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Debt Limitapalooza 2023!

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Greenman said:
Why do we even have a debt limit? If we're stuck with it for some reason, just raise it to a quadrillion dollars and we're good to go for the next fifty years.
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Originally designed as a tool to limit our involvement in WW1 (or future wars) IIRC
 
Pens1566 said:
they'll mint the $1T coin they keep talking about
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K1052 said:
Either a clean raise will have to pass by discharge petition or 1T coin mintage.
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fskimospy said:
Yes, basically Biden would mint a $1 trillion (or more!) coin and then give it to the treasury. He can do this as many times as is necessary.
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Such a plan would spike inflation.

It is almost as bad as defaulting on the debt.

also, inflation is just a flat tax.
 
senseamp said:
Democrats obviously thought it's going to be a disaster for the GOP and can be used for leverage, or they would have raised it in the lame duck.
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I doubt they had the votes to raise it.
Anything they did had to be a compromise in favor of Republicans, or it could not pass the Senate.
 
See, it's a big lie that we get to suffer through as a result of the 2020 election. This notion that Democrats actually held power. They did not.
Apparently some of us even grew to believe it.
 
Leeea said:
Instead of borrowing an asset and removing it from circulation

Your just printing money and leaving said asset in circulation.

That will drive inflation.
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The platinum coin isn’t paying for any new spending, it is simply re-authorizing spending that’s already law.

It might be easier if the president just declares the debt ceiling unconstitutional and refuses to let it be enforced but if he doesn’t want to do that the coin is an easy way around it.
 
Pens1566 said:
And yes, they'll all blame Biden no matter what.
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However, eventually it is the hostage takers who take the blame from the American people and from the media as well, well most of the media minus one. It will be clear to everyone that the maga house republicans are responsible for holding America hostage. They will demand insidious cuts up and down the budget while Biden need not do anything but keep on defending the middle class, the poor, the elderly. Joe's job will be easy, it is the house republicans who will take the heat. Yet.... they won't care. Heat doesn't bother maga, not when that heat comes from burning down the country AND democracy.

The thing to watch out for, as this unfolds, is exactly how and when this suddenly involves YOUR WORLD. When YOU begin to suffer. The domino effect. THEY SAY the shutdown and default will not affect people on SS and medicare/medicaid, but it most certanilly will. After the government has entered into default AND the government becomes inoperative it will indeed affect all aspect of American life. Yes, even for social security there will come a limit. Short term? Probably everything will be fine. However long term? Everything will come crashing down.
Can't wait of 2024. That "wave" republicans expected in 2022 will finally show up in 2024 but the color of the wave will not be red.
 
Have you tried looking down the back of the sofa?

Maybe you could sell off some of the states you don't use very much? Do you really need _two_ Dakotas? (Or _one_ Florida?) Put them on Ebay?


Leeea said:
Such a plan would spike inflation.
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Why, though?
That's a genuine question - I really don't understand any of this, but I'm not convinced anybody else does either.

I remember when Thatcher came to power and declared her most important legacy would be to permanently end high inflation, by means of (sado-)monetarism and controlling the money supply - but inflation immediately shot _up_ (I read somewhere once that was because the velocity of circulation went up - the smaller money supply just circulated faster).

It came down again eventually but when she left office inflation was still higher than when she came in (10.9% Vs 10.3%). And now, more than 40 years on, it's still at about the same level (currently 10.7%).
 
fskimospy said:
The platinum coin isn’t paying for any new spending, it is simply re-authorizing spending that’s already law.

It might be easier if the president just declares the debt ceiling unconstitutional and refuses to let it be enforced but if he doesn’t want to do that the coin is an easy way around it.
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Technically, it fund the spending without creating the corresponding trillion dollars in bonds. So it would still add 1T to the money supply, I think.
 
We could just set up a Kevin McCarthy dunking booth and charge $5 per shot. Problem is, it would probably take weeks before any regular citizen gets their shot because all those slots would have been reserved by McCarthy's own caucus. Good thing is that we will eliminate "the deficit" for the next 15 years.
 
Fanatical Meat said:
Can you point me to where you expressed the same level of concern 2017-2020?
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Ive consistently said over the last 20 years that we spend way too much money and should STOP going deeper and deeper into debt. Nobody listens or gives a damn.

And yes, I strongly opposed government STILL deficit spending from 2017-2019 when the economy was very strong and we did not need to cut taxes much less borrow even more money. Dont even get me started on the multi trillion dollar COVID boondoggle covering both Trump and Biden. Biden went even further with more stimumlus spending, a stupidly big infrastructure bill and then the "Inflation Reduction Act" - all of which was highly inflationary.

Yes, we all knew what were were over doing spending trillions in response to covid. We waaaaaay overdid it. Even the Fed and Yellen were both trying to dismiss it as "transitory" to make excuses for it.


So now, again, I call for a drastic cut in government spending (aka austerity).
 
FelixDeCat said:
My job is to make you realize that deficit spending is the Devil's work and should never happen to begin with. Its the only responsible thing to do. And if R's have to put a hard limit on the debt ceiling to do it, so be it.
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But cant they do it on their own watch?
 
FelixDeCat said:
Ive consistently said over the last 20 years that we spend way too much money and should STOP going deeper and deeper into debt. Nobody listens or gives a damn.

And yes, I strongly opposed government STILL deficit spending from 2017-2019 when the economy was very strong and we did not need to cut taxes much less borrow even more money. Dont even get me started on the multi trillion dollar COVID boondoggle covering both Trump and Biden. Biden went even further with more stimumlus spending, a stupidly big infrastructure bill and then the "Inflation Reduction Act" - all of which was highly inflationary.

Yes, we all knew what were were over doing spending trillions in response to covid. We waaaaaay overdid it. Even the Fed and Yellen were both trying to dismiss it as "transitory" to make excuses for it.


So now, again, I call for a drastic cut in government spending (aka austerity).
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Fair enough
 
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