irishScott
Lifer
- Oct 10, 2006
- 21,562
- 3
- 0
Without cracking 40% in any primary. With a sizable portion of the Republican base (ie: Tea Party) desperate to find an alternative. And like I said, take a look at congress if you think the Tea Party isn't running things.
GtB gets owned and providing the lulz, and Craig providing the stupidity. This place is pretty consistent 
irishScott
Lifer
- Oct 10, 2006
- 21,562
- 3
- 0
And? He will get Tea Party support, and GOP support in general for that matter, simply because he isn't Obama. The GOP will have no real issues rallying around Romney.
And as you said, the Tea Party is desperate to find an alternative. If they had such power as you claim, Perry, Bachman, Cain, Santorum or Gingrich would be where Romney is now. They're not. In fact they're all basically afterthoughts at this point.
monovillage
Diamond Member
- Jul 3, 2008
- 8,444
- 1
- 0
You just make shit up as you go along, then claim it's not debatable. Got it.
Republicans are all evil wicked monsters and Democrats are good and pure and love unicorns.
If the Tea Party was an afterthought we wouldn't have had that little Republican implosion over the payroll tax extension a couple of weeks ago. They are steering this party, and the fact they haven't finally coalesced around some non-Romney doesn't change that. Because as you said, supporting someone who is not Obama is priority #1, even if they hold their noses and pick Romney.
Skitzer
Diamond Member
- Mar 20, 2000
- 4,414
- 3
- 81
So you agree with Schultz that the Tea Party is to blame for Giffords shooting then? And the Tea Party is steering the GOP?
The Tea party is to blame for violent and inciteful rhetoric they consistently used. Whether that's what motivated Loughner to act or not, it very easily could have, him or someone else. And that's what Schultz is blaming the Tea party for -the discourse, not the shooting. I hadn't even bothered with the video before now, but the whole damn premise of this thread is fallacious. So yes, I agree with Schultz, but not with what you and others are asserting she's saying.
Absolutely.
Jaskalas
Lifer
- Jun 23, 2004
- 35,829
- 10,130
- 136
America was founded as small government capitalism. Yes, Obama IS destroying that. Along with all the other Dems and most the Reps.
Look, your boy chose to be President. That position is intended to be a lightning rod that takes all the blame for everything regardless of how realistic or plausible that blame actually is. For anyone who thinks socialism is anti American, Obama is 'destroying the nation'.
Wait a minute, how far off topic do you intend to take this? Last I checked it was the OP referring to the DNC's vitriol against the Tea Party. First you blame the victim and then you obscure the topic by using a generic 'but you're so mean to Obama'.
Looks like the OP held up a mirror and you ran for the hills, scared of your own shadow.
You just stated that all the evidence in the world wouldn't refute your point, so what's the point? You've already clearly put a blinder to reality.
The sun is cold. No evidence in the world to the contrary will change that fact. You are still welcome to debate it all you want, good luck.
I'm going to ignore the pissing context and go back to the OP and the link. Wasserman was not blaming the tea party for the Giffords shooting. It's quite a stretch to interpret her comments that way. She WAS blaming them for a general lack of civility. You can argue hypocrisy because of violent comments coming from the left, but claiming that she blamed the tea party for the Giffords shooting is a straw man.
Incidentally, if you look at Loughner's background, the shooting WAS politically motivated, just not by a clear ideology from either left or right. It was motivated, rather, by the paranoid style of American politics, in this case specifically by internet based conspiracy theories. These fed into a pre-existing mental illness. However, it's a mistake to claim that the fear and paranoia in our political culture had nothing to do with it. Politics played a role in the shooting, just not one amenable to partisan interpretation.
Incidentally, if you look at Loughner's background, the shooting WAS politically motivated, just not by a clear ideology from either left or right. It was motivated, rather, by the paranoid style of American politics, in this case specifically by internet based conspiracy theories. These fed into a pre-existing mental illness. However, it's a mistake to claim that the fear and paranoia in our political culture had nothing to do with it. Politics played a role in the shooting, just not one amenable to partisan interpretation.
I know it's basically her job, but even when I'm agreeing with her, Debbie Wasserman Schultz always comes across as an insufferable bitch to me.
irishScott
Lifer
- Oct 10, 2006
- 21,562
- 3
- 0
They're not an afterthought, but they're hardly steering the party. There's quite the schism in the Republican party actually, with no-compromise Tea Partiers being at odds with old-school Republicans. Yes Republican politicians tend to vote as a whole regardless, largely doing so for the good of the party. You can call it single-minded and lock-step if you like, but fact is Republicans have largely avoided the political dissension of the Democrats and the inherent political weakness it induces. That said, the Tea Party can only get away with so much, and mainstream America is just as disenfranchised with the Tea Party as it is with OWS. And it is mainstream America that wins general elections.
And my point still stands. If the Tea Party were steering the GOP, they wouldn't be forced to "hold their noses". You can't say they're steering the party when the party is going in a direction they don't want. Romney is getting the nomination against the will the Tea Party. They are hardly all-powerful, and their power will diminish even more during the general election.
But they make a nice scapegoat for Democrat idealogues such as yourself to point at, so by all means, make them appear more threatening than they are. Gives you something to rage against.
feralkid
Lifer
- Jan 28, 2002
- 16,866
- 4,979
- 136
Jaskalas
Lifer
- Jun 23, 2004
- 35,829
- 10,130
- 136
Least you're not hiding for cover, but instead have come out biting and barking.
The Tea Party is the first step of conservatives actually standing up for themselves against the big government Neocons. You know, the men like Bush, McCain, and Romney who intentionally cry out for small government, but side with and support the Democrats once they're in office. We're fighting back against traitors in the GOP who speak our language but walk YOUR walk.
When Gingrich pats himself on the back for making good deals in the 90s, it's that sort of moderate action that supports and advances your agenda. I don't call GWB a half-Dem for nothing, he grew entitlements, trashed our civil rights, gave us a massive expansion of government, and pre-socialized the country in bailouts. He freaking signed a energy bill that banned incandescent light bulbs. He was an absolute traitor to small government values.
Bush was not alone. A solid establishment in the GOP speaks to small government conservatives, but firmly believes in a fascist big government. These men keep getting the Republican nomination due to their moderate stances, their electability with independent voters. The voters want 'winners' and that means big government Neocons who sing 'bomb bomb bomb, bomb bomb Iran'.
The Tea Party is the call to arms for small government conservatives whose primary concern is freedom and liberty in this country. That means attacking the compromises the GOP makes with the Democrats. That means doing everything we can to stop your agenda in Congress. Every step of the way, if you want the debt ceiling increased you gotta go through us.
The reason the GOP is afraid of us is that they get elected using the rhetoric of small government. They don't practice what they preach, unless the Tea Party forces them to. Boehner would love to play moderate, to be a Half-Dem and give you debt ceiling increases, and keep expanding government. It'd give him independent votes for re-election. It is our duty to stop him from passing what you want.
This 'change in tone and rhetoric' you bemoan from the Tea Party is the sound of true conservatives, something you have not seen since the Reagan revolution.
You'd love if it when voted out of office the Republicans simply kept your seat warm for you. Hell, Bush even expanded it. For the first time in your life there's a faction in a major party that's not going to play your game. There is an actual resistance trying to force the Republicans to live up to their campaign promises. This discourse you warn against is the only true opposition you face.
Like Schultz, you want to go for the throat of the Tea Party. You've gotta do what you can to stop us from stopping the Neocons. Imagine if we actually got a hold long enough to shrink the size of government. That'd be a first.
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Nice discussion, except the tea party isn't a libertarian movement. It is socially conservative and hawkish. One need only listen to the speeches at their rallies and examine the candidates they support to understand this. They aren't for small government when it comes to national security and social issues. Only on fiscal and economic issues. In other words, they are the mainstream right, just the pissed off end of it. They may have started with a patina of libertarianism, but that is not what it has evolved as.
- wolf
xj0hnx
Diamond Member
- Dec 18, 2007
- 9,262
- 3
- 76
irishScott
Lifer
- Oct 10, 2006
- 21,562
- 3
- 0
What happened to her by a deranged Republican is all the representation the people of her district need.
xj0hnx
Diamond Member
- Dec 18, 2007
- 9,262
- 3
- 76
blankslate
Diamond Member
- Jun 16, 2008
- 8,797
- 572
- 126
The guy was insane and no one knows what set him off.
However, when you go around saying "Don't retreat reload." And have a U.S. map showing the areas you will be contesting in upcoming elections with icons that look like targeting reticles that you might see when looking through a rifle scope... it doesn't really do much for the political discourse either.
However, when you go around saying "Don't retreat reload." And have a U.S. map showing the areas you will be contesting in upcoming elections with icons that look like targeting reticles that you might see when looking through a rifle scope... it doesn't really do much for the political discourse either.
Linflas
Lifer
- Jan 30, 2001
- 15,395
- 78
- 91
monovillage
Diamond Member
- Jul 3, 2008
- 8,444
- 1
- 0
The people in her district are better represented by her now then they were when she was doing what Pelosi told her to do.
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