Dell vs. local build - Help spec a mom system

[mrzed]

Edit: Dell Canada has free shipping on their Dimension 2350 Just until Friday (cel 2.0/30Gb/etc.) that would come to about $550 without monitor (before taxes). Seems like a reasonable deal for a Dell (they are usually too expensive in Canada, once shipping is included). Any experience with how quiet/decent this model is? Compare it to what I originally spec'd below:

Mom is an editor, right now she is running win98se on a p133 (not kidding) and has finally had it. She need it for work, mostly, but also using crossword compiler and surfing. not a power user - never will be.

She cares about stability/quality/noise, and is willing to pay a little extra for it, but she has also been told she can get a bare box for around $400 (CANADIAN), so that's the general target. So far I am looking at:

$95 Celeron 1.7 retail (don't bother telling me to buy AMD, it may be better price performance - that matters for me - price matters for her, and price is about the same)

$92 Seagate HDD
$45 256 Mb Crucial PC2700
Video - My old Matrox G200 (free)
$40 Case
$40 Upgrade to Enermax PSU

$130 Intel brand 845pe mobo

leaning towards the Intel board for rock solid stability and quality rep, but I'm over budget already. I can get MSI or Gigabyte boards for about $20-30 less. comments on stability or quality there? Asus is out of the question because they cost more than Intel.

RAM: local shop offers something labeled Micron Spectek original. Is this any good?

PSU: any cheapies that are actually good enough and not too noisy? My Enermax whisper series is OK, but I still find it too loud for myself.

Also: how noisy is the retail HSF on the celeron 1.7. I was even considering going with a VIA Epia based solution before finding out this would likely be cheaper (seems foolish, but true). Any cheap s478 HSF that beat the retail by a reasonable margin on noise?

 

[mrzed]

Bump because I only have till Friday to choose the Dell deal.

 

[nick1985]

i love him SO much...

 

[dexvx]

Originally posted by: nick1985
i love him SO much...

Right...

2350 is quiet. I dont think you can build a quieter one unless you really try for the correct parts. Although I'd try and get a Pentium4... even a 1.6 beats a 2.0 Celeron. But then again if you're moving from a Pentium133, I doubt she'd notice.

 

[Chobits]

Hrmm...go with your computer and I'm suprised you want intel for a price system. I'm telling you now - AMD and get here a Duron 1.1-1.3 (they are what? like 4-5 dollars extra between those 200mhz so if price really makes a difference get the cheaper one) for around 33$ and a ecs k7s5a pro/biostar m7giv (is that the right model #?) and pair it with pc2100 crucial ram for 29 USD at Newegg.

Might I ask where you will order so I can see the site? Is this a Canadian based one or a USA based one?

And woe to your mother for win98se and a pentium 133

As for the case and psu perhaps you should get a combo case since its obvious you will not be overclocking and could save a few bucks. Just make sure the amps on the 12v rail are sufficient and the psu brand isn't a complete no name

 

[theanimala]

Personally, I would get the dell. I have both a homemade system and a 4550 I just purchased. Nothing is quieter then the Dell. Not only that, but you don't want to answer technical questions from her when something goes wrong. Having her call Dell is worth the $ to me.

 

[mikecel79]

If it's for your mom just go with the Dell. The Dimension 2350 is a good model and it'll be perfect for what she needs. The 2350 is very very quiet, plus she gets a 1 year warranty on the whole thing. She's not overclocking and she's not a power user. I see no reason to custom build a machine for her.

 

[peter7921]

Well this is what i priced using the retailer i usually go to (they are in my hometown so i don't have to worry about shipping), the prices are about similar. One thing i can tell you for sure is that the Reatil HSF with the celerons are extremely quiet, at my old job i built alot of celeron boxes and they were very quiet, although that is my opinion.
With your budget this is what i built so you can have a comparison.

BTW If you are looking for a quiet system, i have heard from many that DELL does a very good job in that department, but many of there parts are proprietery especially in there cheapo system, so therefore are harder to upgrade(I have had a few friends fall into the DELL trap only to regret it later).

From Cananda Computers

Celeron 1.7 GHz 128k cache Retail $86 - Same processor
MSI 865PEN2-LS i865PE, S-478 800FSB $150 - chose this motherboard because it is more future proof,Springdale chipset
Seagate 40.0GB $92 - same HD
Samsung 256MB PC-3200 DDR400 - $63 - chose this that way you can get another stick in future for upgrade
Enermax 300W EG301P-VB Single Fan $45 - Enermax PSU one fan should be quieter than two(cheaper too).
Super Case $28 Picture of Case This case is cheap and suprizinly not bad quality, and pretty good looking.

Total Price: $464

Just another place for you to compare with, good luck on your decision.

 

[mrman3k]

I second Peter's choice!

 

[Zepper]

I second the thought that if you are excluding AMD from your options, then you really aren't interested in price.

Duron 1.3 Retail (w/HSF) - $45.
or Athlon 1800+ Retail (w/HSF) - $72.
MSI KM2M Combo L or KT2 Combo L - $62.

There you have the system core for $107. - $134.

I recently went from an AMD K6-2/500 to a Duron 1200 with the MSI KM2M and do similar tasks as your Mom and I am very satisfied with the performance. Though I am tempted by the XP 1700+ on newegg for only $42. shipped.
.bh.
:sun:

 

[Winchester]

I would go with Dell, just because of the technical support thingy.

 

[thraxes]

I would also look at an AMD Duron system for price! That Duron 1200 with the MSI board sure looks sweet, especially since it has onboard graphics, sound and LAN - pretty much everything you need. just get a nice cheap case, RAM and drives and you would be set. Perhaps splurge a little on a good, quiet CPU cooler (slow spinning 80mm FAN is a must) for getting the machine nice and quiet. the rest is standard, 40GB HDD and a standard 52x cd-rom or burner... whatever makes sense and fits your budget.

But on the other hand, if yu don't want to be the support monkey then just buy the dell

 

[mrzed]

Well this is Canada, so Newegg is not an option. Socket A and 478 boards of a similar quality level are similar prices here, and a Duron 1.3 is $60, plus at least $25 for a HSF that's not noisy (if I'm lucky) saving me about $10 over a retail Celeron 1.7, so really, price is not an AMD advantage in this case. If I was at all concerned about performance it would be, and I would go with a TbredB.

And price is not the #1 consideration, just one of 3 important factors. #1 is that everything she tries to install or run just does without thinking about it. I'm running a Tbred on a MSI KT3 board myself, so it's not like I'm that biased, but the amount of validation the #1 Intel chipset (currently some form of 845) goes through is without a doubt a factor in everything just working. Maybe other chipsets are close (I include other PIV chipsets here), but being the market leader just simply means everyone else makes damn sure their stuff will work with your stuff, it doesn't even mean Intel is better, it's just a result of their sales dominance.

The tech support is not a big factor, because every time mom gets information from anywhere, she usually calls me about it anyhow, either to ask for my opinion on the opinion, or because she didn't understand the information. I suspect Dell is better than average at dealing with moms though. I am leaning towards the Dell right now, just because it would mean I could call her and just tell her what to order and be done with it. If it's quiet, that's even better.

Quick question that I should really ask the Dell folks: Does the Dimension 2350 case offer expansion room for at least one 3.5" drive?, I want to drop in her old 2 Gig to copy over her files, then use it for backup.

 

[Sid59]

is your mom the type that would actually call up tech support and find out answers? Or will she call you no matter what?

If that's the case, i wouldn't care either way.

 

[dexvx]

Originally posted by: mrzed
The tech support is not a big factor, because every time mom gets information from anywhere, she usually calls me about it anyhow, either to ask for my opinion on the opinion, or because she didn't understand the information. I suspect Dell is better than average at dealing with moms though. I am leaning towards the Dell right now, just because it would mean I could call her and just tell her what to order and be done with it. If it's quiet, that's even better.

Quick question that I should really ask the Dell folks: Does the Dimension 2350 case offer expansion room for at least one 3.5" drive?, I want to drop in her old 2 Gig to copy over her files, then use it for backup.

All your answers are here.

External: Two 5.25-inch and one 3.5-inch
Internal: One bay for 1-inch-high IDE hard drive

I seriously dunno how people can fall into the "dell trap", but its clearly labeled as "basic audio and video" and then clearly relabled as no AGP slot. OEM proprietarity is something tahts about 2 years old.

 

[mrzed]

Sid pretty much nailed it there. That's exactly why Dell tech support never seemed a huge advantage to me. But I imagine I could train her to call Dell first after about the 15th time if I worked hard at it.

 

[pfiaz089]

nm

 

[Budmantom]

Dude!!!

 

[chin311]

Just get her a Dell, no hassle.

 

[mrzed]

Originally posted by: chin311
Just get her a Dell, no hassle.

Looks to be going that way, even though it pains me.

dexvx: what do you think the Dell trap is in this case. I realise there is no AGP slot in this computer, OTOH, it's mom, so I doubt it will be a problem.

 

[DT4K]

Originally posted by: mrzed

Originally posted by: chin311
Just get her a Dell, no hassle.

Looks to be going that way, even though it pains me.

dexvx: what do you think the Dell trap is in this case. I realise there is no AGP slot in this computer, OTOH, it's mom, so I doubt it will be a problem.

Just don't let her try Doom3.
You never know, she may become a hardcore gamer and be pissed she can't buy a Radeon 9800.

I'd get the Dell.
Even if she calls you first, if it's something you can't fix easily and quickly, you can just tell her to call Dell.
I've never been a fan of prebuilts, but if I was recommending one, it would be Dell.

 

[GregMal]

I built a PC for a relative once........never again.......
I'd get calls at Midnight asking what happened to the task bar etc.......
Get the Dell...........

 

[dexvx]

Originally posted by: mrzed

Originally posted by: chin311
Just get her a Dell, no hassle.

Looks to be going that way, even though it pains me.

dexvx: what do you think the Dell trap is in this case. I realise there is no AGP slot in this computer, OTOH, it's mom, so I doubt it will be a problem.

Just by looking at the case, compared to the other Dimension and Precision series, you'll notice its a smaller version. Home-Dimensions also have worse technical support than Precision or XPS line of computers or their small business counterparts (thats relatively, because I have no idea how bad "worse" is). It didnt seem that bad as a call during the business day only averaged about a 10-20 min wait.

Its not really worth it to extend the warranty up to 3 years (~$150). It'll more than last 3 years on average, and even if it breaks in 3 years, just get another cheap dell.

 

[mrzed]

Well I gave mom the options, and she seems to want to go with the local build for about $100 less. I'm not too worried about tech support for her, because I have been the guy she calls every week wondering why her computer is so slow (I usually tell her it's because it's a slow computer). Anything new is likely to be less trouble.

Leaves me with one final concern:

I'm looking at putting it in an In-Win S500 case. Anyone know how good/noisy the PSU are in these things? I'm going to assume that the celeron retail fan won't be too bad, and I'm putting a Seagate HD in there, so this could be the only noisy part of the system if I'm not careful. This is the final spec from Atic computers in Vancouver

Intel D845PESV - 129
Celeron 1.7 - 84
256 Crucial pc2700 - 45
ATA IV 40Gb - 92
Cdrom - 29
In-Win S500 - 78
Matrox G200 - 0
Total - 457

 

[gplracer]

Just build her a system and get a Athlon XP 1700+ and a Epox 8RDA+. You can then dial in any speed you want within reason. The durons are slower and the price difference is not much. IT IS YOUR MOM!!!!!!!!!!!!! She is going to call you anyway. I just built one for my dad. Someone above said their relative called them at midnight! Dude you need to tell your relative to get a life. I have built 42 computers in the last two years and no one ever called me a midnight. That is just plain rude. Besides if something goes wrong she can call microsoft if it is the operation system or the company that makes whatever software it is that is messing up. The other parts have tech support too. Good Luck!!!