Dealership Dread

[Carbo]

I'm in the market for a new car. My '17 Civic is approaching end-of-lease and I'm looking to swap it out for a '20. My experience with the '17 was painless. All done online via email and text, I had 3 dealerships bidding for my business. Got the deal I wanted, walked into the dealership and out with a new car in about 90 minutes, if I recall.
So I started looking at local Honda dealership websites and I'm not seeing internet sales departments listed. Is this a thing of the past?
The first dealership I called insisted I come in to get any numbers. I told her I don't need to see the car, drive the car, or hear about the features, so there's no need for me to go there. She refused to cooperate and we were done. Is this what I'll be dealing with during the process? Ugh. . .

 

[herm0016]

seems like an easy sale for them... I don't get it.

 

[Carbo]

I agree. Give me your best price and if you're lower than your competition I'm comin' in.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

I'm in the market for a new car. My '17 Civic is approaching end-of-lease and I'm looking to swap it out for a '20. My experience with the '17 was painless. All done online via email and text, I had 3 dealerships bidding for my business. Got the deal I wanted, walked into the dealership and out with a new car in about 90 minutes, if I recall.
So I started looking at local Honda dealership websites and I'm not seeing internet sales departments listed. Is this a thing of the past?
The first dealership I called insisted I come in to get any numbers. I told her I don't need to see the car, drive the car, or hear about the features, so there's no need for me to go there. She refused to cooperate and we were done. Is this what I'll be dealing with during the process? Ugh. . .

I had a similar experience with my Camaro. I agreed to go in, but had a printout of what I wanted, and accepted no negotiations. Offered MSRP, which was acceptable at the time (many places were charging over). I was done pretty quickly.

 

[manly]

I'm not a car buying expert, but most dealers are happy to start negotiations through email. Saves both parties a lot of time. Many dealer web sites even list many of their publicly facing staff members, and Internet sales advisor is shown!

Here's an example from my local Honda dealership:
https://www.ochondaworld.com/meet-our-staff/

 

[dave_the_nerd]

Yeah, it sounds like you just ran into a jerk dealership. Shop around.

 

[Commodus]

This is part of why I'd like to get a Tesla when I'm ready for a car again. No haggling, no pressure, no insistence that you have to massively inconvenience your life just so they can pretend dealerships are still relevant in 2020. If I want the car, I shouldn't have to fight to get it!

 

[Carbo]

I'm not a car buying expert, but most dealers are happy to start negotiations through email. Saves both parties a lot of time. Many dealer web sites even list many of their publicly facing staff members, and Internet sales advisor is shown!

Here's an example from my local Honda dealership:
https://www.ochondaworld.com/meet-our-staff/

I agree. I think they would be on board with a customer who knows what he wants and doesn't need foreplay.

 

[Carbo]

The sales manager just texted me a quote. $200 above MSRP. . .for a Honda Civic. I wasn't aware there's a shortage of Civics or dealerships.

 

[ondma]

Here in Minnesota it varies. Some dealership post their "best price" on line. Supposedly no negotiation. Others post a modestly discounted price and are willing to negotiate, usually by e-mail, at least to get the ball rolling. A few list only MSRP.

Personally, I have found Honda dealerships some of the most rude and condescending in the business. OP, have you just considered purchasing your Civic when it comes off lease? No negotiation, no hassle.

If you are sure you want to buy a new car, shop around until you find a dealer you feel is open and fair. The Civic is a very nice car, but there are certainly a lot of worthy competitors in the class now, such as the Mazda 3, VW Golf/Jetta, and the compacts from Hyundai and Kia, which have a much better warranty. Honda used to be at the top for reliability, but seems to be only mid-pack now. They do have a very nice safety/driver assistance package that is standard now; that is a big plus to me.

 

[rstrohkirch]

One of the best methods is research what your car is selling for compared to msrp. Then you put together a spreadsheet with the model and all options listed with the price in the exact order off the website as you build it. At the bottom you put in your expectations for discount off msrp, if there is any without incentives and what you're willing to put for down payment. You then email all the dealerships within a couple of hours of you for the vehicle you want and give them that spreadsheet. Tell them this is what I want. You'll get what you want or at the very least you'll find out who is willing to give you the best deal if your research is a bit off.

 

[NutBucket]

This is part of why I'd like to get a Tesla when I'm ready for a car again. No haggling, no pressure, no insistence that you have to massively inconvenience your life just so they can pretend dealerships are still relevant in 2020. If I want the car, I shouldn't have to fight to get it!

No haggling means you're paying too much I love negotiating. Part of the fun for me.

 

[Carbo]

Hehe. That's another way of looking at it.

 

[zinfamous]

I'm in the market for a new car. My '17 Civic is approaching end-of-lease and I'm looking to swap it out for a '20. My experience with the '17 was painless. All done online via email and text, I had 3 dealerships bidding for my business. Got the deal I wanted, walked into the dealership and out with a new car in about 90 minutes, if I recall.
So I started looking at local Honda dealership websites and I'm not seeing internet sales departments listed. Is this a thing of the past?
The first dealership I called insisted I come in to get any numbers. I told her I don't need to see the car, drive the car, or hear about the features, so there's no need for me to go there. She refused to cooperate and we were done. Is this what I'll be dealing with during the process? Ugh. . .

Yes, I think it's rarer these days. I ended up dealing with the one that would work with me over the phone. I had about 3 dealerships that would keep calling and emailing me, after I had visited them, but they still refused to talk numbers over the phone.

One, that I had never visited, I spoke to on the phone maybe 2 times, then 3 or 4 emails. Only ever discussed numbers over about 4 days. I walked in on a Monday afternoon after we came to a deal that morning (had to drive about 40 miles to this place) and walked out with the car some hours later (we were actually held up by a single jackass in the financing department FOR HOURS. Fucker had no skills in that office. I was done in about 30 minutes, but had to sit around and wait for that crap.)

So, I'd say just wait for the dealership that actively calls you back and will make offers.

 

[Ajay]

No haggling means you're paying too much I love negotiating. Part of the fun for me.

I didn't like it when I was younger - I was no match for experienced middle age men. My wife is soooo much better than this compared to me. Good looks and confidence really puts these guys off balance. My job is research and make sure she knows her facts - we make a great team.

 

[NutBucket]

Negotiating is easy. They want the sale more than you need the product. As long as you remember that it's cake. That's why there are lots of dealerships.

 

[Carbo]

The asshat who quoted me a price $200 above MSRP has since called 3 times. I let it go to voice mail each time. He lost me with that move.

 

[NutBucket]

You should answer the phone and counter with $2000 under invoice.

 

[zinfamous]

yeah, just keep lowballing him.

 

[Commodus]

No haggling means you're paying too much I love negotiating. Part of the fun for me.

Well, yes and no. There's no doubt that you're paying more than you absolutely have to if there's a fixed price. But at the same time, no haggling also means the car can cost closer to what's actually sustainable for profit instead of needing an additional markup to offset the customers who are good negotiators.

I suppose part of it is, as you gathered, that I come from it at a very different angle. Negotiation stresses me out -- it's an unnecessary process that forces both sides to antagonize each other, and you'll never know just how good your deal really is. It's this odd, arbitrary song and dance routine that you're just expected to go through with conventional car purchases and very little else.

 

[NutBucket]

Flea markets, Craigslist, etc.

Another prime opportunity is clearance items at big box stores like Home Depot/Lowe's. Chances are you can get a better price on that open box appliance than what the tag says. When I was younger and there was more competition in electronics retailers there were some stores where you could negotiate better prices on new products too. I seem to recall getting a car amplifier for something like $250 when the shelf tag said $325....just by asking basically.

 

[Commodus]

Flea markets, Craigslist, etc.

Another prime opportunity is clearance items at big box stores like Home Depot/Lowe's. Chances are you can get a better price on that open box appliance than what the tag says. When I was younger and there was more competition in electronics retailers there were some stores where you could negotiate better prices on new products too. I seem to recall getting a car amplifier for something like $250 when the shelf tag said $325....just by asking basically.

Oh, I agree on those... and those stress me out, too. List something for "$300 firm" and you'll invariably get that person who says "I'll give you $100 for it" (and not because they're trying to haggle you down, either). My folks actually negotiated down the price of the first HDTV we owned, but I think that era's over now that the internet makes it patently easy to see who has the best deal.

And that last bit is why I don't like negotiating in many cases. It's 2020, we shouldn't have to arm wrestle a sales rep when the internet exists! Of course, the challenge is ensuring that car makers keep prices semi-competitive if they do go to online ordering, rather than just making dealer-style markups standard.

 

[Carbo]

My new BFF just called again. This time I picked up and he apologized for the "misunderstanding". But he said he'll give me a below invoice price and beat all others by $500. So that's a start.

 

[Kaido]

My new BFF just called again. This time I picked up and he apologized for the "misunderstanding". But he said he'll give me a below invoice price and beat all others by $500. So that's a start.

Yeah that's weird, I help a lot of friends shop for cars & every shop around here has an Internet dealer. I only go to dealers for test-drives & warranty fixes, then we do the bidding thing through the online contacts. In a lot of cases, they'll deliver the car for free so you don't even have to go down, which is brilliant!

 

[thecoolnessrune]

Oh, I agree on those... and those stress me out, too. List something for "$300 firm" and you'll invariably get that person who says "I'll give you $100 for it" (and not because they're trying to haggle you down, either). My folks actually negotiated down the price of the first HDTV we owned, but I think that era's over now that the internet makes it patently easy to see who has the best deal.

And that last bit is why I don't like negotiating in many cases. It's 2020, we shouldn't have to arm wrestle a sales rep when the internet exists! Of course, the challenge is ensuring that car makers keep prices semi-competitive if they do go to online ordering, rather than just making dealer-style markups standard.

In my opinion, negotiation is for unique offerings and services. When I'm working with our partners and we're orchestrating a deliverable with lawyers in the room, you can bet all the group's finance guys are running numbers to determine the best mutually beneficial profit potential for us, for our partners, and maintaining our appeal in the market. Those negotiations that I'm part of make total sense.

For a car? Of which they're making more than a quarter million of them that year alone? No. That's not special in the slightest. There is absolutely no purpose to it except to get people who aren't "game" enough to deal with the system to subsidize those that are. For cars of which there's literally millions produced every year it's just silly.

When I bought my Subaru in 2015, I went to 8 different dealers across 3 states from their e-sales that had matching cars (because again, there's nothing special about buying an econobox). I had each of them give me their lowest number and noted that I'd only be working over E-mail, and I'd be buying whichever vehicle had the lowest price, because they're all the same. Subaru Impreza, Hatchback, Eyesight, Leather, Climate Control. Check all the boxes and get back to me with the price. I then would tell them where they stood in pricing compared to each other and went through all of that over about 3 days until only 1 remained. And I went and bought the car. Was that easy? Yes (because there's nothing special about buying a car). But it was completely an unnecessary waste of my time.

When I bought my Tesla, I customized it, and bought it just like buying something off Amazon. I paid the single price that Tesla has calculated with the best balance of profit margin and competitiveness in the auto market, and I did it in 15 minutes at my computer.

Even the delivery portion was massively better. With the Impreza I had the car I wanted only after sitting there for an hour with them going on and on about how I needed to buy extra services for it. The Tesla I was there for half an hour spending the vast majority of the time signing forms. Then I'm walked to my car, given a brief overview, and told I'm free to go at my leisure.

I can't wait for Tesla's business model to freakin' crush the auto industry.