and deaths went down. They dropped every year until the limit in most states was set at .08. Once .08 became the norm DUI deaths started increasing again.

The theory generated from this data was this: If you can have one or two beers and not get a DUI you are more likely to stop before you've had too many and go home. When you lower the limit such that two beers will get you a DUI... well... why not have a few more? After all a DUI is a DUI whether you're at .08 or .12.

No, it's not even the same charge after you cross a certain limit. There are 2 degrees of severity. (At least in my state of Maryland) You can have DWI (Driving While Impaired) and if you blow above a certain point, you have graduated to DUI (Driving Under the Influence). DUI is the more severe charge with an instant 12 points on your license if convicted and other harsher penalties as well (jail time included). In Maryland, if you get 12 points on your license during a 1 year (maybe 2 I forget) period, your license is REVOKED. Therefore, 1 DUI conviction can very easily take you off the roads for a very long time without a good lawyer.

 

[ahurtt]

Originally posted by: Stonehawk
I hesitate to step into the pit that is P&N normally, but this is a rare exception....

So, OP, you feel that it is OK for someone who has a few drinks (but knows their limits) to go ahead and "get their car home".

Right?

Well then, you should have no problems with the following scenarios:

Airline pilot tipping a few back before flying you overseas, after all he knows his limits and he is a good pilot.

. . .snipped for brevity, read the original reply for all the details. . .

Just want to say, :thumbsup:

 

[ahurtt]

Originally posted by: GoPackGo

Originally posted by: Agnostos Insania

Originally posted by: GoPackGo

so the driver goes from being driven normally, to the driver going to the other side of the road...and hitting a car head on at lets say 25mph or so? so i let my family drive a vehicle with NO airbags, No seatbelts and no crumple zone?

There you go, folks. It's okay to drink and drive because of airbags and seatbelts. It must be fine to go 100mph in a 20mph zone too. My god you anti-DUI law people are vile, despicably selfish people. As long as you can drink and party who cares if innocent people are put in danger.

Forget driving school, there should be morality tests for getting a license.

So a cop lets a guy by driving at 100 mph in a 20 mph zone?

I just don't think a blood alcohol level is a fair test. Find a real fair test to determine if someone is able to make it home from the bar. If they fail, then they can be busted.

Tell me, lets say i have been up 36 hrs straight, but have one beer in my system. Its the middle of the night and I am driving home and fall asleep. I crash into another car. I kill everyone including myself. Was the crash caused by alcohol? of course not. But the ME does the old blood test and they will say its another case of drunken driving....

Actually, you don't know if it was caused by alcohol in this case. You can't just say "of course not." Maybe that 1 beer was enough to make you just drowsy enough to fall asleep behind the wheel where you wouldn't have otherwise. ANY TIME there is a traffic accident where any amount of alcohol is involved, it will ALWAYS become a factor in the investigation. The ONLY way to avoid that happening is not to drink at all if you are gonna be driving. You don't know what would have happened differently if you hadn't had that 1 beer. The only way to rule it out completely is to not have drunk it. Whether you were actually drunk or not, when that story hits the evening news, the headline is going to say "driver had been drinking."

 

[GoPackGo]

Originally posted by: ahurtt

Originally posted by: GoPackGo

Originally posted by: Agnostos Insania

Originally posted by: GoPackGo

so the driver goes from being driven normally, to the driver going to the other side of the road...and hitting a car head on at lets say 25mph or so? so i let my family drive a vehicle with NO airbags, No seatbelts and no crumple zone?

There you go, folks. It's okay to drink and drive because of airbags and seatbelts. It must be fine to go 100mph in a 20mph zone too. My god you anti-DUI law people are vile, despicably selfish people. As long as you can drink and party who cares if innocent people are put in danger.

Forget driving school, there should be morality tests for getting a license.

So a cop lets a guy by driving at 100 mph in a 20 mph zone?

I just don't think a blood alcohol level is a fair test. Find a real fair test to determine if someone is able to make it home from the bar. If they fail, then they can be busted.

Tell me, lets say i have been up 36 hrs straight, but have one beer in my system. Its the middle of the night and I am driving home and fall asleep. I crash into another car. I kill everyone including myself. Was the crash caused by alcohol? of course not. But the ME does the old blood test and they will say its another case of drunken driving....

Actually, you don't know if it was caused by alcohol in this case. You can't just say "of course not." Maybe that 1 beer was enough to make you just drowsy enough to fall asleep behind the wheel where you wouldn't have otherwise. ANY TIME there is a traffic accident where any amount of alcohol is involved, it will ALWAYS become a factor in the investigation. The ONLY way to avoid that happening is not to drink at all if you are gonna be driving. You don't know what would have happened differently if you hadn't had that 1 beer. The only way to rule it out completely is to not have drunk it. Whether you were actually drunk or not, when that story hits the evening news, the headline is going to say "driver had been drinking."

So lets say you take some cough syrup....no driving either right?

 

[ahurtt]

Originally posted by: GoPackGo

Originally posted by: ahurtt

Originally posted by: GoPackGo

Originally posted by: Agnostos Insania

Originally posted by: GoPackGo

so the driver goes from being driven normally, to the driver going to the other side of the road...and hitting a car head on at lets say 25mph or so? so i let my family drive a vehicle with NO airbags, No seatbelts and no crumple zone?

There you go, folks. It's okay to drink and drive because of airbags and seatbelts. It must be fine to go 100mph in a 20mph zone too. My god you anti-DUI law people are vile, despicably selfish people. As long as you can drink and party who cares if innocent people are put in danger.

Forget driving school, there should be morality tests for getting a license.

So a cop lets a guy by driving at 100 mph in a 20 mph zone?

I just don't think a blood alcohol level is a fair test. Find a real fair test to determine if someone is able to make it home from the bar. If they fail, then they can be busted.

Tell me, lets say i have been up 36 hrs straight, but have one beer in my system. Its the middle of the night and I am driving home and fall asleep. I crash into another car. I kill everyone including myself. Was the crash caused by alcohol? of course not. But the ME does the old blood test and they will say its another case of drunken driving....

Actually, you don't know if it was caused by alcohol in this case. You can't just say "of course not." Maybe that 1 beer was enough to make you just drowsy enough to fall asleep behind the wheel where you wouldn't have otherwise. ANY TIME there is a traffic accident where any amount of alcohol is involved, it will ALWAYS become a factor in the investigation. The ONLY way to avoid that happening is not to drink at all if you are gonna be driving. You don't know what would have happened differently if you hadn't had that 1 beer. The only way to rule it out completely is to not have drunk it. Whether you were actually drunk or not, when that story hits the evening news, the headline is going to say "driver had been drinking."

So lets say you take some cough syrup....no driving either right?

Well it does say right on the label if it contains alcohol that you should not operate heavy machinery etc. . .after taking it. I can only assume they put that on the label for a reason.

 

[soundforbjt]

It's also been shown in studies that people talking on cellphones while driving (hands-free or held) are impaired as much as a drunk (.08) driver.

Do you feel the same legal penalties should apply to them as well?

 

[azazyel]

Originally posted by: ahurtt

Well it does say right on the label if it contains alcohol that you should not operate heavy machinery etc. . .after taking it. I can only assume they put that on the label for a reason.

But not all medicines effect the same people the same way. I know that even non drowsy stuff knocks me out.

And personally I have never felt these effects off 4 beers...

BAL .08%-.09%: You believe you're functioning better than you actually are. At this level, you may start to slur your speech. Your sense of balance is probably off, and your motor skills are starting to become impaired. Your ability to see and hear clearly is diminished. Your judgment is being affected, so it's difficult for you to decide whether or not to continue drinking. Your ability to evaluate sexual situations is impaired. Students may jokingly refer to this state of mind as ?beer goggles?, but this BAL can have serious repercussions.

 

[ahurtt]

Originally posted by: soundforbjt
It's also been shown in studies that people talking on cellphones while driving (hands-free or held) are impaired as much as a drunk (.08) driver.

Do you feel the same legal penalties should apply to them as well?

Actually, personally I do. I have been rear-ended 2 times in my life. Once in my car, another time as a passenger in a friends car. BOTH TIMES the person who hit us was gabbing on a cell phone. Cell phones in moving cars should be T3H BANNED! PERIOD!

 

[ElFenix]

going from .1 to .08 increased the number of innocent people convicted of DUI and the number of guilty people who are let off.

why? because a breathalyzer machine has a set margin of error. for the purposes of this post lets say its plus or minus .01. so at .1 the margin of error is 10% of the measured number. moving the law to .08 changed the margin of error to about 13% of the measured number.

 

[ahurtt]

Originally posted by: azazyel

Originally posted by: ahurtt

Well it does say right on the label if it contains alcohol that you should not operate heavy machinery etc. . .after taking it. I can only assume they put that on the label for a reason.

But not all medicines effect the same people the same way. I know that even non drowsy stuff knocks me out.

And personally I have never felt these effects off 4 beers...

BAL .08%-.09%: You believe you're functioning better than you actually are. At this level, you may start to slur your speech. Your sense of balance is probably off, and your motor skills are starting to become impaired. Your ability to see and hear clearly is diminished. Your judgment is being affected, so it's difficult for you to decide whether or not to continue drinking. Your ability to evaluate sexual situations is impaired. Students may jokingly refer to this state of mind as ?beer goggles?, but this BAL can have serious repercussions.

Well, for you, is 4 beers enough to raise your BAL to the .08-.09 range? It depends on your height / weight. If you can confirm that your BAL is between .08-.09 and you DO NOT exhibit these behaviors, it could mean you are developing an alcohol tolerance. This could mean two things. . .1) You drink this much regularly which is considered by most to be abusive and 2) You could be genetically predisposed to be alcoholic. Watch out.

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy

Originally posted by: Tab
Nobody is drunk at .08 but you're driving is impaired, trust me. There is a reason many states have gone form .1 to .08.

Yes there is. It's called Mothers Against Drunk Driving.

It's not based on any kind of science. I read an article a few weeks ago that made an interesting observation. After the national limit was set at .10 drunk driving accidents and deaths went down. They dropped every year until the limit in most states was set at .08. Once .08 became the norm DUI deaths started increasing again.

The theory generated from this data was this: If you can have one or two beers and not get a DUI you are more likely to stop before you've had too many and go home. When you lower the limit such that two beers will get you a DUI... well... why not have a few more? After all a DUI is a DUI whether you're at .08 or .12.

Actually the increase can be attributed to the lower "legal" limit. I bet if they dropped it to .01 the rate would sky rocket.

 

[BlancoNino]

Talking on cell phones while driving? A lot of times it's necessary and it should NEVER be banned. My dad had a job where he was a salesman on the road. 'Would have made HORRIBLE time if he pulled over to the side and made all of his phone calls and probably wouldn't have made very good money. I sat next to him and watched him drive flawlessy through strange cities and heavy traffic.

I wonder how cops sleep at night trying to convince themselves they are doing the city a great deed by throwing the book at a middle class family man who had a couple beers and decided to drive home.

The legal limit should be .15....period. And even at .15 anyone who causes a wreck is either a bad driver or a complete idiot. I know people who have passed their drivers test with flying colors after about 8 drinks. Drinking and driving laws are no different than facist gun laws. Some people are irresponsible so lets take the right away from EVERYBODY.

 

[azazyel]

Originally posted by: ahurtt
Well, for you, is 4 beers enough to raise your BAL to the .08-.09 range? It depends on your height / weight. If you can confirm that your BAL is between .08-.09 and you DO NOT exhibit these behaviors, it could mean you are developing an alcohol tolerance. This could mean two things. . .1) You drink this much regularly which is considered by most to be abusive and 2) You could be genetically predisposed to be alcoholic. Watch out.

And your point is?

 

[ahurtt]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino
Talking on cell phones while driving? A lot of times it's necessary and it should NEVER be banned. My dad had a job where he was a salesman on the road. 'Would have made HORRIBLE time if he pulled over to the side and made all of his phone calls and probably wouldn't have made very good money. I sat next to him and watched him drive flawlessy through strange cities and heavy traffic.

I wonder how cops sleep at night trying to convince themselves they are doing the city a great deed by throwing the book at a middle class family man who had a couple beers and decided to drive home.

The legal limit should be .15....period. And even at .15 anyone who causes a wreck is either a bad driver or a complete idiot. I know people who have passed their drivers test with flying colors after about 8 drinks. Drinking and driving laws are no different than facist gun laws. Some people are irresponsible so lets take the right away from EVERYBODY.

You are so full of horse$hit. How in hell could somebody who had 8 drinks pass a driving test? Did the test administrator have no sense of smell? Somebody who has had 8 drinks gives off quite a distinctive alcohol aroma. Theres no way the administrator would let them behind the wheel. And if you can have 8 drinks and not appear even a little drunk, you are either like 300+ pounds or you belong in AA. With a .15 BAC most people have trouble standing up straight and walking. That is unless they are alcoholic.

 

[ahurtt]

Originally posted by: azazyel

Originally posted by: ahurtt
Well, for you, is 4 beers enough to raise your BAL to the .08-.09 range? It depends on your height / weight. If you can confirm that your BAL is between .08-.09 and you DO NOT exhibit these behaviors, it could mean you are developing an alcohol tolerance. This could mean two things. . .1) You drink this much regularly which is considered by most to be abusive and 2) You could be genetically predisposed to be alcoholic. Watch out.

And your point is?

My point was that if you can drink enough to raise your BAC to the .08-.09 range and you don't exhibit any signs of being drunk or impaired, it should be sending up warning flags, that's all. What part of my post was unclear?

 

[BlancoNino]

It's the DMV...you think their employees are top quality? It's a state-funded operation, which is why it's so slow, has such terrible hours, the employees are so mean, and has no competition .

 

[JEDIYoda]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino
It's the DMV...you think their employees are top quality? It's a state-funded operation, which is why it's so slow, has such terrible hours, the employees are so mean, and has no competition .

Crawl back under wherever you cam from-plz
No DMV employee administering a behinf the wheel drivers exam is going to let sopm,ebody behind the wheel who even remotely smells of alcohol...that was such a bogus statement you made.......rofl

 

[BlancoNino]

Teachers let it slide at our school all the time.