David Nalasco of AMD interview about 7990

[3DVagabond]

Computerbase.de interviewed David Nalasco of AMD about the 7990 and microstutter, new drivers, etc... Not sure if he can be taken at face value or if it's just marketing speak. Could be the latter, but how he phrases his responses shows strong conviction in what he's saying.

 

[f1sherman]

David Nalasco, AMD:
We are releasing the Radeon HD 7990 now because we believe it is the most powerful single graphics card available, delivering the best overall experience in the most demanding games at the highest resolutions and image quality settings.


Riiight...

http://www.hardware.fr/articles/891-20/recapitulatif-performances.html

 

[Will Robinson]

Interesting what he had to say about FCAT and FRAPS.
While all the hype has been over the graphs,not a lot has been said about effect on actual game play/perceived "smoothness" etc.

 

[3DVagabond]

Interesting what he had to say about FCAT and FRAPS.
While all the hype has been over the graphs,not a lot has been said about effect on actual game play/perceived "smoothness" etc.

That's because people are using it backwards. At least the early FRAPS articles. If people were using it to diagnose a perceived problem that would be one thing, but people are instead taking measurements and then creating a problem to attach to it. Dual GPU microstutter is a real issue that's been identified for years. Up until now it's never been able to be quantified or actually even demonstrated in black and white. It appears that FCAT is the genuine article for demonstrating it. I say appears because the information it gives can be correlated to what we perceive while actually playing games.

In the end though, I do believe that we'll end up with a better gaming experience because of all of this. That's a good thing. I respect the sites that haven't simply rushed to judgement and are examining the tests closely before they just release numbers that might, or might not, be pertinent. Or blown out of proportion at the detriment of others just to generate page hits or make a name for themselves. You notice that it's the biggest sites that are taking the more analytical approach. They don't need sensational headlines for people to click on their sites. That's responsible journalism, in my book.

 

[Will Robinson]

It's not the sites that have been rushing to judgement..its the fanatics here that will latch on to anything they perceive to be negative towards AMD.
Notice the sudden quiet in the last 24 hours or so since PCper published the updated article using the new beta driver for 7990.
You could almost hear a pin drop...
The first dual GPU card from AMD in a long time didn't work perfectly on opening day drivers...wow...didn't see that coming.
Still waiting for the absolute thrashing 7990 gives NVDA cards in compute functions to be discussed....:whiste:

 

[3DVagabond]

It's not the sites that have been rushing to judgement..its the fanatics here that will latch on to anything they perceive to be negative towards AMD.
Notice the sudden quiet in the last 24 hours or so since PCper published the updated article using the new beta driver for 7990.
You could almost hear a pin drop...
The first dual GPU card from AMD in a long time didn't work perfectly on opening day drivers...wow...didn't see that coming.
Still waiting for the absolute thrashing 7990 gives NVDA cards in compute functions to be discussed....:whiste:

I think the creating negativity towards AMD about this was, and is, far more organized than simply a few people here latching onto it. That's just the effect of the campaign, IMO.

Anyway, /off topic. Back to the 7990. I hope AMD gets these drivers out ASAP and maybe even releases a bios update to fix the throttling.

 

[VulgarDisplay]

I think the creating negativity towards AMD about this was, and is, far more organized than simply a few people here latching onto it. That's just the effect of the campaign, IMO.

Anyway, /off topic. Back to the 7990. I hope AMD gets these drivers out ASAP and maybe even releases a bios update to fix the throttling.

I could see another 7970 in my future if the drivers they release show enough improvement across the board. I've always wanted to try dual GPU.

 

[Souv]

good interview from David Nalasco,also good post 3DV

 

[SirPauly]

Interesting what he had to say about FCAT and FRAPS.
While all the hype has been over the graphs,not a lot has been said about effect on actual game play/perceived "smoothness" etc.

Maybe you missed the years of subjective views about AFR and so much a term was coined: MicroStutter! Now there is subjective and tangible data.

This awareness was like music to my ears and have been vocal about this for many, many years with AFR not offering accurate frame-rate.

 

[bystander36]

THG used a gamer panel to do blind tests on their review of the 7990. They sound like they plan to do more of those blind tests with more people in the future, since a lot of people don't want to believe the graphics mean anything. The results were that SLI did look smoother to their gamer panel.

The whole reason these tests were used is because review sites have noticed a difference visually.

 

[Will Robinson]

Maybe you missed the years of subjective views about AFR and so much a term was coined: MicroStutter! Now there is subjective and tangible data.

This awareness was like music to my ears and have been vocal about this for many, many years with AFR not offering accurate frame-rate.

Maybe you missed that fact that most people didn't notice the "stutter" you claim to have perceived...all those years ago.

 

[Attic]

Nice find. He's clearly going to be biased, but I don't find it to a level of absurdity some in his position would take.

As a gamer I like the way AMD does things more than nvidia. We have the "motivated" forum crew who push an agenda, but when it comes down to it the cards that are out from both camps are incredible. Where AMD wins me is the game bundle and that they add features to games available across brands as opposed to nvidias slimy tactics of game involvement.

 

[thilanliyan]

Nice find. He's clearly going to be biased, but I don't find it to a level of absurdity some in his position would take.

As a gamer I like the way AMD does things more than nvidia. We have the "motivated" forum crew who push an agenda, but when it comes down to it the cards that are out from both camps are incredible. Where AMD wins me is the game bundle and that they add features to games available across brands as opposed to nvidias slimy tactics of game involvement.

This can only go well

 

[SirPauly]

Maybe you missed that fact that most people didn't notice the "stutter" you claim to have perceived...all those years ago.

http://beyond3d.com/showpost.php?p=1168949&postcount=160

And here is a quote from years and years ago asking for smoothness investigations:

It would be so refreshing to read investigative articles on the gaming experience instead of cookie cutters

http://beyond3d.com/showpost.php?p=1168390&postcount=125

So, I am now seeing investigative articles and sites going beyond frame-rate -- hence, music to my ears.

At least I am consistent.

 

[Face2Face]

I don't think anybody here is going to buying a 7990... I think all of the current 7900 series owners are more interested in seeing crossfire driver improvements - Seeing the progress is making me want another 7950

 

[bystander36]

Maybe you missed that fact that most people didn't notice the "stutter" you claim to have perceived...all those years ago.

That doesn't mean that the same people would not have found evenly spaced out frames to look smoother if seen side by side. After all, the reviews are to help us choose what is best for us, not what we'd find tolerable.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/radeon-hd-7990-review-benchmark,3486-13.html

Unanimously, the entire group identified game play on Nvidia’s GeForce GTX 690 as the smoothest. Although I was worried about group pressures affecting the responses, or any of the other pitfalls associated with subjective analysis, each gamer was asked to identify the factors that affected his judgment, and we received specific answers.

 

[SirPauly]

This can only go well

And the forum motivated crew!

 

[Attic]

I don't think anybody here is going to buying a 7990... I think all of the current 7900 series owners are more interested in seeing crossfire driver improvements - Seeing the progress is making me want another 7950

This. I wonder why AMD chose to release the 7990 without a final and ready x-fire fixed driver. PCperspective has touched on an early beta of that driver and it looks really promising. Most reviews have been decidedly negative on the merits of the 7990 given the price and especially x-fire issues. That first impression is so critical, I'm surprised AMD didn't wait to release the 7990 in tandem with resolved x-fire driver to put the focus on the good instead of the bad.

Now those reading about the 7990 get reminded of the xfire issues and presented with good reasons not to go dual GPU from AMD at this time. I'm not going to have same enthusiasm to seek out updated reviews of the 7990 when/ if they are done with the new driver.

 

[SirPauly]

Imho,

Because by offering the fastest card offers technology leadership and offers more choice for prospective customers instead of just nVidia offering a GTX 690 and Titan, brings more competition.

 

[SirPauly]

Wonder why?

Because AMD can offer this:

All Hail the New King

The AMD Radeon™ HD 7990 is an uncompromising masterpiece of breathtaking performance. As the world’s fastest and most advanced graphics card, it descends from generations of AMD Radeon™ graphics cards that wore the same crown. And with a heritage like that, you know what you’re getting: an unparalleled experience wherein gaming is everything… but not the only thing. All hail the new king

 

[Attic]

Wonder why?

Because AMD can offer this:

All Hail the New King

I always have a difficult time gauging the merits of my and our (as an enthusiast group) reactions to the card vs the broader public who are getting a glimpse at the card now. Broader public being more vulnerable to marketing gimmicks vs our awareness of what is best to put in focus when critiquing a card.

The guys who are ready to plunk down 1k for a gpu should fall more heavily into the enthusiast group. AMD being able to claim having the fastest card may mean more sales of the lower end offerings due to perception of vendors, I've never bought into that though.

 

[SirPauly]

I always have a difficult time gauging the merits of my and our (as an enthusiast group) reactions to the card vs the broader public who are getting a glimpse at the card now.

To be a fly on a wall in their meetings and devising strategies.

 

[Rvenger]

Wonder why?

Because AMD can offer this:

All Hail the New King

If they can't get the driver issues sorted properly its going to be a big fail. Hopefully by all these issues they can actually develop some good software for their cards and come up with the times.

 

[BrightCandle]

If they can't get the driver issues sorted properly its going to be a big fail. Hopefully by all these issues they can actually develop some good software for their cards and come up with the times.

We have been complaining about amd/ati I drivers for over a decade. I think it unlikely that this general problem of shoddy drivers will go away soon, it likely never will. Its why AMD sells better hardware cheaper than their main competitor, it really costs them. They have the better hardware, they ought to be dominating the market. Software and their reputation because of it is the reason they aren't doing so.

Considering where crossfire currently is that interview is just incredible. We have pcper on the one hand telling us that AMD knows there is a problem, they are providing prototype drivers and working hard to try and resolve the bigger problems which started in earnest in January. But then their marketing guys go out and don't understand the issues at all. Their card is fundamentally crippled by poor drivers, the videos show just how bad it is.

I would say AMD should know better, but they don't seem to test for anything smoothness related. Pcper on this weeks podcast said AMD still doesn't have a FCAT capture card and one of the reasons they got the prototype driver was to test it for them. That is incredible, a company with this level of problem, working on a fix currently has no way to test for smooth delivery of game frames at all. Something is deeply rotten in the AMD Quality assurance department.

 

[Skurge]

We have been complaining about amd/ati I drivers for over a decade. I think it unlikely that this general problem of shoddy drivers will go away soon, it likely never will. Its why AMD sells better hardware cheaper than their main competitor, it really costs them. They have the better hardware, they ought to be dominating the market. Software and their reputation because of it is the reason they aren't doing so.

Considering where crossfire currently is that interview is just incredible. We have pcper on the one hand telling us that AMD knows there is a problem, they are providing prototype drivers and working hard to try and resolve the bigger problems which started in earnest in January. But then their marketing guys go out and don't understand the issues at all. Their card is fundamentally crippled by poor drivers, the videos show just how bad it is.

I would say AMD should know better, but they don't seem to test for anything smoothness related. Pcper on this weeks podcast said AMD still doesn't have a FCAT capture card and one of the reasons they got the prototype driver was to test it for them. That is incredible, a company with this level of problem, working on a fix currently has no way to test for smooth delivery of game frames at all. Something is deeply rotten in the AMD Quality assurance department.

No offense, but I'm sorry, that last bit sounds like absolute nonsense. If AMD were that bad at what they do, how on earth are they the only ones that were about to trade blows with nvidia all these years. How do you think AMD wrote the driver if they had no way of testing it?

This driver issue stuff is also complete BS. Do you remember when the FX5800 ultra came out? If you do then you know nvidia's drivers were absolutely terrible in both performance and image quality. 6800 Ultra? It had IQ issues in a lot of games as well. 7800GTX? it was ok, but it couldn't run HDR. Fermi's drivers with the early texture issues? Starcraft 2 menus killing nVidia cards? Nvidia drivers killing cards, then after that, GTX590s dying cause the drivers OCP didn't work properly. The Adaptive v-sync bug? Fermi stuttering? GTX680 stuttering in BF3, The clocking bug that nV had? When Surround launched it had a crap ton of issues too. Who else makes GPUs? Intel? How are their drivers? Don't make me laugh.

nVidia has had just as many driver issues as AMD. if not more serious ones. Yes, granted SLI has been smoother for the entirety of the current generation. If these issues were always there how come nobody picked them up during the 4 series? Where crossfire was far superior to SLI. Every review of the 4870X2 had crossfire working perfectly. Same with the 5970 and the 6990.

GCN is a brand new architecture and arguably more complex than kepler. It is a compute powerhouse. It compete with Titan with much less resources and Die size. It is incredibly fast a OCL stuff. nvidia's drivers in regards to OCL are an absolute mess.

AMD admited they chose implement crossfire as it is now. They realise it was the wrong decision and in a few months they have a driver that makes crossfire just as smooth as SLI, but you can adjust it as you see fit for reduced latency, but less smooth FPS output. Why doesn't nVidia give you that option?

AMD can't test for frame latency? How do you think they wrote a driver to fix it?