Could the Third Time Be the Charm on Impeachment?

[Muse]

Double negatives make me sad.

Yeah, I pondered that but decided it made enough sense at the time. I don't do that lot. Some subcultures are loaded with double negatives. In fact, I think, Spanish considers them appropriate, for instance, no hay nada.

 

[brycejones]

Between the gerrymandering and Republican solidarity, I think the Senate is going to be rough to get to 51, much less the 60 vote threshold.

Senators are elected by statewide votes.

 

[akenbennu]

Senators are elected by statewide votes.

Yep, and the math is bad for Dems this cycle.

 

[Greenman]

The overwhelming majority of voters want tighter gun control laws yet here we are.

The overwhelming majority of voters want higher taxes on the rich yet here we are.

Democrats want these things yet nothing happens.

If those things don't happen it's because there isn't an overwhelming majority that want them. If the democrats had overwhelming numbers, they would have the white house, the house, and the senate. They have none of those. Not one. The reason for that is that they don't win elections. That's not Trumps fault, it's not the republicans fault, it's the democrats fault.

 

[MtnMan]

Between the gerrymandering and Republican solidarity, I think the Senate is going to be rough to get to 51, much less the 60 vote threshold.

A very basic civics crash course, perhaps you slept through the class, nor even paid attention during previous elections.

Senate races are state wide, and as such cannot be gerrymandered.

And even in red states, people that have lost their health care, SNAP benefits, jobs, farms, homes, and after the hurricane, wildfires, tornados, and a call to FEMA is met with a recording "the number you are calling is no longer in service" they will remember what republicans have done. Voters clearly have the attention span of a goldfish, but these facts will be within their 3-second memory retention period, simply because it is their day-to-day reality.

 

[Pens1566]

He did have to appear and sit through a (for him) grueling trial in NY where he was convicted. He may have to face stuff like this in the future. RESIST, we must RESIST. How? Every way we can. It makes him stronger? More popular? WTF is that? RESIST!

That's the process, not a consequence.

Reminder, nothing came of that case. Zip. Zilch. Nada.

 

[BonzaiDuck]

I just think it's troubling -- horrifying -- that the chances of a successful impeachment removal are questionable at best.

In this country, with the promises we'd been sold since grammar school, we should be able to get rid of a dangerous person like Trump by means other than a 2028 election.

 

[BonzaiDuck]

That's the process, not a consequence.

Reminder, nothing came of that case. Zip. Zilch. Nada.

Judicial Notice is something. Without material penalty, the convictions provided judicial notice.

 

[Pens1566]

Judicial Notice is something. Without material penalty, the convictions provided judicial notice.

Well, it sure did rein him in ...

 

[manly]

Will you stop fucking gaslighting me already? What's your trip?

I said I didn't know what would happen but that Donald has promised lots of stuff that never happened. I didn't say "What me worry." I'm not saying that now. I'm saying we don't know what's coming but we already see a shitload of things he can be impeached for. Not impeaching the most impeachable POTUS ever (if it can be done, and even if it can't) is absurd and a lost opportunity.

Nobody is gaslighting you, and it's nothing personal. It was pretty clear what you said in November, as several of us explained that the new Trump admin was ready and willing to do a lot of harmful shit. Just because it's not possible to insta- deport 10M people doesn't mean they wouldn't do illegal and immoral things.

Look, we have similar politics but you react really forcefully when people disagree with you. Like folks in this thread explained why a third impeachment isn't a good idea politically and you snap called that bullshit, then accused Pens1566 of being a closet Republican. You do you, but this isn't normal behavior even for spirited discourse.

It's not that we disagree on what DJT deserves; it's that we disagree on what the path forward needs to be.

Between the gerrymandering and Republican solidarity, I think the Senate is going to be rough to get to 51, much less the 60 vote threshold.

It's actually 2/3 to convict, an almost* impossibly high bar. Even if Dems had 51 Senators, they'd need to peel off another 16 Repugs! In the current polarized environment, you can't really do this through persuasion; you'd need the GOP to themselves decide to get rid of Trump.

* Arguably conviction could have been done right after J6, but Moscow Mitch was the linchpin. Once he caved, there was no chance.

Look at the criminal justice system as an example. There's a reason why DAs go to trial if they believe they have a strong chance of conviction; they don't press charges just because "it's the right thing to do." The extreme example of this is Japan, where conviction rates are in the high 90s IIRC (which means they are cherry-picking only the guaranteed wins).

 

[fskimospy]

Yes he got more votes than Kamala but he did not get the majority of votes, which is what Greenie keeps saying. Funny how he never once brought up the popular vote from 2016 to 2020, now it's incredibly important to him. I wonder why.

This is not true, he brought up the popular vote many times to say that it didn’t matter.

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[BonzaiDuck]

This is not true, he brought up the popular vote many times to say that it didn’t matter.

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OK -- you could say he "didn't get a majority of the votes", understanding that about 40% of eligible and registered voters did not vote. But the point spread over Harris was about 2 million votes. That's no mandate. You would call it a slim margin.

 

[Muse]

That's the process, not a consequence.

Reminder, nothing came of that case. Zip. Zilch. Nada.

Except that you see everywhere to this day him being labeled a felon. That really is something.

 

[WilliamM2]

OK -- you could say he "didn't get a majority of the votes", understanding that about 40% of eligible and registered voters did not vote. But the point spread over Harris was about 2 million votes. That's no mandate. You would call it a slim margin.

4th smallest victory in history. But MAGA calls it a landslide.

 

[Muse]

4th smallest victory in history. But MAGA calls it a landslide.

MAGA or anyone feeding them or stroking their belly figures that a big portion of the base is very low information with no proclivities to change that. Tell them what you want them to believe and figure they'll take it as gospel. Trump does that all the time regardless of the facts.

 

[fskimospy]

OK -- you could say he "didn't get a majority of the votes", understanding that about 40% of eligible and registered voters did not vote. But the point spread over Harris was about 2 million votes. That's no mandate. You would call it a slim margin.

My point is he said the popular vote was irrelevant in the past but cites it now.

 

[BonzaiDuck]

My point is he said the popular vote was irrelevant in the past but cites it now.

I see more clearly now.

Enough news exposure on any given day, and I may start wondering if I can endure more of this.

I was speaking with my congressman at a Saturday neighborhood fundraiser.

I told him I and friends agreed we wanted the government all restored to what it was before February. He responded suggesting that we "build back better." I can agree to that, but the restoration is going to have a significant cost. Somebody must've put the personnel data on a thumb drive, or the records are still maintained -- but who can trust the Trump appointees? A succeeding administration might want to contact people who were fired and offer them a chance to return or apply for posted positions.

But the "plan" of the democratic legislators is to win in 2026. And even then, people here mention the simple fact that an insufficient majority in both houses will not result in a successful impeachment.

I can't think about it any more today. I need some escape. something besides the news. I'm really effing distressed.

dinner time . . .

 

[Pens1566]

Except that you see everywhere to this day him being labeled a felon. That really is something.

And what benefit (to us) or consequence (to him) has that conferred? Concrete examples please, not feels/vibes ...

 

[cytg111]

Fuck Elon Musk for pushing that turd over the finish line. Anyway, cool story Obama, I have a feeling strong words are not gonna cut it.

 

[BonzaiDuck]

FACTS AND REALITY

LA TIMES today published Trump's repetitive nonsense about votes in LA (or CA) being phonied-up and elections rigged. They cited about 10 different reasons as to why his palaver cannot be true.

But I can cite hundreds or thousands of facts proving that Trump is a criminal. His supporters can talk about Impeachment acquittals, or the "meaningless nature" of the 34 convictions in New York. I'll cite the acquittal of the parties guilty in the Emmett Till murder -- just one example -- as to how judicial notice can evade reality.

I'm ashamed I have to share the same streets and sidewalks with delusional MAGA. It ruins my day; it ruins my grocery shopping.

 

[ivwshane]

Fuck Elon Musk for pushing that turd over the finish line. Anyway, cool story Obama, I have a feeling strong words are not gonna cut it.

Him and holder have been working on de-gerrymandering districts for a while now with some success. He’s not all talk.

 

[Muse]

And what benefit (to us) or consequence (to him) has that conferred? Concrete examples please, not feels/vibes ...

This is not feels/vibes:

Concrete example number one: I am reminded daily that djt is a felon.
No. 2: Millions of other people are reminded daily.
It keeps us aware that this guy is a convicted criminal.
You think this is inconsequential? Evidently. In the info wars it's not. Every time it's publicly noted that DJT's a very untrustworthy person is a win for his opposition. It gladdens me when I encounter that in MSM, and I do all the time. The fact that his allegations of losing the 2020 election are false is still heard in MSM. This helps. I don't understand your perspective, it's anathema to me.

 

[Muse]

FACTS AND REALITY

LA TIMES today published Trump's repetitive nonsense about votes in LA (or CA) being phonied-up and elections rigged. They cited about 10 different reasons as to why his palaver cannot be true.

But I can cite hundreds or thousands of facts proving that Trump is a criminal. His supporters can talk about Impeachment acquittals, or the "meaningless nature" of the 34 convictions in New York. I'll cite the acquittal of the parties guilty in the Emmett Till murder -- just one example -- as to how judicial notice can evade reality.

I'm ashamed I have to share the same streets and sidewalks with delusional MAGA. It ruins my day; it ruins my grocery shopping.

One benefit of living where I do (Berkeley, CA) is that I seldom get the idea that I am in the company of MAGA or their ilk. It doesn't help with the anxiety of living in a nation filled with 10s of millions of MAGA morons. But I don't have to deal with that of encountering them in my day to day life. My contempt for Donald Trump is never ending.

 

[Pens1566]

This is not feels/vibes:

Concrete example number one: I am reminded daily that djt is a felon.
No. 2: Millions of other people are reminded daily.
It keeps us aware that this guy is a convicted criminal.
You think this is inconsequential? Evidently. In the info wars it's not. Every time it's publicly noted that DJT's a very untrustworthy person is a win for his opposition. It gladdens me when I encounter that in MSM, and I do all the time. The fact that his allegations of losing the 2020 election are false is still heard in MSM. This helps. I don't understand your perspective, it's anathema to me.

And again, none of that matters. It was all known before the election, yet he still won. He increased his total vote and voter share across all major demographics. There is/was no negative impact from it. Your "info wars" win is meaningless. Great moral victory though. As would be a 3rd impeachment in the house.

 

[Muse]

And again, none of that matters. It was all known before the election, yet he still won. He increased his total vote and voter share across all major demographics. There is/was no negative impact from it. Your "info wars" win is meaningless.

Take off the fucking blinders, moron: