Christians on Decline, Non-believers Skyrocketing in US

[sandorski]

There's going to be some big surprises in store for people, I am very sad to say.

Yup, when we're all standing before Zeus, only the ones who have memorized the Pantheon amongst us will stand a chance.

 

[shortylickens]

this wouldnt bother me if more Americans were embracing science as an alternative. But I think they're mostly embracing the Kardasians instead.

 

[1prophet]

Soon the left will direct their hate towards Islam, but they aren't done with Christians yet.

Doubtful, since Islam doesn't turn the other cheek.

this wouldnt bother me if more Americans were embracing science as an alternative. But I think they're mostly embracing the Kardasians instead.

This, the me first mentality that has permeated our society from the welfare queen to the wall street king where greed and covetousness is a virtue to be aspired to, is fast becoming the norm, not the boundless, altruistic Star Trek society most had hoped for.

 

[DrPizza]

this wouldnt bother me if more Americans were embracing science as an alternative. But I think they're mostly embracing the Kardasians instead.

I think science actually is playing a roll. When kids learn one thing, and see the preponderance of evidence supporting it, they're a bit more likely to question things than their parents who steadfastly refuse to accept that the Earth is older than 6000 years.

 

[IronWing]

this wouldnt bother me if more Americans were embracing science as an alternative. But I think they're mostly embracing the Kardasians instead.

Goddesses incarnate with the sex tapes to prove it.

 

[MongGrel]

Soon the left will direct their hate towards Islam, but they aren't done with Christians yet.

One of the truly saddest things is most of the so called "Left" in your addled mind believe in values that Christians are supposed to believe to begin with.

Is pretty pathetic to look at on a daily basis, really.

You really believe everyone that is a Democrat is non-religious in some alternate universe ?

 

[Ricochet]

There's going to be some big surprises in store for people, I am very sad to say.

That blastingcap's prediction of Islam overtaking Xtianity as the US main religion? Oh yeah, I will be extremely surprised. Us freethinkers and humanists, of course, will continue the ideological battle against oppressing world views.

Although I'm extremely grateful that the majority of Xtians are moderates who ignore the Old Testament almost completely, it will be glorious once the majority of the population divorce itself from the mind shackle that is religion.

 

[mindmajick]

Doubtful, since Islam doesn't turn the other cheek.




This, the me first mentality that has permeated our society from the welfare queen to the wall street king where greed and covetousness is a virtue to be aspired to, is fast becoming the norm, not the boundless, altruistic Star Trek society most had hoped for.

http://philadelphia.cbslocal.com/20...the-other-cheek-as-anti-islam-bus-ads-appear/

http://www.lamppostproductions.com/islam-turning-the-other-cheek/

 

[stormkroe]

I think science actually is playing a roll. When kids learn one thing, and see the preponderance of evidence supporting it, they're a bit more likely to question things than their parents who steadfastly refuse to accept that the Earth is older than 6000 years.

I kind of see a model of 'micro-reformations' as science forces rational people to abandon old presuppositions on doctrine. The radical shifts are probably over now that scriptures are freely available to the laity, no more just taking the word of a priest.
I had to remove my family from our last church about 8 months ago because of my belief in an old universe, a 'local' flood event, humans being around for 100k +/- years, etc.
The old fashioned beliefs aren't as numerous as they once were, it's just that they (Ken Hamm, Kent Hovind, Jason Lyle, etc) beat a LOUD drum.
/$0.02

 

[Nebor]

Maybe you should consider that Islam is the fastest growing religion in the US and world and consider the implications. In the near future (2050) it's projected that 1/3 of the world will be Islamic. http://www.cnn.com/2015/04/02/living/pew-study-religion/

Eh, job security. They'll never take over this country, and once Europe gets hot anti-Islamic sentiment here will go through the roof.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

Good. The faster they let go of the fairy tale the quicker we can move onto a better world

The atheists, agnostics, and secular people are going to get out-bred by the Muslims.

 

[davmat787]

Soon the left will direct their hate towards Islam, but they aren't done with Christians yet.

I doubt it, most muslims aren't white.

 

[irishScott]

Personally I thank the internet. Speaking as a millennial, "respect thy elders" really loses its punch when you can google something and pull up dozens of PhDs who directly contradict your parents.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

Calvinist?

 

[Orignal Earl]

Eh, job security. They'll never take over this country, and once Europe gets hot anti-Islamic sentiment here will go through the roof.

What will happen when anti-Islamic sentiment goes through the roof?

America is already full of progessives, liberals, socialists, jews, immigrants, blacks, police, government, gays, and all the other things you righties here hate.

 

[Newell Steamer]

People are tired of religious institutes - no surprise there. And, faith is a very personal thing. Which is why fear was used in Christianity a few centuries ago (and still today in some parts of the world). Fear was the only way to get into someone's head and make them believe what you wanted them to believe.

People are waking up and realizing they aren't evil or bad; they just are. They live their lives as they see fit and that is OK, so long as they are not hurting anyone.

The straw that is breaking a camel's back though is fundamentalism.

Christian fundamentalists are demanding total control over how other people live their lives - yet, they themselves usually live in a manner contrary to Christian beliefs; contrary to beliefs such as love, acceptance, tolerance and respect. As a result, people turn their backs to Christianity.

Islam fundamentalism is also not accepted. Which is why every single one of the 1.6 billion Muslims on this planet haven't wiped out the remaining population (nor will they ever, contrary to what certain posters on these forums 'know' about Islam). Islamic fundamentalism will fade. ISIS is being pounded by Iran for goodness sake. It's not like they have taken over the entire Arab world.

So, I am not surprised by this news.

It is unfortunate that we've moved into the direction of religion leaving a bad taste in our mouths, but, I can only hope that will fade with time and people do return to some form of acknowledgement to the existence of a being or force that guides us, for our own benefit and happiness in this life.

 

[TheSlamma]

Wow, people waking up

It's finally "Morning in America!"

 

[Ventanni]

I kind of see a model of 'micro-reformations' as science forces rational people to abandon old presuppositions on doctrine. The radical shifts are probably over now that scriptures are freely available to the laity, no more just taking the word of a priest.
I had to remove my family from our last church about 8 months ago because of my belief in an old universe, a 'local' flood event, humans being around for 100k +/- years, etc.
The old fashioned beliefs aren't as numerous as they once were, it's just that they (Ken Hamm, Kent Hovind, Jason Lyle, etc) beat a LOUD drum.
/$0.02

So, I went and saw Ken Hamm at a local church here in Tampa, FL a few months back, because even as a devout Christian, I, too, am a bit critical of the young Earth theory. As someone who actually reads the Bible and the old Testament, there's nothing in the Bible that states that the Earth is 10,000ish years old. There just isn't. But if I figured I was going to be hyper critical about the matter, I best go and actually listen to what the man says so that I can form my own ideas. I mean, that's smart, right? And here's what I learned, so hear me out:

The reality is, the Young Earth vs Old Earth debate is merely the symptom of what's truly going on. Ken Hamm's main point in his Creationist crusade, which I can respect, is that if I can't take the first 11 chapters of the Bible seriously, then I can't take the rest of the Bible seriously either. Now, as someone who actually reads the Bible, there is a tremendous amount of fruit in what both the New and the Old Testament teaches. The Bible teaches giving, love, forgiveness, money management principles, servitude, and hope. It teaches how I should treat my wife, and how my wife should treat me. And aside from it's salvation message, it does teach one thing that all of you who read this should understand; it teaches value in people. As an example, I may not like some person, but I'm still taught to love them regardless. And these are all things that, regardless of our beliefs, we can all get behind. Yes, there are Christians out there who swing a very militant bat, but that's just people being people.

Ken Hamm's primary point is that these things don't change. As humans, our values can change over time. They can also be susceptible to being changed by what someone says. World War 2 for example? God's values, however, do not. God's value and love for you does not change. To God, you are still a masterpiece of His creation, and you are to be loved, treated with respect, and nurtured regardless of what we think.

And you know what, that resonated with me. I can get behind that even despite if I think interpreting the Bible in such a literal fashion (regarding our creation) feels awkward. Because no longer am I thinking about how I'm created. I'm already created. I'm already here! We're already here! Regardless of whether the universe is 15 billion years old or 10,000 years old, it doesn't change the fact that we're all still here and living our lives. And despite our beliefs, we're still held accountable to how we treat, view, and respect those who live with us on this planet.

So what should we really be thinking about here? What's the warning that Ken Hamm was trying to tell me? It's not about us, it's about our children. I've stated this on these forums before, but this is why I say it: In the United States of America, it is God and His biblical teaching that form the moral foundation of how we should live, love, and treat others. And if we remove that, we ultimately remove the value of people and the others that live around us. Yes, this is a stark warning to everyone. Who's going to teach others that your child is worth something? Would you rather someone who's viewpoint can change appropriate value to your child, or would you rather God, who's value in your child does not change do so?

Case in point, let's look at some examples in our Earth's history when God, and ultimately, human value was removed from the equation. In North Korea, religion is outlawed entirely. Look at their human rights track record. Did they not just execute someone with AA cannons? And not just that, how many people are sent to Soviet-style gulags to die? I see no value there, only a regime desperate to hold a grip on its power. And China? Religion is essentially outlawed as well. And as a people, look at what they suffer from that isn't spoken about very often: Greed, selfishness, disrespect for the environment. Even the Chinese will tell you that their culture's love of money has to improve, because their human rights record and the way they treat employees is not good. And India? Huge population, and while religion is not outlawed there, the Untouchable caste system which existed for well over a millennium is what happens when God is taken out of the picture. Want me to keep going? The Soviet Union? Nazi Germany? The list goes on. Has the United States been perfectly Christian? Nope! We're human just like everyone else, but it is because of Christian values that we've done things like abolished slavery, abolished segregation, asked for forgiveness for the way that we treated the Native Americans on this continent (which was not Biblical to begin with), and others.

So what's the important message here? It's about our kids. If you don't believe in God, then that's fine. That's your choice, and I respect that. But understand that without God, you have no viable alternative to teaching the next generation the importance of loving one another. Sure, you can try, but those values can change just like history books can be changed, and we've seen many cases in history where exactly that happened. The Bible cannot be changed, and because God's word cannot be changed, His viewpoint of your value cannot be changed, and I'm held accountable to that.

So be careful in your war against Christianity. You might just find yourself poking holes in your own ship.

 

[blastingcap]

So, I went and saw Ken Hamm at a local church here in Tampa, FL a few months back, because even as a devout Christian, I, too, am a bit critical of the young Earth theory. As someone who actually reads the Bible and the old Testament, there's nothing in the Bible that states that the Earth is 10,000ish years old. There just isn't. But if I figured I was going to be hyper critical about the matter, I best go and actually listen to what the man says so that I can form my own ideas. I mean, that's smart, right? And here's what I learned, so hear me out:

The reality is, the Young Earth vs Old Earth debate is merely the symptom of what's truly going on. Ken Hamm's main point in his Creationist crusade, which I can respect, is that if I can't take the first 11 chapters of the Bible seriously, then I can't take the rest of the Bible seriously either. Now, as someone who actually reads the Bible, there is a tremendous amount of fruit in what both the New and the Old Testament teaches. The Bible teaches giving, love, forgiveness, money management principles, servitude, and hope. It teaches how I should treat my wife, and how my wife should treat me. And aside from it's salvation message, it does teach one thing that all of you who read this should understand; it teaches value in people. As an example, I may not like some person, but I'm still taught to love them regardless. And these are all things that, regardless of our beliefs, we can all get behind. Yes, there are Christians out there who swing a very militant bat, but that's just people being people.

Ken Hamm's primary point is that these things don't change. As humans, our values can change over time. They can also be susceptible to being changed by what someone says. World War 2 for example? God's values, however, do not. God's value and love for you does not change. To God, you are still a masterpiece of His creation, and you are to be loved, treated with respect, and nurtured regardless of what we think.

And you know what, that resonated with me. I can get behind that even despite if I think interpreting the Bible in such a literal fashion (regarding our creation) feels awkward. Because no longer am I thinking about how I'm created. I'm already created. I'm already here! We're already here! Regardless of whether the universe is 15 billion years old or 10,000 years old, it doesn't change the fact that we're all still here and living our lives. And despite our beliefs, we're still held accountable to how we treat, view, and respect those who live with us on this planet.

So what should we really be thinking about here? What's the warning that Ken Hamm was trying to tell me? It's not about us, it's about our children. I've stated this on these forums before, but this is why I say it: In the United States of America, it is God and His biblical teaching that form the moral foundation of how we should live, love, and treat others. And if we remove that, we ultimately remove the value of people and the others that live around us. Yes, this is a stark warning to everyone. Who's going to teach others that your child is worth something? Would you rather someone who's viewpoint can change appropriate value to your child, or would you rather God, who's value in your child does not change do so?

Case in point, let's look at some examples in our Earth's history when God, and ultimately, human value was removed from the equation. In North Korea, religion is outlawed entirely. Look at their human rights track record. Did they not just execute someone with AA cannons? And not just that, how many people are sent to Soviet-style gulags to die? I see no value there, only a regime desperate to hold a grip on its power. And China? Religion is essentially outlawed as well. And as a people, look at what they suffer from that isn't spoken about very often: Greed, selfishness, disrespect for the environment. Even the Chinese will tell you that their culture's love of money has to improve, because their human rights record and the way they treat employees is not good. And India? Huge population, and while religion is not outlawed there, the Untouchable caste system which existed for well over a millennium is what happens when God is taken out of the picture. Want me to keep going? The Soviet Union? Nazi Germany? The list goes on. Has the United States been perfectly Christian? Nope! We're human just like everyone else, but it is because of Christian values that we've done things like abolished slavery, abolished segregation, asked for forgiveness for the way that we treated the Native Americans on this continent (which was not Biblical to begin with), and others.

So what's the important message here? It's about our kids. If you don't believe in God, then that's fine. That's your choice, and I respect that. But understand that without God, you have no viable alternative to teaching the next generation the importance of loving one another. Sure, you can try, but those values can change just like history books can be changed, and we've seen many cases in history where exactly that happened. The Bible cannot be changed, and because God's word cannot be changed, His viewpoint of your value cannot be changed, and I'm held accountable to that.

So be careful in your war against Christianity. You might just find yourself poking holes in your own ship.

Imho, the world would be a better place without religions that ask people to abandon reason and instead embrace "faith," which can be manipulated to suit rulers' wishes. "Don't believe your eyes or try to think about it.. TRUST ME... just do as I say" is not a recipe for a well-functioning society in the long run.

Rulers sometimes tolerate religion if they think they can use religion as a weapon by convincing the flock that so-and-so is an infidel or somesuch... even in modern times, like Emperor Hirohito's personal cult used as a weapon.

Religion has started many wars. You may try to say something like "those who started those wars were not following the TRUE teachings of Christ," but then you'd sound like Muslims who say that people like Daesh aren't following the TRUE teachings of Mohammed. (The problem being that they are following it quite literally in many cases.)

P.S. You sound JUST LIKE Islamic crazies when you talk about immutable words of God.

That said, I do appreciate that the Bible (which btw is NOT immutable, it was written by fallible people and there are disagreements over parts of it) doesn't encourage Christians to mistreat others as much as the unholy Quran (which was likewise written by people.. imho transcribing the words of a mentally ill "prophet" who claimed he heard voices from God after spending too much time in the hills meditating). So given a choice between living in a Christian world and Islamic world, I'd go with the Christians every time.

 

[Nebor]

The atheists, agnostics, and secular people are going to get out-bred by the Muslims.

Even "Christians" aren't breeding beyond the replacement rate. The only thing keeping the US in the black on the birth rate are Mexican immigrants, and all studies show that once they've been here for one generation, their birthrate mimics our own.

Like I said earlier in the thread, once a major European country goes into a spiral of riots and violence due to their major Islamic population, the rest of the world will likely wake up and institute the reforms necessary to fend off an insidious takeover. With atheism on a dramatic rise, that reform might well be the suppression of ALL religions, to which Islam will react most violently, and then be crushed.

 

[Atreus21]

Even "Christians" aren't breeding beyond the replacement rate. The only thing keeping the US in the black on the birth rate are Mexican immigrants, and all studies show that once they've been here for one generation, their birthrate mimics our own.

I've got three. I'm doing my damned part, thank you.

 

[BoberFett]

I think science actually is playing a roll. When kids learn one thing, and see the preponderance of evidence supporting it, they're a bit more likely to question things than their parents who steadfastly refuse to accept that the Earth is older than 6000 years.

Really? You actually believe this change is science based? That seems pretty far fetched given declining science scores in the US. It's far more likely that this change is apathy based. Who the hell wants to get up on a Sunday morning and go to church?

 

[Ronstang]

Even "Christians" aren't breeding beyond the replacement rate. The only thing keeping the US in the black on the birth rate are Mexican immigrants, and all studies show that once they've been here for one generation, their birthrate mimics our own.

Like I said earlier in the thread, once a major European country goes into a spiral of riots and violence due to their major Islamic population, the rest of the world will likely wake up and institute the reforms necessary to fend off an insidious takeover. With atheism on a dramatic rise, that reform might well be the suppression of ALL religions, to which Islam will react most violently, and then be crushed.

Sorry, but you appear to be living in a fantasy world you have created in your mind. Mexicans immigrants are very religious and as the population of Hispanics skyrocket over the next few decades it's likely all the atheists will be very disappointed.....religion and god aren't going any where any time soon.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Maybe you should consider that Islam is the fastest growing religion in the US and world and consider the implications. In the near future (2050) it's projected that 1/3 of the world will be Islamic. http://www.cnn.com/2015/04/02/living/pew-study-religion/

So, you're saying we should embrace Catholicism just to spite Muslims?

 

[Mursilis]

Good. The faster they let go of the fairy tale the quicker we can move onto a better world

Different, yes, but better? What evidence is there of that? I'd say the non-believing future will be neither better nor worse in moral terms.