I don't get why these executives are holding on to the failed brand name. I would bet if Hyundai drops that ugly name, and comes up with a new badge, sales would go through the roof.
Hell, I might buy the Genesis, remove the "H" in the back and put a custon label on it just to prove a point to management who won't care.
That is the most idiotic statement ever... also selling over 1k genesis last month is nowhere near a failure, and actually where they wanted to be.
When did I say the Genesis is a failure? I'm just saying my thesis is that if Hyundai rebranded themselves, with cars like the Genesis they can be a true contender and gain enormous market share and close in on the Japanese car companies.
reminds me of a case study in college, the failure of the Ford Edsel. From what I remember they put a lot of the blame on the brand name "Edsel" itself. Just wanted to point out how a shitty brand name and label can keep you down.
I so want to buy a new 2009 Ram... but until the economy starts to rebound and this partnership with Fiat plays out, I'll stay away from them. Sure, if they folded, their assets would be bought up along with the warranties.... But the main concern would be the rapid depreciation of the vehicle once that happened.
I've looked at all the trucks and by far in my opinion the new ram is the best *for me. Too bad about the times though.
I've looked at all the trucks and by far in my opinion the new ram is the best *for me. Too bad about the times though.
Chrysler wants dealers to stock more inventory and the dealers are basically saying f-you. They can't sell what they have, why buy more? This is probably not going to end well for Chrysler.
It's far easier to clean up a brand's image than it is to successfully establish a whole new brand. Toyota and Honda never changed their names, they just made great products consistently and people started associating them with "solid reliable cars" instead of "tinny cheap econoboxes".
Toyota et all did introduce luxury brands, but I don't think the Genesis is really aiming for the mainstream Lexus/BMW/MB/etc market, it is after all priced at the same price as a Maxima.
PingSpike
Lifer
- Feb 25, 2004
- 21,765
- 615
- 126
The subaru thing I think is same as always. Nobody really makes anything that competes with the niche they've carved out. Other vehicles with AWD usually have a less refined system, get worse gas mileage and/or cost a lot more. If you want AWD and aren't looking for a badgewhore mobile then you end up buying one. There main problem is that they're so painfully common is boring to buy one. But everyone that has one tells me they love how it handles in the snow. They are probably stealing some sales from more expensive brands that offer AWD as moderately affluent people scale back their car purchases to the more pedestrian AWD offerings of subaru.
Pretty surprising on Hyundai. I have an 06 Elantra and frankly I like it quite a bit so far. Lots of features in it, good price, dealership was nice and the warranty is great. I didn't think the company would do that well during the downturn honestly though, they still have brands they're trying to build up. I think maybe they are offering what the market wants now. People are scared. I know the return the car thing is a gimmick but I think its a good one, especially given Hyundai's resale value problem. The economy is shaky but your car is a crapper and needs to be replaced...you don't want to spend a lot of money though because you're scaling back and you might end up with a pay cut if you even have a job a year from now. Hyundai shows up with a long warranty, low price and offers to buy back the car if things really go to shit on you. If you're just trying to get to work, that is a pretty compelling deal. People probably didn't want to get caught dead driving one of those crappy hyundai's when everything was going good but now that their back is up against the wall maybe that just isn't that big of a concern anymore. If thats what is going on, this is probably a good long term play for Hyundai. I think personally their cars have improved, but they have a bad image problem where people won't touch them. If they have to scare people into the cars, so be it...you have to get them into the cars before you can change their mind.
Pretty surprising on Hyundai. I have an 06 Elantra and frankly I like it quite a bit so far. Lots of features in it, good price, dealership was nice and the warranty is great. I didn't think the company would do that well during the downturn honestly though, they still have brands they're trying to build up. I think maybe they are offering what the market wants now. People are scared. I know the return the car thing is a gimmick but I think its a good one, especially given Hyundai's resale value problem. The economy is shaky but your car is a crapper and needs to be replaced...you don't want to spend a lot of money though because you're scaling back and you might end up with a pay cut if you even have a job a year from now. Hyundai shows up with a long warranty, low price and offers to buy back the car if things really go to shit on you. If you're just trying to get to work, that is a pretty compelling deal. People probably didn't want to get caught dead driving one of those crappy hyundai's when everything was going good but now that their back is up against the wall maybe that just isn't that big of a concern anymore. If thats what is going on, this is probably a good long term play for Hyundai. I think personally their cars have improved, but they have a bad image problem where people won't touch them. If they have to scare people into the cars, so be it...you have to get them into the cars before you can change their mind.
Genesis is indeed going after Lexus/BMW/MB.
But you just proved my point by pointing out Toyota creating lexus (and Scion), just as Honda created Acura and Nissan created Infiniti.
Where's datsun? Weren't they a butt of all car jokes at one time? But now they're called Nissan.
Hyundai tops out where lexus begins, so while there's a bit of overlap (there always is, even between same-company brands like Toyota and Lexus), its absurd to say that a company that makes cars from 10k to 40k is going after a company that makes 40k-100k cars.
If they do decide to go after the luxury brands, then they'll need a new brand, they'll have to do it with way more than 1 car and they'll have to start playing down or get rid of the "value" thing. Its hard to think of any purveyor of luxury goods whose main feature is value.
As for datsun, that's not really comparable. Nissan has always been Nissan, Datsun was a test-the-waters brand they used for a few years, then quickly skuttled.
Funny, I was willing to give them a chance too. My stickler was resale values. Then I quoted lease rates on the Entourage...the 3/36k lease payments were higher than the 60mo loan....yikes
trenchfoot
Lifer
- Aug 5, 2000
- 16,139
- 8,733
- 136
Long term, stable and steady income strategy won out over short term maximum profits-this-very-second "planning".
And -
Offer a product that lasts longer, with better looks, better bang for the buck, better quality, better gas milage, better reliability = higher demand = higher resale value = even higher demand = even higher and higher sales.
Why is it that something this simple could not have been recognized and capitalized upon by the Big Three that would have prevented them from getting stuck in this horrendous downward spiraling rut they've been mired in since the mid-70's I'll never know.
I guess being King of the Hill for so long gave them a false sense of superiority and a sneeringly arrogant attitude toward their seemingly weak off-shore rivals, so much so that they foolishly ignored the basic principles of being competitive and instead concentrated on being boorish manipulative profiteers.
And -
Offer a product that lasts longer, with better looks, better bang for the buck, better quality, better gas milage, better reliability = higher demand = higher resale value = even higher demand = even higher and higher sales.
Why is it that something this simple could not have been recognized and capitalized upon by the Big Three that would have prevented them from getting stuck in this horrendous downward spiraling rut they've been mired in since the mid-70's I'll never know.
I guess being King of the Hill for so long gave them a false sense of superiority and a sneeringly arrogant attitude toward their seemingly weak off-shore rivals, so much so that they foolishly ignored the basic principles of being competitive and instead concentrated on being boorish manipulative profiteers.
PingSpike
Lifer
- Feb 25, 2004
- 21,765
- 615
- 126
They have the same problem as American makers with resale value. It doesn't make sense for them to lease a car when its worth hardly anything when it comes back. I think it was GM and Chysler that killed off leases completely? And Ford I know used a similar strategy where they just raised the lease rate to the point where it makes no sense.
5150Joker
Diamond Member
Hyundai can discount their shit by 50% and I wouldn't touch it. I made the mistake of purchasing a Kia Sportage and that thing gave me constant problems and anguish. I'm currently renting a 2008 Pontiac G6 --until I find out later today if financing for a car I bought yesterday goes through--and so far the Pontiac is leaps and bounds better than the shitty Kia I owned. What's even more impressive is that the G6 handles and accelerates a lot better than some BMW's I tested yesterday.
I agree, a few people commenting here that they love their Korean car does not mean they are good cars overall. I've heard nothing but horror stories from my mechanic about those things, from failures covered by warranty to heating units going after 25k that aren't covered, and cost 600 shipped from Korea. He says just buy a damn Honda to pretty much everyone. Plus, at least for Kia, you can tell its a piece of shit just from looking at it. Once you get inside its even worse. I seem to think that newer Hyundai's are nicer, but my friend has like an 02 elantra.. what a piece of crap lol.
Have a 05 forester and it is a great car in the snow, and really a fun car to drive. Cost like.. 15k used. I really don't know why anyone would buy a car that is not AWD unless they live in Florida or something.
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