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current Boston mayor takes most dangerous platform ever taken by Boston mayor.

shortylickens

No Lifer
Jul 15, 2003
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ivwshane

Lifer
May 15, 2000
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What’s great about cities and states is that you can try different things to see how it affects policy goals. I applaud him for, at the very least, trying something.
 
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repoman0

Diamond Member
Jun 17, 2010
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Maybe.
I dont know.
I do know this will NOT be popular with a good chunk of the city.
On the other hand, maybe it will be real popular with another chunk of the city.
Boston will support this, it’s not the city it used to be. We voted against Dump like 10:1
 
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Feb 4, 2009
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From what I heard on the radio Walsh is basically saying move duties the Police aren’t well equipped to handle to other organizations I believe he cited problem kids on a school bus. The Police aren’t the right solution and the Police hate doing it.
He spoke about having the community decide what type of Police force is needed for what seemed like a long time.
My deplorable friends are going nuts over this. From what I heard it makes sense and even the Police Chief welcomes the idea, he would prefer to have his officers doing crime prevention stuff vs house calls and dealing with mental illness calls.
 

zzyzxroad

Diamond Member
Jan 29, 2017
3,190
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From what I heard on the radio Walsh is basically saying move duties the Police aren’t well equipped to handle to other organizations I believe he cited problem kids on a school bus. The Police aren’t the right solution and the Police hate doing it.
He spoke about having the community decide what type of Police force is needed for what seemed like a long time.
My deplorable friends are going nuts over this. From what I heard it makes sense and even the Police Chief welcomes the idea, he would prefer to have his officers doing crime prevention stuff vs house calls and dealing with mental illness calls.
I had never though why are we asking cops to do all these things. Now that it's been brought up I wonder why we ever set the system up the way it is.
 
Jun 19, 2004
24,135
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I had never though why are we asking cops to do all these things. Now that it's been brought up I wonder why we ever set the system up the way it is.
The police represent structure and safety, at least to most white folks. In times gone by, our culture provided that structure and safety. However now, we tend to look down on people who strongly follow their culture because it's not "ours." We have traded the melting pot for the self encapsulating every man is an island .
 

shortylickens

No Lifer
Jul 15, 2003
79,060
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More then just convenience, though I know a lot of people believe that.
They are almost always the first responders to a given situation, because they are already out on the road, moving around.
Firemen and EMT's are usually sitting around waiting for calls.

Because police are normally the first ones to show up, they started getting more and more training in dealing with oddball situations. You can watch LivePD on youtube if you're curious.
They are marriage counselors, crisis counselors, dog catchers, cat wranglers, low-level medics, and improv rescuers.
Most of the time they aren't really good at this stuff and in some cases it's actually better for them to secure the area and wait for subject matter experts instead.

Cities are slowly starting to realize this and put more time, effort, and money into hiring rescue type people and equipping them. Usually this stuff goes thru the fire department but sometimes they have a few specialized groups set up.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
67,357
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The police represent structure and safety, at least to most white folks. In times gone by, our culture provided that structure and safety. However now, we tend to look down on people who strongly follow their culture because it's not "ours." We have traded the melting pot for the self encapsulating every man is an island .
American exceptionalism in concern for justice became look at how great I am.

Because it was convenient.
Yes true. Now tell me what the convenience was and what a better alternative would have been. I used to take certain ideas on faith having never had to articulate what they were or defend them when I did.
 

Greenman

Lifer
Oct 15, 1999
17,459
2,667
126
American exceptionalism in concern for justice became look at how great I am.



Yes true. Now tell me what the convenience was and what a better alternative would have been. I used to take certain ideas on faith having never had to articulate what they were or defend them when I did.
There really isn't anything to defend. Someone has to deal with homeless people that sometimes become violent, send in the police. Schools gave up the entire concept of discipline, so they need police on campus to maintain order. Even parents have been using police to control the children they couldn't be bothered raising properly. For all of these things it was cheaper and a lot easier to hand it to the police than to deal with the underlying issues or face the tough decisions.
We created the entire problem, we handed it to law enforcement, now we're pissed of that they didn't do a better job than us. Now we're going to try to reinvent law enforcement, because that's better than admitting that we fucked it up to begin with. I don't believe that we're bright enough to do that.
 

shortylickens

No Lifer
Jul 15, 2003
79,060
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Its not the schools fault.
Parents today dont wanna parent, they put too many of their responsibilities on teachers. In addition to that they also sue the school or city any time some minor piddly bullshit happens.
At this point many school systems are really just expensive daycares. And they arent very good daycare either. We need to see what successful European countries are doing and copy them. Frankly we are not world leaders any more and we should probably start learning from others instead of continuing to fail.
 
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Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
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"Greenman, post: 40193916, member: 2751"
There really isn't anything to defend.

M: You said, "Because it was convenient. I agreed with you, but I asked that you defend that statement by explaining exactly what you mean by convenient because I may mean something completely different with that word than you do. You should be able to defend what you mean by convenient is the real reason. And you begin to explain yourself here:

G: Someone has to deal with homeless people that sometimes become violent, send in the police.

M: a typical conservative response to fear

G: Schools gave up the entire concept of discipline, so they need police on campus to maintain order.

M: You should recognize that this need to maintain order is a very conservative thingi because the conservative brain is wired to react to uncertainty and chaos with fear. Liberals who concentrate in educational systems were first in line to rectify the notion the teaching to the hickory stick is dangerous to children's minds, that curiosity and the love of learning are what will motivate academic excellence. The convenience was that there was no money for real educational reform.

G: Even parents have been using police to control the children they couldn't be bothered raising properly. For all of these things it was cheaper and a lot easier to hand it to the police than to deal with the underlying issues or face the tough decisions.

M: Again, it is conservatives not liberals that won't pay the kind of taxes needed to make real reform happen.

G: We created the entire problem, we handed it to law enforcement, now we're pissed of that they didn't do a better job than us.

M: Not we, but conservatives created the problem and handed it to law enforcement and now still demand they fix the problem they were handed. They are pissed because they handed the problem to their own creation and conservatives couldn't do shit.

G: Now we're going to try to reinvent law enforcement, because that's better than admitting that we fucked it up to begin with. I don't believe that we're bright enough to do that.

M: Of course you don't believe we're bright enough to do that because the we you refer to is the ones we see in the mirror.

Convenient for a conservative is called rationalization: anything that keeps negative emotions from surfacing and scaring the bejesus out of them. But the important point to me is this matter of 'fucking up'. Nobody fucked up. Everybody did the best the could within the limits of their conditioning. If you weren't conditioned to fear fucking up you wouldn't nearly as often. You love others, but you lack faith that all people are basically good. You were raised as though only fear would keep you from that path and we become what we fear.

There are lots of bumps in the road ahead but we need to evolve toward more liberal reasoning if we are to survive. Have faith in people. Only the humility of the recognition we don't know all the answers will allow us to seek for better solutions than the ones we thought would work in the past. We grow or we go extinct.
 

woolfe9998

Lifer
Apr 8, 2013
13,500
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Whatever the merits of these proposed reforms, saying a 500 year old problem is all the sudden a "public health crisis" after all this time is rhetorical idiocy. He's pandering for black and liberal votes, just like the Minneapolis City Council.

If you've got good reforms, announce the reforms. Stop preening like a peacock to the public.
 

shortylickens

No Lifer
Jul 15, 2003
79,060
11,966
126
Whatever the merits of these proposed reforms, saying a 500 year old problem is all the sudden a "public health crisis" after all this time is rhetorical idiocy. He's pandering for black and liberal votes, just like the Minneapolis City Council.

If you've got good reforms, announce the reforms. Stop preening like a peacock to the public.
its more about getting support from the people than offering help to them.
thats just politics. I finally accepted this is the way things work in America and stopped being irritated by it.
If Americans actually gave a crap about their country they'd spend more time keeping track of what their public officials are doing and less time on the Kardashians or whatever.
 

shortylickens

No Lifer
Jul 15, 2003
79,060
11,966
126
BUMP!

INDIRECTLY RELATED:


Two things happening in New York-
1.
Massive budget cuts, probably inline with the current notion that cops shouldn't be expected to solve every little problem in society and possibly that they have too much power and authority.

2.
More transparency and accountability, again inline with the notion police are a little too special and have been getting away with stuff.

I suspect this trend may continue across the nation. My only worry is SOME folks who love guns and think cops are just fuckin awesome, may see this as a threat to their version of Jesus Christ and Freedom and might start going out on their own, looking for trouble, and acting as citizen-police, which will only cause more trouble.
 

ch33zw1z

Lifer
Nov 4, 2004
33,333
12,135
146
Bold move, let's see how it plays out. I'm sure here at the opposite side of the state there will be some people unhappy, but they dont live is Boston, so eff em.
 

Starbuck1975

Lifer
Jan 6, 2005
14,651
1,883
126


Maybe.
I dont know.
I do know this will NOT be popular with a good chunk of the city.
On the other hand, maybe it will be real popular with another chunk of the city.
It will work fine so long as there are no bad actors who exploit the situation, although this sounds more like a knee jerk than sound policy decision.

The police get called into social and domestic situations that they lack the training or expertise to handle, but they get called because they have the physical presence to respond.
 

hal2kilo

Lifer
Feb 24, 2009
17,516
5,075
136


Maybe.
I dont know.
I do know this will NOT be popular with a good chunk of the city.
On the other hand, maybe it will be real popular with another chunk of the city.
More valid than Trump's Border Emergency declaration.
 

Greenman

Lifer
Oct 15, 1999
17,459
2,667
126
More valid than Trump's Border Emergency declaration.
So racism is a public health crisis, but obesity, drug use, alcoholism, gang violence, child abuse, and homicide aren't worth the effort?
About Trump, every nation has not only the right, but the duty to defend it's borders. Much as we love having a peon class to exploit, it can't last forever.
 
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ch33zw1z

Lifer
Nov 4, 2004
33,333
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So racism is a public health crisis, but obesity, drug use, alcoholism, gang violence, child abuse, and homicide aren't worth the effort?
About Trump, every nation has not only the right, but the duty to defend it's borders. Much as we love having a peon class to exploit, it can't last forever.
Beat that straw, feels so good.
 

cytg111

Lifer
Mar 17, 2008
16,451
6,325
136
So racism is a public health crisis, but obesity, drug use, alcoholism, gang violence, child abuse, and homicide aren't worth the effort?
About Trump, every nation has not only the right, but the duty to defend it's borders. Much as we love having a peon class to exploit, it can't last forever.
Its funny to see our “conservative” members getting into absurdity overdrive in realtime tandem with Trump tanking in the fringes of whats left of his base.
Yea greenie, thats exactly what it means, the left dont give two shits about child abuse anymore.
Damn.
 
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Feb 4, 2009
30,513
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So racism is a public health crisis, but obesity, drug use, alcoholism, gang violence, child abuse, and homicide aren't worth the effort?
About Trump, every nation has not only the right, but the duty to defend it's borders. Much as we love having a peon class to exploit, it can't last forever.
Did you read the article?
I myself can’t imagine why the Police are required for the situations the Chief of Police mentioned.

Boston’s Police Commissioner William Gross stood by the mayor to welcome the new reforms, saying spreading out the responsibility of keeping Boston safe will ultimately help officers focus on their jobs.


“Quite frankly, what I’ve heard in the community is we wear too many hats anyway,” Gross said. " A child doesn’t want to go to school? You call the Boston police. A child’s on the bus being unruly? You call the Boston police. There’s an emotionally disturbed person in a home? You call the Boston police. How many hats do you want us to wear?"
 
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ch33zw1z

Lifer
Nov 4, 2004
33,333
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Did you read the article?
I myself can’t imagine why the Police are required for the situations the Chief of Police mentioned.
Which, funny enough, the same point was made by him in a different post. LEO have been given many hats to wear, some of which would be better served by reallocating the funds provided to police departments to other government departments better equipped to handle the problem.

But, that post from him is 100% strawman. Somehow a major city in a solid blue state doesn't care about anything but racism in terms of public health problems? Yea, lol....right. more like he disagrees, but can't provide a solid argument why, so beats the straw with those other topics
 

MtnMan

Diamond Member
Jul 27, 2004
6,189
4,483
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Its not the schools fault.
Parents today dont wanna parent, they put too many of their responsibilities on teachers. In addition to that they also sue the school or city any time some minor piddly bullshit happens.
At this point many school systems are really just expensive daycares. And they arent very good daycare either. We need to see what successful European countries are doing and copy them. Frankly we are not world leaders any more and we should probably start learning from others instead of continuing to fail.
I suspect with the kiddies being at home 24/7 for the past 3 months that many are seeing the errors of their parenting first hand, up close and personally.
 

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