Customer fires at Auburn Hills shoplifting suspects

[irishScott]

Chicago isn't exactly a good representation of what gun bans would or could accomplish in America though. Like you said, they get guns from nearby states/counties where they are easy to get or they steal them. Also, the notion that there is so much crime and killing in Chicago because of gun bans or that murders/crime would decrease and people would be safer if they had guns is ridiculous. Most of this is black on black crime in the poorest areas.

It's like saying all of San Diego is dangerous because there is a lot of crime in Chula Vista.

It's a good representation because it's one of the high water marks of gun control. For gun bans to do any more would require their implementation over an entire region, perhaps even the entire nation, and they'd have to be complete in the sense of destroying current supply. Frankly that's a fantasy within our lifetimes. Even universal healthcare is more likely.

Of course Chicago's murder problem isn't due to gun bans, the causes of the violence are far more complex. But gun bans do largely prevent good people from defending themselves effectively, and clearly don't stem supply enough to be effective in a realistic implementation. Granted allowing people to defend themselves probably wouldn't fix the problem by itself, but I'd say people should be allowed the opportunity, particularly in more violent neighborhoods.

For an extreme example, in Mexico you actually see local militias fighting the cartels. Imagine what those people would do if the government came in and disarmed them.

 

[MrPickins]

Tangential, but:

For an extreme example, in Mexico you actually see local militias fighting the cartels. Imagine what those people would do if the government came in and disarmed them.

They did just that in Michoacán:

http://therealnews.com/t2/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=31&Itemid=74&jumival=114170

The army killed 3 civilians. :\

 

[CitizenKain]

The operative words are "at someone." It's kind of hard to kill a "thing."

There are people in car. Is this too confusing for you?

 

[fleshconsumed]

Yes, it's a tangent, but it's an interesting/sad dilemma. There is a documentary that talks about it: Cartel Land. Supposedly since then Mexican government jailed Dr José Mireles. I can sort of understand Mexican government position, but on the other hand, if they can't protect their own citizens, what's left for the citizens to do but to defend themselves?

 

[CZroe]

There are people in car. Is this too confusing for you?

Doesn't change anything if she was shooting at the tire and hit the tire.

I'm not trying to justify it, I'm just trying to say that it could be misconstrued.

 

[Darwin333]

I certainly hope she is charged and her CCW permit revoked.

Who the hell starts shooting at an SUV in a public place over a possible shoplifting?

As a permit holder myself and assuming those are all the details of the story, I agree the woman should be charged with public endangerment at the very least. I don't see how she or anyone else could have been in imminent danger if they already in their vehicle and were fleeing the scene. Especially stupid is the fact that it wasn't her shit they were stealing.

 

[Darwin333]

It is a shame there wasn't someone else with a gun there to but some bullets in that lady.

You know they would actually be in the right more than the shooter in the story. If some other CCW person was in the parking lot, saw her shooting at a vehicle, they could easily have shot her and from where I stand (assuming all the details are correct) it would have been a good shoot.

 

[Fanatical Meat]

As a permit holder myself and assuming those are all the details of the story, I agree the woman should be charged with public endangerment at the very least. I don't see how she or anyone else could have been in imminent danger if they already in their vehicle and were fleeing the scene. Especially stupid is the fact that it wasn't her shit they were stealing.

Everyone is forgetting to chance at that moment the suspect may not have stolen anything.

 

[Darwin333]

Everyone is forgetting to chance at that moment the suspect may not have stolen anything.

I don't see how its even relevant if they stole anything or not. Stealing something from a store and then running away is not a life and death situation by any stretch. That's why they don't arm their loss prevention people at the Home Depot. Hell most stores have a policy that their loss prevention aren't even allowed to try to physically subdue people much less use deadly force against people fleeing.

I called the cop who shot the guy in the back who was (rather slowly) running away a murderer because he was. This woman attempted to do the same and she had absolutely zero skin in the game.

 

[TeeJay1952]

As a permit holder myself and assuming those are all the details of the story, I agree the woman should be charged with public endangerment at the very least. I don't see how she or anyone else could have been in imminent danger if they already in their vehicle and were fleeing the scene. Especially stupid is the fact that it wasn't her shit they were stealing.

Darwin333, you got it right. Someone shoots her and someone sees that and shoots second shooter and on and so forth till Civil War breaks out. Too many guns in that parking lot.