Couple Questions... Temp and s754

[jolancer]

These are the parts.

GIGABYTE GA-K8NE
newegg.com_Gigabyte_GA-k8NE

Athlon 64 3700+ ClawHammer s754
newegg.com_3700

SCYTHE NINJA HSF
http://www.svc.com/scnj-1000.html
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First question, the motherboard manual says

"Because of CPU Limitations, if you want to install DDR400 memory modules in your system, please install either one double-sided or two single-sided DDR400 memory modules. The DDR400 speed will drop down to DDR333 if you install two double-sided or three single-sided DDR400 memory modules."

Those of you with s754 experience.... Is this Ram limitation specific to s754? or only specific CPUs? or only specific Motherboards?

Im asking because i dont yet have ram for this motherboard... i was only able to test the board out with DDR333 i have... But if that limitation affects my 3700, then i will need to watch out witch ram i get.

If thats the case.... how do i tell if the ram is Sinlge or Double-sided befor opening the retail packaging?
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My second question is: What do you guys think of these temps, do you think the bios is properly reading CPU temp? room temp is roughly ~65F ~70F

Are Gigabyte boards usually acurate at reading Temps?

with a normal 80mm Fan at 2000rpm on the Ninja... CPU temp = idle ~26*C , Load ~34*C

with Prime95 running Max heat for 1hr... i uncliped the fan from the Ninja while Prime95 was still running, and cpu temp rose up and almost froze at 50*C... but still rose very very slowly up to 51. at that point i clipped the fan back on and temp gradually dropped back to 34.

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o yea, in the BIOS, CPU fsb overclock option lists between 200 to ---> 450 something..... am i missing something here, isnt it impossible to overclock that high... so its kind of pointless to give you the option to even get near that fsb speed right?

do other motherboards allow you to select such a high fsb even though its impossible to run it that fast?

 

[Firsttime]

your links are broken, my 754 Sempron 2600+ runs at around 29*C with the fan at its lowest speed around 2200 RPMs I think, don't know if that helps any

 

[jolancer]

Thx for your input, but the more important question to me is the Ram compatibility.

Firsttime, if you could tell me... what speed and how many sticks of ram do you use? and are there chips on both sides of your ram or just single-sided?

 

[Bluegizzard]

My new Asus K8N-E has the same restrictions about the ram. Rather than spend a lot of time researching it, i decided that one stick of ram would work weather it was one or two sided. So i decided to get one stick of 1GB of ddr400 for 90 bucks or so instead of two 512s.

This isn't an answer but it may be a solution.

Bill

 

[jolancer]

Bluegizzard... in your manual... does it say something like... 'Due to CPU limitations' or 'Due to the motherboard limitations' or maybe 'Due to cpu socket limitations'

... becuase im trying to figure out if the limitations only applys to sertains CPU's... becuase the gigabyte manual says "Due to CPU limitations".

... and it would help out a lot if someone knows or has input about it, because i may be putting 2GBs into this board.

 

[Bluegizzard]

No mine has a one page chart, but it sends pretty much the same message. I was going to use two 512s but the chart said if you used two double sided DDR400 sticks it would reduce them to DDR330. No this one doesn't blame it on the CPU.

 

[Texun]

I had a K8NS and the manual said the same thing. Using 2x512's of doublesided PC3200 it would run at 166 speed in Auto. I manually turned it up to 200 and it worked fine but I never tried to go beyond that. As far as the temps... I have a Sempron 3400+ with a Zalman 7000 or whatever copper HS and the temps never went above 31 even with a Prime95 tourture test. Something's screwy with temp sensors anyway. The board didn't support CnQ, which I wanted because it sits as a file box 99% of the time and I didn't want to pull juice I didn't need, so I swapped the board for a Chinatech VNF3 and used the same hardaware and my temps are now in the mid 40's all the time.

Regarding the RAM, you may want to check out the memory configurator on Crucial's web site and see what they recommend, then get it where it's the cheapest. My logic tells me DS RAM has chips on both sides but I don't know how you would tell before buying it unless you got the part number from a site like Crucial or could find it in the description. I used the RAM that I had.

I can't tell a bit of difference in how the two boards operate once all set up an running at the correct speed, but I had a better overall experience with Gigabyte. It just went together easier like you would expect. The only complaint was the memory speed. Once I set it to manual it was fine. CnQ doesn't work on the VNF3 either, even though the BIOS supports it and the 3400+ is supposed to be able to do it. I may end up going back to the Gigabyte just so I can feel better about the finished project. As far as all the talk about 754 being a dead end board... it isn't a S939 but there will be no hint of budget performance with the 754 unless you are a uber tuner or like to swap CPU's a lot. I also have one a S939 with a 3800 Newcastle and they both feel the same under normal use.

 

[jolancer]

Thx Texun for your input... a few questions for you though..

How did you O/C the ram on your gigabyte board? these are the only options i see on my K8NE...
-CPU Frequency
-CPU Spread Spectrum
-K8 CPU Clock Ratio
-Robust Graphics Booster
-then a bunch of diff voltage options for cpu, PCIE, DDR, HT-Link

I dont think i have a o/c option for mem? an i correct?

and if so, is it possible for a mem o/c option to be added threw a Bios Update?
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Does your VNF3 board also downclock the ram to 333 if you use 2 double sided mem sticks with it?
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conserning your problem with CnQ.... did you go threw the steps on Gigabyts website to enable it?

I havent tryed it on my board yet because i only had it setup the otherday on the bench for testing, and CnQ would be needed on my system but..... gigbyte stated to Update the Bios, then DL the CnQ drivers, then Turn it on via Windows PowerManagment settings.
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And so far what iv seen when i tested it, my K8NE works great as you stated with your K8NS.... only thing im not able to test is the PCIE slot untill my GFX card arrives here... but yea my only consern is the Double-sided memory stick issue.... but so far these replys seem to indicate thats how every 754 board is.... I was planing on maybe putting 2GBs in, but if i cant o/c it to the mems stock 400speed, i may just stick with 1GB.

Thanks again for your input

 

[Ike0069]

All S754 boards have issues with running 2 double sided sticks, but some are better at workarounds than others.

For instance, some will run fine at DDR400 if you run at 2T, while others will only run at DDR333 max. And a few will not even boot with 2 double sided sticks installed.

Best thing to do is decide on a MB, then research that particular model on this subject. But just realize that this can be kind of like OC'ing. Even though one person can run at DDR400, you might no have the same luck even with the exact same hardware.

In short, your best bet is to get a 1GB stick of RAM, or go S939.

 

[Einy0]

I set up 4 s754 systems. A 3400+, 2x 3200+ and a 3000+ all older ones now. Each with 1GB 2x512MB DS Dimms and set them to DDR400 both on a ASUS K8V Deluxe MBs one was a K8V-SE Deluxe. Mostly I use the Corsair and Kingston RAM. Haven't had anyone complain about any of those systems yet. 34C is a good temp for s754 A64s not sure about the 3700+ but based on my experiences with the previously mentioned systems it would be possible. I used mostly stock HSFs and cheap Thermaltake HSFs and usually get temps between 32 and 42C. My 3500+ runs full load 42C with stock HSF.

 

[jolancer]

Thx, most of my questions have been answered...

Now i just need to know how 'Texun' o/c'ed his ram to DDR400.... because i looked at his mobo manual on the gigabyte website and his board has less o/c options then mine does... Is there a utility or something from AMD you can download to change the divider of the built in mem controller to the cpu?

Advice on this last question would be greatly appreciated

 

[Texun]

Originally posted by: jolancer
Thx Texun for your input... a few questions for you though..

How did you O/C the ram on your gigabyte board? these are the only options i see on my K8NE...
-CPU Frequency
-CPU Spread Spectrum
-K8 CPU Clock Ratio
-Robust Graphics Booster
-then a bunch of diff voltage options for cpu, PCIE, DDR, HT-Link

I dont think i have a o/c option for mem? an i correct?

and if so, is it possible for a mem o/c option to be added threw a Bios Update?
--------------------------------------------

Does your VNF3 board also downclock the ram to 333 if you use 2 double sided mem sticks with it?
---------------------------------------------

conserning your problem with CnQ.... did you go threw the steps on Gigabyts website to enable it?

I havent tryed it on my board yet because i only had it setup the otherday on the bench for testing, and CnQ would be needed on my system but..... gigbyte stated to Update the Bios, then DL the CnQ drivers, then Turn it on via Windows PowerManagment settings.
----------------------------------------------

And so far what iv seen when i tested it, my K8NE works great as you stated with your K8NS.... only thing im not able to test is the PCIE slot untill my GFX card arrives here... but yea my only consern is the Double-sided memory stick issue.... but so far these replys seem to indicate thats how every 754 board is.... I was planing on maybe putting 2GBs in, but if i cant o/c it to the mems stock 400speed, i may just stick with 1GB.

Thanks again for your input

To be clear, it wasn't 400 but I did raise it from 166 to 200 which is where the same memory and CPU run with the Chinatech.

It defaulted to 166 in Auto on the K8NS but there was a manual setting that I used. I'm using the Chinatech now so I am not able to see the path to the setting. One thing I did do was flash it to the newest BIOS on the Gigabyte since it would not recognize the Sempron, but I don't remember if the option was there before the flash. The boot screen and CPU-Z both showed 166 and then 200 after the change.

I'm really not looking forward to swapping boards again but I don't have a warm-fuzzy feel for the Chinatech, although it does run at 200 in Auto. I guess it could be the fact that I didn't gain a single thing with CnQ by swapping boards and I've read several threads since then about failing USB ports on the Chinatech. I have both and need to send one back so I guess I just need to pull it down and get it done. RMA time for the Chinatech I guess.

Regarding the CnQ question; I followed the instructions to the letter and couldn't get it to work. If I remember correctly, the Gigabyte solution to CnQ directed me to the AMD page where I DL'd the file. I thought it would be a waste of time since I've never had to DL any other files with XP to get CnQ to work... I was right.

 

[jolancer]

Ok, Thank you a lot for the info....

When i have the system setup ill take another look around the Bios but i think i checked pritty much everything.... however if there is no memory setting in there, it might appear as you say after i Flash the Bios to the latest version... I checked there Bios versions but did not yet wont to Flash it... mine is like the 2nd or 3rd to the last Bios update released.

sorry i cant help with the CnQ problem, iv never used it.... but you know you may wont to post your problem over on AMD's Support Forum, if you havnt already.... thy will most likely have a strait up answer to your problem i imagine. LINK --> http://forums.amd.com/

 

[Texun]

Originally posted by: jolancer
Ok, Thank you a lot for the info....

When i have the system setup ill take another look around the Bios but i think i checked pritty much everything.... however if there is no memory setting in there, it might appear as you say after i Flash the Bios to the latest version... I checked there Bios versions but did not yet wont to Flash it... mine is like the 2nd or 3rd to the last Bios update released.

sorry i cant help with the CnQ problem, iv never used it.... but you know you may wont to post your problem over on AMD's Support Forum, if you havnt already.... thy will most likely have a strait up answer to your problem i imagine. LINK --> http://forums.amd.com/

I'm back onthe K8NS again. I pulled the Chinatech and when I installed this one again I checked the BIOS and the memory is under "Frequency\Voltage" on the left side of the menu. From there I changed it to "Manual" instead of "Auto." Not sure if your BIOS has that but the F18 version I have does. It boots to 200 where it used to boot at 166.

I'm not positive but I think the CnQ problem may be related to the double sided memory I am using. I alredy had this memory and have no plans to invest more $$ in memory right now. I can live without the CnQ. Good luck with your memory.

 

[jolancer]

THx..

I do have the Frequency/Voltage options, its jut there are not Memory settings inside...

But from what i can see, yours probably didnt originally have Memory settings either(maybe) , because the manuel at gigabyte.com shows no memory settings for either of our boards... Hopefully this is the case and that the mem option will be added to mine once i Update the Bios.

Thx again.

 

[Texun]

Originally posted by: jolancer
THx..

I do have the Frequency/Voltage options, its jut there are not Memory settings inside...

But from what i can see, yours probably didnt originally have Memory settings either(maybe) , because the manuel at gigabyte.com shows no memory settings for either of our boards... Hopefully this is the case and that the mem option will be added to mine once i Update the Bios.

Thx again.

Yup. I checked my book and I see the Freq\Voltage but nothing in there points to tweaking the memory. You may be good to go once you flash it.

If you have a floppy and Q-Flash in the BIOS it's a snap. DL the latest BIOS to a floppy, reboot, enter Q-Flash at when you see the boot screen. It's as painless as checking email. Good luck.

 

[jolancer]

Update:

I got it setup again and tested... I updated the Bios and it did add Manual Ram setting, along with other stuff too.

 

[Texun]

Originally posted by: jolancer
Update:

I got it setup again and tested... I updated the Bios and it did add Manual Ram setting, along with other stuff too.

:thumbsup: :thumbsup: