Does atheism allow for good and evil?

[BoberFett]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

In an atheists mind, there should be no purpose to humankind.

Not true. We don't know and we are sure that nobody else does either.

Then wouldn't that make you an agnostic? Not being sure?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but an atheist rejects any notion of creation, and therefore purpose.

 

[nater]

Originally posted by: BoberFett

Originally posted by: nater
*If* our only purpose of being on earth, or our purpose as a species, is to procreate/continue the species, then instinctively good and evil would be acts that would further/preserve mankind, and acts that would be detremintal to mankind, respectively, as amish pointed out.

Purpose? In an atheists mind, there should be no purpose to humankind. For something to have purpose, it must have been created. If it was not created, then it was an accident. How can an accident have a purpose? Purpose implies a plan, which requires a creator.

So there is no purpose to life on this planet, it just happened. So even the continuance of the species isn't a good reason to define something as evil. If humans wipe themselves out, what's the universal consequence? None really. And if the universe doesn't need humans, why is furthering the species important, other than "because our chemical reactions tell us it's important"?

Why do our chemical reactions tell us procreation is important? That certainly isn't a feeling given to us solely by society--stripped 100% of anything resembling society, that goal would still be pursued.

 

[ThaPerculator]

Atheists can have viewpoints of good and evil... for instance, since you are a human it is only natural for you to have views that benefit, or are for 'the better good' of humanity. Or, saying if you are a American they could do something to "better" America... etc. It's all relative... who cares about "ABSOLUTE" good and evil, when in reality nobody will ever be able to experience either.

go to dictionary.com and look at the defined definitions of good and evil... being that we all speak english, we should adhere to it while discussing it.

Obviously, this was a stupid question because good and evil ARE NOT TRADITIONALLY DEFINED BY GOD, HOLINESS, ETC. DO YOUR RESEARCH NEXT TIME...

good and evil are traditionally defined by "relative good" or "relative evil"...

Don't hate me... hate your language

 

[CChaos]

Agreed. I'm an atheist and there is no purpose to life on this planet. It just happened. There's no plan. We are not god's instruments, but simply meatbags motiviated by instincts and the byproducts of our own feeble intellects.

 

[nater]

Originally posted by: UglyCassanova

Originally posted by: nater

Originally posted by: UglyCassanova

Originally posted by: nater
*If* our only purpose of being on earth, or our purpose as a species, is to procreate/continue the species, then instinctively good and evil would be acts that would further/preserve mankind, and acts that would be detremintal to mankind, respectively, as amish pointed out.

So what is our purpose on earth? Why does there need to be a purpose?

I propose that *if* statement because if you look at pretty much all of the other species on the planet, that seems to be their end goal. I'm sure someone will correct me on that though.

I think BoberFett already did.

By saying that Atheism, by definition, excludes a purpose? I think we do have an innate purpose though--the advancement of the species. Is that an incorrect assumption?

 

[Kev]

Originally posted by: Electric Amish
How about something like:

For mankind = good?

against mankind = bad?

yup, it's pretty much that simple.

 

[UglyCasanova]

Originally posted by: nater

Originally posted by: UglyCassanova

Originally posted by: nater

Originally posted by: UglyCassanova

Originally posted by: nater
*If* our only purpose of being on earth, or our purpose as a species, is to procreate/continue the species, then instinctively good and evil would be acts that would further/preserve mankind, and acts that would be detremintal to mankind, respectively, as amish pointed out.

So what is our purpose on earth? Why does there need to be a purpose?

I propose that *if* statement because if you look at pretty much all of the other species on the planet, that seems to be their end goal. I'm sure someone will correct me on that though.

I think BoberFett already did.

By saying that Atheism, by definition, excludes a purpose? I think we do have an innate purpose though--the advancement of the species. Is that an incorrect assumption?

Yes and no. To say that we have a "purpose" implies that we were created to do just that. Life was not created in order to procreate, that is not it's "purpose". The ability to reproduce only ensures it's survival.

 

[CChaos]

nater--Not necessarily incorrect but it really doesn't answer the question. The purpose of the species is to continue the species?

EDIT: Also, atheism certainly allows for good and evil. Society decides what is good and what is evil.

 

[nater]

If we have no purpose, then why even bother with survival?

 

[UglyCasanova]

Originally posted by: nater
If we have no purpose, then why even bother with survival?

Why not?

edit: I still enjoy being alive. I have no ultimate goal to strive to, but I think steak taste good.

 

[nater]

Originally posted by: UglyCassanova

Originally posted by: nater
If we have no purpose, then why even bother with survival?

Why not?

Because there's no purpose!!

< - - Should really read some philosophy.

 

[glen]

Originally posted by: Ameesh

Originally posted by: glen

Originally posted by: Anubis
good and evil really have nothing to do with religion.

everyone is born with the sence of what is right and wrong (good/evil). it is within everyone to deceide for themselfs where there line is. we dont need a book or a god or anyone to tell us what it is

No.
They have everything to do with religion.
With out a god, there is no "good an and evil," just your personal prefrences.

good and evil are completely abstract ideas, just because you choose to define them in terms of what your god tells you doesnt mean that i have to do the same. your point of view is vary narrow minded and myopic

I never said weather any god exists or not, so I am not sure how you can accuse me if being narrow minded or having any sort of personal ownership over the afore mentioned "Your" god.

The point - without a god they are abstract ideas, and do not exist.
I never said weather I believed in a god or not, and it does not change anything.
if a god exists; "good and evil" exist.
if a god does not exist; they don't.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: nater
If we have no purpose, then why even bother with survival?

For the Nookie!

 

[glen]

Originally posted by: nater

Originally posted by: glen

Originally posted by: Anubis
good and evil really have nothing to do with religion.

everyone is born with the sence of what is right and wrong (good/evil). it is within everyone to deceide for themselfs where there line is. we dont need a book or a god or anyone to tell us what it is

No.
They have everything to do with religion.
With out a god, there is no "good an and evil," just your personal prefrences.

You mean that without a god, there is no written/defined good/evil?

Yes.
Without a god, there is no definition of good and evil, and it simply becomes a question of "might makes right."

 

[Kev]

of course the purpose of the human race is to procreate! if you disagree with this, you disagree with the theory evolution.

why the hell is being created a necessary condition to have a purpose?

and if we were created, what is our purpose? to worship a god?

 

[vi edit]

***reserving place for later***

 

[CChaos]

Why bother with survival? Because it's gods plan! Seriously though, being alive is better than being dead. It's instinct. Just like the instinct to procreate and spread your genes around so that you "live" on after you die.

EDIT: Don't confuse the purpose of an individual with the purpose of a species.

 

[BoberFett]

Believe it or not, I think we're getting somewhere and I'm thorougly enjoying this thread.

 

[Kev]

Originally posted by: glen

Originally posted by: nater

Originally posted by: glen

Originally posted by: Anubis
good and evil really have nothing to do with religion.

everyone is born with the sence of what is right and wrong (good/evil). it is within everyone to deceide for themselfs where there line is. we dont need a book or a god or anyone to tell us what it is

No.
They have everything to do with religion.
With out a god, there is no "good an and evil," just your personal prefrences.

You mean that without a god, there is no written/defined good/evil?

Yes.
Without a god, there is no definition of good and evil, and it simply becomes a question of "might makes right."

you mean there's noabsolute definition of good and evil. right and wrong is a gray area a lot of times. but as we grow as a species we learn to differentiate between the two, and we cease to need a "god" to tell us the difference between right and wrong.

 

[Kev]

Originally posted by: CChaos
Why bother with survival? Because it's gods plan! Seriously though, being alive is better than being dead. It's instinct. Just like the instinct to procreate and spread your genes around so that you "live" on after you die.

EDIT: Don't confuse the purpose of an individual with the purpose of a species.

god put us here so he could watch us hump each other and make babies?

 

[UglyCasanova]

Originally posted by: Kev

Originally posted by: glen

Originally posted by: nater

Originally posted by: glen

Originally posted by: Anubis
good and evil really have nothing to do with religion.

everyone is born with the sence of what is right and wrong (good/evil). it is within everyone to deceide for themselfs where there line is. we dont need a book or a god or anyone to tell us what it is

No.
They have everything to do with religion.
With out a god, there is no "good an and evil," just your personal prefrences.

You mean that without a god, there is no written/defined good/evil?

Yes.
Without a god, there is no definition of good and evil, and it simply becomes a question of "might makes right."

you mean there's noabsolute definition of good and evil. right and wrong is a gray area a lot of times. but as we grow as a species we learn to differentiate between the two, and we cease to need a "god" to tell us the difference between right and wrong.

We form our own definition, that is all.

 

[CChaos]

Originally posted by: Kev

Originally posted by: CChaos
Why bother with survival? Because it's gods plan! Seriously though, being alive is better than being dead. It's instinct. Just like the instinct to procreate and spread your genes around so that you "live" on after you die.

EDIT: Don't confuse the purpose of an individual with the purpose of a species.

god put us here so he could watch us hump each other and make babies?

I guess you missed the seriously though part there. It was a joke. I'm certainly an atheist.

 

[glen]

Originally posted by: BoberFett
Believe it or not, I think we're getting somewhere and I'm thorougly enjoying this thread.

yes, but many people are getting side tracked or confused about which god we are talking about or the existance of a god at all.
the question you pose, has been ask and written about quiet a lot.
there is almost no debate on the issue.
For "good and evil" to exist and you must have a god.
Otherwise "good and evil" become societal customs or ettiquet.
That is esentially undeniable.

Which fork to use, when to call someone an "asshat," how many angels fit on the head of a pin, weather or not God comes down to earth in the form of a bull to have sex with women, are separate and very debatable topics.

 

[CChaos]

It seems like semantics are the problem here. No there is no absolute good and evil. We define good and evil societally.

 

[Kev]

Originally posted by: CChaos

Originally posted by: Kev

Originally posted by: CChaos
Why bother with survival? Because it's gods plan! Seriously though, being alive is better than being dead. It's instinct. Just like the instinct to procreate and spread your genes around so that you "live" on after you die.

EDIT: Don't confuse the purpose of an individual with the purpose of a species.

god put us here so he could watch us hump each other and make babies?

I guess you missed the seriously though part there. It was a joke. I'm certainly an atheist.

hehe, my bad... friday afternoon.... brain chugging to a halt.... need to refuel :beer::beer::beer: