Conservatives simply don't get it

[OneOfTheseDays]

Their actions are counter-Constitutional and anti-democratic. At this point, they are essentially saying that if they can't get their demands met they are going to take the credit of the United States hostage and watch this country go down in flames. This is not how our democracy was ever designed to work.

If you cannot convince the House, Senate, and President to go along with what you want then you MUST find a way to compromise. This whole situation is akin to me getting my credit card bill in the mail and just deciding I didn't like what I bought so I'm just not going to pay.

The bulk of the money that our government spends is tied up in our entitlement programs (SS, Medicare) and our military. If conservatives were really serious about reducing spending then the military should be one of our biggest targets. We are fighting two utterly useless wars and spending FAR too much money on a large standing army. Instead all I hear from conservative leaders is how we should abolish the EPA, reduce spending on education, etc. Do you really think that our country should reduce spending on education? Do you really think we're going to remain a competitive superpower if we can't train our children better than 3rd world countries are doing right now? Do you realize that we IMPORT the majority of our PHD students?

We must also reform our tax code in a serious way, and part of that involves ROLLING back the reckless Bush tax cuts and going back to the Clinton rates. There must be spending cuts along with revenue increases. This is the only logical way forward.

 

[CADsortaGUY]

lol, look in the mirror fool...

 

[GuitarDaddy]

lol, look in the mirror fool...

Yes, when you look in the mirror that is a fool you see:biggrin:

 

[ProfJohn]

Law making 101:

1. House passes bill

2. Senate passes bill

3. House and Senate sit down and work out a compromise.

4. House + Senate pass new bill

5. President signs bill. Or he can veto the bill and send it back to step 3.


We have just got past step 1. Now it is the Senates turn to pass a bill.

 

[Fear No Evil]

Their actions are counter-Constitutional and anti-democratic. At this point, they are essentially saying that if they can't get their demands met they are going to take the credit of the United States hostage and watch this country go down in flames. This is not how our democracy was ever designed to work.

If you cannot convince the House, Senate, and President to go along with what you want then you MUST find a way to compromise. This whole situation is akin to me getting my credit card bill in the mail and just deciding I didn't like what I bought so I'm just not going to pay.

The bulk of the money that our government spends is tied up in our entitlement programs (SS, Medicare) and our military. If conservatives were really serious about reducing spending then the military should be one of our biggest targets. We are fighting two utterly useless wars and spending FAR too much money on a large standing army. Instead all I hear from conservative leaders is how we should abolish the EPA, reduce spending on education, etc. Do you really think that our country should reduce spending on education? Do you really think we're going to remain a competitive superpower if we can't train our children better than 3rd world countries are doing right now? Do you realize that we IMPORT the majority of our PHD students?

We must also reform our tax code in a serious way, and part of that involves ROLLING back the reckless Bush tax cuts and going back to the Clinton rates. There must be spending cuts along with revenue increases. This is the only logical way forward.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NJxmpTMGhU0

 

[OneOfTheseDays]

We all know whatever shit bill Boehner just passed is DOA.

There will NEVER be a constitutional amendment for a balanced budget. It's wishful thinking, even if it somehow got out of Congress 3/4 of the states would need to ratify it which could very well take decades.

Question. Who do the states turn to when they run out of money?

 

[IronWing]

Law making 101:

1. House passes bill

2. Senate passes bill

3. House and Senate sit down and work out a compromise.

4. House + Senate pass new bill

5. President signs bill. Or he can veto the bill and send it back to step 3.


We have just got past step 1. Now it is the Senates turn to pass a bill.

Actually we are past step 2 now. The Senate considered the House bill and killed it. There is no obligation for the Senate to develop their own bill (I'm not saying they shouldn't, only that they don't have to). The ball has rolled out of bounds and someone is going to have to go pick it up.

 

[ProfJohn]

And there is no obligation for the house to develop another bill either.

They passed one and handed it to the Senate, the ball is now in their court.

 

[IronWing]

And there is no obligation for the house to develop another bill either.

They passed one and handed it to the Senate, the ball is now in their court.

They already disposed of Boehner's silly bill just as they said they would.

 

[Lithium381]

Their actions are counter-Constitutional and anti-democratic. At this point, they are essentially saying that if they can't get their demands met they are going to take the credit of the United States hostage and watch this country go down in flames. This is not how our democracy was ever designed to work.

If you cannot convince the House, Senate, and President to go along with what you want then you MUST find a way to compromise. This whole situation is akin to me getting my credit card bill in the mail and just deciding I didn't like what I bought so I'm just not going to pay.

The bulk of the money that our government spends is tied up in our entitlement programs (SS, Medicare) and our military. If liberals were really serious about reducing spending then the military should be one of our biggest targets. We are fighting two utterly useless wars and spending FAR too much money on a large standing army. Instead all I hear from liberal leaders is how we should expand the EPA, increase spending on education, etc. Do you really think that our country should increase spending on education? Do you really think we're going to remain a competitive superpower if we can't train our children better than 3rd world countries are doing right now? Do you realize that we EXPORT the majority of our JOBS?

We must also reform our tax code in a serious way, and part of that involves ROLLING back the reckless Obama stimulus and going back to the Clinton rates. There must be spending cuts along with revenue increases. This is the only logical way forward.

tftfy

 

[ProfJohn]

And your point??

Nothing says that the house has to do a damn thing. They can sit back and wait on the Senate and not do a thing until then.

press: Mr Speaker why aren't you working on another bill?

Speaker: we have already passed two bills and the Senate has voted no on both. At this point it makes no sense for us to keep passing bills if the Senate is going to keep voting them down. It is time for the Senate to pass a bill on their own and then we can sit down together and work on a compromise.



What is the Democrat answer to that?
Who is now the party of no?
Which party refuses to pass a debt ceiling bill?
Hard to blame the Republicans when they are the only people actually doing something.

 

[IronWing]

And your point??

Nothing says that the house has to do a damn thing. They can sit back and wait on the Senate and not do a thing until then.

press: Mr Speaker why aren't you working on another bill?

Speaker: we have already passed two bills and the Senate has voted no on both. At this point it makes no sense for us to keep passing bills if the Senate is going to keep voting them down. It is time for the Senate to pass a bill on their own and then we can sit down together and work on a compromise.



What is the Democrat answer to that?
Who is now the party of no?
Which party refuses to pass a debt ceiling bill?
Hard to blame the Republicans when they are the only people actually doing something.

Have the House Reps allowed a Dem plan, amendment, idea out of committee? The Reps made this mess. The Dems can help fix it but not if the Reps don't want the help.

 

[ProfJohn]

I have no idea, but it is an irrelevant point because every Republican can just vote no on any Democrat plan.

The Democrats can offer all the plans in the world and the GOP can vote no for everyone of them. No different that what the Senate is doing now.


Stop being so damn blindly partisan.

If the Democrats in the Senate can say no to every GOP plan then why couldn't the GOP in the house do the same to every Democrat plan?

And you can't blame the Republicans for failing to pass a plan when the Democrats haven't passed one themselves.

Right now the GOP has passed two plans to the Democrats zero. The American people will have seen this and know what is going on. It will be hard for the Democrats to blame the GOP for the problems when they can't pass anything on their own.

 

[IronWing]

I have no idea, but it is an irrelevant point because every Republican can just vote no on any Democrat plan.

The Democrats can offer all the plans in the world and the GOP can vote no for everyone of them. No different that what the Senate is doing now.


Stop being so damn blindly partisan.

If the Democrats in the Senate can say no to every GOP plan then why couldn't the GOP in the house do the same to every Democrat plan?

And you can't blame the Republicans for failing to pass a plan when the Democrats haven't passed one themselves.

Right now the GOP has passed two plans to the Democrats zero. The American people will have seen this and know what is going on. It will be hard for the Democrats to blame the GOP for the problems when they can't pass anything on their own.

So the Reps passing two blindly partisan plans that they knew would go nowhere counts as doing something? I'm an American people and I think the House Reps need to get serious and pass a debt limit bill without the poison pills. It is the Republican insistence on hanging unrelated riders on their bills that is causing the stalemate.

 

[hydroponik]

There were several repubs that voted no to the Boehner bill, and that's b/c it was epic fail. The problem is no one wants to compromise...

 

[shira]

And your point??

Nothing says that the house has to do a damn thing. They can sit back and wait on the Senate and not do a thing until then.

press: Mr Speaker why aren't you working on another bill?

Speaker: we have already passed two bills and the Senate has voted no on both. At this point it makes no sense for us to keep passing bills if the Senate is going to keep voting them down. It is time for the Senate to pass a bill on their own and then we can sit down together and work on a compromise.



What is the Democrat answer to that?
Who is now the party of no?
Which party refuses to pass a debt ceiling bill?
Hard to blame the Republicans when they are the only people actually doing something.

Excuse me? Reid has been saying to Boehner for two days, "Work with me to craft a bipartisan bill that can pass the House and the Senate."

Boehner's reply? "Fvck you and the U.S.A too. I'm going to waste two days crafting a bill so extreme that it can attract just enough Tea Party support to pass the House, but is so absurd that it's guaranteed to get rejected by the Senate. I'm doing this because Republicans need a fake political debating point for the 2012 elections."

 

[MotF Bane]

Troll thread!

 

[Tristicus]

How much did you pay Craig to make the title for you?

 

[Zorkorist]

Excuse me? Reid has been saying to Boehner for two days, "Work with me to craft a bipartisan bill that can pass the House and the Senate."

Boehner's reply? "Fvck you and the U.S.A too. I'm going to waste two days crafting a bill so extreme that it can attract just enough Tea Party support to pass the House, but is so absurd that it's guaranteed to get rejected by the Senate. I'm doing this because Republicans need a fake political debating point for the 2012 elections."

Yea, like either party wants to defauly on our debt.

We're doing this for fun amd games, not!

-John

 

[Zorkorist]

There were several repubs that voted no to the Boehner bill, and that's b/c it was epic fail. The problem is no one wants to compromise...

The problem is Obama...

And let no one forget that.

-John

 

[UberNeuman]

Troll thread!

...or you could endeavor to challenge his claims..

 

[Zorkorist]

Everyone knows this.

-John

 

[wuliheron]

Their actions are counter-Constitutional and anti-democratic.

They need to shit or get off the pot. I don't care what promises the assholes made to their constituents or lobbyists or even the damned republican party. They all swore an oath to protect the constitution and the interest of the country and if they can't do their job they need to find another damned job. The last thing we need right now is a bunch of loud mouthed dead weights obstructing progress.

 

[robphelan]

working at an oil company in Texas, even my more hardcore and vocal conservative friends are speechless about what is going on with the debt ceiling.

Obama's Grand Bargain gave 4 trillion in cuts to 1 trillion in revenue. 4 trillion in cuts, but the teapartiers dismissed it on principle - they DO NOT want to compromise with a Democratic president and I would go so far as to say they hate Obama specifically.

Why else would you give up almost double the spending cuts as was originally proposed by Boehner 2 months ago?

 

[Engineer]

Why else would you give up almost double the spending cuts as was originally proposed by Boehner 2 months ago?

Because, as Mitch McConjob stated, their goal is 100% to defeat Obama. Nothing more at this point.