Do you think pirating is changing PC gaming?

[smaky]

Xavier434:

I totaly agree with you! On top of all that XboX is tons more user friendly than a pc to most people.

 

[manowar821]

No, DRM hurts it.

 

[MetaDFF]

Originally posted by: Xavier434

Originally posted by: MetaDFF
Interesting that you bring up piracy as the catalyst for changing PC gaming.

This was posted by an Infinity Ward developer:
They Wonder Why People Don't Make PC Games Any More

He basically said that the number of people playing online with pirated copies was astounding. (You can do that with CD checks etc.? I guess those keygens are really good). He didn't quantify what he meant by astounding, but I would imagine it was a number shocking enough to make mention.

Tom's Games has a second take video that also discusses the slump in PC gaming in 2007, even with all these top titles that have just come out.
Second Take PC Gaming Slump

According to their video, COD:4 on the PC sold less than 100k copies in it's first month while the console version sold 1.5M copies on 360 alone. Although the 100k PC sales didn't include digital sales, the number is just too small compared to the console sales numbers. If you are a game developer and you look at these unenthusiastic sales numbers for the PC, it really makes them reconsider where they are putting their developer resources for their next titles. Don't forget game developers are out there to make money after all.

There is probably a larger underlying trend that is causing poor PC gaming sales, more than just piracy. Probably some of the people who would have purchased a PC copy instead picked up a console version so they can play with friends on their home theater etc. But low sales coupled with piracy can only hurt PC gaming, which has already been on the decline. It is like the final stick that breaks the camels back.

I hope PC gaming is here to stay, but I fear the trend is now consoles first and PC games as afterthought.

I am no expert, but I would say that this subject matter has much more to do with certain game genre's becoming less popular on PC's due to competition with consoles. You got your exceptions of course, but a great example would be COD:4 like you mentioned. COD:4 is graphically intensive if you want to play it maxed. Most people do not have the computer to run it well with those settings, can't afford to buy one that does, or cannot justify buying one that does since they already own a 360, HDTV, and can buy COD:4 for $60.

In short, the reason behind the slump (if it exists at all) has more to do with competition than it does piracy.

You certainly make a valid point. From the PC gamer perspective, it's kind of sad seeing that consoles are cannibalizing the PC sales on the multi-platform games. Games like COD:4 are the kind of games that you would want to see on a high-end PC, just to show off the uber PC graphics. But, it is just the same kind of game that would (probably) suffer from poor sales simply because not many people can justify the expense for a PC to run it with maximum graphics.

I just hope that the profit they make from PC game sales justify the expense involved in porting the game to the PC (like in the case of COD:4 where the bulk of the sales are on the console). I would hate to see the day when they don't port a big title to the PC because they don't think the profits justify the investment.

 

[Xavier434]

Originally posted by: MetaDFF

Originally posted by: Xavier434

Originally posted by: MetaDFF
Interesting that you bring up piracy as the catalyst for changing PC gaming.

This was posted by an Infinity Ward developer:
They Wonder Why People Don't Make PC Games Any More

He basically said that the number of people playing online with pirated copies was astounding. (You can do that with CD checks etc.? I guess those keygens are really good). He didn't quantify what he meant by astounding, but I would imagine it was a number shocking enough to make mention.

Tom's Games has a second take video that also discusses the slump in PC gaming in 2007, even with all these top titles that have just come out.
Second Take PC Gaming Slump

According to their video, COD:4 on the PC sold less than 100k copies in it's first month while the console version sold 1.5M copies on 360 alone. Although the 100k PC sales didn't include digital sales, the number is just too small compared to the console sales numbers. If you are a game developer and you look at these unenthusiastic sales numbers for the PC, it really makes them reconsider where they are putting their developer resources for their next titles. Don't forget game developers are out there to make money after all.

There is probably a larger underlying trend that is causing poor PC gaming sales, more than just piracy. Probably some of the people who would have purchased a PC copy instead picked up a console version so they can play with friends on their home theater etc. But low sales coupled with piracy can only hurt PC gaming, which has already been on the decline. It is like the final stick that breaks the camels back.

I hope PC gaming is here to stay, but I fear the trend is now consoles first and PC games as afterthought.

I am no expert, but I would say that this subject matter has much more to do with certain game genre's becoming less popular on PC's due to competition with consoles. You got your exceptions of course, but a great example would be COD:4 like you mentioned. COD:4 is graphically intensive if you want to play it maxed. Most people do not have the computer to run it well with those settings, can't afford to buy one that does, or cannot justify buying one that does since they already own a 360, HDTV, and can buy COD:4 for $60.

In short, the reason behind the slump (if it exists at all) has more to do with competition than it does piracy.

You certainly make a valid point. From the PC gamer perspective, it's kind of sad seeing that consoles are cannibalizing the PC sales on the multi-platform games. Games like COD:4 are the kind of games that you would want to see on a high-end PC, just to show off the uber PC graphics. But, it is just the same kind of game that would (probably) suffer from poor sales simply because not many people can justify the expense for a PC to run it with maximum graphics.

I just hope that the profit they make from PC game sales justify the expense involved in porting the game to the PC (like in the case of COD:4 where the bulk of the sales are on the console). I would hate to see the day when they don't port a big title to the PC because they don't think the profits justify the investment.

I should also toss in one additional reason that I forgot to mention. Consoles are simply less buggy than PCs. Both have their problems but a Console has far less different types of problems making them easier to identify and fix from the average consumer's perspective.

Why is this the case? Well, you can place a lot of the blame on the PC hardware industry for that one. That industry has realized over the years that quantity will make you more money than quality. Think about it. How many different models of GeForce 7 and 8 graphics cards to we really need!? How many Asus motherboards that supported SLI during the first year that it came out do we need? The same can be said about power supplies and hard drives and sound cards. They are pumping out these new models as fast as they can with minimal difference in features because people are willing to spend the dollars to upgrade their system again and again and again just to have the best or near the best despite whether they really need it or not.

What is the result? Engineers of this hardware are spending far less time designing, testing, and fixing their products before they hit the shelves. It doesn't matter if it doesn't completely work because it will sell anyways.

Then all you have to consider are the vast number of manufacturers competing with each other out there and you got yourself a huge cluster fuck of hardware which all claims to do the exact same thing but each performs differently and every single one of them is limited in some way when it comes to different hardware combinations despite their claims. It is a mad house and it has resulted in a lot of PC problems which are just considered "the norm" which really sucks.

You don't have this problem with consoles. The market is anywhere even close to being this saturated and the customers just want something that is easy to use, affordable, works, and works well. Consoles provide these things much more than PCs do.

 

[biostud]

more focus on multiplayer gameplay than singleplayer.

 

[Martimus]

Originally posted by: Xavier434
I should also toss in one additional reason that I forgot to mention. Consoles are simply less buggy than PCs. Both have their problems but a Console has far less different types of problems making them easier to identify and fix from the average consumer's perspective.

Why is this the case? Well, you can place a lot of the blame on the PC hardware industry for that one. That industry has realized over the years that quantity will make you more money than quality. Think about it. How many different models of GeForce 7 and 8 graphics cards to we really need!? How many Asus motherboards that supported SLI during the first year that it came out do we need? The same can be said about power supplies and hard drives and sound cards. They are pumping out these new models as fast as they can with minimal difference in features because people are willing to spend the dollars to upgrade their system again and again and again just to have the best or near the best despite whether they really need it or not.

What is the result? Engineers of this hardware are spending far less time designing, testing, and fixing their products before they hit the shelves. It doesn't matter if it doesn't completely work because it will sell anyways.

Then all you have to consider are the vast number of manufacturers competing with each other out there and you got yourself a huge cluster fuck of hardware which all claims to do the exact same thing but each performs differently and every single one of them is limited in some way when it comes to different hardware combinations despite their claims. It is a mad house and it has resulted in a lot of PC problems which are just considered "the norm" which really sucks.

You don't have this problem with consoles. The market is anywhere even close to being this saturated and the customers just want something that is easy to use, affordable, works, and works well. Consoles provide these things much more than PCs do.

PC's are very Modular, while Consoles ar not. Mac's wouldn't have the same problem, because they are not modular. They are very much like a console. I would much rather have a PC where I can build my own, to my own specifications. Otherwise the lack of competition within the PC (components like PSU's, GPU's, CPU's MB's, Memory, etc.) would just result in lower quality components at higher prices. I think you have it backwards on what happens when you have too many options. It is a much better condition that when you have too few options. I would much rather have a bunch of contractors to choose from when I award contracts, but alas their aren't many in the field that I work in, and so the quality suffers.

 

[Xavier434]

Originally posted by: Martimus

PC's are very Modular, while Consoles ar not. Mac's wouldn't have the same problem, because they are not modular. They are very much like a console. I would much rather have a PC where I can build my own, to my own specifications. Otherwise the lack of competition within the PC (components like PSU's, GPU's, CPU's MB's, Memory, etc.) would just result in lower quality components at higher prices. I think you have it backwards on what happens when you have too many options. It is a much better condition that when you have too few options. I would much rather have a bunch of contractors to choose from when I award contracts, but alas their aren't many in the field that I work in, and so the quality suffers.

Choice = good

Quality through competition = good

Too many models being pushed too quickly = bad

Engineering a quality motherboard with new advanced features takes a lot of time and a lot of testing if done properly. There are just way too many things that can go wrong or hinder performance if you rush the process. I believe we would see better quality products if each manufacturer would simply release fewer models at a time. I do not believe the prices would increase due to this change. Instead, you will just have many more people buying the same model instead of all those people buying multiple models. These manufacturers are trading quality for quantity in a bad way to keep up with the competition.

Now, does that mean that their annual profits overall would be more if they all chose to see it my way? I don't know. They may or they may not. We have never had a market where PCs are as common and as cheap as they are today. We have never had a market where gaming is such a popular hobby as it is today which drives up the sale of more powerful PCs. We have never had a market where manufacturers test the waters to find out if quality is capable of winning over quantity over time during this kind of market. Given all these new circumstances, no one can really say how the consumer's will react to the change that I support. I would think that the money saved in the CS department alone would be something to really consider if a manufacturer decided to spend more time producing quality products.


Keep in mind that I enjoy building a computer to my own specs as well, but my change would still allow me to do just that. Plus you have to remember that most people do not want to do the research it takes to build a quality computer on their own like you and I do. They just want to buy a package deal that works and works very well without having to do an extensive amount of research and be knowledgeable about computers to the point that a lot of people on this forum are. This used to not be necessary but since more and more people like to game and use a lot of media it is becoming necessary and your average consumer is basically left no choice but to buy whatever Best Buy or Dell has to offer because they just have no idea what else to do.

Others decide to screw all that nonsense and just buy a console for gaming instead. It's cheaper anyways. I can't say I blame them.

 

[terpsy]

Well...

Didn't Infinity Ward shut out the group that gave it's studio the kudos it deserved (where was COD 3 on my PC?!?!!?)

Ok, they came back with COD4, and complain about pirating? Can you show me where and how anyone with a
pirated copy or Key generator playing on your game servers?

Last I recall, and this is where I get upset with the fact that I cannot use mounted images instead of having to
always insert a CD/DVD, you need a valid key to play online. Yes, there will always be private servers, but in all
honesty, they will never offer up the flexibility of just logging in and joining any server you please to play on.

Of course console sales are better, there is a LESS of an entertainment pool to play on. Do you think if WoW was
available on Console, the other games would sell as many? This is comes out after COD 4 was the #1 selling PC Title
in the last ratings. How much is enough already? As, we also know that the PC will be the target for the expansion pack
to fix/correct things that should have been implemented before going to release. As well as a limited amount of gameplay
changes/additions that didn't quite fit under the Corporate shipping schedule.

So, before complaining about the PC platform, examine your own actions, as well as the REAL competition in the PC market
(when COD 4 launched, it was among the myriad if launches in September and October, correct?). My memory is not the best,
but I think Team Fortress II, Unreal Tournament III, Quake Wars also launched at this time, with many other titles as well.

A Bonanza for PC Gamers, a maller slice of the market for each title though.

Console games comes out about one a month or two that everyone buys to play until the next one. I have an XboX 360 for
sport games (they are best on that I feel for myself). I absolutely am horrible at trying to play FPS with the controller (Old School
gamer). Guess what, I bought the PC version of COD 4. I will not be buying the XboX version.