Counter-Strike Source Update is LIVE

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Ika

Lifer
Mar 22, 2006
14,264
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FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU

I hated the update when it went to Beta - it changed all the movement dynamics, recoils, strafing speed, movement speed and all other kinds of shit. I was hoping they wouldn't force the regular Source to use it. I guess I'll be quitting CS permanently now.
 

swanysto

Golden Member
May 8, 2005
1,949
9
81
FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU

I hated the update when it went to Beta - it changed all the movement dynamics, recoils, strafing speed, movement speed and all other kinds of shit. I was hoping they wouldn't force the regular Source to use it. I guess I'll be quitting CS permanently now.

I am not sure what you are talking about, none of those things changed at all. The only thing that changed is when you run into another player it pushes you like when you hit a barrel.

And I am not sure why you guys are having so many problems, I have been playing it flawlessly. I am not a fan of the achievements cause I don't care about them, but I do like the fact that it keeps track of your stats. Shows you favorite guns and all that jazz. However, like my previous post said, bring out the hackers who use game stats to determine their place in life.
 

Ika

Lifer
Mar 22, 2006
14,264
3
81
I am not sure what you are talking about, none of those things changed at all. The only thing that changed is when you run into another player it pushes you like when you hit a barrel.

And I am not sure why you guys are having so many problems, I have been playing it flawlessly. I am not a fan of the achievements cause I don't care about them, but I do like the fact that it keeps track of your stats. Shows you favorite guns and all that jazz. However, like my previous post said, bring out the hackers who use game stats to determine their place in life.

This update updates the engine with the Orange Box engine, right? Trust me, when you've played the game competitively for four years you become very keen to whenever Valve makes any change, however minute, to the game. The very first day the beta came out I was horrified at the changes. i couldn't move properly or aim properly anymore, grenade dynamics were all kinds of messed up, achievements froze my comp for like two seconds while it "loaded" the achievement or something... it was all kinds of bad. i assume the update is better than the beta was but I don't expect very much.
 

stag3

Diamond Member
Feb 7, 2005
3,623
0
76
only hope for source is cs pro mod
other than that it's still 1.6 for me
 

Nizbot

Senior member
Oct 13, 2004
765
1
81
Game is on sale right now on Steam for $6.80 (66% off). Think I'm gonna finally pick this up when I get home.
 

zCypher

Diamond Member
Aug 18, 2002
6,115
171
116
What's the difference between 1.6 and CSS if you're just playing Gungame deathmatch?
Or is the non updated CSS considered to be 1.6? Sorry, I'm not much of a gamer so that might be a really dumb question.

I enjoyed some good CSS gungames before the update. Haven't been able to play since the update, none of the servers worked properly and none of my favorite servers worked. Will have to try again and see.
 

0roo0roo

No Lifer
Sep 21, 2002
64,795
84
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What's the difference between 1.6 and CSS if you're just playing Gungame deathmatch?
Or is the non updated CSS considered to be 1.6? Sorry, I'm not much of a gamer so that might be a really dumb question.

I enjoyed some good CSS gungames before the update. Haven't been able to play since the update, none of the servers worked properly and none of my favorite servers worked. Will have to try again and see.

source has always had a different feel compared to 1.6
this is just the same source on a newer revision of the source engine.

This update updates the engine with the Orange Box engine, right? Trust me, when you've played the game competitively for four years you become very keen to whenever Valve makes any change, however minute, to the game. The very first day the beta came out I was horrified at the changes. i couldn't move properly or aim properly anymore, grenade dynamics were all kinds of messed up, achievements froze my comp for like two seconds while it "loaded" the achievement or something... it was all kinds of bad. i assume the update is better than the beta was but I don't expect very much.

maybe someone can find out which version of the source engine they are using. theres the tf2 ver, the left 4 dead ones.. bleh
i saw no freezing on achievements. my computer isn't that fast.
 

NinjaCat

Member
Jul 19, 2009
86
0
66
I don't like this update at all my fps has been cut in half and it also lags when people are near me, only thing i like is that it's easier to hit people with the scout...I had 130-150 fps before, it dropped all the way dawn to 50-70. Also some of my friends games are now unplayable due to graphic problems.
 

0roo0roo

No Lifer
Sep 21, 2002
64,795
84
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how would your fps be cut in half? you sure your graphics settings are at the same level they were before? you weren't doing some crazy dx7 sh*t were you? i'm getting very high fps:p
 

Ika

Lifer
Mar 22, 2006
14,264
3
81
how would your fps be cut in half? you sure your graphics settings are at the same level they were before? you weren't doing some crazy dx7 sh*t were you? i'm getting very high fps:p

when the beta came out a lot of people complained about increased hardware requirements/decreased FPS. A side effect of the engine update, and another reason why i think Valve is fucking stupid when they pushed this update out. They want to market CS:S to casual gamers? Too fucking late, CS:S really only had the pro community and the mod community going for it, and they maimed both of thtem with this update.
 

0roo0roo

No Lifer
Sep 21, 2002
64,795
84
91
when the beta came out a lot of people complained about increased hardware requirements/decreased FPS. A side effect of the engine update, and another reason why i think Valve is fucking stupid when they pushed this update out. They want to market CS:S to casual gamers? Too fucking late, CS:S really only had the pro community and the mod community going for it, and they maimed both of thtem with this update.

bullsh*t they had to use the same engine for the mac as the pc so they could run on the same servers. if your hardware is a decade old you have other problems. the only people that had their frame rates raped have systems so old they should stop getting support, its 6 years after the fact and now users are getting new content and support. any whiners need to be disregarded by now, esp when they are just using the tf2 engine which is also old. as games go cs:s is light weight, and its still very light weight on system resources, i ran it last night and mulititasked out plenty of times and it was speedy as before.
 

Ika

Lifer
Mar 22, 2006
14,264
3
81
bullsh*t they had to use the same engine for the mac as the pc so they could run on the same servers. if your hardware is a decade old you have other problems. the only people that had their frame rates raped have systems so old they should stop getting support, its 6 years after the fact and now users are getting new content and support. any whiners need to be disregarded by now, esp when they are just using the tf2 engine which is also old. as games go cs:s is light weight, and its still very light weight on system resources, i ran it last night and mulititasked out plenty of times and it was speedy as before.

A modded TF2 server with 32 players lagged me down to 32 fps when I was running my 8800GTS 320mb and E6420 @ 3.2ghz, with 4 gigs of ram in Vista x64. This was somewhere around a year or two ago.

These games are six years old, and they absolutely positively do not run on six-year-old hardware. Personally I don't really care, as my hardware will run it fine as it is, but a lot of people had older comps doing just fine in CS:S until they updated it. This is by no means a major reason why I don't like the update, but it contributes.
 

0roo0roo

No Lifer
Sep 21, 2002
64,795
84
91
A modded TF2 server with 32 players lagged me down to 32 fps when I was running my 8800GTS 320mb and E6420 @ 3.2ghz, with 4 gigs of ram in Vista x64. This was somewhere around a year or two ago.

These games are six years old, and they absolutely positively do not run on six-year-old hardware. Personally I don't really care, as my hardware will run it fine as it is, but a lot of people had older comps doing just fine in CS:S until they updated it. This is by no means a major reason why I don't like the update, but it contributes.

wait you are running a server? of course it bogs down if you are running a server.
cs source ran fine on any dual core of recent make let alone any video card within the last couple years. team fortress is not comparable to cs source, its just way way more hardware intensive and always has been, this update in no way even approaches the level of cpu/gpu usage of tf2 which felt like it hit systems at least twice as hard at the very least.. its barely noticeable vs the pre-update cs:s. if you feel a performance hit with an 8800gts running cs source somethings seriously wrong with your system.

"just fine" before updating wasn't just fine at all. i remember running cs source with a 6600gt back in the day, while it ran, i wouldn't claim it ran just fine, it was barely acceptable. the only people that could possibly affected by this update are the folks who had to nerf down their settings to dx7 or whatever to get playable frame rates. its time to ditch those folks. the hdr was messed up in cs source for so long, now its finally better, finally multithread support is added. theres no reason for a couple laggards to hold the rest of us back. if your system really is that old, you should run 1.6. any recent systems igp can run cs source, i mean seriously, macs can run this stuff now. so its just getting silly to complain. if you can't even afford the 50 dollars for a modern video card that can run this...forget gaming.
 
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Ben90

Platinum Member
Jun 14, 2009
2,866
3
0
I concur with Aflac. I have been playing competitively for a while, and a lot of shit is messed up now. My main problem is the FPS drops. It might not be noticable to the average player, but I bought a CRT specifically to pump out insane refresh rates at low resolutions I get random spikes down in the 30s and just bad performance in general.
 

0roo0roo

No Lifer
Sep 21, 2002
64,795
84
91
i'm going to have to see benchmark articles because for sometime now cs has been over 100fps on even lousy cards. i've gone from 100+ fps always to over 100fps always:p
 

nerp

Diamond Member
Dec 31, 2005
9,865
105
106
when the beta came out a lot of people complained about increased hardware requirements/decreased FPS. A side effect of the engine update, and another reason why i think Valve is fucking stupid when they pushed this update out. They want to market CS:S to casual gamers? Too fucking late, CS:S really only had the pro community and the mod community going for it, and they maimed both of thtem with this update.

Hah. People have said this EXACT crap since 2004 with every update Valve ever pushed out. Remember the new T and CT models? Remember when they messed with the AWP recoil? Eventually people get used to the changes, the mod writers fix their code and life goes on with this game.
 

Fallen Kell

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
6,216
539
126
Indeed, they are, apparently enough so that Valve thought it would be nice to take the time to update it. I for one honestly don't understand the "fun" there could possibly be behind watching someone else playing while waiting until the next round starts. If the spawning system was different I might try it again, but then if the spawning system would be different it wouldn't be Counter-Strike anymore, right? It'd turn C-S into "another" Day of Defeat or Team Fortress. So that means it won't ever happen, which in turns means I will never bother with it, it's just boring.

ummm.... don't die? Its a pretty simple way to avoid the whole "I don't like watching someone else play" problem you are having. If you didn't die, then you would be playing and not watching.
 

Ben90

Platinum Member
Jun 14, 2009
2,866
3
0
Hah. People have said this EXACT crap since 2004 with every update Valve ever pushed out. Remember the new T and CT models? Remember when they messed with the AWP recoil? Eventually people get used to the changes, the mod writers fix their code and life goes on with this game.
The difference is while the past updates may have been confined to a few niche setups, or lowered performance overall by like 5%, this new update is a pile of shit for at least half of people.

I'm not one of the people that bitch about every little change to the game, because I love to see changes. Even though I'm a competitive gamer, I welcomed dynamic pricing for public servers because I believed it would have balanced the game out more for public players.

There are a few things about this update that I do absolutely love. Bringing back the awp scoping speed of 1.6 is very nice, and the new OJ Box flashlight is the shiz. Bunnyhopping is absolutely insane now, although most people would consider that a bug. While I'm impartial about the achievements, I think they would be a nice touch for the casual player, and they arn't really that obscure as to hinder gameplay.

On the flip side to that we have the game breaking bugs: Invisible players, wrong team player models, and inability to alt tab (only for a few). My biggest complaint about the update is all in all performance issues, where things arn't just a 5% drop in fps. To see where I'm coming from here are my specs:

Core i7 920@ 4ghz HT Off
3x2GB DDR3 @ 1200mhz@6s
HD 4890
WD Black 640

Now refer to the following graphs:
55977571.png

On the first graph we have unrestricted FPS
On the second graph we have fps_max 121 set
On the third graph we are using default settings of fps_max 300

To be honest, none of these look bad from your point of view, but unfortunately they are not as fine grained as I would like because ATT does not refresh faster than around 40ms.
All three of these were taken just sitting in T Spawn, not moving the mouse, not hitting any buttons on the keyboard, not clicking, no other players on the server, nothing entered in console....Just sitting in spawn on an empty server basically AFK.

The first graph basically shows the theoretical maximum framerate of the new engine on my setup. It looks great, but you can't see the whole story, ATT misses basically all of the drops due to not having a fine enough resolution. The actual minimum in this ~10 second test was 43, with it dropping under 100 multiple times per second via the in game fps counter (which I unfortunately cannot record).

The second graph shows my preferred settings of fps_max 121, matching the refresh rate of my monitor for more consistency. This is where things start to look wrong on the graph. The average framerate looks to be around 100 now with a minimum of 73. Actual gameplay performance between fps_max 121 and fps_max 0 remain the exact same. This reveals the engine is thrashing all around being extremely inconsistent. One frame will be computed in less than a thousandth of a second, and the next will take 50ms. When the maximum framerate is lowered, minimums start making more of an impact on the graph.

I cannot explain exactly what is happening, but something is not right. During actual gameplay the game will just randomly start to stutter horribly for a few seconds, then resume micro stuttering.