does it really cost them 30-40% more to make a stainless steel appliance?

[Train]

That's great, but it still changes the price that someone who buys a widget pays. Period.

Companies can't suddenly force someone to pay more for a product, (unless a monopoly, and even then, people would typically just buy less) You are seriously stuck in the wrong perspective here.

And just to preempt your same inapplicable argument: it does not change what someone is WILLING TO PAY. But we know they're willing to pay $120, which means they're also willing to pay $115, or $110.

Last year the taxes on cigarettes were hiked up by ~$1 a pack. The final price should have went up by the same amount, right? But instead the final price was kept the same (sellers had $1 chopped off their margins)... why do you think that is?

 

[Train]

The majority of companies are, if they're publicly traded.

And the vast majority of companies are NOT publicly traded. Even when they are, with today's accountants, hiding real costs in a maze of a balance sheet is fairly easy.

 

[actuarial]

Companies can't suddenly force someone to pay more for a product, (unless a monopoly, and even then, people would typically just buy less) You are seriously stuck in the wrong perspective here.

I never said they could, and my argument doesn't depend on it. Where did I say there were going to force someone to buy a widget for more than $120? I did say they can offer a product at less than their maximum though. Where below that maximum is determined by expected profit, and profit is affected by costs.

Last year the taxes on cigarettes were hiked up by ~$1 a pack. The final price should have went up by the same amount, right? But instead the final price was kept the same (sellers had $1 chopped off their margins)... why do you think that is?

I never said there was a 1-to-1 relationship. I also said there are certain products where the relationship is weak. But you can be damn sure if they hiked taxes by $10/pack they would change (since it would be impossible to make a profit).

And FYI in Canada when the taxes were hiked the price of packs did increase.

 

[Train]

But you can be damn sure if they hiked taxes by $10/pack they would change (since it would be impossible to make a profit).

no, the price would go up because of supply and demand. Wether different companies reduced margins, increased margins, kept margins, went out of businees, started a business, went black market, is all irrelevant. There is still a non-correlation there.

 

[skyking]

Stainless steel is fucking awesome. You can keep your shitty white plastic fridge in your trailer park.

I don't know where you shop, but I get chromed metal handles, no plastic, not shitty, no trailer park.
To each his own, stainless does not turn me on that much.

 

[actuarial]

no, the price would go up because of supply and demand. Wether different companies reduced margins, increased margins, kept margins, went out of businees, started a business, went black market, is all irrelevant. There is still a non-correlation there.

Exactly, because of supply and demand. (At least you've finally admitted that the supply curve impacts price). Now to get you all the way there - what impacts the supply curve? HINT

And by the way - that IS correlation. You seem to only understand correlation in the 'perfectly correlated' sense.

 

[Train]

Exactly, because of supply and demand. (At least you've finally admitted that the supply curve impacts price). Now to get you all the way there - what impacts the supply curve? HINT

And by the way - that IS correlation. You seem to only understand correlation in the 'perfectly correlated' sense.

sigh. you sound like a college freshman.

 

[actuarial]

sigh. you sound like a college freshman.

Nice ad hominem.

 

[BlahBlahYouToo]

what was this thread about again?

 

[actuarial]

what was this thread about again?

It's about college freshman buying cigarettes.

 

[Train]

Nice ad hominem.

If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck...

 

[actuarial]

If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck...

Another well thought out reply.

 

[Train]

Another well thought out reply.

Whats the point? I keep repeating the same points to you, you dance around them quoting 101 econ like you know something. 3 pages of arguing with a brick.

 

[Sureshot324]

Train I have a question for you. Lets say a breakthrough technology was invented that allowed us to manufacture a fridge for $30, and these fridges are just as good as today's firdges in every way. Would this effect the sales prices of fridges at all?

 

[BlahBlahYouToo]

Train I have a question for you. Lets say a breakthrough technology was invented that allowed us to manufacture a fridge for $30, and these fridges are just as good as today's firdges in every way. Would this effect the sales prices of fridges at all?

absolutely yes.

 

[gorcorps]

Train I have a question for you. Lets say a breakthrough technology was invented that allowed us to manufacture a fridge for $30, and these fridges are just as good as today's firdges in every way. Would this effect the sales prices of fridges at all?

Of course it would. A manufacturer would drop their price to have a competitive edge, then eventually others would follow to remove that edge. This would keep happening until the price is closer the cost, also affected by what consumers are willing to pay. The only way this wouldn't happen is if all of the companies colluded and agreed on keeping the price high, which is highly illegal. And then there's always the looming threat of one company stabbing the others in the back to get the extra sales by dropping their price... it's basic game theory.

 

[J3S73R]

when i worked at best buy (many many years ago bleh) the "cost" difference between SS and the normal models was around 10$

 

[MagnusTheBrewer]

what's wrong with an open kitchen?

Where to start?
airborne grease and oil
Horrendously underpowered exhaust hoods (see above)
open to view causes more focus on looks than utility
noise and heat get shared with living areas
appliance garages (shudder)
Galley kitchens in fricking 4000 square foot homes
Granite counters and stainless steel appliances.
And, the all time most disgusting thing to ever happen to a family in the history of housing, 'breakfast bars.'

Home builders, "kitchen designers" and, home improvement magazines should all diaf for misleading the public with regards to value.

 

[silverpig]

Companies can't suddenly force someone to pay more for a product, (unless a monopoly, and even then, people would typically just buy less) You are seriously stuck in the wrong perspective here.


Last year the taxes on cigarettes were hiked up by ~$1 a pack. The final price should have went up by the same amount, right? But instead the final price was kept the same (sellers had $1 chopped off their margins)... why do you think that is?

Gasoline?

 

[silverpig]

And the vast majority of companies are NOT publicly traded. Even when they are, with today's accountants, hiding real costs in a maze of a balance sheet is fairly easy.

Wrong financial statement. It wouldn't be on a balance sheet.

 

[silverpig]

sigh. you sound like a college freshman.

You don't even sound like you've taken a single course in finance, accounting, or econ, and god help you if you have. You don't understand what "correlation" means, don't understand supply and demand other than to whip out the term at random times, can't think of an example where an increase in the cost of production yields a higher price for the consumer (gasoline and oil), and don't know which financial statement the cost of goods sold appears on.

 

[Shawn]

what was this thread about again?

derailing trains

 

[Train]

Train I have a question for you. Lets say a breakthrough technology was invented that allowed us to manufacture a fridge for $30, and these fridges are just as good as today's firdges in every way. Would this effect the sales prices of fridges at all?

Who is "us" ? Do you mean every fridge manufacturer would all instantly have access to this technology at the same time? Probably not. I guess one of the main points I am trying to make is that all buyers and sellers are autonomous. From an academic perspective, they don't usually take autonomy into it at all.

It's also the academic perspective to assume there is this perpetual undercutting going on, which is ridiculous. Like I said earlier, if this were true, everyones profit margins would be below 1%. Companies can (and do) go into business and sell nothing but products twice as expensive as the competition, with nothing better quality wise, and get by just fine. Marketing alone can create a demand for an inferior product over a superior one.

 

[Train]

Train I have a question for you. Lets say a breakthrough technology was invented that allowed us to manufacture a fridge for $30, and these fridges are just as good as today's firdges in every way. Would this effect the sales prices of fridges at all?

I actually proposed the same scenario on the last page, except I used $20 for a final price, same idea though.

I was summarily dismissed.

Yeah, because the market for refrigerators is going to drop to $20/unit overnight...

If a business can't make a margin on something, they won't make it.

 

[vi edit]

Where to start?
airborne grease and oil
Horrendously underpowered exhaust hoods (see above)
open to view causes more focus on looks than utility
noise and heat get shared with living areas
appliance garages (shudder)
Galley kitchens in fricking 4000 square foot homes
Granite counters and stainless steel appliances.
And, the all time most disgusting thing to ever happen to a family in the history of housing, 'breakfast bars.'

Home builders, "kitchen designers" and, home improvement magazines should all diaf for misleading the public with regards to value.

I've debated this with you in the past, but it's not 1950 anymore. Wives aren't locked up in the kitchen all day making full course breakfast and dinners for their husbands. "Open" kitchens allow families to still socialize and "gather" while dinner is being prepared and the subsequent cleanup.