"Mandatory training", yea, OK, maybe a cop should have "mandatory training" not pull out his gun and start pumping shots at someone who has shown zero aggressiveness and was simply trying to comply with the cop's request, apparently that's the way most everyone else feels as well since the cop was quickly fired and charged with felony assault.
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Cop shoots guy for pulling out his driver's liscence.
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"Mandatory training", yea, OK, maybe a cop should have "mandatory training" not pull out his gun and start pumping shots at someone who has shown zero aggressiveness and was simply trying to comply with the cop's request, apparently that's the way most everyone else feels as well since the cop was quickly fired and charged with felony assault.
Carson Dyle
Diamond Member
Did anyone see for certain how many shots the cop fired? I only hear three shots in the video, but it appears as though there may be an audio glitch and the first two could have been fired in rapid succession. It kind of looks like there may be two muzzle blasts.
squarecut1
Platinum Member
There is a basic, deeper issue here. This has been highlighted in The Wire as well (an excellent show, coming from someone who doesn't like TV shows).
The cops now have the mentality that they rule over the people, instead of seeing their jobs as to serve and protect the people. They see people as subjects. It is a mindset that has become more prevalent as our society has become more and more authoritarian. No doubt our imperial adventures oversees, occupation of foreign lands and bossing around other hapless people, has contributed to this.
The cops now have the mentality that they rule over the people, instead of seeing their jobs as to serve and protect the people. They see people as subjects. It is a mindset that has become more prevalent as our society has become more and more authoritarian. No doubt our imperial adventures oversees, occupation of foreign lands and bossing around other hapless people, has contributed to this.
Well that "mentality" didn't work out so well for this cop, his life is basically ruined, completely. He went from an employed LEO to a soon-to-be convict and rightfully so.
Uh, they're not mutually exclusive, and no one is defending what the officer did here as ok, and it's not the normal thing that happens on traffic stops.
Is there any reason not to do what we're saying around police, in order to increase the safety of everyone and reduce the chances of the police doing a bad shoot?
No and you've raised a good, valid point. Lets just hope that some sort of psychological screening could be performed before anyone is allowed to be an armed LEO because this kind of shit just should not happen..
Did I say it was mutually exclusive? I am simply pointing out that there are lots of advise surrounding how one should act around cops but nothing on the other end. Just trying to cover both bases.
SlitheryDee
Lifer
There's one thing that a police officer should know very well though. Shouting orders at completely untrained civilians will almost invariably cause them to comply in a very quick, panicky kind of way. That HAS to be taken into account by the officer. The police officer supposedly has training that would help him make good decisions in such situations, but you can't count on any normal person to react in a slow, controlled manner when you're screaming at him. You just can't. If that's not part of a police officer's training then it should be.
Will it help if I type slowly that we're not defending what the officer did?
If this guy had done what we say, he likely would not have got shot. That doesn't mean we're saying the shooting is the victim's fault.
If the light turns green, should you walk without looking at traffic?
You have the right of way. If a car is not following the law and will hit you, they're in the wrong. So we're wrong to say it's a good idea to look just in case, right?
Psychological screening can only catch some of the people who might do bad.
One issue is the training - some sources are saying the training - which is increasingly militaristic - is putting a lot of direction on the officer being more aggressive.
I saw a report suggest this officer might have PTSD from a previous shooting. But how do you draw the line when to pull an officer? You don't 'know' he'll do this or not do this.
Are you kidding me? What's with the attitude? My initial statement wasn't directed towards you, nor anyone in particular. It's a general statement saying that LEO should be trained to contain situations like this and not make it worse. Not all civilians know what to do and how to act around a person with a gun.
BeeBoop
Golden Member
My first reaction when seeing this was that the cop should go to jail but after thinking about it, he was only doing his job. He made a bad judgment due to stupidity because his job trained him to act in such situations. I can tell the cop really did feel threatened by the individual with all the shouting and running he did. Losing his job seems like just enough punishment.
Printer Bandit
Lifer
Anyone willing to get shot / grazed for a few million dollars?
BeeBoop
Golden Member
Only if I knew the cop was an extremely bad shot. Can't spend money six ft under.
GagHalfrunt
Lifer
His job is to panic, shoot unarmed people and spray bullets blindly in a public place? Good work if you can get it, but I think being able to distinguish between innocent people and potentially dangerous criminals BEFORE opening fire on them might be part of the job description. So no, he wasn't doing his job.
Red Squirrel
No Lifer
What a stupid situation all round. How about cops stop targeting black people and treating them like criminals on first sight, and how about they stop being so rude and arrogant about their authority, such as yelling at people and being so pushy. This just makes people nervous and makes them do sudden movements out of nervousness. I guess they want people to do that so they can have a better excuse to shoot them. "But he made a sudden movement, I think he was getting a gun!"
Glad to see the cop is going to jail though, it's not often that something actually gets done when they harm or kill people for nothing. I wonder if it would be different if the guy died. A dead guy can't fight back legally. The guy survived so it opens up a bigger can of worms all round for the department.
Glad to see the cop is going to jail though, it's not often that something actually gets done when they harm or kill people for nothing. I wonder if it would be different if the guy died. A dead guy can't fight back legally. The guy survived so it opens up a bigger can of worms all round for the department.
I'm sure his training did not instruct him to start pumping out rounds because you "think" someone "might" have a gun. Luckily for the dude driving the car aiming and shooting while running is not as easy as one might think.
BeeBoop
Golden Member
Like I said, he was doing a poor JOB. There is nothing in the video that says the cop is a racists. The cop did not stop the man because he intended to shot him. He stopped him for a seat belt ticket, all part of his JOB. He didn't wake up and say to himself that he was going to shot someone before the day is over. The cop felt a threat and acted according to how he was trained to act in what he felt was a threatening situation. Obviously, he made a poor judgment but there is nothing to say that what he did was with any ill intent. The cop acted out because he assumed the man to be pulling a weapon on him, and that isn't against the law. It just means he did a poor job.
If everyone could just step back....police shooting incidents are basically still in line with the last decade. There is no "obvious increase" in police shooting unarmed black men OR "obvious increase" in civilians shooting cops. What HAS increased is media coverage of both incidents.
So right now, we have civilians who are extremely aware and cautions of police who will violate their civil rights or harm them, etc. WE ALSO HAVE cops who are extremely aware and cautions of the civilians they encounter.
This is a terrible tragedy and appears to be an extremely negligent act BUT WE ARE ALL PARTLY responsible in agitating the shit out of everyone!
So right now, we have civilians who are extremely aware and cautions of police who will violate their civil rights or harm them, etc. WE ALSO HAVE cops who are extremely aware and cautions of the civilians they encounter.
This is a terrible tragedy and appears to be an extremely negligent act BUT WE ARE ALL PARTLY responsible in agitating the shit out of everyone!
Carson Dyle
Diamond Member
This, IMO, is the very definition of criminal negligence. The cop may have born no ill-will against the guy. Maybe he wasn't even a racist POS. But he fucked up so badly, and performed his job so poorly, that he came within inches (OK, feet) of killing an innocent citizen. He needs to go to prison.
13Gigatons
Diamond Member
The driver should have mentioned that his wallet was in the car. He moved too quickly. He turned his back to the officer.
However, the Police Officer did a bad job at controlling the situation. He was so casually about "can I see your license please", that the driver didn't think the situation was serious. If the officer felt a tinge of danger he should have called for backup.
However, the Police Officer did a bad job at controlling the situation. He was so casually about "can I see your license please", that the driver didn't think the situation was serious. If the officer felt a tinge of danger he should have called for backup.
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