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David Kanter: AMD's ARM core will be 10% faster than their x86 one, ditch Bulldozer

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mrmt said:
http://phx.corporate-ir.net/External.File?item=UGFyZW50SUQ9MjQyNDM4fENoaWxkSUQ9LTF8VHlwZT0z&t=1

(...)

Computing Solutions segment revenue increased 1 percent sequentially and decreased 20 percent year‐over‐year. The year‐over‐year decline was due to decreased microprocessor unit shipment

======================
Click to expand...

First lets see what Computing Solution represent.
Computing Solutions segment primarily includes x86 microprocessors, as standalone devices or as incorporated as an accelerated processing unit (APU),
chipsets, embedded processors and dense servers.
Click to expand...

Then lets see what happened in Q2 2014

Q2 2014 Segment Results

Computing Solutions segment revenue was $669 million, up 1% sequentially, due to higher notebook and embedded processor sales offset by lower desktop processor and chipset sales.

• Client product revenue increased sequentially primarily due to *higher notebook microprocessor sales in the quarter offset by lower desktop processor and chipset sales.

• Microprocessor average selling price (ASP) increased sequentially.
Click to expand...

*Notebook processor sales are APUs only.

Then lets see some numbers.

o6fzfp.jpg


1. They sold less volume than last year but they made a profit unlike last years higher revenue with a loss.

2. Also, only looking at Computing Solution Revenue you have no idea how much was the APU Volume sold last year and this year. So you and Intel17 have no idea how APUs sales did this quarter. 😉
 
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blackened23 said:
AMD did not make money Q2 and certainly did not make a profit, not sure what you're talking about. They had a 36 million loss as of Q2 this year.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/8270/amd-q2-2014-quarterly-earnings-analysis
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depends on whether you are talking about GAAP or Non GAAP numbers.

"Once again, gross margins were flat over the preceding quarter at 35%. Operating income for the quarter was $63 million, up from $49 million in Q1, however the GAAP results still ended up with a $36 million net loss.

The Non-GAAP numbers come in higher due to the exclusion of $49 million in loss from debt redemption. Non-GAAP operating income was $67 million, with a net income of $17 million or $0.02 per share which missed analyst’s expectations of $0.03 per share."

btw the refinancing has moved out AMD's earliest major debt return to 2019. Enough time to rebuild the company and start repaying the debt gradually.
 
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raghu78 said:
depends on whether you are talking about GAAP or Non GAAP numbers.

"Once again, gross margins were flat over the preceding quarter at 35%. Operating income for the quarter was $63 million, up from $49 million in Q1, however the GAAP results still ended up with a $36 million net loss.

The Non-GAAP numbers come in higher due to the exclusion of $49 million in loss from debt redemption. Non-GAAP operating income was $67 million, with a net income of $17 million or $0.02 per share which missed analyst’s expectations of $0.03 per share."

btw the refinancing has moved out AMD's earliest major debt return to 2019. Enough time to rebuild the company and start repaying the debt gradually.
Click to expand...

I personally made a million dollars last quarter*, see how easy it can be with accounting to claim you made money even when your bank account says otherwise?

* excluding a host of expenses and costs associated with me eating, living, being housed, and otherwise surviving this thing we call life.
 
Concentrate on Compute Solutions segment only,

With a revenue of 669M and total average margins of 35% in Q2 2014, that particular segment now makes money. Last year with 20% higher Revenue the same segment didnt.

And yes the Total Revenue and Operating Income from the above table is before taxes and other expenses. But that was not intended to be the focus of the conversation.
 
raghu78 said:
depends on whether you are talking about GAAP or Non GAAP numbers.
Click to expand...

They have been more or less stable around break even point regarding their operating results in the last few quarters, so it's largely irrelevant whether they can make a few millions in losses or profits.
 
AtenRa said:
Concentrate on Compute Solutions segment only,

With a revenue of 669M and total average margins of 35% in Q2 2014, that particular segment now makes money. Last year with 20% higher Revenue the same segment didnt.

And yes the Total Revenue and Operating Income from the above table is before taxes and other expenses. But that was not intended to be the focus of the conversation.
Click to expand...

If you don't know how to read financial results I don't even understand why you comment on it. Any form of revenue and operating income is not profit.

GAAP = generally accepted accounting practices. Non GAAP is how corporations put their own spin on their finances. At the end of the day the bank account tells the true story, and AMD's bank is not growing, it's the opposite. AMD's debt went up by .07 billion last quarter.

AMD is on stable ground so far despite the losses (like the above post mentioned, they've hovered around breaking point for some time) but the real casualty in all of this is the fact that AMD cannot spend as much on R+D as their competitors. For that you need warfunds in the bank, something that AMD does not have a lot of, and they need it to have the most compelling products in the future. You need money to make money in the silicon biz.
 
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blackened23 said:
If you don't know how to read financial results I don't even understand why you comment on it. Any form of revenue and operating income is not profit.
Click to expand...

The Compute Solution Segment made a Operating income profit of 9 Millions in Q2 2014. Like it or not that is what happened. And that is how every company including Intel measure it.
Also just to point out, those figures in the table i have posted above are GAAP. 😉
 
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AtenRa said:
The Compute Solution Segment made a Operating income profit of 9 Millions in Q2 2014. Like it or not that is what happened. And that is how every company including Intel measure it.
Also just to point out, those figures in the table i have posted above are GAAP. 😉
Click to expand...

You don't get it do you. Operating income is not the indication of a corporations' profit unless taxes and interest do not exist. Net income is profit. Operating income doesn't account for a vast number of expenses including, duh, tax and a ton of other things. If you knew how to read financial results, you would know this. Unless you live in a fantasy land where taxes, interest, and stock dividends didn't happen. These things do happen and are subtracted to give you the income or profit, the NET INCOME. Net income is the measure of profit or the lack of profit. Besides which, the computing solutions segment results are just sad, the real saving grace of AMD was their graphics division. If not for the graphics division, AMD's net income would be way further in the red than it already is.

Doesn't really matter though. AMD has been hovering around the break even point for some time now, what they need is a good quarter of profit so they can invest into important things. Such as less marketing and more R+D.
 
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blackened23 said:
Jesus CHRIST. You don't get it do you. No, you obviously don't. Operating income is not indicative of a corporations' profit. Net income is profit. Operating income doesn't account for a vast number of expenses including, duh, tax and a ton of other things. If you knew how to read financial results, you would know this. Net income is the measure of profit or the lack of profit. Besides which, the computing solutions segment results are just sad, the real saving grace of AMD was their graphics division. If not for the graphics division, AMD's net income would be way further in the red than it already is.

Doesn't really matter though. AMD has been hovering around the break even point for some time now, what they need is a good quarter of profit so they can invest into important things. Such as less marketing and more R+D.
Click to expand...


How many times should i BOLD the Compute Solution Segment for you to understand what the context of the conversation is ??? 😵
The Compute Solution Segment made an Operating profit of 9 Millions in Q2 2014. I have never spoke about AMDs Net income, the faster you understand that the better.
 
Ajay said:
It seems like the window of opportunity for ARM based servers is closing: http://www.pcworld.com/article/2461180/processor-delays-hurt-arm-server-adoption-dell-exec-says.html



If the K12 ARM CPU was already here on 20nm; it would have a bigger impact on the market. I fear AMD has leaped too late to really open a new market under ARM.

As far as AMD's next gen x86 - I just can't make sense of all the comments made by AMD execs to really have a clue where it's going to fall performance wise. A big problem for AMD is that their APU (excluding consoles) business is shrinking - so a K12 x86 CPU will either be a CAT replacement (a bit beefier with better perf/watt) or, AMD pulls off a miracle and produces a competitive gaming APU in 2016 (really, competitive performance w/dGPU Intel systems). The latter would be the last hurrah for AMD, the either make it, or down size again and lose heavily against Intel and Nvidia because of constrained R&D dollars.
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Its hard to see any future success for ARM in the server space when one of the major OEMs speaks so directly about it. x86 simply owns the segment completely in all metrics. Its also clear from Dell that the interest in ARM is dropping fast from its prototype clients. Samsung and nVidia also dropped ARM server plans because they couldnt see a market.
 
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ShintaiDK said:
Its hard to see any future success for ARM in the server space when one of the major OEMs speaks so directly about it. x86 simply owns the segment completely in all metrics. Its also clear from Dell that the interest in ARM is dropping fast from its prototype clients. Samsung and nVidia also dropped ARM server plans because they couldnt see a market.
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The OEM with a history of taking kickbacks from Intel is not advocating ARM servers? Shocker! :awe:
 
NTMBK said:
The OEM with a history of taking kickbacks from Intel is not advocating ARM servers? Shocker! :awe:
Click to expand...

Nice try to derail. Specially considering how much you are after other people for it.

Lets turn back time:
http://www.eetimes.com/document.asp?doc_id=1256326

4 years later, still no fruit. And IBM sold its server business to Lenovo.
Samsung and nVidia also drops ARM server plans. Qualcomm havent any ARM server plans on the table either.

So it leaves what, AMD, HP(doubtful since ARM is gone from their Moonshot pages.) and APM left? The confidence in ARM servers is astonishing.
 
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ShintaiDK said:
Nice try to derail. Specially considering how much you are after other people for it.

Lets turn back time:
http://www.eetimes.com/document.asp?doc_id=1256326

4 years later, still no fruit. And IBM sold its server business to Lenovo.
Samsung and nVidia also drops ARM server plans. Qualcomm havent any ARM server plans on the table either.

So it leaves what, AMD, HP(doubtful since ARM is gone from their Moonshot pages.) and APM left? The confidence in ARM servers is astonishing.
Click to expand...

You missed to mention at least Broadcom and Cavium.
And why should Qualcomm make a server SOC? They are mainly a telecom company.
And there are only two companies making x86 server CPU's so I don't understand why number of suppliers are important.
 
teejee said:
You missed to mention at least Broadcom and Cavium.
And why should Qualcomm make a server SOC? They are mainly a telecom company.
And there are only two companies making x86 server CPU's so I don't understand why number of suppliers are important.
Click to expand...

If it was looking to be a big market, then the big players (like Dell) would certainly be exuberant about their ARM products - instead of speaking soberly about it (or not showing any public interest at all).

By the time ARM K12 is out, so will Broadwell-E. Broadwell-E is going to provided allot of computer power, many threads and much reduced power consumption. I think we'll also have a Cherrytrail server SoC from Intel by then. Where is the room for ARM when Intel will have such excellent perf/watt (for both HP and LP processors) in 2016?

I think an ARM server market was a good idea, the TTM was just too long for it too build enough momentum to become self-sustaining. AMD's best hope is that their are enough customers who don't like Intel, and AMD comes close enough in perf/watt to grab a large enough market share to fund their R&D and make a profit - but I think it's really a fools errand at this point in time. Still, I wish AMD the best of luck.
 
ShintaiDK said:
Nice try to derail. Specially considering how much you are after other people for it.

4 years later, still no fruit. And IBM sold its server business to Lenovo.
Samsung and nVidia also drops ARM server plans. Qualcomm havent any ARM server plans on the table either.

So it leaves what, AMD, HP(doubtful since ARM is gone from their Moonshot pages.) and APM left? The confidence in ARM servers is astonishing.
Click to expand...

Wow, I wasn't aware all those companies made ARM and x86 Motherboards that were pin compatible. You do realize that AMD is building it so people can just say, I want an ARM Server..... Buy it and then change their mind, nah... Give me an x86 one instead by just swapping the CPU.

That flexibility is going to be very attractive to a lot of organizations.
 
MiddleOfTheRoad said:
Wow, I wasn't aware all those companies made ARM and x86 Motherboards that were pin compatible. You do realize that AMD is building it so people can just say, I want an ARM Server..... Buy it and then change their mind, nah... Give me an x86 one instead by just swapping the CPU.

That flexibility is going to be very attractive to a lot of organizations.
Click to expand...

As attractive as Opterons is today?
 
ShintaiDK said:
Nice try to derail. Specially considering how much you are after other people for it.

Lets turn back time:
http://www.eetimes.com/document.asp?doc_id=1256326

4 years later, still no fruit. And IBM sold its server business to Lenovo.
Samsung and nVidia also drops ARM server plans. Qualcomm havent any ARM server plans on the table either.

So it leaves what, AMD, HP(doubtful since ARM is gone from their Moonshot pages.) and APM left? The confidence in ARM servers is astonishing.
Click to expand...

Did you every consider that these companies just don't have what it takes to make a competitive ARM server processor? They have to spend a lot more money than AMD does to compete. AMD already has the IP developed with its x86 processors.

Yes, the market won't be huge but it's still a place to make money. Samsung can't even make its own processor for its own phones not alone produce a server chip. Qualcomm has no server experience, nVidia has server experience but not in CPU...
 
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