Does Thuban benefit from lower CAS latency or higher frequency RAM?

[Chicken76]

Does anyone remember any details of this sort from that time?

A bit of background: I'm using a 960T quad (Thuban with 2 cores disabled) mildly overclocked (3.6GHz core, 2.4 GHz IMC) and can't say it's very slow. Sure, Haswell is definitely snappier, but a mobo+cpu upgrade for me would be a lot of money for a mediocre gain.

I'm asking this question because a friend is upgrading his PC and would like to keep costs to a minimum. So, I could sell him my RAM and buy lower latency modules or higher frequency ones, for a small price difference ($30 max). I'm just wondering if it's worth the hassle. I'm using this computer for gaming also, but given my CPU, don't expect to crank the setting up to Ultra. It's just in the poorly threaded games I could use a little more oomph, and I'd rather not overclock this CPU any higher.

 

[SlowSpyder]

I remember getting better scores by tightening timings more than adding more bandwidth, and I was using DDR2 with my Thuban. I ran it at 866 speed, dual channel,so I would imagine DDR3 speeds in dual channel probably provide enough bandwidth at relatively low clocks. I'd shoot for average speeds and good timings over loose timings and more bandwidth.

But unless his ram is really slow stuff, I'd not bother buying new memory. The difference probably won't be very big in practical real life use.

 

[Cerb]

It might help, but if you're lucky, and have high-latency or slow DIMMs (like 1333 CAS 11), you might see several % in some RAM-sensitive programs. If you've got typical 1600MHz CAS 9, don't expect much outside of synthetic physics or AI simulations, and usually <5% even then.

 

[DrMrLordX]

All Stars chips crave tight timings in general. Bear in mind that tightening timings can actually increase your effective bandwidth!

You can also improve performance by working on your NB/IMC. Faster NB = better memory performance and L3 cache performance.

 

[Magic Carpet]

So, I could sell him my RAM and buy lower latency modules or higher frequency ones, for a small price difference ($30 max). I'm just wondering if it's worth the hassle.

My Thuban was very sensitive to timings and ram speed. I remember seeing up to 20% difference, in Handbrake. You want to aim for ~1600 at CL7.

 

[Smoblikat]

As I recall, Phenom 2 preferred low latency ove rhigh frequency. The intel equivalents seemed to prefer the opposite.

 

[richierich1212]

Tight Timings for sure.

 

[Cerb]

http://hwbot.org/news/hwbot_research_lab_amd_thuban_nb_and_memory_performance_scaling_part_6
(notice the graphs are not zero-origin)

http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/memory/display/phenom-ii-x6-memory_2.html

http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/memory/display/phenom-ii-x6-memory_3.html

Both AMD's and Intel's do and did better with tighter timings, it's just a matter of further diminishing returns, in applications. The NB also needs to be run higher to make the best use of both higher-MHz and lower timings.

 

[Chicken76]

Thanks guys.
Do you think it's worth overclocking the IMC past 2400 ? I achieved 2400 1year+ stable with a very-very small voltage increase. 2600 might require a bit more voltage.

 

[SlowSpyder]

Thanks guys.
Do you think it's worth overclocking the IMC past 2400 ? I achieved 2400 1year+ stable with a very-very small voltage increase. 2600 might require a bit more voltage.

I didn't run benches on different NB speeds, I went straight to 2.6GHz on the NB with my Thuban. I did get some solid increases at 2.6GHz over factory clocks, but I was a little over 4GHz on my cores. I don't know how much there is to gain over 2.4GHz at 2.6GHz, especially with the cores at a more moderate overclock. With a relatively modest overclock, I imagine it is easier to keep the cores fed, so the NB doesn't have to be as fast to get the job done. At 3.6Ghz, there might not be too much left to gain by bumping your NB speed up, but only one way to find out.

 

[sm625]

From one of the links above

This is for an overclocked thuban, so the results are better. But still, I'd hardly call that significant. It seems 1333 and 7-7-7-21 are "good enough".

 

[soccerballtux]

Thanks guys.
Do you think it's worth overclocking the IMC past 2400 ? I achieved 2400 1year+ stable with a very-very small voltage increase. 2600 might require a bit more voltage.

I've been running +0.2v on the CPU-NB/L3 cache for a couple years no big deal.
2.6ghz is the sweet spot for 4ghz on the cores to keep them fed. If you're at 3.6ghz you could overclock further but you don't need to.

What you aught to do is go to 4ghz (should be easy) and then up the CPU-NB.

That would be more heat though...

 

[soccerballtux]

From one of the links above

This is for an overclocked thuban, so the results are better. But still, I'd hardly call that significant. It seems 1333 and 7-7-7-21 are "good enough".

impressive

 

[Smoove910]

Hmmm, if I were you I'd be trying to unlock those extra 2 cores. I have a 960t and have been running all six cores at 3.5ghz for about 2 years. Messing with ram might gain you something, but I think having an extra core or two would be more beneficial.

Good luck!

 

[Chicken76]

Hmmm, if I were you I'd be trying to unlock those extra 2 cores.

I tried and didn't work. It won't post if I unlock the extra cores. Might be my motherboard that's the problem, as before this 960T I had a dual core that would not unlock any cores stably. I sold it and the guy that now uses it said he successfully unlocked one of the cores.

 

[Chicken76]

I'm running +0.1 (1.35v) on the core and +0.025 (1.15v) on the IMC.
Since the temperature sensors on AMD chips are not calibrated, I can't rely on it to tell me when I've pushed it too far. This is why I settled on this modest overclock 3.6 / 2.4 GHz.

In Prime95 the core readings top at 36°C while the motherboard's sensor that's under the CPU socket shows 47°C. Probably core temperature is in the 50s. I'm reluctant to push further as I'm in no mood to do a forced impromptu upgrade.

What voltages and speed do you guys run your Thubans at? Also, what kind of cooling do you have? I have a Corsair H50 with a Scythe Gentle Typhoon instead of the stock fan. Think that's enough, considering it's got 2 cores disabled?

 

[SlowSpyder]

I don't remember what my settings were. I want to say 1.45v on the cores was what I had my 1090T set at, can't recall what I did with the NB. I ran 260 x 15.5. Used a Scythe Ninja Copper for my cooling needs. It wasn't the best even back in it's day, I imagine today it'd perform similar to a mid range to upper midrange cooler. But having a tower of copper in my PC looked cool and got me to over 4Ghz, so I was fine with that.

 

[Magic Carpet]

What voltages and speed do you guys run your Thubans at? Also, what kind of cooling do you have?

I gave my Thuban away to a friend, downclocked it to 3.1 Ghz and undervolted it to slightly above 1v (about 1.04). In handbrake, total power consumption of that rig did not exceed the 100w (with integrated graphics) mark so I was happy. It's been running fine with a stock 965 HSF ever since (125W version, with the copper heatpipes) on the lowest speed (about 1300 rpm), so it's fairly quiet even under load. When OC'ed I had a D14 Noctua cooler, no problem with the temps, but it was hungry for power... had about 1.45v for 3.9 Ghz.

 

[Cerb]

I don't remember what my settings were. I want to say 1.45v on the cores was what I had my 1090T set at, can't recall what I did with the NB. I ran 260 x 15.5. Used a Scythe Ninja Copper for my cooling needs. It wasn't the best even back in it's day, I imagine today it'd perform similar to a mid range to upper midrange cooler. But having a tower of copper in my PC looked cool and got me to over 4Ghz, so I was fine with that.

My HR-02 Rev. A gets a bit worse delta-T with an 80W CPU, than that review gets with a 130W CPU. Having to come up with custom mounting methods for new sockets is what makes those coolers obsolete, not their performance.

 

[Chicken76]

Wow, 1.45v on the core! Isn't that too much? Are you using that voltage for your permanent overclock or was it just to see how far it would go?

I've started another thread in the Memory section about tightening timings. How are they usualy achieved, by overvolting the DIMMs or is it simply a matter of luck?

 

[DrMrLordX]

Actually, many Stars chips defaulted to 1.425v vcore. 1.45v is really not much for a chip of that generation. I usually won't push more than 1.48-1.49v, and the maximum most sane overclockers will use is 1.5v-1.55v.

Granted, that's a lot of heat for a Thuban what with its six cores and all, but if your cooler can handle it, then it's fair game. For a Zosma quad, vcore up to 1.55v should be just as manageable as it was for Deneb.

 

[schmuckley]

Lower CAS,higher CPU/NB
Keep the RAM 1920 or less.
Idk..I never run my Zosma @ more than 1.47 on water..

 

[Chicken76]

How long have you run your chips with those voltages? Any sign of fatigue?

 

[SlowSpyder]

My HR-02 Rev. A gets a bit worse delta-T with an 80W CPU, than that review gets with a 130W CPU. Having to come up with custom mounting methods for new sockets is what makes those coolers obsolete, not their performance.

Yea, I agree. That cooler would work fine for future builds, and cool well enough to provide decent overclocks (for air cooling) on any current consumer CPU, I have no doubt. Mor than a kilogram of copper better do something. (unrelated to the thread pic, really nice finish on the base of this cooler.) As you said, mounting it on an unsupported socket is a much bigger issue than it's cooling capability.

I have a spare MSI 990FX board, 900 watt power supply, plenty of DDR3, and am eyeing up an FX6300 or maybe FX8310/8320. Going to use that cooler on it, should be a fun experiment to see how well I can overclock on that 'old' piece of gear. Going to upgrade myself and hand down my 7970 to the build. My kid should get smooth gameplay in Minecraft.

Wow, 1.45v on the core! Isn't that too much? Are you using that voltage for your permanent overclock or was it just to see how far it would go?

I've started another thread in the Memory section about tightening timings. How are they usualy achieved, by overvolting the DIMMs or is it simply a matter of luck?

The more I think about it, the more I think I ran 1.5v, actually. I am 99% sure that's the voltage I used.

I bought that CPU on 10/13/2011. It ran 4Ghz with the voltage bump pretty much from day one of receiving it. I built my FX system December of last year. I ran it at those clocks / voltages for about two years. But, I had a fairly stout cooler too.

But I've seen 1.7v+ peaks on my FX while screwing around, so maybe you shouldn't do what I do.

 

[Chicken76]

What can I expect at 4 GHz core and 2.6 GHz uncore? Is it comparable to a s1156 quad?