Conservatives simply don't get it

[soundforbjt]

"Under the plan outlined by Obama on Wednesday, "
http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Politics/2011/0414/Obama-s-Medicare-proposal-How-would-it-work

"President Obama unveiled an aggressive plan to raise fuel economy standards to an average of 54.5 mpg by 2025, nearly doubling current mileage rules."
http://autos.aol.com/article/obamas-cafe-plan/

Obama $1 Trillion Tax Proposal Slams Into Republican Wall of Opposition
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-...al-u-s-tax-code-rewrite-to-raise-revenue.html

Obama Administration Utilities Offer Plan to Accelerate U.S. Smart Grid
http://www.smartmeters.com/the-news...s-offer-plan-to-accelerate-us-smart-grid.html

Obama's housing-finance reform plans
http://www.minnpost.com/community_v...fer_hope_especially_for_low-income_households

How many more do you want?

He "outlined" his plan, he offered 4T in cuts and 1T in revenue increases.

 

[ProfJohn]

There aren't many details needed. "The debt ceiling is raised to xxx." End of bill. You're just pissed because you want to stack destructive riders onto the bill that have nothing to do with the issue at hand and your buds can't get them through.

So you are saying that he should offer a plan that won't get passed??

And yet you bitch about how the Republican plan can't get passed....

 

[IronWing]

So you are saying that he should offer a plan that won't get passed??

And yet you bitch about how the Republican plan can't get passed....

I don't bitch that the Rep plan can't get passed; it is a stupid and destructive plan. The Reps need to stop their tantrum and pass a bill to support the deficit spending included in the FY11 budget they already passed. The Reps need to take responsibility for their actions and stop being such assclowns.

 

[ProfJohn]

He "outlined" his plan, he offered 4T in cuts and 1T in revenus increases.

I have a 'outline' for retirement too.

I also have an outline for a new business. I am going to sell stuff and make money. Think the bank will give me a loan with just an outline?

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

So, it's all about staying in power. Damn, here I thought it was supposed to be about serving the country's (the people) interests.

While I think most of the Republicans are crazy letting the status quo go on without being properly addressed is also nuts. Sorry, neither they or the "What me worry?" Dems are serving the public interest. Why don't the Dems surrender in the public interest? Fat chance.

In a rational world the answer would be to increase the debt ceiling in exchange for an honest examination of how the bureaucracy works and what can be done to introduce some sane reforms.

Nope. The Dems want to protect the status quo and the Reps want to play hatchet man.

This is what was wanted by oh so many. Enjoy.

 

[ProfJohn]

Found the White House plan:
http://www.whitehouse.gov/search/site/%22debt ceiling plan"

 

[hal2kilo]

Excuse me? Reid has been saying to Boehner for two days, "Work with me to craft a bipartisan bill that can pass the House and the Senate."

Boehner's reply? "Fvck you and the U.S.A too. I'm going to waste two days crafting a bill so extreme that it can attract just enough Tea Party support to pass the House, but is so absurd that it's guaranteed to get rejected by the Senate. I'm doing this because Republicans need a fake political debating point for the 2012 elections."

Amen brother.

 

[Jaskalas]

So you are saying that he should offer a plan that won't get passed??

And yet you bitch about how the Republican plan can't get passed....

In this case, what CAN get passed? Nothing.

 

[Moonbeam]

ROFL. You're declaring war on at least 25% of the population. Good luck with that.

These are vicious dogs that a bunch of fools have allowed off their short leashes. It happened with Senator Joseph McCarthy and it took broadcasting him foaming at the mouth on TV to get the public to put him back on a leash. Either the majority now recognizes the threat these vicious dogs represent in the current crisis and puts them back on their leashes or they continue to pay the consequences.

I didn't say anything different. What did you imagine?

 

[wuliheron]

I didn't say anything different. What did you imagine?

You were the one saying we had to declare war on them. There's a big difference between leashing a vicious dog and sticking him in the backyard and declaring war on people. Between marginalizing a bunch of lunatics at the ballot box and poking a hornet's nest.

 

[ProfJohn]

In this case, what CAN get passed? Nothing.

The Bohner bill minus the Balanced Budget amendment can probably get through both the House and the Senate.


The heart of the bill is what Reid and Bohner agreed to last weekend before things fell apart.

$900 billion in new debt.
$900 billion in cuts.

6 months to come up with something more long term or else hard caps go into place.

 

[Moonbeam]

You were the one saying we had to declare war on them. There's a big difference between leashing a vicious dog and sticking him in the backyard and declaring war on people. Between marginalizing a bunch of lunatics at the ballot box and poking a hornet's nest.

I was wondering what you imagined I meant by war. I imagined crushing them at the ballot box by declaring war on the notion they are sane. How do you ever hope to marginalize idiot politicians without marginalizing the fools who vote for them.

And you never poke a hornet's nest unless you can stand a sting.

 

[hal2kilo]

The Bohner bill minus the Balanced Budget amendment can probably get through both the House and the Senate.


The heart of the bill is what Reid and Bohner agreed to last weekend before things fell apart.

$900 billion in new debt.
$900 billion in cuts.

6 months to come up with something more long term or else hard caps go into place.

It will never happen with the 6 month poison pill. You think things are bad now. Yea, let's mix in election talking points into the debate. That will surely create a good bill.

 

[GuitarDaddy]

The Bohner bill minus the Balanced Budget amendment can probably get through both the House and the Senate.


The heart of the bill is what Reid and Bohner agreed to last weekend before things fell apart.

$900 billion in new debt.
$900 billion in cuts.

6 months to come up with something more long term or else hard caps go into place.

Delusional dream or outright lie, either fits and is standard MO for you
Reid and Obama have made it clear from the begining that a six month solution was a non starter. But I understand in you fairly tale right wing eutopia that 100% republican and teaparty support = a bipartisan agreement:whiste:. Kinda like "we the people" = spidey07, you and A777pos and Warren Jeffs:biggrin:

 

[ProfJohn]

Delusional dream or outright lie, either fits and is standard MO for you
Reid and Obama have made it clear from the begining that a six month solution was a non starter. But I understand in you fairly tale right wing eutopia that 100% republican and teaparty support = a bipartisan agreement:whiste:. Kinda like "we the people" = spidey07, you and A777pos and Warren Jeffs:biggrin:

The pass a bill on your own... good luck...

 

[wuliheron]

I was wondering what you imagined I meant by war. I imagined crushing them at the ballot box by declaring war on the notion they are sane. How do you ever hope to marginalize idiot politicians without marginalizing the fools who vote for them.

And you never poke a hornet's nest unless you can stand a sting.

You never poke a hornets nest unless you can stand twenty stings to the face. Those suckers don't mess around. You did compare it to the war on the commies. That involved guns, bombs, spys, and all the usual nastiness associated with war and hornets.

In this case we need to persuade anyone who voted republican that it was a mistake. The republican party is now controlled by a significant minority within their ranks who make irrational demands and are willing to risk anarchy and economic collapse to achieve their goals. Waiting for the republicans to disown their own or by some miracle tame the vicious beast is not a viable option. The party as whole must be leashed until they get their shit together.

 

[Bateluer]

Oy. I am appalled by the complete lack of financial sense in ATPN. You guys are worried about this little debt ceiling debate? Seriously? You guys should be worried about the fact that more than 1/3rd of the US budget is borrowed money, the republicans and Tea Party have been saying this for a while. They understand that you cannot live on credit, its not sustainable.

Repealing the Bush tax cuts? You guys really want to pay more taxes to pay the bloated salaries of politicians, social entitlement programs for people who lived like the Grasshopper their entire lives, etc? You all do know that those tax cuts were across the board, if you paid income tax, you got a tax cut. Jacking taxes up is rarely a good idea. I've worked for government, USAF, 6 years. The military could easily see a substantial budget cut, but not while we're engaged in multiple wars over seas. Wars, which won't be won while politicians try to fight them. Social Security should be entirely privatized, that would solve a large chunk of the budget problem right there. Heck, Congressional republicans tried in 2005 to do just that, failed, unfortunately. So, we all continue to 'invest' in Social Security at a -30% return rate. Thats right from my SS statement, by the way.

Congress will continue to bicker until the last minute, then they'll raise the debt ceiling, borrow more money, and eventually the House will pass a budget that probably includes more spending. And we'll all be right back in the mess for another couple years.

 

[Moonbeam]

You never poke a hornets nest unless you can stand twenty stings to the face. Those suckers don't mess around. You did compare it to the war on the commies. That involved guns, bombs, spys, and all the usual nastiness associated with war and hornets.

In this case we need to persuade anyone who voted republican that it was a mistake. The republican party is now controlled by a significant minority within their ranks who make irrational demands and are willing to risk anarchy and economic collapse to achieve their goals. Waiting for the republicans to disown their own or by some miracle tame the vicious beast is not a viable option. The party as whole must be leashed until they get their shit together.

They have their shit together whenever they meet. It is what they are. And we didn't bomb the Commies in this country.

 

[Gonad the Barbarian]

You never poke a hornets nest unless you can stand twenty stings to the face. Those suckers don't mess around. You did compare it to the war on the commies. That involved guns, bombs, spys, and all the usual nastiness associated with war and hornets.

In this case we need to persuade anyone who voted republican that it was a mistake. The republican party is now controlled by a significant minority within their ranks who make irrational demands and are willing to risk anarchy and economic collapse to achieve their goals. Waiting for the republicans to disown their own or by some miracle tame the vicious beast is not a viable option. The party as whole must be leashed until they get their shit together.

If people who vote Republican could be persuaded by things like rationality and practicality they wouldn't be voting Republican. This is the only thing that persuades those folks:

 

[RFE]

Found the White House plan:
http://www.whitehouse.gov/search/site/"debt ceiling plan"

lol, I was actually hopeful that said plan was in writing.

The current White House "Plan" seems akin to campaign promises for hope and change: vague words bantered about to ensnare the gullible.

Its incredibly wreckless that BOTH sides have let this come down to the wire

 

[wuliheron]

If people who vote Republican could be persuaded by things like rationality and practicality they wouldn't be voting Republican. This is the only thing that persuades those folks:

Republicans understand the concept of punishment and caging a vicious animal very well. At the very least some will abstain in the next election like they did in the last presidential election out of shame and disgust with the party. Then there's the independent voters....

 

[theeedude]

Republicans understand the concept of punishment and caging a vicious animal very well. At the very least some will abstain in the next election like they did in the last presidential election out of shame and disgust with the party. Then there's the independent voters....

Big business is evaluating if supporting GOP is a good idea or a recipe for instability.

 

[OneOfTheseDays]

The Republicans made a dangerous deal when they decided to embrace the Tea Party with open arms, without realizing that this lunatic fringe of Americans were actually dead serious about their misguided and small-minded beliefs.

They are now reaping what they sow. This move is going to cost them dearly politically, right now the American public views them as being obstructionist and not compromising in good faith. The Democrats are willing to put things on the table that they aren't at all comfortable with in order to get a deal done, I ask you WHAT have the Republicans put on the table? Someone please answer this for me. If the Republicans can't come to the table and compromise then a deal simply won't be done.

If ever there was an opening for a legitimate third party in this country it is right now. I think the collective nation is just sick and tired of what we have right now. There needs to be more than just two choices, nothing meaningful will ever get done in such a polarizing environment.

 

[wuliheron]

Big business is evaluating if supporting GOP is a good idea or a recipe for instability.

Some 40% of congress's campaign funding comes from the banks and they're the ones who have the most to gain by the country going deeper into debt. These are the same assholes who made a killing off derivatives and shaky loans. Taking big risks when they know they're too big to fail is what they live for. All the Tea Party has to do is keep obstructing any real progress on the budget without defaulting on the loans.

 

[Craig234]

lol, I was actually hopeful that said plan was in writing.

The current White House "Plan" seems akin to campaign promises for hope and change: vague words bantered about to ensnare the gullible.

Its incredibly wreckless that BOTH sides have let this come down to the wire

Ya, I thought it was incredibly wreckless that the Democrats and Republicans BOTH allowed Watergate to happen, too.