Compulsory voting

[Amused]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mnrP0StT4NU

Um, okaaaay...

 

[MovingTarget]

We should do exactly the opposite. Only those people who demonstrate literacy and basic knowledge of math, science, and global politics should be allowed to vote. If a person can't point to America on a map, they can't vote.

It would be great to have people be required to solve problems like 3^2+4^2=x^2 for x or answer questions like "In what country was the current President of the United States born?" in order to be able to vote, but this can easily be abused. Although nice in theory, literacy tests went the way of the poll tax a long time ago for good reason.

 

[DominionSeraph]

Um, okaaaay...

You asked.

As for the "people."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cognitive_biases
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buyer_decision_processes
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logical_fallacies

 

[dawp]

Part of the problem is that quite a few people will vote D or R because that's what everyone said they should do. At the minimum they should reshuffle things so that straight party voting is a thing of the past. [/b]Then it takes at least ten seconds of thought to cast a ballot.[/b]

It may take a few seconds to cast a ballot but but how many actually put any research into how they vote? I know I really don't any more because both parties totally screwed up and generally vote third party when given a choice. Where I'm at now doesn't have many choices for that, unlike when I lived in TX.

 

[jihe]

How is this enforced in Australia?
Do they put people in jail/prision who refuse to vote?
Do they fine them $1,000 dollars?
What is the repercussion? or did they just put "voting is mandatory" on the books without mentioning any punishment for violators?
Has compulsory voting proven to work? Does Australia have a 100% voter turnout? If not, then I assume the remaining people who didn't vote were either fined or put in prison?

Your idea would be impossible to enforce.
What if the voter only answers one ballot question of the 25 or so questions/votes of candidates on the list?
What if the voter bubbles all the ovals?
What if the voter answered "None of the Above" to every question?
What if the voter didn't answer any questions but there are pencil marks all over the ballot which is not enough to signify voter intent?
What if the voter voted in the primary, but not the general election?
What if the voter votes for local council elections but chooses not to participate in(or skips entirely over federal and state candidates running for office on the same ballot?
What if the voter is unemployed and therefore won't be able to receive your XX% discount on income tax?
What if the person is a college student who his parents claim him as dependent on their taxes meaning he doesn't have to file anything with the IRS? Would the XX% discount(or fixed amount) be awarded to the parents who filed taxes or the student?
What if the person was in a Surgical ICU unit for a month and didn't get the chance to vote?

As far as I know in Australia they fine you 50 bucks or something unless you have some valid excuse, no big deal. Also it is easier to enforce since I think they have far fewer homeless in Australia, so pretty much everyone can be tracked down. But like I said the penalty is no big deal.

 

[lothar]

As far as I know in Australia they fine you 50 bucks or something unless you have some valid excuse, no big deal. Also it is easier to enforce since I think they have far fewer homeless in Australia, so pretty much everyone can be tracked down. But like I said the penalty is no big deal.

What is the % voter turnout in Australian elections?
What are the "valid" excuses that are allowed under their law and who determines that?
How much does it cost their government to enforce their compulsory voting law, and how much money on average do they collect from citizens that break it?
Would be interesting to see all the numbers.

Similarly,
What if the voter only answers one ballot question of the 25 or so questions/votes of candidates on the list?
What if the voter bubbles all the ovals and votes for everything selecting all the choices available?
What if the voter answered "None of the Above" to every question?
What if the voter didn't answer any questions but there are pencil marks all over the ballot or art drawings which is not enough to signify voter intent?

Note: I don't know how the Australia ballot system is structured, so I'm using examples.
This is an example of a sample ballot in the US.
http://www.elections.state.md.us/elections/2010/general_proofing_ballots/baltimore county.pdf

 

[RocksteadyDotNet]

What is the % voter turnout in Australian elections?
What are the "valid" excuses that are allowed under their law and who determines that?
How much does it cost their government to enforce their compulsory voting law, and how much money on average do they collect from citizens that break it?
Would be interesting to see all the numbers.

Similarly,
What if the voter only answers one ballot question of the 25 or so questions/votes of candidates on the list?
What if the voter bubbles all the ovals and votes for everything selecting all the choices available?
What if the voter answered "None of the Above" to every question?
What if the voter didn't answer any questions but there are pencil marks all over the ballot or art drawings which is not enough to signify voter intent?

Note: I don't know how the Australia ballot system is structured, so I'm using examples.
This is an example of a sample ballot in the US.
http://www.elections.state.md.us/elections/2010/general_proofing_ballots/baltimore county.pdf

Voter turn out would be like 95%+. Not many people fail to vote.

You can do whatever you want to the paper. There's no way to force people to fill it out correctly because voting is confidential so. If you dont vote it out exactly right it is not counted.

A lot of people do that, invalid votes were at about 5% this year.

I believe the fine increases every time you don't vote. I'm not sure but I think you can go to jail for not voting. It's probably never happened though.

We don't have primaries.

 

[JMapleton]

You have to be educated on the issues and policies to vote. You should not force someone to vote if they are not education in the issues and candidates. This is a receipt for disaster.

 

[lothar]

Voter turn out would be like 95%+. Not many people fail to vote.

You can do whatever you want to the paper. There's no way to force people to fill it out correctly because voting is confidential so. If you don't vote it out exactly right it is not counted.

A lot of people do that, invalid votes were at about 5% this year.

I believe the fine increases every time you don't vote. I'm not sure but I think you can go to jail for not voting. It's probably never happened though.

We don't have primaries.

But it's still on the record that they voted(even if their scratch marks are determined to be ineligible) and they won't be fined, correct?
As you can see from the sample ballot from my area, there were a LOT of people running uncontested. Why should I waste my time and energy filling in the bubble if you're running uncontested? I hope choosing not to answer a particular question(unless there really is only one question) doesn't make your entire ballot invalid.

I assume the "average" Australian voter is more educated on the issues than the "average" American is?
Most people here just pick a side and stick(you have the ultra left and the ultra right here with barely anything except a few cactus in the middle of the desert) to it instead of seeing things from both lenses and picking what makes sense.
I don't expect "compulsory" voting here to work in our favor since people are not educated on the issues or simply don't care enough to vote for the most part.

 

[GuitarDaddy]

Make the voting period 7 days which gives everyone a chance to get to the polls, then enact a voters tax credit which gives you $200 credit on federal income tax for proof of voting

 

[zsdersw]

Another shining example of leftist elitism, folks!!!

The unwashed masses are too stupid to decide what is good for them!

Every politician in Congress, every president, and every politician at the state and local level was elected by people who chose to get out and vote.

Given the non-stop stream of idiotic policies, laws, and amendments that politicians created and approved over the decades.. at every level of government.. I'd say there's a good case to be made about the idiocy of the average, middle of the bell-curve, American voter.

 

[trenchfoot]

Make the voting period 7 days which gives everyone a chance to get to the polls, then enact a voters tax credit which gives you $200 credit on federal income tax for proof of voting

I like where you're coming from, but this'll never work. The corporate lobbyists will hate it as it takes the power of their vote-buying $$$ away from them and the repubs will fight this down to their last gasping breath as it will be to their overwhelming disadvantage to allow this to happen.

 

[IndyColtsFan]

Does anyone else see the merit in this? Maybe then the candidates won't spend billions to get people to vote and instead try to develop and sell actual policies? Frankly I am appalled by the amount of campaign spending. And maybe it actually gives third parties a chance since now people disillusioned with both parties simply won't get their asses off the couch to vote.

Bad idea for numerous reasons. If you make it compulsory, you'd probably have candidates spending MORE on advertising, etc. to try to get more votes. And frankly, it is our right not to vote. Forcing people who are disillusioned (like me) to vote won't help third parties in all likelihood.

 

[RocksteadyDotNet]

But it's still on the record that they voted(even if their scratch marks are determined to be ineligible) and they won't be fined, correct?
As you can see from the sample ballot from my area, there were a LOT of people running uncontested. Why should I waste my time and energy filling in the bubble if you're running uncontested? I hope choosing not to answer a particular question(unless there really is only one question) doesn't make your entire ballot invalid.

I assume the "average" Australian voter is more educated on the issues than the "average" American is?
Most people here just pick a side and stick(you have the ultra left and the ultra right here with barely anything except a few cactus in the middle of the desert) to it instead of seeing things from both lenses and picking what makes sense.
I don't expect "compulsory" voting here to work in our favor since people are not educated on the issues or simply don't care enough to vote for the most part.

Yes, as long as you sign that you've voted you're sweet. You can draw a nice picture on the ballot and you wouldn't be fined. Like I said, it's secret, how would you enforce that?

Americans are fucking retarded, so yeah, the average aussie would be smarter.

I'd say at least 30%+ of our voters swing. Mind you, that's just my guess, I could be wrong. Heaps of people just stick to their side, poor people go left, rich people go right etc.

It's also well know that compulsory voting helps the left. I think its to do with forcing young people to vote, cause they vote left.

 

[lord_emperor]

Minding you I'm Canadian, but I looked at my options for the last election. In my riding I had Liberal, Conservative and NDP, which to me are three piles of the same shit. There is not even a lesser of three evils to vote for. If I had been forced to vote I'd just roll 1D3 or blindly write an X somewhere on my paper.

When I lived in a city I at least had a Green Party candidate to vote for out of spite.

I can imagine this feeling is worse for Americans, with your two-party system.

 

[ayabe]

Not as big an idiot as the better-than-thou elitist leftists who keep telling everyone they are too stupid to know what's best for them.

The low information right wing voters came out in droves, the left wing ones didn't. That's what the election was about.

 

[dali71]

The low information right wing voters came out in droves, the left wing ones didn't. That's what the election was about.

 

[ShawnD1]

Making voters not know the party when they vote doesn't solve anything about the problems with parties - and benefits Republicans, since more people are Democrats.

So what you're saying is that democrat voters are a bunch of stupid fucks who don't even know the name of the democratic candidates and just vote for whichever one has a D next to his or her name? Well that's just lovely. Voting for people you've never heard of is exactly what the founding fathers wanted.

Hiding the party from voters isn't even logical in that it'll leaver voters with no idea who they're voting for if they remain ignorant, and they'll know the party if they are informed.

This was the OP's point. If you don't know the name of the candidate, you should not be voting. End of story.

I can just imagine how laughable that would look. You get your ballot and you see 1 box that says John McCain and 1 box that says Barack Hussein Hitler Obama. You saw the debates, you didn't like McCain, so you check the one that says Obama. The guy next to you is sweating bullets. "Man, who the fuck are these people? Which one is the black guy? If you just tell me which one is black, I can figure out which candidate is the democrat and which is the republican. Please man you gotta help me."
:\


I'll admit that I didn't even vote for several of the things on the city election that happened about a month ago. I voted for the mayor, and I voted for a council member. I left the part about school trustee blank because I had no idea who these people were.

 

[Nebor]

I literally don't know anyone (in the Army) that voted. Virtually everyone claims their "home of record" in a state with no income tax, which are all (surprise!) solidly red states, so there's really no point. The day that Texas goes blue, I'll eat my patrol cap.

 

[JTsyo]

You should not force someone to vote.

Now, removing the political party affiliation from being stated on the ballot might help.

take it a step farther and show just political history and stand on key issues.

By making everyone vote, there would probably more money spend on ads to get the attention of the unmotivated. The ads would probably drop to the lowest common denominator too.

 

[ch33zw1z]

wouldn't help. Nobody really knows what they're voting for as it is. It would be better to have voting on a day when people normally have off. or make it a national holiday.

and get rid of attack ads. make candidates run on issues and not just against the other guy.

i like your ideas

 

[ShawnD1]

take it a step farther and show just political history and stand on key issues.

You're supposed to know that before you vote. If they had too much information at the polling station, you would end up waiting for some asshole to read through literature and make a choice.

 

[Saint Nick]

Voting makes sense to those who are educated. Uneducated citizens should not vote.

Even though I am college-educated American that maintains a full-time job and pays his taxes, I don't like voting because I feel like law and regulation in general is too wordy and complicated, and, the candidates are never anyone worth voting for. The two party system is archaic and doesn't really allow for anyone with differing views to enter. The nation is doomed to be in political gridlock for centuries, just like it always has been.

 

[Jaskalas]

Bad idea. Very bad idea.

The people who don't take the time to vote are the kind of people you don't want to vote.

Plus, if we forced people to vote the vote getting process would become one big give away. Candidates would fight over who can give away the most money and benefits to their voters. Would be a disaster for the country.

I'm struggling to imagine how that is not already the case.