Choice of Antec, EVGA or Fractal Design?

[Ronin13]

I'm trying to pick a PSU for a new build. A 650 Watter should be more than enough (no SLI). I'd like a minimum efficiency of 80+ Gold and low'ish noise levels. Doesn't have to be fully modular. Budget around $100.

So far I've found good reviews on

Antec EarthWatts Platinum 650W

EVGA SuperNOVA 650 GS 650W

Fractal Design Edison M 650W

Recommendations for/against any of these?

 

[lehtv]

So far I've found good reviews on

Antec EarthWatts Platinum 650W

EVGA SuperNOVA 650 GS 650W

Fractal Design Edison M 650W

Recommendations for/against any of these?

Skip the EA-650 Platinum. Low-load efficiency is no better than on Gold rated units, in fact it can be worse. Not modular. Uses some 85°C rated capacitors instead of 105°C ones. Only 3 year warranty. Other than that, it's good.

EVGA GS is nice. Personally, if I were buying EVGA I'd go straight for their Super Flower based SuperNova G2 series with long warranty (7 years for 550-650W, 10 years for 750W+). However if the price is right, EVGA GS is definitely worth considering.

Edison M looks like a solid Seasonic G series copy. Noise output seems low, but not the best you could get, especially as there is no zero RPM mode. According to TPU it does get noisy at high loads - which is not really unexpected for any unit.

I'd like a minimum efficiency of 80+ Gold and low'ish noise levels. Doesn't have to be fully modular. Budget around $100.

At current prices (in USD) I'd choose from these:

Seasonic G-550 (SSR-550RM) $83 shipped @ superbiiz - it's big enough for any 200 watt GPU with some OC headroom for the GPU and an Intel CPU. Better buy than the 650W version if you're sure you won't buy the highest end 250W+ GPUs and don't mind a little bit of load noise

Seasonic G-650 (SSR-650RM) $101 shipped @ superbiiz - running one myself, and very happy with it. Very quiet unit for a single GPU setup.

EVGA SuperNova 750W G2 $115 shipped @ superbiiz - 10yr warranty, semi passive fan, top notch quality. Overkill for a single GPU, but $14 is a small cost for doubling the warranty length

 

[Ronin13]

Great reply lehtv, thanks.

I should've mentioned that I'm not in the US but in Denmark, so prices are a bit higher here (with adjusted prices my budget is about $120):

EVGA SuperNOVA 650 GS 650W is $122 (550 would be $115)

Fractal Design Edison M 650W is $129 (550 would be $119)

unfortunately no one here seem to sell the 550 or 650 W EVGA G2s, but the

EVGA SuperNova 750W G2 is $129 and the

Seasonic G-550 is $137

Comparing these, the 750 W G2 does seem like a good buy, but it also seems way too big for my needs (I posted about those here: http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2436127 and would love to hear your thoughts on the question there).

As for zero RPM mode, I would probably disable it anyway, as I'd like the PSU to move a little air even at low power levels (but hopefully with slow and quiet RPMs).

 

[lehtv]

Comparing these, the 750 W G2 does seem like a good buy, but it also seems way too big for my needs

750W is only too big in the sense that you probably won't need to run SLI in the next 10 years. It is not too big in any other way - for a single GPU setup, there is no difference in stability compared to a 550-650W unit. And there is no difference in efficiency (that you should worry about, anyway - if there is a difference, it is minuscule).

So, it may not be worth paying extra for a 750W unit compared to an otherwise equivalent lower wattage unit. Thing is, when it comes to the 750W G2, there is no equivalent lower wattage unit, it is alone in having 10 year warranty.

However... it all boils down to whether it makes more sense to spend extra on the PSU, or on other parts. In your other thread, you said:

I might go as low as a i3 4170 (54W) with a GTX 750Ti (60W) or as high as a i5 4690 (84W) with a GTX 960 (120W).

You will be more than fine with a 450W unit, 550W tops, and you won't have to worry about noise at all.

At this wattage, you don't need a modular unit since you'll be using most cables anyway, and modularity is really not that useful. I would much rather spend a little extra on the CPU, GPU, motherboard or SSD than pay extra for modularity.

Finally, there's little reason to pay more than ~$10 extra for Gold efficiency when running such low wattage parts, because your return of investment will be very slow. You could buy a Bronze 400W-500W unit and still run the PC quiet and stable.

Can you find prices on:
Seasonic S12II 430W
Seasonic S12II 520W
Seasonic M12II 520W
Seasonic G-450
XFX TS 550W Gold

If you could save enough on the PSU, say buy grabbing an S12II 520W, would it be within your budget limits to buy an i5-4460, a GTX 970 and a 120-250GB SSD?

 

[Ronin13]

Thanks for taking your time to check my other tread too!

I'm reading through reviews for the 750 W G2 right now, and while it does seem like a great product I agree that there must be a better (price/performance) match for my needs.

Checking prices:

Seasonic G-450: $114
Seasonic S12II 430W: $76
Seasonic S12II 520W: $82
Seasonic M12II 520W: $82
XFX TS 550W Gold: $95

I'll check out reviews for some of those copper rated ones next...

(As for your question about parts, I've already factored in a 500GB SSD, still deciding on CPU/GPU.)

 

[lehtv]

At those prices, go for M12II 520W. The build quality, reliability and warranty of all those units is equal to that of Seasonic G series or EVGA GS series. S12II and M12II are known to run quiet at low-mid loads. XFX's Bronze rated units spin the fan a bit more aggressively, but the Gold rated TS 550 should be just as quiet as S12II and M12II.

 

[Ronin13]

Thank you, will read up on those. But in your opinion M12II is better than S12II? Is the only difference that the M is modular?

(On a PSU of this this size, being modular probably won't matter much. And aren't non-modular a teeny bit more efficient?)

Btw, looking at your avatar, I hope you've seen the Andromeda trailer

 

[TemjinGold]

OP, what do you plan on DOING with this system? If it's gaming, those video card picks aren't the best for your money.

 

[lehtv]

But in your opinion M12II is better than S12II? Is the only difference that the M is modular?

Yes.

And aren't non-modular a teeny bit more efficient?

Not that I know of... Here's an example:

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/Antec/HCG-620/5.html
http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/Antec/HCG-620M/5.html

HCG-620 on the left, HCG-620M on the right

I hope you've seen the Andromeda trailer

Yes

 

[Ronin13]

The Seasonic S/M12II is starting to look like a great fit. Seems like it has very good efficiency at low levels, where my PC spends most of its time (seems to be just as good as the Gold rated ones I've been looking at).

OP, what do you plan on DOING with this system? If it's gaming, those video card picks aren't the best for your money.

Some light gaming, yes. But mostly 2D games (Fallout 1&2, StarCraft, Baldur's Gate and the like) and some less demanding 3D games like KotOR 1&2 and Mass Effect series.

Obviously, the new Mass Effect coming next year might be taxing, but I'll cross that bridge when we get there. Also, I'm on a 1280x1024 screen.

 

[lehtv]

I would upgrade to 1080p... i3 + GTX 960 is enough to run 1080p respectably well in new games. IMO it's silly to even consider an i5 when running such a low res monitor.

 

[Ronin13]

Yeah, I really dislike widescreens for PC use. I considered the Eizo FlexScan S2133 @ 1600x1200, but it's rather expensive at $875...

 

[lehtv]

You would quickly adjust to liking the extra 640 horizontal pixels. I'm pretty sure your dislike of widescreens is mostly a matter of not being accustomed to them

 

[Ronin13]

You may well be right about that.

But assuming I stay with my low res, what in your opinion would be my best price/performance CPU? I like the pricepoint of the i3 4170, but am unsure of what benefit (if any) I'd get from going with a true 4 core i5 instead. (I'm not doing anything particularly taxing - mostly browsing, the occasional movie and the above mentioned light gaming.)

 

[lehtv]

Currently, a Haswell i3 is capable of running practically any game at a playable framerate, regardless of resolution. It just comes down to the graphics card to run graphically intensive games well enough.

The i3 is fast enough that on 1080p, a card like GTX 960 won't be significantly limited, but a faster card like GTX 970 will be. On 1280x1024, however, it's a different story. 1280x1024 has about 37% fewer pixels to render compared to 1080p, which means that a GPU 37% slower than GTX 960 - say, a 750 Ti - would not be significantly limited by the i3, while a card like GTX 960 would be. On your resolution, GTX 960 would be trying to get higher framerates than it could do on 1080p, but an i3 wouldn't allow it (sometimes it would, often not).

So, here are your options:

1. Lowest cost: i3 + 750 Ti + 1280x1024 - Perfect for low power consumption and light gaming, could run it easily and quietly even on a Seasonic G360.
2. Low cost but upgradeable: i5 + 750 Ti + 1280x1024 - As above, but supports a graphics card upgrade without requiring a CPU upgrade.
3. Long term option: i5 + GTX 960 + 1280x1024 - The extra performance of GTX 960 will likely not matter for light gaming, but it'll likely last longer before you need to upgrade. Also supports monitor upgrade without needing a new graphics card.
4. Best immediate experience: i3 + GTX 960 + 1920x1080 - comparable framerates to running 750 Ti on 1280x1024, but at 50% more horizontal screen space (which is also great for watching movies or series and for multitasking)

Whatever you do, buy the 2GB version of the card. Not 750 Ti 1GB, not GTX 960 4GB.

 

[Ronin13]

Thanks again, good stuff. (And yes, I'm only considering 2 GB GPU options.)

If I do go with an i5 over an i3 (where the 4170 is the one to get, no?), which i5 should I look at? No OC planned, so I don't mind it being locked.

And a power question: At the same low workload, do a 54W i3 and a 84W i5 (from the same generation) use the same power, or is the CPU with the lower rated TDP always more effecient? (but obviously unable to work as hard...)

 

[ignatzatsonic]

Can you supply a link to the vendors from which you intend to purchase?

You're in Denmark. Do you have access to PSUs from the Super Flower brand?

I'm guessing your cost for electric power is noticeably higher than in the USA, which would mean that high efficiency at your anticipated load is all the more valuable. I think i read that some areas of Scandinavia pay 40 or 50 cents per KWH?

 

[Ronin13]

I use this for finding prices:

http://www.edbpriser.dk/hardware/stroemforsyning.aspx

a shop I might buy from is this:

http://www.computersalg.dk/produkter/556/strømforsyninger___pc_server - they have Super Flower PSUs.

I actually don't know what I'm paying for power, but from a quick search it seems like it's in the 30 cents per KWH range.

 

[lehtv]

(where the 4170 is the one to get, no?)

i3-4160 could be better bang for buck

which i5 should I look at?

i5-4460 most likely offers the best GHz per cost.

I actually don't know what I'm paying for power, but from a quick search it seems like it's in the 30 cents per KWH range.

Looks like it may be worth buying a Gold unit. Especially if that 30 cents per kWh is just for the power itself and does not include the power transfer cost.

At the same low workload, do a 54W i3 and a 84W i5 (from the same generation) use the same power, or is the CPU with the lower rated TDP always more effecient?

The i5 will almost always use more power, because it can. But a few dozen watts difference is negligible for practical purposes and does not impact PSU choice... except perhaps if building a very tight ITX setup with low profile cooling that needs to stay quiet at load

http://www.computersalg.dk/produkter...er___pc_server - they have Super Flower PSUs.

Only the Leadex models are worth considering, and they're 650W+

 

[ignatzatsonic]

I actually don't know what I'm paying for power, but from a quick search it seems like it's in the 30 cents per KWH range.

At 30 cents, that's $45 for every thousand hours of operation, assuming 150 watts usage.

If the PC is on and using 150 watts half the time (4380 hours per year), that's $197 per year. Adjust accordingly.

You can easily estimate how much a 1%, 3%, or 5% difference in efficiency might cost you.

 

[TemjinGold]

Yeah, I really dislike widescreens for PC use. I considered the Eizo FlexScan S2133 @ 1600x1200, but it's rather expensive at $875...

Have you visited a computer store to check one out personally? If you've seen and tried one, that's one thing but if not, you owe it to yourself to check because a good 1080p is WAY cheaper than that and much better looking.

 

[Ronin13]

Checking up on the Seasonic S12II, it doesn't seem to have the best acoustics, and ideally yes, I would like to go with a Gold rated unit.

Contenders (with local prices):

(Seasonic G-550 $137 - too expensive)

EVGA G2 550 $125 - upper limit of my budget, would like to go cheaper

Fractal Design Edison 550 $120

EVGA GS 550 $120

XFX XTR 550 $117

XFX TS 550 $96 - still have to do some research on XFX models

and then there's this:

Cooler Master V550S $92

from the reviews I've found it seems to be doing exactly what I want: Gold (or close to Platinum) efficiency - *especially at low loads*, very quiet and a decent price.

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/CoolerMaster/V550S/1.html

http://www.pureoverclock.com/Review-detail/cooler-master-v550-psu-review/

Thoughts?

 

[philipma1957]

Checking up on the Seasonic S12II, it doesn't seem to have the best acoustics, and ideally yes, I would like to go with a Gold rated unit.

Contenders (with local prices):

(Seasonic G-550 $137 - too expensive)

EVGA G2 550 $125 - upper limit of my budget, would like to go cheaper

Fractal Design Edison 550 $120

EVGA GS 550 $120

XFX XTR 550 $117

XFX TS 550 $96 - still have to do some research on XFX models

and then there's this:

Cooler Master V550S $92

from the reviews I've found it seems to be doing exactly what I want: Gold (or close to Platinum) efficiency - *especially at low loads*, very quiet and a decent price.

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/CoolerMaster/V550S/1.html

http://www.pureoverclock.com/Review-detail/cooler-master-v550-psu-review/

Thoughts?

yeah I just got this psu

450 watt plat semi modular for 99.99
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B009X8E9D4?

they have a 550watt model for 113.98
semi modular the 2 cables are the cpu cable and the 24 pin cable

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B009X8E9D4?


my thoughts are this 550watt model is perfect for you.

I do own and have owned more then 60 psu's.

the antec 650 watt plat is nice but all cables are attached to it.

my 450watt fsp plat has been running for a week only 2 cables which I truly like.

My pc needs the cpu cable and the 24 pin cable since it uses a m2 ssd as the booter . so the 2 cable attached to the psu are exactly what I need.

 

[ignatzatsonic]

XFX XTR 550 $117

XFX TS 550 $96 - still have to do some research on XFX models

and then there's this:

Cooler Master V550S $92

from the reviews I've found it seems to be doing exactly what I want: Gold (or close to Platinum) efficiency - *especially at low loads*, very quiet and a decent price.

Those 3 would be my choices among your local alternatives.

I was PSU shopping in March and saw the same review you did about the Coolermaster. Seems impressive; I think it's made by Enhance.

The 2 XFX units are made by Seasonic.

In your shoes, considering your alternatives, I'd dig into reviews for finer points, particularly about noise levels if that's a concern. Take a look at efficiency curves. Consider warranty and look for any customer service clues both for the manufacturer and your supplier. Make sure cables are long enough for your case.

Beyond that, I wouldn't agonize a lot. There's always a chance you'll get a bad example or have bad luck and all your research can't prevent that.

 

[Ronin13]

Thanks for your sugestion Phillip, but those units don't seem to be available here (and if they were they'd probably be between 25 and 65% more expensive than in the US, as most of the PSUs I'm looking at - the CM V550S being the exception).

***

That makes sense, ignatz. Looking at the XFX units they seem like they may be quite noisy under load, which definitely is a concern (even though I initially may not load them much).

Comparing some more, the Cooler Master V550S does seem to stand out with both very high efficiency (and again, especially at the low levels where I'll be running it) and very quiet operation.

At this point there seem to be no reason to go with the more expensive Seasonic based units from either EVGA, Fractal or XFX.

As for the case this is going in, I'm trying to be patient for the Fractal Design Define R5 Blackout Edition (no window) to start shipping. If I can't wait, I'll go with the basic model...

edit: Another feather in the CM V550S's cap:

http://uk.hardware.info/reviews/5031/13/19-500-550w-power-supplies-group-test-conclusion