Does it bother you that a recent immigrant has so much political power in U.S.?

[techs]

Rupert Murdoch may be the most powerful man in the Republican party (I would argue he is). Yet, he was born in Australia in 1931 and only became a naturalized American citizen in 1985.
To add to that, when he bought his television station he was technically in violation of US law and was only allowed to keep it by the decision that the FCC made in 1995 that it was in the best interests of the US?
Not to mention how many people know of Murdochs various questionable business dealings?
(McEwen repaid Murdoch's support later by helping him to buy his valuable rural property Cavan, and then arranged a clever subterfuge by which Murdoch was able to transfer a large sum of money from Australia to England in order to finalize the purchase of The News of the World without obtaining the required authority from the Australian Treasury. From Wiki)

I wonder how many people know:
From Wiki:
In 1999, The Economist reported that Newscorp Investments had made £1.4 billion ($2.1 billion) in profits over the previous 11 years but had paid no net corporation tax. It also reported that after an examination of the available accounts, Newscorp could normally have been expected to pay corporate tax of approximately $350 million. The article explained that in practice the corporation's complex structure, international scope and use of offshore tax havens allowed News Corporation to pay minimal taxes.

btw the man whose news network Fox holds itself as the paramount upholder of US "family values" has been married 3 times?

Oh yeah, exactly what kind of person is Rupert Murdoch when it comes to political honesty?

In a 2008 interview with Walt Mossberg, Murdoch was asked whether he had "anything to do with the New York Post's endorsement of Barack Obama." Without hesitating, Murdoch replied, "Yeah. He is a rock star. It's fantastic. I love what he is saying about education. I don't think he will win Florida... but he will win in Ohio and the election. I am anxious to meet him. I want to see if he will walk the walk

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T...ord_IV#Fall_from_power

I have no problem with naturalized citizens exercising their right to be active in politics.
I just question of Murdoch understands the US political system, or even cares if he brings down the US system of democracy. Especially since you can pretty much date the extreme estrangement between the US political parties, and between the opposing political ideologies from Murdochs influence in the American political system.

 

[Wheezer]

*yawn*

 

[cwjerome]

Originally posted by: techs

I have no problem with naturalized citizens exercising their right to be active in politics.
I just question of Murdoch understands the US political system, or even cares if he brings down the US system of democracy. Especially since you can pretty much date the extreme estrangement between the US political parties, and between the opposing political ideologies from Murdochs influence in the American political system.

More LOL?

 

[MovingTarget]

Heh, there is plenty that Murdoch represents that you can dislike him for, but this ain't it. If a naturalized citizen came to the US and ended up owning such a large/influential organization, then good for him if it was done so honestly. That being said, Murdoch's empire is worrysome for what it has done to political discourse in this country. It just has nothing to do with his citizenship status.

 

[mugs]

The fact that he's an immigrant doesn't bother me, and being a citizen for 24 years doesn't really qualify as "recent immigrant" in my book.

What bothers me is that some of his news outlets are embarrassments to "journalism" - the NY Post and Fox News in particular.

 

[CanOWorms]

I have no problem with naturalized citizens exercising their right to be active in politics.
I just question of Murdoch understands the US political system, or even cares if he brings down the US system of democracy. Especially since you can pretty much date the extreme estrangement between the US political parties, and between the opposing political ideologies from Murdochs influence in the American political system.

It seems like you have the typical old-school Liberal belief where you only support immigrants & minorities who agree with you and those who don't are too uppity and should shut up.

Times have changed. Look at our President. You are becoming a dinosaur.

 

[Jaskalas]

Originally posted by: mugs
The fact that he's an immigrant doesn't bother me, and being a citizen for 24 years doesn't really qualify as "recent immigrant" in my book.

What bothers me is that some of his news outlets are embarrassments to "journalism" - the NY Post and Fox News in particular.

That pretty much sums it up. Immigrant is fine, but a right winger? F'that, burn the witch!

 

[nageov3t]

and here I was expecting this thread to be about Obama

 

[n yusef]

Xenophobia FAIL

 

[JEDIYoda]

What has Murdock ever done to you??
Slow news day huh>>???

 

[dali71]

cough**Soros**cough

 

[miketheidiot]

huh?

 

[Gonad the Barbarian]

Yes, but not because he is a recent immigrant.

 

[Craig234]

The part I'll agree about most is the tax issue - where you have the media mogul who stands to make a fortune by not paying his fair share in taxes to the nation he makes billions from, by using his outlets to whip up propaganda making the people who owe more to let him owe less into an anti-tax frenzy against the government, to get them to politically oppose the government taxing Murdoch more, which would *lower* the tax obligations of the average American. It's a major propaganda program to screw people.

 

[XMan]

Originally posted by: dali71
cough**Soros**cough

Yeah, no kidding.

I also wouldn't necessarily consider Murdoch a "Republican" considering his political donations to Clinton and other Democrats. I would say he's a businessman first. Fox was an attempt to fill a market void, not spread his ideology (whatever it is).

 

[Craig234]

Originally posted by: XMan

Originally posted by: dali71
cough**Soros**cough

Yeah, no kidding.

I also wouldn't necessarily consider Murdoch a "Republican" considering his political donations to Clinton and other Democrats. I would say he's a businessman first. Fox was an attempt to fill a market void, not spread his ideology (whatever it is).

Soros donated large sums in an effort to defend democracy from corruption. That is nothing like what Murdoch does.

You're right IMO that Murdoch isn't strictly a Republican - he's a corporatist shark and leech who is happy to exploit nations with propagandizing for bad policies.

It's unfair to lump him in with other buesinessmen who have some stronger values of the welll-being of their fellow members of the human race.

Unfortunately, our political language limits that poit - it's all about the nonsense of 'right' and 'left' and words like 'businessman' hide the distinctions of 'leech' and 'non-leech'.

If we don't have easy words to use for those distinctions, as we do for 'left' and 'right', than the leeches can far more easily go undetected, without public criticism forming.

Indeed, some say that's why the 'left/right' paraidgm is pushed so hard by the corporate media - because it creates cover preventing better lables from being used more.

Just look at how hard it has been even ijn the face of the Wall Street leeches who caused the crisis, to disccus them versus the better businessmen - and how that has helped restrict the debate and public opinion from forming any clear opposition to the Wall Street leeches. There is no mainstream term for the leeches - any discussion of them has to use whole sentences to explain the distinction between them and other businessmen, making it so cumbersome as ti block the debate.

Contrast that with a word like 'bureaucrat' which is so useful for progagands to instantly refer to a 'hated class' when you want to attack the government.

 

[n yusef]

Originally posted by: Craig234

Originally posted by: XMan

Originally posted by: dali71
cough**Soros**cough

Yeah, no kidding.

I also wouldn't necessarily consider Murdoch a "Republican" considering his political donations to Clinton and other Democrats. I would say he's a businessman first. Fox was an attempt to fill a market void, not spread his ideology (whatever it is).

Soros donated large sums in an effort to defend democracy from corruption. That is nothing like what Murdoch does.

You're right IMO that Murdoch isn't strictly a Republican - he's a corporatist shark and leech who is happy to exploit nations with propagandizing for bad policies.

It's unfair to lump him in with other buesinessmen who have some stronger values of the welll-being of their fellow members of the human race.

Unfortunately, our political language limits that poit - it's all about the nonsense of 'right' and 'left' and words like 'businessman' hide the distinctions of 'leech' and 'non-leech'.

If we don't have easy words to use for those distinctions, as we do for 'left' and 'right', than the leeches can far more easily go undetected, without public criticism forming.

Indeed, some say that's why the 'left/right' paraidgm is pushed so hard by the corporate media - because it creates cover preventing better lables from being used more.

Just look at how hard it has been even ijn the face of the Wall Street leeches who caused the crisis, to disccus them versus the better businessmen - and how that has helped restrict the debate and public opinion from forming any clear opposition to the Wall Street leeches. There is no mainstream term for the leeches - any discussion of them has to use whole sentences to explain the distinction between them and other businessmen, making it so cumbersome as ti block the debate.

Contrast that with a word like 'bureaucrat' which is so useful for progagands to instantly refer to a 'hated class' when you want to attack the government.

Techs' OP underscores your post. Xenophobia isn't a left/right issue.

 

[dali71]

Originally posted by: Craig234

Originally posted by: XMan

Originally posted by: dali71
cough**Soros**cough

Yeah, no kidding.

I also wouldn't necessarily consider Murdoch a "Republican" considering his political donations to Clinton and other Democrats. I would say he's a businessman first. Fox was an attempt to fill a market void, not spread his ideology (whatever it is).

Soros donated large sums in an effort to defend democracy from corruption. That is nothing like what Murdoch does.

You're right IMO that Murdoch isn't strictly a Republican - he's a corporatist shark and leech who is happy to exploit nations with propagandizing for bad policies.

It's unfair to lump him in with other buesinessmen who have some stronger values of the welll-being of their fellow members of the human race.

Unfortunately, our political language limits that poit - it's all about the nonsense of 'right' and 'left' and words like 'businessman' hide the distinctions of 'leech' and 'non-leech'.

If we don't have easy words to use for those distinctions, as we do for 'left' and 'right', than the leeches can far more easily go undetected, without public criticism forming.

Indeed, some say that's why the 'left/right' paraidgm is pushed so hard by the corporate media - because it creates cover preventing better lables from being used more.

Just look at how hard it has been even ijn the face of the Wall Street leeches who caused the crisis, to disccus them versus the better businessmen - and how that has helped restrict the debate and public opinion from forming any clear opposition to the Wall Street leeches. There is no mainstream term for the leeches - any discussion of them has to use whole sentences to explain the distinction between them and other businessmen, making it so cumbersome as ti block the debate.

Contrast that with a word like 'bureaucrat' which is so useful for progagands to instantly refer to a 'hated class' when you want to attack the government.

Soros, the same guy who, when referring to the economic meltdown, said "I?m having a very good crisis" and "It is, in a way, the culminating point of my life?s work". Yeah, you're right, he seems like a real prince (of darkness). :roll:

 

[BoomerD]

Politics should be restricted to the Native born Americans...Not only should ONLY native-born citizens be the only ones who are allowed to hold ANY office in this country...voting should be restricted to only native-born Americans too...










(batteries...got some?)

 

[Phokus]

Originally posted by: loki8481
and here I was expecting this thread to be about Obama

OBAMA IS A KENYAN MOOOOSLIM! </republicans>

 

[StageLeft]

Seems a weak point to argue on given that most Americans know far less about the political system than he and hell he's been here for a long time. He is worrying for other reasons, though.

And I may be biased.

 

[rchiu]

Originally posted by: techs
Rupert Murdoch may be the most powerful man in the Republican party (I would argue he is). Yet, he was born in Australia in 1931 and only became a naturalized American citizen in 1985.
To add to that, when he bought his television station he was technically in violation of US law and was only allowed to keep it by the decision that the FCC made in 1995 that it was in the best interests of the US?
Not to mention how many people know of Murdochs various questionable business dealings?
(McEwen repaid Murdoch's support later by helping him to buy his valuable rural property Cavan, and then arranged a clever subterfuge by which Murdoch was able to transfer a large sum of money from Australia to England in order to finalize the purchase of The News of the World without obtaining the required authority from the Australian Treasury. From Wiki)

I wonder how many people know:
From Wiki:
In 1999, The Economist reported that Newscorp Investments had made £1.4 billion ($2.1 billion) in profits over the previous 11 years but had paid no net corporation tax. It also reported that after an examination of the available accounts, Newscorp could normally have been expected to pay corporate tax of approximately $350 million. The article explained that in practice the corporation's complex structure, international scope and use of offshore tax havens allowed News Corporation to pay minimal taxes.

btw the man whose news network Fox holds itself as the paramount upholder of US "family values" has been married 3 times?

Oh yeah, exactly what kind of person is Rupert Murdoch when it comes to political honesty?

In a 2008 interview with Walt Mossberg, Murdoch was asked whether he had "anything to do with the New York Post's endorsement of Barack Obama." Without hesitating, Murdoch replied, "Yeah. He is a rock star. It's fantastic. I love what he is saying about education. I don't think he will win Florida... but he will win in Ohio and the election. I am anxious to meet him. I want to see if he will walk the walk

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T...ord_IV#Fall_from_power

I have no problem with naturalized citizens exercising their right to be active in politics.
I just question of Murdoch understands the US political system, or even cares if he brings down the US system of democracy. Especially since you can pretty much date the extreme estrangement between the US political parties, and between the opposing political ideologies from Murdochs influence in the American political system.

Not a big fan of Rupert Murdoch but you sounded like only immigrants and recent immigrants make use of offshore accounts, tax law loopholes and international money transfers in big business dealing and only immigrants and recent immigrants got questionable business dealings.

Or only immigrants and recent immigrant talks about US family value but get married bunch of times.

Or only immigrant and recent immigrants have issue like political honesty.

So does it make it alright if an US born person have lots of political power but with the same personal quality as Murdoch? Seriously you just sound like an anti-immigrant person with a sorry excuse.

 

[Craig234]

Originally posted by: dali71

Soros, the same guy who, when referring to the economic meltdown, said "I?m having a very good crisis" and "It is, in a way, the culminating point of my life?s work". Yeah, you're right, he seems like a real prince (of darkness). :roll:

I'm a hell of a lot less concerned about an investor who knows how to profit from the crisis than from the corrupt culture that caused the crisis.

Anyone in this forum on the right or left might get an opportunity to have left the market before the crash and buy in at a low point. So what?

If you want to attack Soros, attack him for the harm he did to Asia as he found ways to profit from currency trades that had negative effects on their economies.

The thing is, while you would have the legitimate point that he did that harm, you wouldn't be attacking him for anythning more than what the system allowed.

The fact that he turned around and used some of those gains to try to improve democracy is to hids credit.

 

[MovingTarget]

Originally posted by: Skoorb
Seems a weak point to argue on given that most Americans know far less about the political system than he and hell he's been here for a long time. He is worrying for other reasons, though.

And I may be biased.

Sadly this is true. Naturalized citizens, as a whole know more about our politics than the average citizen by birth because the have to in order to pass the citizenship test. If anything, this is a better argument for the reintroduction of a real civics cirriculum in our schools...

 

[MagicConch]

One thing I find about Murdoch so entertaining is that before he was big in the USA, whenever there was a movie with a character characterized as "The Man" he always was a grissly, old, unnecessarily dishonest, white guy with a foreign accent and in the end it turned the movies were right all along. lol. I think he would be more entertaining though if he just said "hey if you were me and you had these dumb sheeple that will think anything you want, wouldn't you also use them shamelessly to promotoe your own interests?" Most honest people would probably say yes, with a caveat that their brains would be handed back once the world became a better place.

As far as the immigration thing though, I think it's great an immigrant can come in and take over a political party. I think Schwarzenegger should be allowed to run for president too. The less barriers, the more competition, and the best chance for long-term health of the country I think.