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China to increase military spending 17%

It doesn't suprised since we raised ours. Maybe we can run them into the ground like we did the Soviet Union.

Btw Skoorbie - its on 😉

EDIT: SPELLING
 
You are going to hear two or three explanations of this.
1. They were going to do it no matter what we did. They are really serious about Taiwan and are convinced we will actively participate if they try to take it back by force. If they want to play with us they had better add a few 0's to that percentage.
2. They did it in response to the US doing _____. The critics will say we have contributed to the destabilization of the world,etc,etc,etc.
3. We are trying to force them to go the way of the Soviet. I don't think it is the same situation in China as it was in the USSR. Don't think it will work.

JMO
 


<< Chief, why don't you think it would work? >>



wishful thinking. No one can ignore China's economic power. Major corporations around the world are pouring billions of dollars into China everyday.
 


<< <- runs outside with a shovel and starts creating a bunker >>


I don't think we are quite there yet. You could probably wait 2 or 3 days.



<< Chief, why don't you think it would work? >>


I hesitate to answer because I'm still doing research but, except for Taiwan, I don't get the impression that China is expansionist. The Soviets were burdened with trying to prop up all the Warsaw Pact countries and every other Commmunist regime they could find. This in addition to trying to match our military power and having to buy a lot of stuff from us with little being exported. I think China's economy is completely different in that she is a huge exporter and she is getting a lot of foreign investment. Again, I'm no expert and I'm sure the one or two people on this board who are smarter than me will correct me if I'm wrong.😉
 
They might not be expansionist now, but when pushes comes to shove and they're busting at the seams with people, they might decide then need some lebenstraum. While China does not have their hands in as many places as the Soviets did, they do have a hand in North Korea. I agree about the economy, that's the unknown variable. I do think at some point in time they will make a move on Taiwan, it seems inevitable. And I know we will respond.



<< I hesitate to answer because I'm still doing research but, except for Taiwan, I don't get the impression that China is expansionist. The Soviets were burdened with trying to prop up all the Warsaw Pact countries and every other Commmunist regime they could find. This in addition to trying to match our military power and having to buy a lot of stuff from us with little being exported. I think China's economy is completely different in that she is a huge exporter and she is getting a lot of foreign investment. Again, I'm no expert and I'm sure the one or two people on this board who are smarter than me will correct me if I'm wrong.😉 >>

 


<< I think China's economy is completely different in that she is a huge exporter and she is getting a lot of foreign investment. >>

Yes, a huge exporter of coffee cups and stuffed dolls.

China has a strong economy but it is still not as strong as the US. They have a large army but quality always bests quantity and in this century as technology has an ever-increasing presense in military conflict this chasm will only widen.

Taiwan is not entirely defenseless by itself. The real question is where does the rest of the world stand? I don't think the US should back Taiwan if China really goes gung ho on this. It's too much risk for WW III. However, if the rest of the world helps out as well I think China would have a damn hard/impossible time taking back Taiwan. Their Navy can't cut it. Their air force might be good but their ground forces are useless if they can't get them across the water because Aegis destroyers are saying no.
 
china gets a lot of foreign investment, but it also invests heavily in other countries. taking out a home loan? some of that comes from china...

They might not be expansionist now, but when pushes comes to shove and they're busting at the seams with people, they might decide then need some lebenstraum. While China does not have their hands in as many places as the Soviets did, they do have a hand in North Korea.

no, lebenstraum is not going to happen...

a.) they've got the population problem under control
b.) they're not stupid

i'm sorry, but i just don't see china turning expansionist, and i don't see where you draw that conclusion.
 


<< China has a strong economy but it is still not as strong as the US. >>



Won't be too long before they catch up.
 
1) if you look up the nation name for both china and taiwan you would find
China=People republic of China (communist-one government)
Taiwan=republic of China (like u.s.a got many different party, and the people choose by voting.)

there is no question that taiwan belong to China, just the question of which Chinese government should run it
and there is no question if it cannot be solve peacefully, it will be ugly
what i don't like about western media is they are making it look like china is claiming foreign land, and act like bully. when in fact it is unfinish civil war.
if you are a good research, you would also find the government at Taiwan also claim all part of mainland China as it's own, and if chance given, it would definely sent army into mainland China to regain loss land from the communist.

2) what china are spenting in military, it's packet change compare to what U.S.A are spending.
it's packet change compare what Japan are spending

i hope both Chinese government can solve this in peaceful matter, but if you look harder. U.S.A are actually the biggest bully against peaceful talk between them.
 


<< I don't think the US should back Taiwan if china really goes gung ho on this. It's too much risk for WW III. >>

Look at what comes out of Taiwan. I don't think that we'd hesitate to back them. The first thing I thought of was that post in GH. Almost all Motherboard makers have fabs in Taiwan. I gotta have my hammer board!

In all seriousness though,


<< Jiang said: "to solve the issue of Taiwan and realize complete reunification of the motherland is one of the three major tasks for the Party and the nation in the new century." >>

that's no good.
 


<< 1) if you look up the nation name for both china and taiwan you would find
China=People republic of China (communist-one government)
Taiwan=republic of China (like u.s.a got many different party, and the people choose by voting.)

there is no question that taiwan belong to China, just the question of which Chinese government should run it
and there is no question if it cannot be solve peacefully, it will be ugly
what i don't like about western media is they are making it look like china is claiming foreign land, and act like bully. when in fact it is unfinish civil war.
if you are a good research, you would also find the government at Taiwan also claim all part of mainland China as it's own, and if chance given, it would definely sent army into mainland China to regain loss land from the communist.

2) what china are spenting in military, it's packet change compare to what U.S.A are spending.
it's packet change compare what Japan are spending

i hope both Chinese government can solve this in peaceful matter, but if you look harder. U.S.A are actually the biggest bully against peaceful talk between them. >>




EXACTLY.

from a fair and just standpoint, taiwan is rightfully property of china. *however* because people don't like the chinese government, they try to twist this into an invasion of sorts. this makes no judgement as to whether it is a good or bad thing that PROC rule taiwan... just stating the facts.
 
China's military is based on an obsolete Cold War doctrine that did not have foresight into the logistical problems of supporting several million-strong rifle-based armies, hundred-strong warship forces, and thousand-strong aircraft forces. More modern armies (like the U.S.) can put focus twenty to thirty times the firepower into a thousand mile-wide hinterland than Peking's army can muster, making her but a paper tigress. Even India can focus more force along there border than China could ever hope to muster.

The problem with any army like China's is that it takes a dozen to support one fighter, a hundred to support one tank, a thousand to support one airplane, and a million to support one nuke...
 
the best situation right now is just to keep it as it is. China always makes verbal threats, it really doesnt mean they are acutally gonna do anything. maybe 100 years down the road, when china becomes a developed country, i believe this issue will dissolve by itself.

Economic reform is only the first step, i believe political reform is soon to follow, and i truly believe china will become more and more democratic down the road as the economy gets more prosperous. just gotta give it some time, it is impossible to turn a communist country into a democratic one over night, or else it would end up like Russia.
 


<< Guess they want Taiwan back >>


True, but China is patient and has more immediate problems. . .

China's attempt at revamping its military has been going on for some time now, but Beijing now feels a stronger sense of urgency: its fear of a unipolar world is materializing before its eyes. China feels it is surrounded, with US forces in Central, South and Southeast Asia, with Russia sidling up to Washington, and with Japan rapidly shifting the role and reach of its heretofore purely defensive Self Defense Forces.

The problem Beijing faces is whether to focus its security resources on the potential regional instabilities and the threats to energy supplies posed by U.S. deployments, or to bolster internal security before economic and social pressures tear China apart.

Pentbomb
 
is that 17% the official number or the actual number? the government doesn't spend much on the military, but the military has its own income streams (factories) so its not fully funded (not even half funded) by government revenues. the government figure isn't very large, but it isn't pocket change either. better estimates of actual PLA income put it really close to japan's expenditures.




<< Even India can focus more force along there border than China could ever hope to muster. >>

the only reason that might be even a smidgen of truth is that china has already taken land from india and shifted the border to a more natural location in terms of equal inaccessability. china had a highway up to the border with india, india had a couple of goat paths winding through mountains. guess who won that war?
 
I personally think it's just more big talk from Beijing. Although 17% sounds like an enormous increase, it really isn't. That would bring their military spending up to ~$15 billion a year. The U.S. will still be spending 18 times more than China. $15 billion isn't even double what Taiwan spends. China won't make a move anytime soon as the Bush has shown he isn't afraid to step in with force.
 
from a fair and just standpoint, taiwan is rightfully property of china. *however* because people don't like the chinese government, they try to twist this into an invasion of sorts. this makes no judgement as to whether it is a good or bad thing that PROC rule taiwan... just stating the facts.

Democratic principles rule . . . one party regimes bite (China, Cuba, TX). But I don't understand our stance. Guys that were around during the Civil War (like Red Dawn) probably remember the Union threatening France not to intervene in our internal conflict (ironically, France bankrolled the Colonies during the Revolutionary War). We bluster at any foreign involvement in our government but we puff up our chest about the internal conflicts of other countries?!
 


<< from a fair and just standpoint, taiwan is rightfully property of china. *however* because people don't like the chinese government, they try to twist this into an invasion of sorts. this makes no judgement as to whether it is a good or bad thing that PROC rule taiwan... just stating the facts.

Democratic principles rule . . . one party regimes bite (China, Cuba, TX). But I don't understand our stance. Guys that were around during the Civil War (like Red Dawn) probably remember the Union threatening France not to intervene in our internal conflict (ironically, France bankrolled the Colonies during the Revolutionary War). We bluster at any foreign involvement in our government but we puff up our chest about the internal conflicts of other countries?! >>



lol...

but yes, i agree. it is better for china to get rid of that communist regime... but that doesn't mean we should resort to falsifying facts. china will change when it is ready.
 
Another wild card is the Chinese people. They are patriotic and they want Taiwan back, but do they want a communist government forever? China is going to catch up with the US in economic power? The majority of Chinese still do not enjoy the economic success you guys mentioned, in fact they are very poor. The government is corrupt, sooner or later those hundreds of millions of people are going to realize that communist does not mean equality. Only a few Chinese are enjoying economic success, the government officials who take bribe and a few businessmen (a lot of them belong to the PLA).
 
I'm sure it was not lost on China that the level of support for Bush went from pathetic to 90% with a declaration of war.
 
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