Choking on Obamacare

[dank69]

The fact the answer would be nothing more than Left Talking points there's no reason to ask even a simple question of you.

I'm sure you've never entered a thread to post a talking point either.

 

[Ausm]

The fact the answer would be nothing more than Left Talking points there's no reason to ask even a simple question of you.

Where are all my left wing talking points? I just post facts that the Right can't seem to handle which 9 times out of 10 I back up with links.

 

[spacejamz]

It just amazes me that anyone could possibly think that such a huge bill could possibly be good for anyone. But almost every single piece of scum who voted for that boondoggle will get sent back to washington every 2 or 6 years. So who is to blame really?

We have to pass the bill so you can find out what is in it!!!!

 

[zsdersw]

Here's ObamaCare in a nutshell:

 

[Ausm]

Here's another good link:

http://www.hhs.gov/news/press/2011pres/09/20110908a.html

 

[Londo_Jowo]

Where are all my left wing talking points? I just post facts that the Right can't seem to handle which 9 times out of 10 I back up with links.

You are so hilarious, you know that you spew forth the same exact crap that's the topic of the day on the dailykos. I make it a point to check there before coming to the forum.

 

[werepossum]

Here's ObamaCare in a nutshell:

http://www.projectcartoon.com/cartoon/345842

LOL!

Here's another good link:

http://www.hhs.gov/news/press/2011pres/09/20110908a.html

Wow, the debate is over.

If we can't trust the government to honestly determine whether a huge expansion to government is working out, next thing we'll be questioning the ability of foxes to guard hen houses.

 

[Ausm]

LOL!


Wow, the debate is over.

If we can't trust the government to honestly determine whether a huge expansion to government is working out, next thing we'll be questioning the ability of foxes to guard hen houses.

Can you post proof which would make the Gubermint a liar in this post?

 

[Ausm]

You are so hilarious, you know that you spew forth the same exact crap that's the topic of the day on the dailykos. I make it a point to check there before coming to the forum.

Lolwut???

 

[Ausm]

http://newssun.suntimes.com/business/9105050-420/story.html


A 50 percent discount that the law secured from pharmaceutical companies on brand name drugs yielded an average savings of $581. Medicare also picked up more of the cost of generic drugs, saving an additional $2

If Republicans succeed in repealing what they dismiss as “Obamacare,” the discounts would be wiped out as well

http://insurancenewsnet.com/article.aspx?id=304442

http://blog.chron.com/texaspolitics...s-in-texas-save-millions-thanks-to-obamacare/

http://www.nilesstar.com/2011/12/11/affordable-care-act/

Good luck GOP in Repealing the Affordable Care Act when your constituents are saving cash from it.

 

[werepossum]

Can you post proof which would make the Gubermint a liar in this post?

No. Neither can I post proof that JHK wasn't murdered by Castro. That doesn't make either of those things true.

 

[Ausm]

No. Neither can I post proof that JHK wasn't murdered by Castro. That doesn't make either of those things true.

SO basically EVERYTHING you post is factual correct without anything to back it up....OOOOOKKK.

You are claiming your links are factual but mine from the U.S Gubermint are not.

Would you believe this post if a Republican was running the White House?

Oh, If these numbers I posted were not accurate the Right Wing media would been all over like stink on shit. Fox news would been running the debunking 24 X 7.

 

[cybrsage]

No. Neither can I post proof that JFK wasn't murdered by Castro. That doesn't make either of those things true.

JFK was murdered by Bush Sr. as part of his plot to get his son to be President so he could blow up the twin towers and attack Iraq.

DUH!

 

[werepossum]

SO basically EVERYTHING you post is factual correct without anything to back it up....OOOOOKKK.

You are claiming your links are factual but mine from the U.S Gubermint are not.

Would you believe this post if a Republican was running the White House?

Oh, If these numbers I posted were not accurate the Right Wing media would been all over like stink on shit. Fox news would been running the debunking 24 X 7.

I wasn't going to bring it up, but yes. Yes it is.

My point was that government's first priority is the preservation and growth of government. This is true of any entity; eventually the entity becomes more important that the thing it was supposed to address. In the private sector this is self-correcting - IBM ignores the computer market it created (commercial personal computer hardware) and subsequently gets booted out of that market. In government, not so much. Thus government very, very seldom finds that an expansion of government has been a bad thing, and even though more money is required than was estimated, even more money would presumably be needed had the expansion not occurred.

JFK was murdered by Bush Sr. as part of his plot to get his son to be President so he could blow up the twin towers and attack Iraq.

DUH!

LOL!

 

[mattpegher]

http://newssun.suntimes.com/business/9105050-420/story.html


A 50 percent discount that the law secured from pharmaceutical companies on brand name drugs yielded an average savings of $581. Medicare also picked up more of the cost of generic drugs, saving an additional $2

If Republicans succeed in repealing what they dismiss as “Obamacare,” the discounts would be wiped out as well

http://insurancenewsnet.com/article.aspx?id=304442

http://blog.chron.com/texaspolitics...s-in-texas-save-millions-thanks-to-obamacare/

http://www.nilesstar.com/2011/12/11/affordable-care-act/

Good luck GOP in Repealing the Affordable Care Act when your constituents are saving cash from it.

The problem with statistics like these is that it is unclear if the cost savings that the goverment program obtained was obtained via decreasing pharmaceutical companies profit margin or by shifting the expense to other payors.
Medicaid is a prime example. The government pays so little for the services that without shifting the expense to other payors, there wouldnt be an open ER in the country that could survive on what Medicaid pays.

 

[werepossum]

The problem with statistics like these is that it is unclear if the cost savings that the goverment program obtained was obtained via decreasing pharmaceutical companies profit margin or by shifting the expense to other payors.
Medicaid is a prime example. The government pays so little for the services that without shifting the expense to other payors, there wouldnt be an open ER in the country that could survive on what Medicaid pays.

Yeah, but once government controls everything, we can begin importing doctors from third world countries and replace all that unnecessary diagnostic equipment with magic 8-balls.

 

[mattpegher]

Yeah, but once government controls everything, we can begin importing doctors from third world countries and replace all that unnecessary diagnostic equipment with magic 8-balls.

We already recruit too many doctors from third world countries so you might as well be talking to a magic 8-ball.

Honestly, I dont see the government ever taking over healthcare completely because if they did, they would have to establish the same malpractice standard that they use for the military. Ie you can complain to your superior and it might get reviewed but it is unlikely the patient will get anything more than a "sorry" out of it.
The government is made up of lawyers, they will never enact any law that limits the income of lawyers. Its just about as difficult as trying to get them to agree to election finance reform.

Does anyone know how malpractice is handled in UHC countries?
If your doctor says you dont need a study or a drug, can you pressure him to get what you want?
What are the statistics regarding studies done in ER in UK vs here? CT's for abdominal pain, or head injury?

I will have to see if anyone has done any studies.

 

[IronWing]

The problem with statistics like these is that it is unclear if the cost savings that the goverment program obtained was obtained via decreasing pharmaceutical companies profit margin or by shifting the expense to other payors.
Medicaid is a prime example. The government pays so little for the services that without shifting the expense to other payors, there wouldnt be an open ER in the country that could survive on what Medicaid pays.

What is the cost of care? Is it the invoiced rate care providers produce? Is it the Medicare reimbursement rate? The insurance company negotiated rate? We know that care is expensive but with all parties playing games with the bills it is very difficult to determine the actual cost of care.

 

[Zebo]

Random question: Does anyone know of any studies on what health care and insurance costs will be in 30-40 years? Seems like they go up a ridiculous amount (20%?) each year, which isn't exactly sustainable. If that number if anywhere close to correct, how is health care going to be funded in 2050?

HC doubles every 7 years. Just look at what medicare cost every 7 years, doubled like clockwork. So say you pay $1000 a month now, you will pay $8,000 and month in 30 and $16,000 a month in 40 years.

 

[shira]

Random question: Does anyone know of any studies on what health care and insurance costs will be in 30-40 years? Seems like they go up a ridiculous amount (20%?) each year, which isn't exactly sustainable. If that number if anywhere close to correct, how is health care going to be funded in 2050?

HC doubles every 7 years. Just look at what medicare cost every 7 years, doubled like clockwork. So say you pay $1000 a month now, you will pay $8,000 and month in 30 and $16,000 a month in 40 years.

I don't think this is accurate. The per-capita annual real rate of increase in HC costs is currently between 4% and 5%. Even at 6%, it takes almost 12 years for costs to double in constant dollars.

Yes, the rates of a given plan might jump up 20% or more from one year to the next, but that's not an accurate indicator of the average increase across the entire industry.

 

[mattpegher]

What is the cost of care? Is it the invoiced rate care providers produce? Is it the Medicare reimbursement rate? The insurance company negotiated rate? We know that care is expensive but with all parties playing games with the bills it is very difficult to determine the actual cost of care.

So very true


---
I am here: http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=41.045717,-74.565511

 

[Zorkorist]

Random question: Does anyone know of any studies on what health care and insurance costs will be in 30-40 years? Seems like they go up a ridiculous amount (20%?) each year, which isn't exactly sustainable. If that number if anywhere close to correct, how is health care going to be funded in 2050?

The answer is that the health care industry is seriosly full of itself.

Kind of like Government.

This isn't rocket-science, and helping someone is not that expensive.

90% of what folks need is good Doctors, Nurses, Home Health Aides.

They DON'T need them to be expensive.

-John

 

[Zorkorist]

As soon as you have fake money, however... watch the vultures fly.

-John

 

[Ausm]

I wasn't going to bring it up, but yes. Yes it is.

My point was that government's first priority is the preservation and growth of government. This is true of any entity; eventually the entity becomes more important that the thing it was supposed to address. In the private sector this is self-correcting - IBM ignores the computer market it created (commercial personal computer hardware) and subsequently gets booted out of that market. In government, not so much. Thus government very, very seldom finds that an expansion of government has been a bad thing, and even though more money is required than was estimated, even more money would presumably be needed had the expansion not occurred.


LOL!

LMAO You have an AMAZING amount of self confidence....

 

[Ausm]

The problem with statistics like these is that it is unclear if the cost savings that the goverment program obtained was obtained via decreasing pharmaceutical companies profit margin or by shifting the expense to other payors.
Medicaid is a prime example. The government pays so little for the services that without shifting the expense to other payors, there wouldnt be an open ER in the country that could survive on what Medicaid pays.

Ok, but was there any savings at all for Medicare or Medicaid BEFORE this bill was inacted? I think you would be hard pressed to find any instance of savings period.

At least 3/4 of the Affordable Care Act hasn't yet to be implemented so I am looking forward to more savings in the future...If there isn't savings for Americans then the GOP will be partially correct but in this instance I do believe the Affordable Care Act HAS saved money for American Seniors and the GOP is going to have fun clawing that money back from their constituents hands.