Democratic Party - Clueless & Feckless - is the D party done?

[pmv]

Who's not enacting change?

The larger systemic changes people claim to want require larger majorities so you can marginalize the more wishy-washy party members instead of them having outsized power to block stuff.

Well, here, Starmer's lot (who banged on endlessly about 'getting power being more important than ideological purity') clearly are not enacting any kind of change. Nothing is improving.

I don't know enough about the US to argue the point, but self-evidently whatever change the previous Biden admin achieved was nowhere near sufficient, or you wouldn't be back with Trump again (and if there'd been a bit more change in the last century or so, he wouldn't now have all the mechanisms he has available to ensure he never loses power again).

 

[gothuevos]

Look at that and then take a look at this.
People are just input/output devices.

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And then ponder the Marshall Plan post WW2

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Oooh ... So lifting people out of poverty ensured a lasting peace and prosperity?

You're talking about a country that rewarded Obama giving them some semblance of health care with one of the worst midterm losses ever in US history.

So just completely ignore whatever logic you think applies here .

 

[Brainonska511]

Well, here, Starmer's lot (who banged on endlessly about 'getting power being more important than ideological purity') clearly are not enacting any kind of change. Nothing is improving.

Well, I can't speak for the UK. The UK is also the country known for shooting itself in the dick with going forward with Brexit after a non-binding, barely-passing referendum when it had a pretty strong stake in the EU... So there is certainly an opportunity for dramatic change - perhaps it's just not the change you want.

I don't know enough about the US to argue the point, but self-evidently whatever change the previous Biden admin achieved was nowhere near sufficient, or you wouldn't be back with Trump again (and if there'd been a bit more change in the last century or so, he wouldn't now have all the mechanisms he has available to ensure he never loses power again).

If anything, the Trump --> Biden --> Trump years really goes to show that material politics isn't the be-all-end-all. There were lots of vibes that seemed to matter more and people perfectly happy to sacrifice some material gains for a form of sociological materialism in the form of indulgence into racism and brutality against "the other".

As for the re-election of Trump, there were many places to stop him where people failed miserably: Republican Senators refusing to convict at impeachment #2 to ban him from office forever; the seemingly slow walk of bringing Trump to trial for insurrection under Garland's DOJ; SCOTUS deciding the 14th Amendment doesn't ban insurrectionists from running for office for calvinball reasons; the media for constantly normalizing his insanity as if it was "normal policy" and papering over his inadequacies; and of course, the voters for putting Trump back in office, despite having witnessed the disaster of his first presidency (and apparently memory-holing 2020 and his disaster of a response to covid)

 

[cytg111]

You're talking about a country that rewarded Obama giving them some semblance of health care with one of the worst midterm losses ever in US history.

So just completely ignore whatever logic you think applies here .

You guys need to think a step or two beyond what's right in your face.

If you go to war with the trailer trash ... the machine is going to produce more trailer trash.

You need another strategy.

 

[fskimospy]

Am I wrong?

They are not in an enviable position.

Yes you are very obviously wrong.

 

[pmv]

If anything, the Trump --> Biden --> Trump years really goes to show that material politics isn't the be-all-end-all. There were lots of vibes that seemed to matter more and people perfectly happy to sacrifice some material gains for a form of sociological materialism in the form of indulgence into racism and brutality against "the other".

Which is why it might be worth fighting fire with fire and trying to define a different "other" for people to rage against. Class war not race war. If people want an enemy to turn on, give them one - the rich.

But if you are suggesting the problem is the electorate, i.e. the nature of people, you might be right, but then the problem is insoluble, no? I'm increasingly of the view that that might be the case, human nature is just a bit rotten.

The only thing that ever seemed to 'work', was in the period when socialism was a real threat but not triumphant. The fear of socialism kept the plutocrats in check and made them behave themselves and meant they were prepared to make concessions to the masses (the welfare state was created by Bismark to stave off socialist revolt).

Absent that fear they've run amok and can't seem to restrain their impulse to try and own and control everything and grind everyone else into the dirt.

 

[Indus]

Which is why it might be worth fighting fire with fire and trying to define a different "other" for people to rage against. Class war not race war. If people want an enemy to turn on, give them one - the rich.

But if you are suggesting the problem is the electorate, i.e. the nature of people, you might be right, but then the problem is insoluble, no? I'm increasingly of the view that that might be the case, human nature is just a bit rotten.

The only thing that ever seemed to 'work', was in the period when socialism was a real threat but not triumphant. The fear of socialism kept the plutocrats in check and made them behave themselves and meant they were prepared to make concessions to the masses (the welfare state was created by Bismark to stave off socialist revolt).

Absent that fear they've run amok and can't seem to restrain their impulse to try and own and control everything and grind everyone else into the dirt.

They're a bunch of libs with excuses and want to be *different*

But ultimate you have to give the people their pound of flesh if that's what they want!

 

[cytg111]

Class war would be great. Now you need to convince Fox News to broadcast that.

 

[Brainonska511]

Which is why it might be worth fighting fire with fire and trying to define a different "other" for people to rage against. Class war not race war. If people want an enemy to turn on, give them one - the rich.

Yes, there are class issues, but in the US, you can't separate race from class. It's more than simple economics.

 

[pmv]

Yes, there are class issues, but in the US, you can't separate race from class. It's more than simple economics.

Well it's not easy, obviously, or we wouldn't be in this mess to start with.

I don't know about the US - my lifelong 'revolutionary socialist' father (himself a 'person of colour') always gave up in despair when considering that country - he was of the view it would inevitably turn fascist, because of the racial politics (and the, seemingly all-pervasive, militarism and nationalism).
(Shame he didn't' live to see Jan 6th - it would not have surprised him one bit)

It was the lone exception to his faith in the inevitable triumph of socialism, and his advice to all racial minorities in that country could be summed up as 'get out' (in the spirit a time-traveller might have advised Jewish people in pre-1930s Germany).

But I don't share my parents socialist faith, it didn't really work out, and I'm inclined to extreme pessimism, i.e. that it's not just the US that is likely to go that way, the problem is humans in general. Still think it's worth a try to demand socialism and demonise the rich/ruling class/capitalists. The 'grown up'/centrist/liberal alternative does not seem to be working. That's the spirit in which I'd vote for some Corbyn-led leftist alternative-to-Labour.
The only hope seems to be to at least scare the plutocrats into thinking socialism is a real threat - then they might be willing to make some concessions.

 

[gothuevos]

Dems lose at everything, lol

https://twitter.com/x/status/1959403654353666165

 

[Pontius Dilate]

Am I wrong?

They are not in an enviable position.

In the future whenever you ask if you're wrong, think back to when you said the US annexing Canada or Venezuela would be easy.

Instead of endlessly unilaterally surrendering to Republicans you should think about joining them, at least you might get something out of it. Look at PCGeek and Greenman, not a care in the world. Think how much happier you would be.

 

[UNCjigga]

A knife fight? This guy still doesn’t get it. The GOP isn’t even messing around with assault weapons anymore—they’ve gone nuclear.

https://www.npr.org/2025/08/26/nx-s1-5515631/dnc-democrats-ken-martin-trump-facism

 

[Indus]

 

[gothuevos]

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LOL wow

 

[GodisanAtheist]

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-Jews are like in GYST and UR Fine at the same time. On one hand, the whole Israel thing is drawing pressure from some quarters. Also the whole white supremecist thing from another quarter.

But then at the same time everyone is ok with final solution of Palestinians and speaking out against Israel is somehow anti-semitism.

We've ended up in a topsy turvey world of casual jew hating but militantly oppressed speech against Israel.

 

[UNCjigga]

A glimmer of hope for Democrats?

Democrat flips Iowa state senate seat and breaks Republican supermajority

Catelin Drey beats extremist Christopher Prosch, flipping district so Democrats can block governor’s appointments

www.theguardian.com

Democrat flips Iowa state senate seat and breaks Republican supermajority

A Democratic candidate has defeated an extremist Republican in a state senate election in Iowa, claiming that voters are “waking up” to realise Donald Trump’s party “sold the working class a bill of goods”.

Catelin Drey flipped Iowa state senate district 1, beating Christopher Prosch in a special election held on Tuesday to fill the seat of the late senator Rocky De Witt.

Prosch had aligned himself with Trump’s Maga movement, floating conspiracy theories about the 2020 presidential election and climate crisis. He also compared abortion access to the Holocaust.

But Drey, a 37-year-old marketing executive [and founder of Moms for Iowa] won with 55% of the vote to Prosch’s 44%, representing a swing of more than 20 points from Trump’s performance last year in the district, which covers most of Sioux City.
—

Still a looooooong ways to go, and plenty of electoral shenanigans left for the GOP to thwart the will of voters come Election Day 2026. Hell, even if they lose the midterms, I’d fully expect Trump and his lame duck Congress to change the Presidential Order of Succession and put Hegseth and the rest of the cabinet ahead of Speaker or Pres Pro Tempore.

 

[Indus]

Wow a Trump like nickname that sticks for Jeffries:

 

[Indus]

National divorce, as I've previously said, is largely a pipe dream and does nothing to solve anything. Plenty of Trumpers live in blue states, and lots of people who would suffer more live in "red" states.

Nevermind the whole humanitarian crisis you're effectively calling for (because of forced or induced mass migration), I also don't think I'd want to live in a new country that is adjacent to fascist Jesus land that might want to turn to external violence to cover up their utterly depressed and ruined economy.

People do it willingly apparently. You just sell em a pipe dream!

 

[Brainonska511]

People do it willingly apparently. You just sell em a pipe dream!

I'm not watching that video. Why don't you summarize its contents for the class.

 

[Indus]

I'm not watching that video. Why don't you summarize its contents for the class.

People willingly taking a "donkey route" for a better life.. walking across countries/ continents.. some freezing to death.. in search of a "better life" than a job just waiting for customers in a shop in India.

If they're willing to do that.. why can't Americans move states. I mean this is the wrong example but @iRONic moved states. He didn't make any excuses..

You can't stop progress just because of a few.



Ofcourse in our current system:

The needs of a few billionaires outweight the needs of the many!

 

[Brainonska511]

People willingly taking a "donkey route" for a better life.. walking across countries/ continents.. some freezing to death.. in search of a "better life" than a job just waiting for customers in a shop in India.

If they're willing to do that.. why can't Americans move states. I mean this is the wrong example but @iRONic moved states. He didn't make any excuses..

You can't stop progress just because of a few.

View attachment 129477

Ofcourse in our current system:

The needs of a few billionaires outweight the needs of the many!

Maybe because Americans have a lot more accumulated wealth and economic stability and are not willing to simply walk away in a hissy fit that will cause massive unrest for everyone and almost certainly leave everyone worse off?

And again, easy for you to advocate for other people to suffer when you live in NYC. You're not going to be the one dumping your property and completely uprooting your life for this. But you're asking other people to do it like it is no big deal? Get out of here.

 

[gothuevos]

In utter freefall lol

https://twitter.com/x/status/1969033935846855119

 

[KMFJD]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1976773476926284134

not knowing anything about her stances or anything but sheesh, you couldn't find anyone under 60 atleast?

 

[Brainonska511]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1976773476926284134

not knowing anything about her stances or anything but sheesh, you couldn't find anyone under 60 atleast?

There is a primary in Maine with many candidates running, and it uses ranked choice voting. If someone can't beat the geriatric governor, what hope would they have against Susan Collins?

The governor has been okay, and I'd rather see someone younger. However, I don't care at all for this bs where loud people want to crown someone the winner before we even have the primary, or trying to encourage people to stay out because they don't want competition against their preferred candidate.