Doesn't it hurt society more to make drunk driving illegal?

[nonlnear]

This thread is quite an ingenius troll.
Anarchist420 hasn't appeared since page 1!

 

[cubeless]

and the thread is better for it...

 

[Rock Hydra]

For one thing, it's a victimless crime, for another, it costs too much to lock these people up and send them to court, etc., and finally, people do it anyway. It's not like someone who is severely intoxicated has enough self-control to make the decision not to drive.

Now, if someone hits someone, then that's another story.

So, why should drunk driving be illegal? I don't want money being wasted on having drunk driving illegal.

Please understand. It's not that it's a victim-less crime. It's because YOU HAVE A CONTRACT with the UNITED STATES. You agree, on paper, that you will follow the statutes, to the letter, in association with your Social Security Number, your TIN or any other federal agreement. Relinquish yourself of these contracts (release your drivers license, de-register and return VIN numbers on automobiles, file a notice of claim of right, zero out your IRS account, etc. and finally.....NEVER CONTRACT WITH THE GOVERNMENT WITHOUT FULL DISCLOSURE on their part [yeah right, like that'll happen]).

 

[bobsmith1492]

please understand. It's not that it's a victim-less crime. It's because you have a contract with the united states. You agree, on paper, that you will follow the statutes, to the letter, in association with your social security number, your tin or any other federal agreement. Relinquish yourself of these contracts (release your drivers license, de-register and return vin numbers on automobiles, file a notice of claim of right, zero out your irs account, etc. And finally.....never contract with the government without full disclosure on their part [yeah right, like that'll happen]).

anarchists untie
no more rules





(that includes spelling)

 

[alkemyst]

Wow, you don't need to drink, you're too fucking daft to drive anyway.

Actually 2x more people die driving without alcohol involved.

 

[Acanthus]

Actually 2x more people die driving without alcohol involved.

Please tell me you are trolling.

Total deaths: 100000 (simplicity)

Alcohol related: 50000
Normal accidents: 50000

3% of drivers on the road are "drunk" at any given time.

97% of the drivers are sober at any given time.

This means drunk drivers crash fatally at over 15x the rate of sober ones.

 

[alkemyst]

100000?

Try about 40%

In 2008, 11,773 people died due to DUI out of 37,261 total.

 

[Soltis]

Wow people are really having discussions about stuff like this? It's bad enough people willingly choose to take their minds out of a state where they can make informed decisions just to feel "loose", but to think its ok for them to be operating something that can be considered a deadly weapon(and even worse that any innocent person's life be dismissed as insignificant) is just ridiculous. I mean think about what is being said... would you let a doctor operate on you while he was drunk? Would you let someone cut your hair/shave your beard? Would you let someone administer medicine to you? Just remember a car is just as or alot more deadly than any instrument used during those procedures.

 

[SilentRunning]

For one thing, it's a victimless crime, for another, it costs too much to lock these people up and send them to court, etc., and finally, people do it anyway. It's not like someone who is severely intoxicated has enough self-control to make the decision not to drive.

Now, if someone hits someone, then that's another story.

So, why should drunk driving be illegal? I don't want money being wasted on having drunk driving illegal.

Tell that to my cousin. Oh wait you can't tell her because she was killed by a drunk driver.

 

[alkemyst]

Wow people are really having discussions about stuff like this? It's bad enough people willingly choose to take their minds out of a state where they can make informed decisions just to feel "loose", but to think its ok for them to be operating something that can be considered a deadly weapon(and even worse that any innocent person's life be dismissed as insignificant) is just ridiculous. I mean think about what is being said... would you let a doctor operate on you while he was drunk? Would you let someone cut your hair/shave your beard? Would you let someone administer medicine to you? Just remember a car is just as or alot more deadly than any instrument used during those procedures.

great argument, except driving isn't based on fine motor skills.

 

[PlasmaBomb]

^this

(good find Red)

 

[PlasmaBomb]

Don't cars put peoples' lives at risk? Should they be banned?

That is why they are licensed... essentially without a licence you can't legally drive ~ you are banned from driving, i.e. if caught you will face consequences. People seem to forget that driving is not a right...

 

[PlasmaBomb]

you realize there are only about 13,000 deaths a year where someone was drinking right? Many are the driver themselves and no others.

It's a great money maker for the government and helped to build one of the most powerful political lobbies in our country.

Drinking and driving is not the problem people think it is.

There are 100's of people arrested each week in most metropolitan areas on this charge...most would have never hurt anyone/thing.

That is 13,000 people alky... potentially 13,000 families (mothers, fathers, brothers, sisters, wives, husbands, sons and daughters) all of which are affected by the loss of a loved one...

Plus there is the cost of it... saying that "only" 13,000 die and it's a great money maker sounds like it's a load of bunk.

How much does the government make?

 

[alkemyst]

That is 13,000 people alky... potentially 13,000 families (mothers, fathers, brothers, sisters, wives, husbands, sons and daughters) all of which are affected by the loss of a loved one...

Plus there is the cost of it... saying that "only" 13,000 die and it's a great money maker sounds like it's a load of bunk.

How much does the government make?

You should look into MADD as a political lobby.

There is about $5000 on average to be made on every DUI arrest. This is shared by those that help create the laws that are enforced.

Even down to a 'special' rate charged for towing a car even if it's parked on the owner's premises.

 

[PlasmaBomb]

You should look into MADD as a political lobby.

There is about $5000 on average to be made on every DUI arrest. This is shared by those that help create the laws that are enforced.

Even down to a 'special' rate charged for towing a car even if it's parked on the owner's premises.

So I will ask again... how much do they make? as in total amount taken from all DUI convictions?

 

[3chordcharlie]

100000?

Try about 40%

In 2008, 11,773 people died due to DUI out of 37,261 total.

That's less than a third - just over 30%.

That means drunk drivers are more than twice as safe as sober ones, right?

Or, it's still about 15x the kill-rate.

You got a DUI, and you're pissed about it; we get it. However, you're trying to pick and choose your way through statistics to paint a picture that just isn't there.

 

[zinfamous]

For one thing, it's a victimless crime, for another, it costs too much to lock these people up and send them to court, etc., and finally, people do it anyway. It's not like someone who is severely intoxicated has enough self-control to make the decision not to drive.

Now, if someone hits someone, then that's another story.

So, why should drunk driving be illegal? I don't want money being wasted on having drunk driving illegal.

You should see the smaller post-Soviet, post bloc countries where drunken driving remains essentially legal, or enforcement is so weak, corruption so strong, that all ti takes is a 20 spot to avoid any legal trouble when stopped.

See what unchecked drunken driving does for them, then get back to us. IIRC, Maldova is a good start.

 

[zinfamous]

You should look into MADD as a political lobby.

There is about $5000 on average to be made on every DUI arrest. This is shared by those that help create the laws that are enforced.

Even down to a 'special' rate charged for towing a car even if it's parked on the owner's premises.

That's right, we keep forgetting that you aren't actually alcoholic. You just need your 15 Coors each night, no biggy. Damn the police for stopping you on your way to the store to restock!

 

[ZaneNBK]

Apparently the people in this thread are so used to arguing idiotic topics that they can no longer recognize a blatant troll.

Next up, why Christianity should be the required religion of all Americans.

 

[nonlnear]

Apparently the people in this thread are so used to arguing idiotic topics that they can no longer recognize a blatant troll.

Ahem...

This thread is quite an ingenius troll.
Anarchist420 hasn't appeared since page 1!

😉

 

[alkemyst]

That's less than a third - just over 30%.

That means drunk drivers are more than twice as safe as sober ones, right?

Or, it's still about 15x the kill-rate.

You got a DUI, and you're pissed about it; we get it. However, you're trying to pick and choose your way through statistics to paint a picture that just isn't there.

Has nothing to do with 'being pissed'...it was nearly 10 years ago, it became a non-event. I simply paid it out and was done with it. Not a big deal to me.

However, I have learned what the real game is behind the enforcement....saving lives is not it.

They have you fooled though.

 

[alkemyst]

That's right, we keep forgetting that you aren't actually alcoholic. You just need your 15 Coors each night, no biggy. Damn the police for stopping you on your way to the store to restock!

it's about 21 in a whole week, max.

You go though trolling an argument.

 

[alkemyst]

So I will ask again... how much do they make? as in total amount taken from all DUI convictions?

I have no way of fucking knowing that...it's different per state as to the break down....

here are the 2008 numbers: http://www.numberof.net/number-of-dui-arrests-per-state/

Just assume each is a first time offender for simplicity and the lowest cost. Figure $5000 each which is considerably less than those that fight it. There ain't much way out of paying without going to jail instead due to mandatory fines/sentencing.

Ignore lost revenue in this...ignore one month of having to get a driver.

Plus most of that money is not going directly back to the 'government'...it's going to 'counselling' and MADD, along with a few private companies aligned with these organizations.

For Florida, the take is over $300 MILLION dollars. California over a billion.

 

[3chordcharlie]

Has nothing to do with 'being pissed'...it was nearly 10 years ago, it became a non-event. I simply paid it out and was done with it. Not a big deal to me.

However, I have learned what the real game is behind the enforcement....saving lives is not it.

They have you fooled though.

You've convinced yourself of a pretty serious fallacy here - remember: Just because your paranoid, doesn't mean no one is trying to kill you.

I've already made it crystal clear what my feelings are about DUI enforcement. Repeatedly. Over and over. I'm not blindly swallowing the government, or MADD's line.

But you are still wrong about DUI being no big deal. Completely and totally wrong. You've been shown the reason why statistically, and yet you return to the same arguments that have been shredded by the actual numbers.

I can only surmise from this that for you, it's a personal thing.

 

[cubeless]

...but when your paranoia is due to your inebriated state, then, because of the dui laws, they actually are out to get you...