Computers and Gaming, why have the companies NOT done this?

[ForceCalibur]

Does anyone else find it rather odd that an 3 year old ( i think) Xbox can run Halo, Ninja Gaiden, and many other graphically intensive games so smoothly and so beautifully. Oh, and get this, you would have to spend nearly 20 times the money to buy a computer that can even run a freaken 5 year old Halo without shooting itself in the head.

Nowadays, people are so consumed with the "power" of their hardware, that people forget that Hardware only exists to run software. All they care about are their 3Dmarks or PCmarks or whatever benchmarks... its like constantly buying new cars but only test driving them, but never actually using them.

I for one, am NOT impressed with how PC graphics have been evolving. If a Pentium 3, Geforce 3 based $150 dollar piece of hardware can still beat the *crack* out of the some of best PC graphics today still astounds me. Not to mention how the now ancient playstation 2 was cranking out graphical goodness like Final Fantasy X on a puny 4 megabyte GPU years ago.

The only saving grace for the PC is the keyboard/mouse design.

Give me an Xbox2/PS3. Stick it onto a monitor, give it full keyboard/mouse support along with pads. Attach a stero system. And I will have a dedicated system for games with NO issues with bugs, full support of games, NO risk of being outdated every month.

Why have they NOT done this? Why have they not realized such a ridiculous number of people buy computers MAINLY for games? When could spend 1/4 as much with a dedicated gaming system, and a much less expensive computer system.

 

[Acanthus]

Because a TV is 600 lines of resolution?

 

[Falloutboy]

yeah rendering a game at 640x480 and not having to worry about other graphics chips, or what processor the game will run on helps alot. thier are alot more low level tricks when you know exactly what hardware you will be running on compared too, the PC where you have two processor platforms, 3 or 4 chipsets for each, 4-5 different graphics chips...etc. so you have to program on the safe side to keep compatability, or spend time writing seprate code for each.

 

[gsaldivar]

Run your PC games at 640x480 and see how well they perform.

 

[AIWGuru]

If you saw a side by side comparison of Halo on xbox and on pc, you wouldn't need to ask this question.
Also, a poor port isn't indicative of overall platform abilities.

 

[ForceCalibur]

640 X480 is on a TV SCREEN. How hard is it for an Xbox2/PS3 to support 1280x1024?

 

[SneakyStuff]

Consoles will never beat PCs as far as image quality goes, end of story. They are a cheaper alternative to a PC if you ask me

I have a PS2 that I haven't used in over a year because all the good games are for the PC now, not the console

 

[Dman877]

It's 640x480 and (correct me if I'm wrong) but an average of 30 fps. Some console games do chug at times. I personally can't stand playing fps games on a TV, I remember trying to play bond after quake3 came out, it was like gauging my eyes out.

 

[spanner]

Not only is a tv 640x480 but you cannot exceed 30fps.

 

[EarthwormJim]

Well an Xbox does not have to run resource hungry apps like anti virus programs or the OS in the backround. Console games usually run at 6480x480 at 30 frames max (60 with interlacing). If you look back at Halo, a lot of times the FPS did go way down down to 20 or so(that's 20 including interlacing or 10 actual). Also what level of AA if any do console games run?

 

[darkswordsman17]

You people do realize that the Xbox, PS2, and Gamecube can all put out graphics in higher resolutions. There are some xbox games that put out in 1080i.

Compare Gran Turismo 4, Metroid Prime, and Ninja Gaiden to PC games, and you'll realize that their graphics are just as good. Also pretty much all Xbox games come in Dolby Digital surround sound whereas most PC games the sound is almost an afterthought.

Its shameful that a system that cost $300 when it arrived can put out graphics better than the $500 graphics cards that came out at that time. Also don't use that its on a TV excuse, because a computer monitor would make graphics look better regardless of the source. I've played Xbox Halo on my pc monitor and it looks better than the pc version does on my computer, despite the fact that the xbox has a less powerful graphics processor, processor, RAM, etc. Also, the keyboard is one of the least ergonomic things you can use as a controller.

Don't get me wrong, I enjoy playing games on my pc too, but console games are just more enjoyable for me. I'm sure if I could afford one of the awesome graphics cards and a fast processor and RAM then I'd probably be singing a different tune, but thats just it, I can't afford those, and I don't want to be missing out on the full experience of a game because I can't afford the expensive hardware to play it on.

 

[wizdum]

Halo XBOX = Great game.
Halo PC = Horrible game.
Why? Bad port. I have halo for my XBOX and halo for my PC and the PC version looks infinitely better. I just beat Ninja Gaiden on my xbox also, and my PC could easily run that kind of graphics. Keep in mind the cutscenes are pre-rendered.

eah rendering a game at 640x480 and not having to worry about other graphics chips, or what processor the game will run on helps alot. thier are alot more low level tricks when you know exactly what hardware you will be running on compared too, the PC where you have two processor platforms, 3 or 4 chipsets for each, 4-5 different graphics chips...etc. so you have to program on the safe side to keep compatability, or spend time writing seprate code for each.

Exactly. XBOX game developers can optimize the game code to run excellent on a GF3 / 733MHz P3. But with PC, you can't do that. Different OS'es, different hardware, not that easy.

PC graphics outdated PS2 and XBOX graphics the first day they hit the shelves. Graphics like Half-Life 2 and Doom III are the kind of graphics you will see on XBOX2 and PS3 while I'm on my PC reading about Half-Life 3. :beer:

 

[wizdum]

Originally posted by: darkswordsman17
You people do realize that the Xbox, PS2, and Gamecube can all put out graphics in higher resolutions. There are some xbox games that put out in 1080i.

Compare Gran Turismo 4, Metroid Prime, and Ninja Gaiden to PC games, and you'll realize that their graphics are just as good. Also pretty much all Xbox games come in Dolby Digital surround sound whereas most PC games the sound is almost an afterthought.

Its shameful that a system that cost $300 when it arrived can put out graphics better than the $500 graphics cards that came out at that time. Also don't use that its on a TV excuse, because a computer monitor would make graphics look better regardless of the source. I've played Xbox Halo on my pc monitor and it looks better than the pc version does on my computer, despite the fact that the xbox has a less powerful graphics processor, processor, RAM, etc. Also, the keyboard is one of the least ergonomic things you can use as a controller.

Don't get me wrong, I enjoy playing games on my pc too, but console games are just more enjoyable for me. I'm sure if I could afford one of the awesome graphics cards and a fast processor and RAM then I'd probably be singing a different tune, but thats just it, I can't afford those, and I don't want to be missing out on the full experience of a game because I can't afford the expensive hardware to play it on.

True, many console games are now HDTV compatible.

No, sound is not an afterthought. Many games today are designed with multiplaying in mind, and for players to have a full sound experience you need to have directional sound like footsteps, gunfire, and to be able to tell where these things are coming from.

By the time XBOX and PS2 were on the shelves, PC had already exceeded those graphics. A mouse/keyboard combo may not be the most ergonomical or "cool" control for that matter, but they are much more accurate. (Being both an XBOX gamer and a PC gamer, I can confirm this.)

I understand that if you can't afford PC hardware then you just resort to playing console games. But PC hardware and gaming is a passion for me so that's why I do it. Cheers!



:heart:

 

[Vonkhan]

console r for po' azz people who cant afford pc gaming goodness

play Far Cry on 1600 x 1200 with a 9800XT and a 2001FP and u'll never wanna touch a console again

 

[darkswordsman17]

First of all I'd like to thank you people for not thinking I was just trying to bash pc gaming. I'm kinda new to it myself.

Yeah, mouse is more accurate, I have no problem with the mouse, its the dam keyboard I hate. Oh well, I just need to get over it.

Thats the thing with pc games though, you'll be reading about them for a long time before they come out. They showed off Doom 3 what was it 2 years ago (they announced its development far before that too)? and its still not out (shut up about Fable). Yet in that time its graphics haven't improved much (admittedly, I don't know how they could really) and the consoles have all improved pretty considerably in their graphics.

You all make valid points, you just have to choose which you prefer, there is no right or wrong answer. There is one thing I must disagree with though. PC games will not always outdo console graphics, because computing will reach a point where one day you can't really get any better. In fact its almost already here. Oh and about how the Xbox 2 will be putting Half-Life 2 and Doom 3 caliber graphics when they come out, not true. Have you heard about the Unreal 3.0 engine? They've said the Xbox can do that kind of stuff now. Also, Halo 2's graphics are a pretty good rival.

The last thing I'll gripe about pc's is the fact that you cannot play more than one player per pc. I know many of you will probably say this is a good thing, but it'd help offset the expense of the hardware if you could have multple people play on the same machine (dual monitor support anybody?).

Once again, I stress, all gaming is good gaming, wether it be old school Nintnendo or a $2500 dollar juggernaut of a pc.

 

[MercenaryForHire]

Consoles and PCs are in two totally different worlds. There is no way to directly compare.

- M4H

 

[wizdum]

Unreal 3.0 engine? huh? The current unreal engine is unreal warfare (i believe) and not even xbox can do that...

Graphics are far from being done upgrading, just watch the final fanstasy movie and you'll see why..

 

[darkswordsman17]

Yes the Unreal 3.0 engine, and yes they said the Xbox could actually do what they have the engine doing (I know this isn't the whole story). You are likely right that the Xbox couldn't run the actual Unreal 3.0 engine, but its still far from a lame duck.

The thing about rendered movies like Final Fantasy is that the graphics in them are not that much better than what consoles and pc's can do, yet it takes rooms full of supercomputers to achieve that. There will always be innovation into graphics, but even today the difference is almost negligible.

In my opinion though, pc companies spend too much time dealing with the graphics when they could spend it on making the game better. I don't mind 8-bit graphics as long as the game is good. I love eye candy too, and if you've got a 9800 XT or soon to be Geforce 6800 then I envy what you get to experience, I just wish there was more equality to it than that. If I have a crappy graphics card then it'll make some really good games crappy (poor framerates, etc.) but on consoles if a game is crappy its not because of my hardware but because they didn't code it well.

In all reality, regardless of the hardware it always boils down to the software. For me there are more trully classic games on consoles than on pc.

Lets not argue over something as trivial as graphics, and try to come up with ways that both could improve. For instance I can use pretty much any gamepad I want on the pc, and well there solves one of my gripes about it.

 

[ForceCalibur]

You guys still don't get my post do you?

A PC costs what, 2000 dollars for really nice/fast PC with a good graphics card, high processor etc.

When Xbox TWO and PS THREE Come out, there should be:

Full Monitor Support and high resolution support
Full keyboard/Mouse support (Atleast as an option, very good for FPS)
Full Sound system support (like computer speakers or whatever, or home theature support)

And the current online option, with a Harddrive etc...

Why does this BEAT a COMPUTER as a gaming system?

1. No BUGS
2. STREAMLINED Support/Optimization.
3. More Games/ LESS development time

Since this ONLY designed to run games, (and I'm sure the Xbox has an OS on it), there could be ways to easily port or actually RUN PC games on this, as well as proprietary console games.

This would be a DREAM for average gamer/consumer. Why?

1. Cost is cut INSANELY. Instead of spending 1000 dollars on the hardware to RUN the games, get EVERY game that interests you. You don't play hardware, you play the SOFTWARE.
2. Multifunctional Online/Party gameplay. Invite friends over for gamepad action, or play online with keyboard/mouse.
3. No Spending more and more cash trying to keep up with technology trends, your thing getting outdated.

Lets face it, If Xbox can crank out things like Ninja Gaiden/Halo with a freaken 5 year old Hardware (and Halo was FIRST GENERATION), what do you think XBox2/PS3 can do? I am SUPREMELY confident if the resolution issue was resolved ANY FREAKEN game would beat the sh*t out of the new Unreal Engine. Because every game is designed to use ONE system, there is no compatibility, design, performance ANYTHING to be worked out. You get the best possible every time.

I'm just saying Sony and Microsoft should atleast consider this. And if you really want upgradeability, make the freaken thing upgradeable. When new GPUs come out, you can stick it in there, firmware/driver updates. Its the internet. Whatever, it'll all work out.

 

[BFG10K]

) Xbox can run Halo, Ninja Gaiden, and many other graphically intensive games so smoothly and so beautifully.

640 x 480 @ 30 FPS isn't even remotely smooth or beautiful.

 

[darkswordsman17]

Whoa! Wait a second. Ninja Gaiden not smooth or beautiful? Have you seen or played this game? You can't say that just because it doesn't put out in 2048X1530 or whatever at 150 fps that its not smooth and good looking.

The reason why MS nor Sony will likely add monitor support is because you can get a better looking picture on a nice big HDTV.

I doubt that every game could outdo the new Unreal engine if the resolution was upped, because the Xbox is programmed on pcs and runs pretty much the same code (albeit stripped down). In fact look at Unreal 2. That game uses the new Unreal engine and yet, it looks pretty crappy.

The Xbox can put out some really nice graphics. I dare anybody to say that it doesn't after seeing Ninja Gaiden on a 50" HDTV. Its guaranteed that the Xbox 2 will have better graphics yet. Yes it is a better value for gaming, but doesn't mean that pc gaming should be done away with. An F1 car costs millions upon millions but its still awesome despite the fact that a street legal motorcylce can do 70% of its performance.

 

[wizdum]

Well, whatever floats your boat I guess. I like PC games, you like console games. Let's have a big group hug.

 

[wizdum]

A PC costs what, 2000 dollars for really nice/fast PC with a good graphics card, high processor etc.

My top of the line PC last year cost me a grand total of: $672. It has about 3 times the functionality of a console so I'd say i Saved about 230 bucks. That's everything included, monitor, keyboard, case, mouse, mousepad, everything.

 

[darkswordsman17]

*Hug*

Hey, everybody now. What, no I'm not homosexual.

We're all gamers and thats all that matters.

I'm only dissing pc games because I totally suck at them, and I have a friend who loves pc gaming and only disses on consoles so I of course have to have some rebuttals.

I'm actually off to play some pc Halo right now.

Oh and also, I have to point out that pretty much all (well mostly all) of the posts were intelligent. Its been a long time since I've had an intelligent conversation about gaming.

 

[BFG10K]

Ninja Gaiden not smooth or beautiful? Have you seen or played this game? You can't say that just because it doesn't put out in 2048X1530 or whatever at 150 fps that its not smooth and good looking.

Yes I can because if you saw it at 2048 x 1536 @ 150 FPS your console would look butt ugly.

The reason why MS nor Sony will likely add monitor support is because you can get a better looking picture on a nice big HDTV.

Fine, then add the cost of an HDTV to the console system and see where we end up.

Also compare its cost to a 21" CRT and also take into account that pretty much any 3D PC game will run at whatever resolution you like, unlike the handful of console titles that have been specifically made to do it. So on a console you fork over money for an HDTV and you've got like six games that will take advantage of it.