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CPUs limiting GPUs

A

annihilat0r

Junior Member
Okay this is my first post here and hopefully not the last. Hello to everyone.

I'm going to buy a computer in one week, and it's going to be high-end. I'm going to go with AMD. I'm sure all of you will say "wait until 23th July and buy Conroe" and I can't comply with that, as my holiday starts now and at the end of July I'll be going to an internship and won't be able to play. So I must buy it as fast as I can and play with it as much as I can !

Now I can't exactly tell you my budget because you're not going to be able to make calculations out of it because prices are so much different here.

What I'm basically going to ask is, how much does a CPU limit a GPU? I was actually planning to buy x2 3800+ with a pair of X1900XTs in Crossfire. But after reading http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=2747, I wondered if the card was too much for the CPU. Could a 3800 limit performance of Crossfire? By limiting what I mean is "one X1900XT's performance and two X1900XT in Crossfire performance being virtually the same"

- Would you recommend 3700+ or x2 3800+? Because the 3700 is actually slightly better performing than 3800 while it's 100 dollars cheaper. And if the 3800 would "limit" my X1900XTs, would a single core 3700+ be even more limiting?

- And which boards would you recommend for a Crossfire setup?

- THE IMPORTANT QUESTION: With the cost of a 3800+ and a pair of XT's would you be able to buy something else (right now) that would yield a better performance? Or more clearly, what GPU / CPU would YOU buy if you were handed the money for a 3800 and two XTs ?

- I don't know about overclocking much and I don't want to go for extra cooling devices. Without any appreciable risk, how much would be I able to overclock a 3800+? Would it be worth it?

- Do I really need to spend $200 for the case for such a system?

Thanks in advance
 
I'm not as free as I'd like to be to answer your post in full, but as for your last question, no. You don't need to buy a $200 case for your system, although you shouldn't shy away from buying a good power supply (which needn't be expensive).
 
Why not Intel? The 9XX series dual-core are very reasonable now.

Crossfire works very well on an Intel chipset board, and with the $$$ you save on the CPU, you can buy a nice board - like this one.. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16813121016

🙂

Especially the 930.. Good CPU for a great price. (Psst - there will be a price drop tonight)
AMD definately has better stock coolers - I use a Zalman, the stock fan gets VERY loud when under extended high utilization.

Either way, do your research and get a great power supply, I *hear* the X1900 Xfire cards may have issues with some power supplies..

(Damn - where did I read that? :confused😉
 
When you play at higher res, you are generally video card limited. If you play at low res, you are generally cpu limited (assuming you have similar levels of CPU/GPU equipment).
 
fortron 500w, seasonic s12 500w, or enermax liberty 500w are all good for your power supply needs. your cause can be $50 if you want it to be. i personally don't like it but the coolermaster centurion 5 (i think) is recommended a lot for cheap cases.

the CPU/GPU limiting factor really matters on the resolutions you play at. if you play at 1600x1200 resolution or less, a single x1900xt would be fine with your 3800x2 (assuming u get it). if you play at higher resolutions, buying 2 x1900xt's wouldn't be a bad idea, although the single card could put up to the challenge, especially if you turn down some of the graphics settings.

it also matters on what games you'll be playing. until you state what resolutions you'll be playing what games at, there really is no right answer.

as for the 3700+ vs the 3800x2, i would recommend getting a dual core over a single core CPU. especially with the prices less than $100 away from each other. it may be different where you are. what is the price difference between a 3700 and 3800x2 over there?
 
the best crossfire board right now would be the a8r32-mvp deluxe. u get asus reliability, every overclock option in the bios, great bios flashing software, excllent asus stability, and is quite mature now... i wouldn't buy any single core cpu right now so i'd either get the 3800, 4200, or 4400 dual core cpu's. a safe overclock for the 3800 would be something in the 2.2-2.4ghz range. and no you dont need any expensive case. actually you can get any case you want, but you'd be paying for quality, 120mm fans, and looks and brand name
 
Thanks a lot everyone;

SuperSix: Well, same priced Intels generally are worse than AMDs in benchmarks..
alimolem: The difference between 3700 and x2 3800 is $100 over here. But 3700 performs better overall, doesn't it? I intend to play CS: Source, Quake 4 & Doom 3, and I think mostly Oblivion. I won't be playing at resolutions higher than 1024, generally.

What would your pick be with the same cost?
 
How would a pair of 1800XTs and some higher CPU do? I think I can get a 4600 instead of a 3800 then.

4600+ and X1800XT Crossfire, or
3800+ and X1900XT Crossfire ?
 
just out of curiosity where are you as your profile says North Carolina.

also, what resolution are you going to play at and what game that needs 2xX1900xts?

to answer your question - "THE IMPORTANT QUESTION: With the cost of a 3800+ and a pair of XT's would you be able to buy something else (right now) that would yield a better performance? Or more clearly, what GPU / CPU would YOU buy if you were handed the money for a 3800 and two XTs ?"

i would buy the 3800 o/c it a bit to ~2.2-2.4GHz, nothing special and then go with a single x1900xt, again this is considering you are playing at 1680x1050 or lower. just go with 2GB of ram, pc3200 and don't worry too much about timings as they are not that important with x2. just get a decent brand value select setup (unless the better, higher ends rams are cheaper, which sometimes they are with sales)
 
oblivion if on high and on a pretty high res could call for two x1900's. the game kills all vid cards out right now
 
Ah I didn't edit my profile, it's North Carolina by default. I'm from Istanbul / Turkey, prices are a bit steeper here with a larger value added tax put on them.

I am going to play in 1024 or 1280 resolution. I'm gonna be playing Oblivion and CS: Source mostly, and of course those power hungry games like FEAR and Quake 4. I'd like to be able to turn AA on. Everyone sort of says "this is too much, (something lower) will do it." Well, the problem is that I WANT to spend that money. 😀 Plus, I'm not sure it's gonna do it anyway, check http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=2747&p=3 out. An Athlon FX 60 with a pair of X1900XT Crossfire averages 45fps . (the resolution is 1280 and the settings are high, not max; and AA is off) As anything I'm gonna buy will be lower than that, I see it's not gonna do the trick so easily, especially if I turn AA on.

So if some psychopath FORCED you to spend your money (amount of $= the cost of 3800+ and a pair of 1900XT's) on CPU + GPU what would you buy if you were in my situation? That's my question.

Thanks for your help!
 
In your scenario, I would take Crossfire X1900XTs and an Athlon 64 X2 3800+ over crossfire X1800XTs and an X2 4600+. The X2 4600+ is not that much faster than an X2 3800+, while the X1900s can be quite a bit faster than the X1800s in certain scenarios.
 
I agree with that but we should keep in mind the limiting factors I talked about. If you look at performance charts for 1800 / 1900XT there is a great difference but those charts are made using the best of the best processors (FX 60) so it's clear there won't be any CPU limit in GPU performance. But if I get a 3800 that's pretty much different from a FX 60 so it can limit performance and so the difference between 1800XT and 1900XT will not be that great.
 
Originally posted by: SuperSix
Why not Intel? The 9XX series dual-core are very reasonable now.

Crossfire works very well on an Intel chipset board, and with the $$$ you save on the CPU, you can buy a nice board - like this one.. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16813121016

🙂

Especially the 930.. Good CPU for a great price. (Psst - there will be a price drop tonight)
AMD definately has better stock coolers - I use a Zalman, the stock fan gets VERY loud when under extended high utilization.

Either way, do your research and get a great power supply, I *hear* the X1900 Xfire cards may have issues with some power supplies..

(Damn - where did I read that? :confused😉
Click to expand...

Pentium D 930 is a very good bang for the buck for under $200 nothing, i mean NOTHING even touches it. stock it only loses to the 3800+ in gaming performance, but the 930 is known for its overclocking potential at stock voltage(which makes it alot safer). Its also running on a 65nm process making run decently cool, not as cool as AMD's but still. You would also be ready for conroe but buying using a compatible mobo, and just sticking the 930 in until your ready to upgrade.
 
Originally posted by: annihilat0r
I agree with that but we should keep in mind the limiting factors I talked about. If you look at performance charts for 1800 / 1900XT there is a great difference but those charts are made using the best of the best processors (FX 60) so it's clear there won't be any CPU limit in GPU performance. But if I get a 3800 that's pretty much different from a FX 60 so it can limit performance and so the difference between 1800XT and 1900XT will not be that great.
Click to expand...

the 3800 can be o/ced to a respectable 2.2-2.4 pretty easy....
 
Originally posted by: Running
oblivion if on high and on a pretty high res could call for two x1900's. the game kills all vid cards out right now
Click to expand...

what is oblivion? is it a role playing game? why does it need so much gpu power? poor coding or tons of eye candy?
 
Originally posted by: TAGImperialMarch
If you're overclocking, 3800 X2 and X1900s.
If you aren't overclocking, 4400 X2, and X1900s if you can still get them, or 7900 GTs SLI.
Click to expand...

if a game will bring 2xx1900xts to its knees why would you suggest 2x7900gts?
 
Originally posted by: bob4432
Originally posted by: Running
oblivion if on high and on a pretty high res could call for two x1900's. the game kills all vid cards out right now
Click to expand...

what is oblivion? is it a role playing game? why does it need so much gpu power? poor coding or tons of eye candy?
Click to expand...
You really don't nkow what Oblivion is?
 
Originally posted by: Howard
Originally posted by: bob4432
Originally posted by: Running
oblivion if on high and on a pretty high res could call for two x1900's. the game kills all vid cards out right now
Click to expand...

what is oblivion? is it a role playing game? why does it need so much gpu power? poor coding or tons of eye candy?
Click to expand...
You really don't nkow what Oblivion is?
Click to expand...

no clue, i have always been a fligh sim or fps person since the playstation days - doom 🙂
 
Originally posted by: bob4432
Originally posted by: Howard
Originally posted by: bob4432
Originally posted by: Running
oblivion if on high and on a pretty high res could call for two x1900's. the game kills all vid cards out right now
Click to expand...

what is oblivion? is it a role playing game? why does it need so much gpu power? poor coding or tons of eye candy?
Click to expand...
You really don't nkow what Oblivion is?
Click to expand...

no clue, i have always been a fligh sim or fps person since the playstation days - doom 🙂
Click to expand...

Game of the Year IMO:
http://www.elderscrolls.com/games/oblivion_overview.htm
 
Originally posted by: MustISO
Originally posted by: bob4432
Originally posted by: Howard
Originally posted by: bob4432
Originally posted by: Running
oblivion if on high and on a pretty high res could call for two x1900's. the game kills all vid cards out right now
Click to expand...

what is oblivion? is it a role playing game? why does it need so much gpu power? poor coding or tons of eye candy?
Click to expand...
You really don't nkow what Oblivion is?
Click to expand...

no clue, i have always been a fligh sim or fps person since the playstation days - doom 🙂
Click to expand...

Game of the Year IMO:
http://www.elderscrolls.com/games/oblivion_overview.htm
Click to expand...



A game that has gameplay that is superior to its graphics. If the graphics are that good and the gameplay is better, you better bet that the game is fun.

http://media.pc.ign.com/media/702/702491/img_3442822.html


 
So what have you guys decided? 😀 How can I best spend this money? I want to spend it all. 😀

I think I have enough money to go 4200+ and two 1900XT's instead of 3800. I don't think 4200 will be limiting anything much, especially if I slightly overclock it.
 
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