Did I screw up my clutch?

SketchMaster

Diamond Member
Feb 23, 2005
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149
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I have ~13,000 miles on my car (Suzuki SX4) and lately the clutch has been acting funny. When I'm letting it out it seems no matter what I do the car learches back a forth a bit in the lower gears. Today I was merging onto a busy road and when I hit the gas in 1st it defanitly felt like it was slipping.

I'm not going to BS anyone, I learned how to drive on a clutch but I drove an auto for over a year once I got my licence so I didn't have any real time becoming good at shifting. I just got this car last year so I pretty much had to relearn how to drive stick and I'm sure I suck. I feather the clutch alot and I'm probably a bit rough on it in the corners since I'm still getting the hang of down shifting.

Is there ANY chance it may just be time to change the fluid, or is this going to be an expensive lesson?
 

Vette73

Lifer
Jul 5, 2000
21,503
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Fluid would not cause your problem, unless it was leaking but that would be another problem.

Since its under warrenty have the dealer look at it. Worse case they say you tore the clutch up and its not covered (wear item) best case its either minor and/or covered by the warrenty.
 

SketchMaster

Diamond Member
Feb 23, 2005
3,100
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So what would be a good guess of the cost I could be looking at? I would ask if this is something I can do myelf, but I'm sure it's one of those thing were if I have to ask, I shouldn't try.
 

exdeath

Lifer
Jan 29, 2004
13,679
10
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Do you have a tach? Sounds like you are just bogging it or not rev matching right if it's jerking and rocking. In a small engined car the momentum of the drive train and mass off the car easily overpowers the engine and can cause the car to buck, rock, bog, feel no power at all with your foot to the floor to where it feels like slipping, etc, if you don't shift at the right time or allow the RPM the drop too low. That feedback is normal being that there is no play or slip in the drive train like there is with an automatic's torque converter. If you are in the wrong gear or too low RPM for your speed and the wheels aren't tuning, the engine and drive train are going to bind up and cause bucking, shuddering, etc, and if you are in too high a gear, trying to accelerate will have zero effect (perceived as slipping?), especially if its not a torque-y engine down low.

How high do you rev before you shift and whats the lowest you get when you are driving? With a 4 cyl, cruising should be 1,500-2,500 RPM and never lower unless stopped and idle. Don't be afraid to let it go up there and scream if you need to get moving in a hurry. If you had an automatic and it had a tach, you'd see the manufacturer allowing it it go to 6,000+ (or a few 100 RPM from the red) every time before the first shift. That first shift from first to second is the biggest change in gear ratio and would cause what you describe if you shift to early in first without enough revs.

The lower gears are also really low and the car is going to be really sensitive to the slightest creeps in the pedal below your right foot, and once you get rocking, your foot bounces and the problem just compounds until you let off and wait for it to smooth out again.

If it's you, don't worry about it, you'll get used to it and get better. Every car is different anyway and no matter how good you car, you can easily drive like a n00b in a different car right off the bat. I have a terrible time switching between driving a Camry 5 spd and a Cobra 6 spd when I haven't driven one or the other in more than a week. It's especially entertaining slamming the Camry's clutch pedal into the floor like a feat of Hercules... :eek:

To know if it's the clutch, accelerate to 25-30 in 2nd, then shift into 5th, let off the clutch completely and, and floor it. Does the engine scream and the acceleration of the car doesn't feel proportional to the rising RPM, almost like neutral? Then the clutch is slipping. Otherwise you will see the engine RPM drop immediately and the car will have no power at all. Then the clutch is working properly. You can also slowly and gently climb the revs high in second, let off and coast abruptly, then rapidly accelerate again and that would slip the clutch also if its not holding well. The engine will rev extremely quickly or sound weird going up and down as the clutch struggles to take hold.

Stock OEM clutches aren't all that super expensive, maybe like $150 for a clutch set. Not sure about labor. It's a easy do it yourself job if you know what you are doing, but if it's front wheel drive transverse mount, it's easy to get overwhelmed and you are also dealing with suspension/brake/axle components which could be a safety issue if you don't know what you are doing putting it all back together. The clutch itself is a 5 minute job, but on a FWD car it takes like an hour to get to it!

Could also be pedal position or linkage adjustment that is out of whack.

No offense but I think it's just you personally, because I do the same thing in my Camry if I haven't been driving it in a while until I re-adjust, usually in like a day. And every car I have ever owned has been manual.

Wow, and I'm extremely chatty tonight... boring rainy Friday night.
 

programmer

Senior member
Mar 12, 2003
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A lot of newer clutches have no adjustment, especially on econo-boxes. Likely it needs to be replaced, and I wouldn't be surprised if it requires some specialized tools (and knowledge) to do it "right".

As Marlin suggests, take it to the dealer and say there is something wrong with it, "like the transmission." Let them look and determine if it is warranty work. I *would* be surprised if you burned it up by 13,000 miles, really. Hopefully the dealer will chalk it up to something defective and fix it for you.
 

SketchMaster

Diamond Member
Feb 23, 2005
3,100
149
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After playing with it more I think the slipping was in my head, or I was on some loose gravel. The rest is me trying not to rev so high, 1st gear is very low so I have to hit 4.5K+ to get it upto 25MPH (car redlines ~6k) and so kids in Hondas get the wrong idea and try racing me. But the low gearing aslo makes it fun to mess with them, if I drop the cluth over 3k I can smoke my tires and it freaks them out thinking I have 200+ HP in my car and they quit the race. :p But I've only done that once since I know it's very hard on the car.

I'll still take the car by the dealer some time soon since I should have the car looked over anyway to make sure all is well.

Thanks for the help.
 

T2urtle

Diamond Member
Oct 18, 2004
3,432
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Originally posted by: Marlin1975


Since its under warrenty have the dealer look at it. Worse case they say you tore the clutch up and its not covered (wear item) best case its either minor and/or covered by the warrenty.


Best way to do it... Prior to them taking it apart the guy might say, hey there is a chance that you need a new clutch, and we won't know untill we have everything apart. But here is the price of a clutch job, do you agree to this IF it is a worn clutch... say $1000.

Now what can happen is with 13k they can good will warranty this FOR ONE TIME ONLY, if they are nice. Or find out its another problem. It would be the safest option, because you might not know something could be wrong with it.

 

Demo24

Diamond Member
Aug 5, 2004
8,356
9
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better way to tell if the clutch is slipping.

get to a road of decent speed(I'd say try this around 40-45mph), put it in high gear and then floor it. If the rpm's rise with no initial acceleration its possible you have an issue. If they rise slowly along with your speed then the clutch should be fine.
 

Kestnuts

Junior Member
Aug 2, 2007
8
0
0
Originally posted by: SketchMaster
After playing with it more I think the slipping was in my head, or I was on some loose gravel. The rest is me trying not to rev so high, 1st gear is very low so I have to hit 4.5K+ to get it upto 25MPH (car redlines ~6k) and so kids in Hondas get the wrong idea and try racing me. But the low gearing aslo makes it fun to mess with them, if I drop the cluth over 3k I can smoke my tires and it freaks them out thinking I have 200+ HP in my car and they quit the race. :p But I've only done that once since I know it's very hard on the car.

I'll still take the car by the dealer some time soon since I should have the car looked over anyway to make sure all is well.

Thanks for the help.

That's actually pretty typical for most cars, you really don't want to be in first gear much over ~15-20mph anyway. My car makes 5500rpms at 30mph in 1st gear by way of comparison.
Don't be afraid to rev it up some to get going either, the first couple gears in my car I let it get up to about 4k rpms before shifting, but I only have 110 horses under the hood too. If there really IS a problem, don't hesitate to get it looked at IMMEDIATELY. My car started popping in and out of 3rd gear 6 months back and I paid it no attention, thinking I was just messing up. I would just smack it into gear a little harder the next time. It kept happening more and more often until one day I just completely lost power in the middle of a state park at 10 at night. It turned out that the shift fork in my transmission had gotten slightly warped, due to the previous owner towing it behind an RV without disconnecting the drive shaft. Normal driving, plus my idiot self smacking the shifter harder instead of getting the problem checked, caused the fork to break off and locked the transmission into first gear and reverse at the same time. $1,000 and a slightly used transmission and new clutch later, my car is running like new again but it was an EXPENSIVE lesson.

Oh, by the way, new guy here, what's up?
 

exdeath

Lifer
Jan 29, 2004
13,679
10
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I have to rev my 95 Camry 2.2L to 6k with the AC off for at least the first two gears to not get run over and traffic is still pulling away from me without even trying.

Then there is the Cobra I short shift at 2k all the way to 6th and pull away from traffic at 1100 RPM going 45-55. Mmm torque.

I wanted to turn the Camry into a 3SGTE sleeper because it would be hilarious seeing people get smoked by the slowest car on Earth, but with all the rain here, I'm thinking I should just get a truck... hmmm SVT Lightning....

Main thing with a 4 banger is if you lug it at a low RPM, and step on it you will not feel anything, you'll just be loading the engine up and the revs aren't going to go anywhere unless you wait all day. Thats not slipping, thats just lack of torque. If you shift from 2nd to 5th and let off the clutch completely and floor it and your revs skyrocket then you are slipping. If it sticks, you'll just see the tach needle slam down from 6,000 to 1,000 and the car will just feel like it died, then the clutch is working.
 

SketchMaster

Diamond Member
Feb 23, 2005
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Originally posted by: Kestnuts
Originally posted by: SketchMaster
...1st gear is very low so I have to hit 4.5K+ to get it upto 25MPH (car redlines ~6k) and so kids in Hondas get the wrong idea and try racing me...

That's actually pretty typical for most cars, you really don't want to be in first gear much over ~15-20mph anyway. My car makes 5500rpms at 30mph in 1st gear by way of comparison...

I glanced down at the tac today and I was buzzin at 5500 for 25MPH. Not getting into a contest, just thought I should correct myself.
 

Kestnuts

Junior Member
Aug 2, 2007
8
0
0
Ah, that's a bit lower gearing than mine. But you're in 1st gear so little in normal driving that it shouldn't be much trouble anyway. What matters more is what the engine spins at at typical cruising speeds. I think mine spins at about 3,000 to 3200 going 75mph in fifth gear, which is pretty good. I say think because I don't have a tach in my car. There's a little chart i found that lists top speeds for each gear in my car and what RPM the engine spins at at those speeds. The engine makes peak power at 5500rpms but it doesn't hit the limiter until 6k. I had THOUGHT once i got out of college of doing some simple mods to my car (a 98 escort LX by the way) to give it an extra 30-40hp because then I think it would be close to a perfect daily driver for me, but it's already got 107k miles on it and I know i could get a car better than that for what i'd put into it in time and money.