Credit card debt the next bubble

[Fenixgoon]

why not use my CC? i get 1% cashback on all purchases. if i were to pay cash, i'd get 0% cash back.

i pay my balance in full every month.

 

[Texashiker]

why not use my CC? i get 1% cashback on all purchases. if i were to pay cash, i'd get 0% cash back.

i pay my balance in full every month.

Lets not derail this thread with a credit card VS cash debate - please.

 

[alkemyst]

Thats stupid.

People living on CCs shouldnt be buying new TV for 2000$ - they should buy something "reasonable" for under 500$.

This is how the poor stay poor...they make insane justifications.

 

[alkemyst]

why not use my CC? i get 1% cashback on all purchases. if i were to pay cash, i'd get 0% cash back.

i pay my balance in full every month.

Yeah...plus even if you run a slight balance at times, that's not the end of the world.

I took down about $80k in CC debt with the last $40k of it being paid off in the last 12 months.

My debt was mostly due to going back to college at 30 and the other large chunk 'divorce' debt and not being able to qualify for loans due to my income prior to going in (I didn't work during it)...that was about 1 year at a state college.

I get a lot of free money moving cash through my cards now and hover at a $0 interest balance for the most part.

With a little over $100k available to me on credit lines, I am sure many would be in bad shape here.

 

[nonlnear]

This is how the poor stay poor...they make insane justifications.

And they have those stupid decisions validated by idiots like Gonad the Barbarian who push for public policy which rewards those choices.

 

[Gonad the Barbarian]

And they have those stupid decisions validated by idiots like Gonad the Barbarian who push for public policy which rewards those choices.

And you have idiots like yourself that push public policy that perpetuates even more miserable poor folks that will turn to things like TV's and Xbox's to try and eek out some happiness.

You god damn morons are really trying to argue that poor folks buying TV's are somehow ruining this country. Unbelievable.

 

[nick1985]

Posting in a TH credit card thread

 

[nonlnear]

And you have idiots like yourself that push public policy that perpetuates even more miserable poor folks that will turn to things like TV's and Xbox's to try and eek out some happiness.

You god damn morons are really trying to argue that poor folks buying TV's are somehow ruining this country. Unbelievable.

Look! It's an army of straw men!

 

[TheSlamma]

So if people are still spending this kind of money (even if it's not theirs) shouldn't these corporations they are buying from be doing just fine and be hiring?

 

[1prophet]

The credit card system is broken. We can not have the banks on one hand evaluate people's credit worthiness, and on the other hand approve credit cards that make them billion if not trillions of dollar and the bank stand to make much more with 20%+ interest for those who lack a bit on their credit rating.

That's as big a conflict of interest as there is. And that's the reason why there is a huge bubble created with credit card given to many who are not suppose to have a credit card.

There has to be 1) government agency that does credit review and approves credit card 2) Independent agency that does credit review and approves credit card.

I don't know why people blame republican or democrats. This is a pure f'ed up in the financial system. We can either let banks suffer their own consequences, but since everyone else will be impacted by banks failure, it's time for government to step in and regulates this.

And since minorities are going to end up with the short end of the stick with that system how long do you think it is going to last without a Barney Frank type politician telling the said agency to relax their standards or else?

 

[werepossum]

Look! It's an army of straw men!

LMAO!

 

[Pulsar]

Rightwing economic policies specifically over the past 30 years have suppressed wages, concentrated wealth at the top, and chipped away at opportunity and the social safety net for everyone else. Your denial would be a lot more plausible if Republicans were not still actively doing this, let alone explicitly campaigning on it as they are.

1. Suppressed wages. How have the republicans done that?
2. Concentrated wealth at the top. If you mean through tax cuts that affect equally (through &#37😉, I agree. We could use some higher taxes and fewer loopholes on the higher earners in this country.
3. Chipped away at opportunity. How have the republicans done that?
4. The social safety net was never meant to be what it has become. It's too large, unsustainably, poorly executed, and doesn't have nearly enough oversight. Simple changes like means-testing could help, if someone ever proposes the f'ing bill to do it.

At some point, I'm farely certain you're going to bring this back around to show us how the Republicans are responsible for people spending irresponsibly. I probably won't agree with your conclusions, since I hold both parties at fault for the state of the country, but we'll see.

 

[Darwin333]

Because it is the honorable thing to do.

Honorable?!?!?!?

When the banks start acting in a fashion that can be used in the same sentence as honorable without causing laughter maybe you will have a point.

Until then its a pure business decision, exactly the same way the bank is looking at it.

 

[Gonad the Barbarian]

1. Suppressed wages. How have the republicans done that?

By standing against attempts to raise minimum wage. By standing against unions. By championing free trade policies pitting US workers against cheap foreign labor.

2. Concentrated wealth at the top. If you mean through tax cuts that affect equally (through &#37😉, I agree. We could use some higher taxes and fewer loopholes on the higher earners in this country.

Not only through taxes. All that cheap labor doesn't mean lower prices as much as it means higher profits. Less money into working class pockets, more money into the top .1%'ers.

3. Chipped away at opportunity. How have the republicans done that?

By standing against education assistance and attacking education budgets. By standing against equal opportunity policies. By opposing healthcare reform that would shift health coverage away from employment based. By allowing big business to grow bigger, collude, and becoming too big to fail. And again, by pitting US labor against cheap foreign labor.

4. The social safety net was never meant to be what it has become. It's too large, unsustainably, poorly executed, and doesn't have nearly enough oversight. Simple changes like means-testing could help, if someone ever proposes the f'ing bill to do it.

Too bad Republicans specifically want drastic changes with he end result of eradicating social safety nets altogether. Obama had put means testing on the table. As well as raising the salary ceiling. Guess which party walked.

Oh, their oppostion to consumer protections and environmental protections should get an honorable mention somewhere up in here as well.

At some point, I'm farely certain you're going to bring this back around to show us how the Republicans are responsible for people spending irresponsibly. I probably won't agree with your conclusions, since I hold both parties at fault for the state of the country, but we'll see.

Democrats are guilty of some of the same things as Republicans, but not in the same frequency or degree, and Republicans certainly own the lion's share of blame for the current situation. Hell, they pride themselves on the very things that got us here. And the current situation is going to promote certain behavior among people. Consumer's maxing credit for things like education, housing, and just all around getting by is one. Resorting to crime is another. Gotta keep that industrial prison complex rolling along. The bottom line is you put people in in certain situations and they are going to behave a certain way. Someone walks up to you and slugs you in the face. Do you hit back? If so is he responsible for you hitting him? Are you?

So, I've played your game, it's only fair now that you play mine. Like I asked earlier, can you name one Republican policy other than gun rights that doesn't screw over everyone else in order to cater to the very rich, very racist, or very evangelical?

 

[Doppel]

I agree there is no honor to be on the table when dealing with a bank, or really specifically any civil contract like this with an institution, at least one that has had tons of attorneys cover their bases. You default, you pay the penalty as spelled out in the contract and nothing more.

 

[dmcowen674]

I'm actually surprised more people aren't retiring in foreign countries to extend their dollars.

It's happening more and more.

Guess you don't watch HGTV, a lot of demographic is Americans that have emigrated in retirement and younger too.

 

[Pulsar]

By standing against attempts to raise minimum wage. By standing against unions. By championing free trade policies pitting US workers against cheap foreign labor.


Not only through taxes. All that cheap labor doesn't mean lower prices as much as it means higher profits. Less money into working class pockets, more money into the top .1%'ers.


By standing against education assistance and attacking education budgets. By standing against equal opportunity policies. By opposing healthcare reform that would shift health coverage away from employment based. By allowing big business to grow bigger, collude, and becoming too big to fail. And again, by pitting US labor against cheap foreign labor.


Too bad Republicans specifically want drastic changes with he end result of eradicating social safety nets altogether. Obama had put means testing on the table. As well as raising the salary ceiling. Guess which party walked.

Oh, their oppostion to consumer protections and environmental protections should get an honorable mention somewhere up in here as well.


Democrats are guilty of some of the same things as Republicans, but not in the same frequency or degree, and Republicans certainly own the lion's share of blame for the current situation. Hell, they pride themselves on the very things that got us here. And the current situation is going to promote certain behavior among people. Consumer's maxing credit for things like education, housing, and just all around getting by is one. Resorting to crime is another. Gotta keep that industrial prison complex rolling along. The bottom line is you put people in in certain situations and they are going to behave a certain way. Someone walks up to you and slugs you in the face. Do you hit back? If so is he responsible for you hitting him? Are you?

So, I've played your game, it's only fair now that you play mine. Like I asked earlier, can you name one Republican policy other than gun rights that doesn't screw over everyone else in order to cater to the very rich, very racist, or very evangelical?

I would say that many of thier policies do. I support lower taxes. (I also support less government spending to balance that). I've liked the direction of lower taxes and no new taxes. I've disliked the Republicans not spending less to balance it.

That said, lower taxes aren't something that hurts people. You can argue that they help the rich more than they help the poor, but I'd argue that when 50% of the population doesn't pay income tax, well, then it's a straw man argument.

The Republicans are for shortening the length of time people can stay on welfare, and collect other types of government aid. I support that. You'll say it's screwing over the poor people. I say making the change would force more people back to being product and reduce dependence on the government. We're doing them no favors by providing for them for endless years.

I also don't believe the minimum wage has anything to do with this argument. Middle-class workers aren't minimum age earners. There ARE jobs that only deserve a very low pay scale. Making the lowest payscale available one that a person could live on doesn't make any sense. I've had this argument in great detail before - minimum wage causes wage inflation. If a guy who flips burgers for a living suddenly makes $20 an hour, all the other jobs have to increase payscales as well for a multitude of reasons. Suddenly he's back where he started, and we've inflated the economy.

We could go back and forth on this one all day I suppose. I don't think either one of us are going to convince the other that we're right.

If the Democrats were to put forward a cadidate that said:
1. Lower taxes.
2. Less spending.
3. Fix entitlement programs by means testing
4. Create systems that promote people leaving government dependence rather than reinforcing it

I would vote for him. However, I think we can both agree we'll never see it. In fact, I'm not all that against the government providing a basic health care package at a set price that every insurance company in the country MUST offer. I'm totally against the idea of forcing everyone to get it though.

 

[Jhhnn]

Rightwing economic policies specifically over the past 30 years have suppressed wages, concentrated wealth at the top, and chipped away at opportunity and the social safety net for everyone else. Your denial would be a lot more plausible if Republicans were not still actively doing this, let alone explicitly campaigning on it as they are.

Shush, you! It's the Obama recession, don'tcha know? And what we need to do now is force layoffs to create jobs! And give the Job Creators another tax cut, along with decreased regulation!

right now, according to Boehner, they're on strike, holding the economy hostage, so we have to give 'em what they want or they'll shoot the hostage!

http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/09/15/boehner-to-argue-g-o-p-case-in-jobs-speech/

Actually, they're riding the gravy train and a monumental wave of stupidity from their followers.

 

[Gonad the Barbarian]

If the Democrats were to put forward a cadidate that said:
1. Lower taxes.
2. Less spending.
3. Fix entitlement programs by means testing
4. Create systems that promote people leaving government dependence rather than reinforcing it

That's 75% Obama right there. Lowered payroll taxes. Proposed $3T in spending cuts. Proposed means testing SS. And he should at least get a few points on 4 for proposing a jobs bill to at least get some folks back to work. He aint perfect, but he's far "better" (centrist?) than most folk want to give him credit for.

And we could go back and forth all day, and you'll have to find someone else if you want to keep on. I'll just leave you with this:
http://www.truth-out.org/goodbye-all-reflections-gop-operative-who-left-cult/1314907779
Maybe you missed it the first time it was posted here, maybe you didn't, but it's worth a read.

 

[sarsipias1234]

This is how the poor stay poor...they make insane justifications.

Inflation has gone up tremendously over the last 30 years yet the average monthly salary has gone down $800 for a single male over that same time period.

Poor people make insane justifications because they have been treated insanely and given insane justifications as to why they are poor.

You sound like a rich person to talk this way. Most people make very little money.

Why shouldn't the poorer people take advantage in any way they can?

Our leaders have been taking advantage in any way they can for years which has left 50% of American people with less than 2.5% of the entire wealth of the country.

 

[werepossum]

Inflation has gone up tremendously over the last 30 years yet the average monthly salary has gone down $800 for a single male over that same time period.

Poor people make insane justifications because they have been treated insanely and given insane justifications as to why they are poor.

You sound like a rich person to talk this way. Most people make very little money.

Why shouldn't the poorer people take advantage in any way they can?

Our leaders have been taking advantage in any way they can for years which has left 50% of American people with less than 2.5% of the entire wealth of the country.

Buying an expensive television on a credit card is not poorer people taking advantage. It's poorer people inviting a credit card company to take advantage of them.

 

[sarsipias1234]

Yeah...plus even if you run a slight balance at times, that's not the end of the world.

I took down about $80k in CC debt with the last $40k of it being paid off in the last 12 months.

My debt was mostly due to going back to college at 30 and the other large chunk 'divorce' debt and not being able to qualify for loans due to my income prior to going in (I didn't work during it)...that was about 1 year at a state college.

I get a lot of free money moving cash through my cards now and hover at a $0 interest balance for the most part.

With a little over $100k available to me on credit lines, I am sure many would be in bad shape here.

You have a high income which is more than adequate to meet all of your needs as a human being.

Most people do not have such income as to meet all of their needs as a human being.

This is the great inequality that is required in a capitalistic society.

Read Why Socialism from Albert Einstein as he is much more articulate in what i'm trying to explain.

http://monthlyreview.org/2009/05/01/why-socialism

 

[sarsipias1234]

Buying an expensive television on a credit card is not poorer people taking advantage. It's poorer people inviting a credit card company to take advantage of them.

I disagree. A poor person stands to lose nothing if they default on a credit card as the banks cannot put people in prison for debt.

So why not max everything out and go crazy and then declare bankruptcy.

A lot of people do this in California including rich people.

This is exactly what our government has done: max everything out and go crazy and then go bankrupt.

So why shouldn't individuals do the same?

I wanted to add that default rates on CC are around 30%.

 

[werepossum]

I disagree. A poor person stands to lose nothing if they default on a credit card as the banks cannot put people in prison for debt.

So why not max everything out and go crazy and then declare bankruptcy.

A lot of people do this in California including rich people.

This is exactly what our government has done: max everything out and go crazy and then go bankrupt.

So why shouldn't individuals do the same?

I wanted to add that default rates on CC are around 30%.

One's honor and integrity are not exactly nothing.

 

[Fenixgoon]

You have a high income which is more than adequate to meet all of your needs as a human being.

Most people do not have such income as to meet all of their needs as a human being.

This is the great inequality that is required in a capitalistic society.

Read Why Socialism from Albert Einstein as he is much more articulate in what i'm trying to explain.

http://monthlyreview.org/2009/05/01/why-socialism

define needs. does someone need a big screen TV, xbox, or internet-capable phone?

basic needs would include food, shelter, and transportation, IMO. anything beyond that is luxury.