TGCid,
Facinating Link (doom9) and it promises to add refinements and phase 2...
It is a harmony for this thread.
Facinating Link (doom9) and it promises to add refinements and phase 2...
It is a harmony for this thread.
NicColt,
Have you checked what version of DirectX you have installed? I am on the following link reading about it DirectX Information
Just a thought...
Have you checked what version of DirectX you have installed? I am on the following link reading about it DirectX Information
Just a thought...
Yea Tung I have DX80a
UPDATE on this entire mess.
My solution to this is not with ATI or the Radeon's, it now lies with Windows, either 98 or 2K.
Normally, capture cards include the VfW windows driver model (WDM) with the cards drivers. But not in the Radeon's case, ATI want's to move towards the DirectShow API only and those are the WDM drivers that are included in the Radeon drivers, officially Radeon's "do not provide a Video for Windows solution" it other words, are not supposed to support VfW. Somehow the OS was able to install the default windows VfW WDM (win32) driver. In turn, with that default VfW driver installed it's able to detect the Rage Theatre chip and be compatible with it.
If I can somehow know which OS installs the default WDM Video for Windows (win32) and how?
Like rbv5 showed on his site, that is the key to fixing all this VfW mess. Somehow the default VfW driver model is able to detect the Rage theatre chip from the Radeon.
FACT: if rbv5 and a few others can use AVI-IO and VirtualDub he will most likely also be able to use NetMeeting, all of which require VfW and he is indeed mapping his Rage Theatre chip (same as AIW128) through the default Video for Windows mapper and not through the DirectShow API for those programs. Which goes against official Radeon support.
FACT: ATI Radeon's do NOT install a Video for Windows mapper it only installs a DirectShow API. ATI want's to move from the VfW to the new DirectShow API.
FACT: Somehow rbv5 and others, CAN and DO have the default WDM Video for Windows (win32) driver installed. The question is HOW. (were getting close to that answer)
FACT: Most users of Win2K and 98 don't have that particular driver installed and therefore can't use programs the require VfW's driver model.
Conclusion, having the OS install the default VfW WDM (win32) will be the key to sucessfully use the Radeon's with programs that require VfW support. Even though it's not officially supported by ATI nor does ATI want their cards to work with VfW. Damm you ATI but either way rbv5 is proof that it can somehow be done, and I won't rest until I know how.
UPDATE on this entire mess.
My solution to this is not with ATI or the Radeon's, it now lies with Windows, either 98 or 2K.
Normally, capture cards include the VfW windows driver model (WDM) with the cards drivers. But not in the Radeon's case, ATI want's to move towards the DirectShow API only and those are the WDM drivers that are included in the Radeon drivers, officially Radeon's "do not provide a Video for Windows solution" it other words, are not supposed to support VfW. Somehow the OS was able to install the default windows VfW WDM (win32) driver. In turn, with that default VfW driver installed it's able to detect the Rage Theatre chip and be compatible with it.
If I can somehow know which OS installs the default WDM Video for Windows (win32) and how?
Like rbv5 showed on his site, that is the key to fixing all this VfW mess. Somehow the default VfW driver model is able to detect the Rage theatre chip from the Radeon.
FACT: if rbv5 and a few others can use AVI-IO and VirtualDub he will most likely also be able to use NetMeeting, all of which require VfW and he is indeed mapping his Rage Theatre chip (same as AIW128) through the default Video for Windows mapper and not through the DirectShow API for those programs. Which goes against official Radeon support.
FACT: ATI Radeon's do NOT install a Video for Windows mapper it only installs a DirectShow API. ATI want's to move from the VfW to the new DirectShow API.
FACT: Somehow rbv5 and others, CAN and DO have the default WDM Video for Windows (win32) driver installed. The question is HOW. (were getting close to that answer)
FACT: Most users of Win2K and 98 don't have that particular driver installed and therefore can't use programs the require VfW's driver model.
Conclusion, having the OS install the default VfW WDM (win32) will be the key to sucessfully use the Radeon's with programs that require VfW support. Even though it's not officially supported by ATI nor does ATI want their cards to work with VfW. Damm you ATI but either way rbv5 is proof that it can somehow be done, and I won't rest until I know how.
rbV5
Lifer
- Dec 10, 2000
- 12,632
- 0
- 0
Nic, I think its time for a poll, because I believe the opposite to be true. I think MOST people with the Radeon in any VIVO flavor IS ABLE to capture video with their cards. I think also that ALOT of Radeon users may never even use the VIVO features, and I think there is a much smaller group of users whose setup isn't quite right to either install the drivers properly, or some other programs have deleted that/those video drivers that are necissary. There's no magic here, its just circuits, hardware and software. People whose stuff doesn't work are by far more vocal than someone whose stuff works. Its working with win2k and xp(whistler) and win98se, so I don't think the OS is the culprit. Keep at it, it works. Besides, to be honest, so far my best quality stuff has been the Mpeg-2 captures off the ATI Digital VCR anyway.
rbv5, I'm truly happy that you and other's, that your systems are running fine. But you would not believe the absolute dismay, pain and frustration that some of us have because we don't have a WDM Video for Windows driver. Also keep in mind that ATI does not want the Radeon's to run with VfW WDM if you want proof call ATI and ask them how to configure NetMeeting or VirtualDub or AVI_IO or other software that requires VfW. They will come back with the standard reply saying that those software do not comply with Microsoft new API implementation.
You'd think that ATI would help us and provide support and some sort of guidance or tell the truth about this.... of course NOT. For those of us that don't have that driver installed by the ATI software or OS and not having ATI support for this in any way shape or form, is an absolute nightmare for some of us.
You'd think that ATI would help us and provide support and some sort of guidance or tell the truth about this.... of course NOT. For those of us that don't have that driver installed by the ATI software or OS and not having ATI support for this in any way shape or form, is an absolute nightmare for some of us.
NicColt Try to do as follows:
move your 2 registry files into a safe place and reboot. the os will recreate the registry and possibly without or with something u need or is in excess. when I removed Adaptec 4.0 after installing Nero5.0 and having problems I uninstalled Adaptec and erased some common file used by other programs. there after Nero would not load at all griping missing files so I searched for those files and found them but possibly they needed tro be in another place too.
Finally I reinstalled win98 over the top of the old one and it worked after that.
The registry trick I tried another time and it had helped me also with a different problem I cannot recall now what it was.
move your 2 registry files into a safe place and reboot. the os will recreate the registry and possibly without or with something u need or is in excess. when I removed Adaptec 4.0 after installing Nero5.0 and having problems I uninstalled Adaptec and erased some common file used by other programs. there after Nero would not load at all griping missing files so I searched for those files and found them but possibly they needed tro be in another place too.
Finally I reinstalled win98 over the top of the old one and it worked after that.
The registry trick I tried another time and it had helped me also with a different problem I cannot recall now what it was.
NicColt,
I feel your frustration((
TGcid I went there and read the phase 2 a bit and will return to read it all later. Thankie thankie
I feel your frustration
(( TGcid I went there and read the phase 2 a bit and will return to read it all later. Thankie thankie
I recorded off TV for 8 hours (9.1 gig scsi drive) with DVIX Low at 1000 bit rate. Works perfectly, 8 gig huge ass file with EXCELLENT quality.
Nic I keep forgetting that you dont have Win2k Pro. I got it "from a friend" and wish you could just wipe your entire machine and install Win2k to solve your problem. Going through the registry bit by bit with NO help from ATI is just TOO time consuming. I really hope you can get a solution, I was right with you in "pains ville" until i wiped my system. Now its all good. ATI, great hardware, terrible drivers.
Also Nic, even if you do get it solved, you gotta go to NT so you can use the FULL size of your drives. That was my second hurdle, WinMe and nothing over 4 gigs!
Good luck bro!
Nic I keep forgetting that you dont have Win2k Pro. I got it "from a friend" and wish you could just wipe your entire machine and install Win2k to solve your problem. Going through the registry bit by bit with NO help from ATI is just TOO time consuming. I really hope you can get a solution, I was right with you in "pains ville" until i wiped my system. Now its all good. ATI, great hardware, terrible drivers.
Also Nic, even if you do get it solved, you gotta go to NT so you can use the FULL size of your drives. That was my second hurdle, WinMe and nothing over 4 gigs!
Good luck bro!
rbV5
Lifer
- Dec 10, 2000
- 12,632
- 0
- 0
venomhed, NTFS on that SCSI drive to make that 4+ gig capture?
Actually, I do know how you feel Nic. I've been messing with computers for over a decade since my 286 and DOS 5.0, I've danced that dance many times, thats why if there is somethng I can help with, you got it. The reason I pipe up isn't to rub in your face because mine works and yours don't, its so that you can see that it does work on my machine, so there is hope that you can get yours going too.
Do you have file "vfwwdm32.dll" in your system32 folder?
Actually, I do know how you feel Nic. I've been messing with computers for over a decade since my 286 and DOS 5.0, I've danced that dance many times, thats why if there is somethng I can help with, you got it. The reason I pipe up isn't to rub in your face because mine works and yours don't, its so that you can see that it does work on my machine, so there is hope that you can get yours going too.
Do you have file "vfwwdm32.dll" in your system32 folder?
rbV5
Lifer
- Dec 10, 2000
- 12,632
- 0
- 0
I don't use Netmeeting, so no, I've never tried it. It's some kinda video conferencing app right? I know that it installs with the OS, but can I just fire it up to try it? Maybe tommorow I can give it a try, I don't have a web cam or anything, but I should be able to recieve video right?
>Do you have file "vfwwdm32.dll" in your system32 folder?
No I don't, damm that could be the file I'm missing. Email it to me please. I'll see if that fixes it.
>wish you could just wipe your entire machine and install Win2k to solve your problem.
FYI I just purchased Win2000 Pro from Microsoft.com for $84 Cdn normal price is about $215Cdn. Figure that one out....
It won't be long now.
Edit: email fixed --->
No I don't, damm that could be the file I'm missing. Email it to me please. I'll see if that fixes it.
>wish you could just wipe your entire machine and install Win2k to solve your problem.
FYI I just purchased Win2000 Pro from Microsoft.com for $84 Cdn
normal price is about $215Cdn. Figure that one out....It won't be long now.
Edit: email fixed --->
NicColt,
Just a word of warning. I have had in the past various virus problems that destroyed some of the files and sometimes would get a requester telling me i'm missing a file with a .dll, I would search my copmuter and find it and then, I would think it was corupt so I would copy it from my other computer, but the same requester would appear.
Another win98 querk was defraging in 2 ways:
1 if I did not close all the files in the botom extrem right of my task bar the defrag would hang up after starting and working a bit, then would do 2% and start from the beginning. So I had to close all the files I could from my bottom right task bar and retry windows defrag. Then I had many problems show up. so I tryed to reinstal win98. Now the computer was reporting it cannot read the CD. so I changed CD roms still the same. so I went and borrowed another CD win98 same problem.
2. I Installed Norton Utilities 4.0 and defragged the drive. Then that let me have the CDRom recognize and reinstall win98. and all seemed well. Then I noticed my networking from this computer was incredibly slow but other computers on the Lan could get files from me quite fast. I switched networking cables no change. I put another computer in that spot and it worked fine. I am about to Do clean reformat and reinstall.
So my computer works fine in everyway but is 100 times slower to start downloading on Lan. well it must be doing something to search files and spin in circles a long time b4 doing the download. posibly because of the failed defrag that may have caused a cancer.
I wrote the above to get u looking for unusual problems or do a full backup and reinstall windows. then if it works, gradualy sestore one program at a time, and finally save the registry files to a different partition or drive and restore the old registry. you may be able to discover what your problem was, and satisfy your pit bull like problem comfronting mechanisms u have so tenatiously trained in yourself.
I beleive your problem is uncommon and will not be found in the usual way, else you would have discovered it by now. I do hope the file from rbV5 works 4 u but juuuuuuuuuuuuuust incase it does not have heart and try the above considerations.) Crossing Fingers 4 u
rbV5 what program installed vfwwdm32.dll file ?
PS I also had removed and installed a spare same brand and model networking card with no changes just in case u thought I missed that possibilitry.
Just a word of warning. I have had in the past various virus problems that destroyed some of the files and sometimes would get a requester telling me i'm missing a file with a .dll, I would search my copmuter and find it and then, I would think it was corupt so I would copy it from my other computer, but the same requester would appear.
Another win98 querk was defraging in 2 ways:
1 if I did not close all the files in the botom extrem right of my task bar the defrag would hang up after starting and working a bit, then would do 2% and start from the beginning. So I had to close all the files I could from my bottom right task bar and retry windows defrag. Then I had many problems show up. so I tryed to reinstal win98. Now the computer was reporting it cannot read the CD. so I changed CD roms still the same. so I went and borrowed another CD win98 same problem.
2. I Installed Norton Utilities 4.0 and defragged the drive. Then that let me have the CDRom recognize and reinstall win98. and all seemed well. Then I noticed my networking from this computer was incredibly slow but other computers on the Lan could get files from me quite fast. I switched networking cables no change. I put another computer in that spot and it worked fine. I am about to Do clean reformat and reinstall.
So my computer works fine in everyway but is 100 times slower to start downloading on Lan. well it must be doing something to search files and spin in circles a long time b4 doing the download. posibly because of the failed defrag that may have caused a cancer.
I wrote the above to get u looking for unusual problems or do a full backup and reinstall windows. then if it works, gradualy sestore one program at a time, and finally save the registry files to a different partition or drive and restore the old registry. you may be able to discover what your problem was, and satisfy your pit bull like problem comfronting mechanisms u have so tenatiously trained in yourself.
I beleive your problem is uncommon and will not be found in the usual way, else you would have discovered it by now. I do hope the file from rbV5 works 4 u but juuuuuuuuuuuuuust incase it does not have heart and try the above considerations.
) Crossing Fingers 4 u rbV5 what program installed vfwwdm32.dll file ?
PS I also had removed and installed a spare same brand and model networking card with no changes
just in case u thought I missed that possibilitry.Holy livin' s#it!
I was in the market for the AIW Radeon. Now after reading this educational thread, I will skip this poorly supported card and wait. I want to transfer and edit my home 8mm videos to CD for preservation purposes, but not go crazy in the process. Frankly I don't have the time to re-invent the wheel for my specific computer configuration nor the desire to purchase Win2k pro or talk to 15 year old's on technical issues. I have Win 98 se and that's the way it will stay for now. ATI your as sorry as they come, bait with cool advertizments but deliver solid confussion. No wonder we're in recession:Q:disgust:
I was in the market for the AIW Radeon. Now after reading this educational thread, I will skip this poorly supported card and wait. I want to transfer and edit my home 8mm videos to CD for preservation purposes, but not go crazy in the process. Frankly I don't have the time to re-invent the wheel for my specific computer configuration nor the desire to purchase Win2k pro or talk to 15 year old's on technical issues. I have Win 98 se and that's the way it will stay for now. ATI your as sorry as they come, bait with cool advertizments but deliver solid confussion. No wonder we're in recession:Q:disgust:
techblast,
Now u are jumping on the other side of the seasaw. This VideoEditing field is new to PC average consumers. and the developments are hectic in the software compatibility. ATI is as sly as u say but they also made a fine product hardware wise for a price hard to beat. If we all thought like u (and I at first did) then this thread would not have so many contributions and helping hands with christian like help.
Stick around, techblast, NicColt will lick his problem and I will get my new MOBO withing 4 weeks and I expect to be Video Editing soon exchanging finnished Videos with NicColt LOL Bwahahahahah
Now u are jumping on the other side of the seasaw. This VideoEditing field is new to PC average consumers. and the developments are hectic in the software compatibility. ATI is as sly as u say but they also made a fine product hardware wise for a price hard to beat. If we all thought like u (and I at first did) then this thread would not have so many contributions and helping hands with christian like help.
Stick around, techblast, NicColt will lick his problem and I will get my new MOBO withing 4 weeks and I expect to be Video Editing soon exchanging finnished Videos with NicColt LOL
Bwahahahahah
rbV5
Lifer
- Dec 10, 2000
- 12,632
- 0
- 0
NicColt, I also sent you file "VFWWDM.DRV" it is required for video capture in win98, it is the 16bit capture driver, the other file is the 32bit WDM helper app. In win2k, "vfwwdm32.dll" serves as both so "VFWWDM.DRV" is not needed. Also take a gander at this Knowledge Base paper, may serve to clear up the problems you and others are experiencing.VfW-to-WDM Video Capture Mapper on Windows
TungFree, I believe it is installed by default on every MS operating system since Win95b, but I certainly could be wrong. Also try your NIC in another PCI slot, they are notorius for conflicts with other PCI cards.
TungFree, I believe it is installed by default on every MS operating system since Win95b, but I certainly could be wrong. Also try your NIC in another PCI slot, they are notorius for conflicts with other PCI cards.
I think netmeeting is installed with OS unless it is customized not to.
A regular video feed should work, it doesnt have to be a webcam.
I dont even do all these fancy video editing stuff that you guys are doing.
All I want is to get this video conferencing going. I like this thread very much,
lots of useful information.
A regular video feed should work, it doesnt have to be a webcam.
I dont even do all these fancy video editing stuff that you guys are doing.
All I want is to get this video conferencing going. I like this thread very much,
lots of useful information.
TungFree,
It is a time budget thingy. I am no computer nerd, but I am no slacker either. I have never purchased a "turn key" computer. I have always braved the elements and pieced together my machine. I have an inhouse network for the kids and periphial sharing (and games). I use my system for business, buying and everything else I can think of. I use ATT @home for internet. My 6th Grade son knows more about Powerpoint then I do. I have attended Junior college several times to expand my expertise with windows and networking.
Now I know I can make the ATI card work. But before I roll up my sleves I must calculate time to achieve the intended goal and for now time is against me. It does trouble me about ATI. This company needs to be more sharing with regards to technical issues and especially with compatibility problems. Still the need to preserve 12 year old 8mm video's of my kids is an important project and will most likely push me into buying the hardware I need to achieve this task. Additionally, my kids are getting into advanced presentations for their respective schools here in the North Dallas area. Technology is all over the place, especially around here. Many of today's kids will be well equiped for tomorrow's job market as many of these kids have never experienced a world absent of high technology. Still I have a problem with Win2k ($$$)to get the expected flexibility from this card.
Did not mean to reflect a general state of shock with the problems being hammered on this thread. I hope you all can find solutions to the loopholes. ATI your still a sorry company to the core and don't deserve customers as good as the folks who are doing your work on this thread. SHAME ON YOU!
It is a time budget thingy. I am no computer nerd, but I am no slacker either. I have never purchased a "turn key" computer. I have always braved the elements and pieced together my machine. I have an inhouse network for the kids and periphial sharing (and games). I use my system for business, buying and everything else I can think of. I use ATT @home for internet. My 6th Grade son knows more about Powerpoint then I do. I have attended Junior college several times to expand my expertise with windows and networking.
Now I know I can make the ATI card work. But before I roll up my sleves I must calculate time to achieve the intended goal and for now time is against me. It does trouble me about ATI. This company needs to be more sharing with regards to technical issues and especially with compatibility problems. Still the need to preserve 12 year old 8mm video's of my kids is an important project and will most likely push me into buying the hardware I need to achieve this task. Additionally, my kids are getting into advanced presentations for their respective schools here in the North Dallas area. Technology is all over the place, especially around here. Many of today's kids will be well equiped for tomorrow's job market as many of these kids have never experienced a world absent of high technology. Still I have a problem with Win2k ($$$)to get the expected flexibility from this card.
Did not mean to reflect a general state of shock with the problems being hammered on this thread. I hope you all can find solutions to the loopholes. ATI your still a sorry company to the core and don't deserve customers as good as the folks who are doing your work on this thread. SHAME ON YOU!
rbV5
Lifer
- Dec 10, 2000
- 12,632
- 0
- 0
techblast, Actually you are right to be concerned, I have been lucky and my AIW Radeon has worked great right out of the box, but others have not been as lucky. I spent alot of time researching and after reading a few different forums, it took a real leap of faith to disregard the negatives I was hearing and spend the $250 (most expensive component of my entire system!) on a card with such a track record, but I am SO glad I did! Your old video's aren't going anywhere, sit back and see, maybe driver developments or another solution will appear.
letian, I think you're right and when I get time, I'll give it a shot...must sleep
letian, I think you're right and when I get time, I'll give it a shot...must sleep
Tung I really don't have any problems with my win98 it's been running very good for me except for this VfW issue. I formatted 3 times this year with a clean install and... nothing for VfW support at all. Like I said below "normally" the VfW drivers are included in the Card's drivers.
techblast we do live in a perplexed world when it comes to video editing on your computer, give me $10,000 and I'll find you a vid editing solution that will make you dream. However to find one that offers an All-in-One in-expensive solution that works properly is not for the faint of heart. I admit there are issues to overcome (for some) but to find one that is able to deliver what this one has, even with certain difficulties that some of us have is hard to find.
rbv5 I'm not home right now so I'll test those files out later and will let you know. I did read that Microsoft knowledge base for the VfW-WDM mapper head to toe but this is what Microsoft wants to get away from an it's just a matter of time before the DirectShow-WDM takes over. The problem for Microsoft is, what "hardware" will support the new DirectShow API and when. That's why ATI on orders from Microsoft, is instructed do include the DirectShow API only for the Radeon's.
Now the obvious flaw with the Radeon is that the Rage Theatre chip that does the vid capture, IS somehow compatible with the default windows VfW driver (actually that's good news for us but bad news for ATI), however for ATI to prevent the Radeon from using the VfW mapper, they did not include it in their drivers and are obviously making every effort to not support this. BUT for you "for example" in order to achieve using the VfW with the Radeon, it somehow connects to the default VfW mapper. All in all that is fine and dandy BUT that's not what Microsoft and ATI wants. With ATI's dumb know nothing lying and misleading attitude about VfW's, it's up to us to find a solution for those of us that can't access the VfW driver. Installing these files may (will) be a solution that both Microsoft and ATI would like to keep hidden and quiet.
techblast we do live in a perplexed world when it comes to video editing on your computer, give me $10,000 and I'll find you a vid editing solution that will make you dream. However to find one that offers an All-in-One in-expensive solution that works properly is not for the faint of heart. I admit there are issues to overcome (for some) but to find one that is able to deliver what this one has, even with certain difficulties that some of us have is hard to find.
rbv5 I'm not home right now so I'll test those files out later and will let you know. I did read that Microsoft knowledge base for the VfW-WDM mapper head to toe but this is what Microsoft wants to get away from an it's just a matter of time before the DirectShow-WDM takes over. The problem for Microsoft is, what "hardware" will support the new DirectShow API and when. That's why ATI on orders from Microsoft, is instructed do include the DirectShow API only for the Radeon's.
Now the obvious flaw with the Radeon is that the Rage Theatre chip that does the vid capture, IS somehow compatible with the default windows VfW driver (actually that's good news for us but bad news for ATI), however for ATI to prevent the Radeon from using the VfW mapper, they did not include it in their drivers and are obviously making every effort to not support this. BUT for you "for example" in order to achieve using the VfW with the Radeon, it somehow connects to the default VfW mapper. All in all that is fine and dandy BUT that's not what Microsoft and ATI wants. With ATI's dumb know nothing lying and misleading attitude about VfW's, it's up to us to find a solution for those of us that can't access the VfW driver. Installing these files may (will) be a solution that both Microsoft and ATI would like to keep hidden and quiet.
OK, I'm circling the wagon.
Question No. 1
With the AIW Radeon can I record and send video clips to other Windows9x users over the net without first sending special sw files or helping others to configure their system and on and on.
Question No. 2
Once I save my 8mm Videos to CD, will the format they are saved in be obsolete in 10 years, so that the hope of viewing and or resaving them in a more up to date format will not exist?
Question No. 3
Is there a better solution around the corner or another affordable solution on the market now? Seems like a direct copy from 8mm to DVD format and or in the least to MPEG4 would be a better choice of graphic image storage. I would like to be able to play my CD stored Videos on my big screen via my home theater DVD player which accepts MPEG-1 only. However, I guess I could run a cable from my Computer's DVD to import MPEG-2 into my Sony HD big screen.
Question No. 1
With the AIW Radeon can I record and send video clips to other Windows9x users over the net without first sending special sw files or helping others to configure their system and on and on.
Question No. 2
Once I save my 8mm Videos to CD, will the format they are saved in be obsolete in 10 years, so that the hope of viewing and or resaving them in a more up to date format will not exist?
Question No. 3
Is there a better solution around the corner or another affordable solution on the market now? Seems like a direct copy from 8mm to DVD format and or in the least to MPEG4 would be a better choice of graphic image storage. I would like to be able to play my CD stored Videos on my big screen via my home theater DVD player which accepts MPEG-1 only. However, I guess I could run a cable from my Computer's DVD to import MPEG-2 into my Sony HD big screen.
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