Disappointed by Ati AIW Radion32 DDR horid software and no support for good ones-- UPDATE!! Read this Thread!! I changed my Mind!!! OH Boy Oh Boy!!!

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fobbman

Senior member
May 16, 2000
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TechBlast:

I'm sorry to say that the current state of analog home video is such that compatibility issues are the norm. It's nice to envision an inexpensive (<$500) solution where you plug the card in, install the drivers and software, and the card automatically captures perfectly synched audio and video. By my experience checking out several solutions this is simply not available.

It DOES work for a lot of people. We must remember that we do not hear from them because they aren't having problems to complain about. I myself should be receiving my AIW in a few days, and am praying that it goes off better than my experience with the Pinnacle DC10+ as my copay for my meds has gone up and would hate to add a battery of psychotropics to the monthly budget.

As always the products users are the best source of help when having difficulties, as vast amounts of money are sucked out of the tech support budget and instead fed into marketing blitzes. It's a sorry state of affairs, and any other industry would have been grilled by the feds over this by now.
 
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NicColt

Diamond Member
Jul 23, 2000
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>Question No. 1
With the AIW Radeon can I record and send video clips to other Windows9x users over the net without first sending special sw files or helping others to configure their system and on and on.

YES: IF you use the same codec that they have. Forget MPEG-2. use divx or MPEG-1 or a free codec that Windows Media Player will automatically download from codec.microsoft.com

>Question No. 2
Once I save my 8mm Videos to CD, will the format they are saved in be obsolete in 10 years, so that the hope of viewing and or resaving them in a more up to date format will not exist?

YES: in 10 years it won't be obsolete but you will be looking at stone age recordings you did 10 years earlier. However if space is not a problem (cheap right now) you can record with a high bitrate and save to CD, that's your best shoot right now.

>Question No. 3
Is there a better solution around the corner or another affordable solution on the market now?

NO: Everything is out there NOW it's a simple equation, Quality divided by Price. You get what you pay for. The higher you pay the higher the Quality.

>Seems like a direct copy from 8mm to DVD format and or in the least to MPEG4 would be a better choice of graphic image storage.

What you would probably want is to record in high quality MPEG-2 and then do a Super-VCD to play on your DVD Player.

I would like to be able to play my CD stored Videos on my big screen via my home theater DVD player which accepts MPEG-1 only.

VCD or S-VCD may be what you want. for today's technology.

>However, I guess I could run a cable from my Computer's DVD to import MPEG-2 into my Sony HD big screen.

MUAHAHAHA don't we all :) but this brings up macrovision issues and carp. DVD players are not that expensive now anyway. If you have a Sony HD big Screen surely a DVD is not a problem.
 
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techblast

Member
Jul 22, 2000
34
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FOLKS,

By the way, the reason I even connected to this thread was due to the information Anandtech issued on their weekly CPU / Video card price round up. They stated that their is an ABSOLUTE difference in the ATI AIW Radeon RETAIL versus OEM versions.

&quot;We should note that several readers have pointed out that there are a few major differences between the Radeon 32MB DDR (Retail) and the Radeon 32MB DDR LE (OEM) which many online retailers fail to point out. The Radeon LE is actually a crippled version of the Retail card and does not feature ATI's Hyper-Z technology. It is important that readers understand this because Hyper-Z can have a significant effect on performance. The Radeon LE was originally meant to be an OEM product for some of the Asian markets. However the success of the product in those markets was overestimated and ATI was forced to bring the product to the North American market. The Radeon LE chips are generally composed of those chips that fail to work properly as fully functional Radeon solutions, meaning that they are often clocked at lower core frequencies and may not have fully functional HyperZ units. Many readers have been reporting success with overclocking their Radeon LEs as well as by forcing HyperZ to be enabled on the boards however proceed with your own risk as there are no guarantees. For more information consult the AnandTech Forums.&quot;

http://www.anandtech.com/showdoc.html?i=1432&amp;p=4

I am sure this thread is keen to this potential problem. Text
 
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LevcoS

Golden Member
Oct 9, 1999
1,529
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0
TechBlast-
The Radeon and the Radeon LE are NOT the same card, regardless of whether the Radeon (no LE) is retail or OEM. OEM Radeons *do* include HyperZ.

LevcoS
 
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fobbman

Senior member
May 16, 2000
882
0
0
Okay, let's see if I can tackle these questions without the card but with the experience that I have:



<< Question No. 1

With the AIW Radeon can I record and send video clips to other Windows9x users over the net without first sending special sw files or helping others to configure their system and on and on. >>



You can encode into either MPEG-1 or MPEG-2 formats with the AIW card, which are viewable in pretty much any system out there. MPEG-2 does require higher minimum system requirements, but the quality is much higher. Check out the official MPEG format website for information on system requirements.



<< Question No. 2

Once I save my 8mm Videos to CD, will the format they are saved in be obsolete in 10 years, so that the hope of viewing and or resaving them in a more up to date format will not exist? >>



Worries of obsolescence (sp?) of format are legitimate in the computer world, so working with a high-quality widely-recognized format is crucial. MPEG-2 would be the best format to archive these in, but of course save the original source media for later use if you need to transfer it again to something better.






<< Question No. 3

Is there a better solution around the corner or another affordable solution on the market now? Seems like a direct copy from 8mm to DVD format and or in the least to MPEG4 would be a better choice of graphic image storage. I would like to be able to play my CD stored Videos on my big screen via my home theater DVD player which accepts MPEG-1 only. However, I guess I could run a cable from my Computer's DVD to import MPEG-2 into my Sony HD big screen. >>



The creation of DVD's for the home is still an expensive venture. Apple's latest line of G4's has a DVD-R included, but I am unaware of what specifications it uses and the resulting products universal compatibility with standalone DVD players. In theory DVD storage would definitely be the best option due to storage and playback and quality considerations. Outside of that capturing the original source data at it's highest quality settings and then using a good MPEG encoder to encode it to your necessary MPEG-1 format would be your best option available at this time. Running cables from the computer to the TV works well(I've done it myself) as long as your computer is reasonably close to your TV. There are also home video transmitters out there that might help here too, but I haven't read any reviews on them as far as video quality goes.

Hope that helps.

 
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NicColt

Diamond Member
Jul 23, 2000
4,362
0
71
Well said fobbman but you forgot the lying, the deceiving, false advertising, mismanagement, financial improprieties, marketing collusion, insider trading and stock manipulation in order to sell the products and achieve financial results. In the end of all this, the poor consumer is the one that get's ultimately screwed out of their hard earned money and left out in the cold.

Welcome to the computer and video market world.
 
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NicColt

Diamond Member
Jul 23, 2000
4,362
0
71
>The Radeon LE is actually a crippled version of the Retail card and does not feature ATI's Hyper-Z technology

Correct, however you can just re-enable it with a registry tweak it will be the same as a Radeon.

The only difference is that the OEM's have slower memmory than the Retail's.
 
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fobbman

Senior member
May 16, 2000
882
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0


<< Well said fobbman but you forgot the lying, the deceiving, false advertising, mismanagement, financial improprieties, marketing collusion, insider trading and stock manipulation in order to sell the products and achieve financial results. In the end of all this, the poor consumer is the one that get's ultimately screwed out of their hard earned money and left out in the cold. >>



Hey now, I *DID* use the term &quot;marketing blitz&quot; didn't I? ;)
 
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fobbman

Senior member
May 16, 2000
882
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0
It's also my understanding that the big difference between the standard Radeon and the LE version is which side of the Radeon QA process you ended up on. If there were any problems with the chip running normal specs it went into the LE bin.
 
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techblast

Member
Jul 22, 2000
34
0
0
fobbman,

Thanks for the input. I often wonder how far technology could be in terms of market size, if manufacturers and producers made their technology work (out of the box) for the minions of non technical folks who don't buy because of compatibility headaches. Soon we will have special computer lemon laws enacted to address issues such as incompatibility, plug and play failures, etc. If companies like ATI won't deal honestly with the technology they produce, and pony up the expertise to cover the spectrum of possible uses of their products they may not be a business after these laws are passed.
 
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venomhed

Junior Member
Feb 28, 2001
23
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Nic and everyone else I really hope that wasn't the UPGRADE version. Never EVER, EVER upgrade an OS from MS. You must WIPE your system completely and install from scratch. Ive been doing this tech stuff for about 5 years and I have yet to see an upgrade work correctly.

Oh and RBV5 (sorry if name is wrong) the captured file was 7.5 gigs (I force VDUB to stop there so I get SOME room to work with). The file was huge but editable no prob.

I then separate the audio and video files, compress them separately, then join (mux) them. My files are very small (700mb usually) fit on an 80min cd and look outstanding!

On a side note, I just found my old VHS tape of Judas Priest Screaming for Vengeance tour! Gotta get that on CD before the tape breaks! Man the audio is really high quality on it too!
yes i am rambling.
 
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fobbman

Senior member
May 16, 2000
882
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0
Sadly enough there is more of a rush to get the product to market regardless of compatibility than what engineering can support. Most hardware/software companies are driven more by the marketing departments and less by the engineering/QA departments, and marketings thoughts are that it's best to get the product to market and then iron out the bugs later.
 
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NicColt

Diamond Member
Jul 23, 2000
4,362
0
71
>I really hope that wasn't the UPGRADE version

No I purchased it from the Microsoft Canada Reseller Evaluation Program since I work for compaq and they are a LAR's (large account resellers) and channel partner. I'm able to get certified Microsoft software at reduce reates, much reduced rates :) It's indeed a full version and not an upgrade.

>marketings thoughts are that it's best to get the product to market and then iron out the bugs later.

Exactly, just like the Radeon II, keep up with the hype, release a defective product and fix the bugs later. Well said.
 
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TungFree

Golden Member
Jan 7, 2001
1,619
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0
rbV5,
I will try the nick in another PCI slot having gread WetWilly's presentation and NicColts trials and errors of slot 1&amp; 5 and the other between come to mind. If this changes things it will be a birst of releif LOL.
if not I will just do as I said b4. I did not meant to go off on a yellow brick road off topic of theis thread I only meant it as an example for NicColt.
Nevertheless thanks :)
 
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TungFree

Golden Member
Jan 7, 2001
1,619
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letian,
welcome :) we all think this is a treasure chest thread, and the contributors are obious!!
 
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TungFree

Golden Member
Jan 7, 2001
1,619
0
0
fobbman,
about a year ago when win2k series came out, they had 63,000 known errors...
Imagine contractor building a home like that Bwahahahahahahah
 
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TungFree

Golden Member
Jan 7, 2001
1,619
0
0
techblaster,
Hawk on anandtech forums here was selling them for $210 and shipped it to hawaii free just hit me up for the paypal 2.2%. He is honest concerned and I highly recomend him as a trader and he loves to give u attention of immediate e-mail responses. If u read earlier in this thread he made some comments here and his profile is available.
 
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NicColt

Diamond Member
Jul 23, 2000
4,362
0
71
LMAO.... maybe now you'll know what I'm talking about. Here's an email response from ATI asking them how to configure NetMeeting with Radeon's.

This is ATI's official response for the NetMeeting and Radeon's issue.

In it, they say &quot;Please refer to troubleshooting steps below&quot; MUAHAHAHA

The steps below are &quot;ATI Engineering has been advised of this problem and is investigating&quot;.

ATI doesn't even know what there doing when sending email support. This is probably just an email drone with automated reply's. Ya gota love it.


===
Dear John, (I don't know where they got John)

Thank you for contacting ATI Technical Support Canada.

Regarding &quot;Microsoft Netmeeting - does not detect capture device when using a RADEON product&quot;:

Please refer to troubleshooting steps below for further assistance.
Netmeeting uses video for windows, but the ATI Multimedia Center 7.0 uses directshow. The operating system does not matter in this case, this issues affect all OS.

Regards,

Tai Chau
Technical Support Canada
ATI Technologies, Inc.

--------------------------------
3749: Microsoft Netmeeting - does not detect capture device when using a RADEON product

PRODUCT: RADEON for PC
STATUS: EPR 039952
Created: 11/18/2000 9:47:06 AM Last Update: 11/18/2000 9:50:50 AM

3rd Party Software: MICROSOFT WINDOWS 2000 MICROSOFT NetMeeting

PROBLEM DETAILS:
This issue affects the RADEON 64MB DDR VIVO and All-In-Wonder RADEON when used under Windows 98, Windows ME and Windows 2000.

When attempting to configure Netmeeting no video capture device is detected.

EXPLANATION:
ATI Engineering has been advised of this problem and is investigating.
===

Interpretation. PURE BULLSHIT
 
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NicColt

Diamond Member
Jul 23, 2000
4,362
0
71
rbv5, the files didn't work, but I'm positive now that win98 won't support the &quot;default&quot; windows vfw wdm driver. BUT

Here's what I got from the files the .drv file was &quot;Microsoft WDM Image Capture&quot; This is Win98's driver which is not a VfW WDM driver.

and the .dll which is Win2k's version is &quot;VfW MM Driver for WDM Video Capture Devices&quot; in this case it is a VfW WDM driver.

I am more than positive that after seeing this, win2k has a default vfw wdm video capture driver.

Well win2k is on it's way so I'm not going to pain myself with this until I install 2K. Thanks anyway.
 
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TungFree

Golden Member
Jan 7, 2001
1,619
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0
NicColt
LOL u never got a &quot;dear john&quot; letter? It is a letter girls send when they are dumping u Bwahahahahaha...
ATI does have some humore as it twists the knife into u :))
 
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astroller

Junior Member
Mar 3, 2001
18
0
0
This is becoming like the thread with the most juice! I have not digested it yet. I just want to have a quick overview, cos I'm planning to get a new VGA card myself.

So, is Radeon horrid? And, will it be a Radeon 64DDR VIVO or Asus V7700 Deluxe 64DDR VIVO (which is better)?

:)
 
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TungFree

Golden Member
Jan 7, 2001
1,619
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astroller
if u are too busy to read this supper fine thread that so many have given prime values to then it seems pointless to enguage u as Video today is not a 3 word answer.
Read the thread hang out a while get to know the ppl :) This seems like an extended family to get to know for a long haul.
Think not?
 
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