China Threatens To Trigger U.S. Dollar Crash

[jonks]

The Weekly World News ran a story about 10 years ago that the Chinese government was coordinating its 1 billion person populace so that they would all jump at the same time in an attempt to knock the earth off its axis. Further, the story related that groups in the west were coordinating to perform a "counter jump" to offset China's jump effect.

I crap you not.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: Hacp

Originally posted by: Jaskalas
And why is this happening?

Its happening because Bush gave tax cuts to the richest 5%, spiraling us towards debt, and borrowing from China.

No no no, somehow the resident Republicans will blame the Democrats.

I wouldn't be surprised if the still blame Clinton and Carter.

 

[Trianon]

Originally posted by: Genx87
2. That is why a record % of people in the United States own houses? Because they are unaffordable?

record percent own houses ATM, numbers would be quite different in not so distant future.

 

[LegendKiller]

Originally posted by: Genx87

Apparently there is no end to the sillyness from you.

1. You dont have to buy US only goods to stimulate our economy. Unless these rich are traveling to these foreign lands to purchase goods. They are buying it from somebody within the United States.
2. That is why a record % of people in the United States own houses? Because they are unaffordable?
3. Need a little more proof than one case between ebay and a 3rd party.

People are so damn clueless...

1. There has not been *one* empirical study that has shown that tax cuts do jack sh!t to stimulate the economy. In fact, there are many studies that show that it does the exact opposite in the long run.

2. It has been shown several times throughout history that manipulating the economy through sovereign debt leads to nothing but financial ruin, see South American countries and Russia.

3. Tax cuts and rampant debt *only* work to provide for the economy *if* those monies return more than the debt costs. In most studies I have read, you cannot draw that conclusion since the cost of funds is higher than the growth attributed to the use of those funds.

The debt Bush piled on results in 120bn annually in interest payments.

4. Our tax base has only been as high as it has been due to housing sales, rampant consumer spending, and incomes inflated by jobs resulting from the previous two. As those decline, so does our tax base.

5. The housing ownership number is moronic. People can't afford those houses and are losing them quickly. The number you tout as being good is actually *BAD* as the average home equity in houses plummets, the savings rate is negative, and housing prices decline. Naturally, you'll ignore the housing market tanking for the benefit of trumpeting your idiot President marching us to financial ruin.

It's amazing that the entire credit market and housing market is burning down and all you can do is trumpet that more people own houses. Are you completely blind?

 

[Blain]

Originally posted by: LegendKiller
the entire credit market and housing market is burning down

Isn't that exaggerating just a bit?

 

[1EZduzit]

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: Hacp

Originally posted by: Jaskalas
And why is this happening?

Its happening because Bush gave tax cuts to the richest 5%, spiraling us towards debt, and borrowing from China.

Your one track mind makes a fool of you everytime.
This debt we have didnt magically appear after the 2003 tax cuts. And these tax cuts went to anybody who paid income taxes. That is how a tax cut works, for the simple minded.

In the stock market, the more you make, the more you can afford to invest which means the more you make in the long run. Yet the tightie righties on this site still insist that the people who work full time and can't even afford health insurance ahould be able to save for their retirement.

Now you expect us to believe that a tax cut, even if was straight across the board for everyone, doesn't end up putting much more money into the pockets of the richest people in the country? So they have even more money to invest? The result of that action is going to be increasing taxes on the whole body and/or increasing the deficit, which is exactly what has been happening.

Sounds like double talk to me, a tax cut at this point is nothing more then a "rob Peter to pay Paul wealth redistrubtion scheme" although some people are simple minded enough to believe it..... especially the ones who "think" they will benifit from a tax cut.

 

[LegendKiller]

Originally posted by: Blain

Originally posted by: LegendKiller
the entire credit market and housing market is burning down

Isn't that exaggerating just a bit?

No, it isn't. I guess you missed the part about MBS securities not getting done and if they do, at drastically higher spreads. How about the news that Asset Backed Commercial Paper conduits, some of the most secure debt out there, are having troubles issuing past overnight when they typically have 30-120+ paper outstanding. That paper is trading at very high spreads.

What about most subprime lenders shutting down anything but higher credit quality clients?

Nah, nothing is wrong.

 

[HombrePequeno]

Originally posted by: Tango

Originally posted by: Hacp

Originally posted by: Pabster
Story here.

Report says China holds around a 1.33 trillion U.S. Dollar Reserve.

Just another reason why "Made In U.S.A." is more important than ever.

Just a bluff. If the US economy flukes, China will go into a recession.

Exports to the US represent 20% of China's total exports. It's a very high figure, but not big enough to be considered critical to an economy survival, especially an economy growing at a 10% annual rate.

I don't really see this as much of a threat. Throwing our economy into a deep recession and causing our real income to drop would be horrible for their economy. Those exports to the US make up a large percentage of their total GDP so them growing at 10% a year would not happen if they did this. It would likely trigger something much worse than the Asian Financial Crisis.

 

[Blain]

I still believe that the statement... "the entire credit market and housing market is burning down" is an exaggeration.
The "entire credit market" or entire housing market is not "burning down".

But I understand that exaggerations do tend to get points across.

 

[Stunt]

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: Hacp

Originally posted by: Jaskalas
And why is this happening?

Its happening because Bush gave tax cuts to the richest 5%, spiraling us towards debt, and borrowing from China.

Your one track mind makes a fool of you everytime.
This debt we have didnt magically appear after the 2003 tax cuts. And these tax cuts went to anybody who paid income taxes. That is how a tax cut works, for the simple minded.

In the stock market, the more you make, the more you can afford to invest which means the more you make in the long run. Yet the tightie righties on this site still insist that the people who work full time and can't even afford health insurance ahould be able to save for their retirement.

Now you expect us to believe that a tax cut, even if was straight across the board for everyone, doesn't end up putting much more money into the pockets of the richest people in the country? So they have even more money to invest? The result of that action is going to be increasing taxes on the whole body and/or increasing the deficit, which is exactly what has been happening.

Sounds like double talk to me, a tax cut at this point is nothing more then a "rob Peter to pay Paul wealth redistrubtion scheme" although some people are simple minded enough to believe it..... especially the ones who "think" they will benifit from a tax cut.

Luxury items in the last 6 years have experienced huge amount of inflation because of heavy demand. I have no way of quantifying the amount of money the rich spent on consumer items versus investment, but for the stock market to move significantly, earnings must rise to fit the P/E ratio wall street feels is fair. Take a look at these companies who sell luxury items: (5 year period)

Sotheby's stock is up 360%
Ralph Lauren's stock is up 310%
Callaway Golf's stock is up 75%
Movado's stock is up 230%
Perry Ellis stock is up 220%
Steinway Musical Instrument's stock is up 100%

From a book I'm reading: (shows AVERAGE spending by the rich in 2006)
net worth: $1m-10m
population: 7.5m
watches: $2,100
cars: $44,000
jewelry: $9,200
spa services: $5,300
primary residence: $810,000

net worth: $10m-100m
population: >2m
watches: $71,000
cars: $158,000
jewelry: $126,000
spa services: $42,000
primary residence: $3,800,000

net worth: $100m-1b
population: 1000's
watches: $182,000
cars: $311,000
jewelry: $397,000
spa services: $169,000
primary residence: $16,200,000

Edit: more consumption info...
It's estimated that the top 20% of Americans account for 70% of the consumption in the US.
Private Jet sales have gone from $3.3b in 1995 to $13b in 2005 (a 300% increase in sales).

The rich are spending, not just investing in the stock market...
You guys really have no clue do you...

 

[halik]

Originally posted by: senseamp
They are threatening us with the exact thing we are asking them to do, which is letting the dollar sink wrt their currency?
Yeah, that makes sense. Sure, they can go ahead and sell their treasuries for pennies on the dollar, but then who is it going to hurt most? Their own economy that relies on strong dollar for exports. Weak dollar is good for the US, because it's the only thing that will offset our high labor and benefit costs.

You know, they could just sell off the $ reserves for a basket of other currencies, which wouldn't change the yuan. The idea is that the FED would have to rise the rates to remove the excess dollars from the circulation (ie fight inflation)

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: Stunt
It's estimated that the top 20% of Americans account for 70% of the consumption in the US.

Private Jet sales have gone from $3.3b in 1995 to $13b in 2005 (a 300% increase in sales).

The rich are spending, not just investing in the stock market...
You guys really have no clue do you...

Thanks for confirming what I have been saying all along about the class warfare in the U.S.

Of course you support it.

 

[dahunan]

Originally posted by: Trianon

Originally posted by: Genx87
2. That is why a record % of people in the United States own houses? Because they are unaffordable?

record percent own houses ATM, numbers would be quite different in not so distant future.

Does OWN = Paid for?

 

[techs]

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: Hacp

Originally posted by: Jaskalas
And why is this happening?

Its happening because Bush gave tax cuts to the richest 5%, spiraling us towards debt, and borrowing from China.

Your one track mind makes a fool of you everytime.
This debt we have didnt magically appear after the 2003 tax cuts. And these tax cuts went to anybody who paid income taxes. That is how a tax cut works, for the simple minded.

And for you, the propagandist deciever, fifty percent of the tax cuts went to the top 3 percent of Americans. And the 50 percent of Americans who don't pay income taxes, but who DO pay gas taxes, phone taxes, they got NOTHING.
And the debt incurred to GIVE the tax cuts will end up costing the bottom 97 percent far, far more than got back

 

[1EZduzit]

Originally posted by: Stunt

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: Hacp

Originally posted by: Jaskalas
And why is this happening?

Its happening because Bush gave tax cuts to the richest 5%, spiraling us towards debt, and borrowing from China.

Your one track mind makes a fool of you everytime.
This debt we have didnt magically appear after the 2003 tax cuts. And these tax cuts went to anybody who paid income taxes. That is how a tax cut works, for the simple minded.

In the stock market, the more you make, the more you can afford to invest which means the more you make in the long run. Yet the tightie righties on this site still insist that the people who work full time and can't even afford health insurance ahould be able to save for their retirement.

Now you expect us to believe that a tax cut, even if was straight across the board for everyone, doesn't end up putting much more money into the pockets of the richest people in the country? So they have even more money to invest? The result of that action is going to be increasing taxes on the whole body and/or increasing the deficit, which is exactly what has been happening.

Sounds like double talk to me, a tax cut at this point is nothing more then a "rob Peter to pay Paul wealth redistrubtion scheme" although some people are simple minded enough to believe it..... especially the ones who "think" they will benifit from a tax cut.

Luxury items in the last 6 years have experienced huge amount of inflation because of heavy demand. I have no way of quantifying the amount of money the rich spent on consumer items versus investment, but for the stock market to move significantly, earnings must rise to fit the P/E ratio wall street feels is fair. Take a look at these companies who sell luxury items: (5 year period)

Sotheby's stock is up 360%
Ralph Lauren's stock is up 310%
Callaway Golf's stock is up 75%
Movado's stock is up 230%
Perry Ellis stock is up 220%
Steinway Musical Instrument's stock is up 100%

From a book I'm reading: (shows AVERAGE spending by the rich in 2006)
net worth: $1m-10m
population: 7.5m
watches: $2,100
cars: $44,000
jewelry: $9,200
spa services: $5,300
primary residence: $810,000

net worth: $10m-100m
population: >2m
watches: $71,000
cars: $158,000
jewelry: $126,000
spa services: $42,000
primary residence: $3,800,000

net worth: $100m-1b
population: 1000's
watches: $182,000
cars: $311,000
jewelry: $397,000
spa services: $169,000
primary residence: $16,200,000

Edit: more consumption info...
It's estimated that the top 20% of Americans account for 70% of the consumption in the US.
Private Jet sales have gone from $3.3b in 1995 to $13b in 2005 (a 300% increase in sales).

The rich are spending, not just investing in the stock market...
You guys really have no clue do you...

That's where your wrong. Do you really, seriously expect me to believe your argument that we can support a healthy economy building yachts, selling jewlery, and other luxery items?

Pleeeeeeease, give me a break.

 

[jackace]

Originally posted by: LegendKiller

Originally posted by: Genx87

Apparently there is no end to the sillyness from you.

1. You dont have to buy US only goods to stimulate our economy. Unless these rich are traveling to these foreign lands to purchase goods. They are buying it from somebody within the United States.
2. That is why a record % of people in the United States own houses? Because they are unaffordable?
3. Need a little more proof than one case between ebay and a 3rd party.

People are so damn clueless...

1. There has not been *one* empirical study that has shown that tax cuts do jack sh!t to stimulate the economy. In fact, there are many studies that show that it does the exact opposite in the long run.

2. It has been shown several times throughout history that manipulating the economy through sovereign debt leads to nothing but financial ruin, see South American countries and Russia.

3. Tax cuts and rampant debt *only* work to provide for the economy *if* those monies return more than the debt costs. In most studies I have read, you cannot draw that conclusion since the cost of funds is higher than the growth attributed to the use of those funds.

The debt Bush piled on results in 120bn annually in interest payments.

4. Our tax base has only been as high as it has been due to housing sales, rampant consumer spending, and incomes inflated by jobs resulting from the previous two. As those decline, so does our tax base.

5. The housing ownership number is moronic. People can't afford those houses and are losing them quickly. The number you tout as being good is actually *BAD* as the average home equity in houses plummets, the savings rate is negative, and housing prices decline. Naturally, you'll ignore the housing market tanking for the benefit of trumpeting your idiot President marching us to financial ruin.

It's amazing that the entire credit market and housing market is burning down and all you can do is trumpet that more people own houses. Are you completely blind?

All I have to say is "what he said", LOL, could not have said it better myself. Trickle Down economics has no proof showing it works as claimed, in fact there is proof to the contrary.

 

[Darwin333]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: Stunt
It's estimated that the top 20% of Americans account for 70% of the consumption in the US.

Private Jet sales have gone from $3.3b in 1995 to $13b in 2005 (a 300% increase in sales).

The rich are spending, not just investing in the stock market...
You guys really have no clue do you...

Thanks for confirming what I have been saying all along about the class warfare in the U.S.

Of course you support it.

You needed confirmation that rich people spend more and consume more than people who are not rich?

 

[LegendKiller]

Originally posted by: dahunan

Originally posted by: Trianon

Originally posted by: Genx87
2. That is why a record % of people in the United States own houses? Because they are unaffordable?

record percent own houses ATM, numbers would be quite different in not so distant future.

Does OWN = Paid for?

No. Bush has parroted to end about "home ownership" in the last 7 years. It's one of his major agendas. Essentially it was just another way of getting Americans to think things were going well.

Genx87 thinks own is owing a bank a ton of money and in many cases with the recent glut of "owners" not being able to pay it back.

One only has to look at what the % of equity people *own* in their house to see it's falling steadily since more people don't "own" as much of their house as they used to. This is also going to accelerate as the equity *owned* relative to the entire house that is "owned" declines due to falling housing prices.

Naturally, people like genx87 will fail to see the difference between *owning* and "owning" a house.

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: LegendKiller

Originally posted by: dahunan

Originally posted by: Trianon

Originally posted by: Genx87
2. That is why a record % of people in the United States own houses? Because they are unaffordable?

record percent own houses ATM, numbers would be quite different in not so distant future.

Does OWN = Paid for?

No. Bush has parroted to end about "home ownership" in the last 7 years. It's one of his major agendas. Essentially it was just another way of getting Americans to think things were going well.

Genx87 thinks own is owing a bank a ton of money and in many cases with the recent glut of "owners" not being able to pay it back.

One only has to look at what the % of equity people *own* in their house to see it's falling steadily since more people don't "own" as much of their house as they used to. This is also going to accelerate as the equity *owned* relative to the entire house that is "owned" declines due to falling housing prices.

Naturally, people like genx87 will fail to see the difference between *owning* and "owning" a house.

You know if I had a dime for every generality you spit out about me, I could retire tomorrow.

I find it amazing you hate the very industry you work within. Probably explains the pure vitriol you spew on these msgboards on a daily basis.

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: techs

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: Hacp

Originally posted by: Jaskalas
And why is this happening?

Its happening because Bush gave tax cuts to the richest 5%, spiraling us towards debt, and borrowing from China.

Your one track mind makes a fool of you everytime.
This debt we have didnt magically appear after the 2003 tax cuts. And these tax cuts went to anybody who paid income taxes. That is how a tax cut works, for the simple minded.

And for you, the propagandist deciever, fifty percent of the tax cuts went to the top 3 percent of Americans. And the 50 percent of Americans who don't pay income taxes, but who DO pay gas taxes, phone taxes, they got NOTHING.
And the debt incurred to GIVE the tax cuts will end up costing the bottom 97 percent far, far more than got back

If you dont like the regressive taxes speak with your representative. I dont like them anymore than you do. But we arent talking about regressive taxes now are we? We are talking about progressive income tax refunds.

 

[Pliablemoose]

Common theory is that China will cool off it's markets after the 08' Olympics.

They're building like crazy right now to host the games and they don't want to look like fools/bullies/jerks to the rest of the world till the Olympics are over.

 

[LegendKiller]

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: LegendKiller

Originally posted by: dahunan

Originally posted by: Trianon

Originally posted by: Genx87
2. That is why a record % of people in the United States own houses? Because they are unaffordable?

record percent own houses ATM, numbers would be quite different in not so distant future.

Does OWN = Paid for?

No. Bush has parroted to end about "home ownership" in the last 7 years. It's one of his major agendas. Essentially it was just another way of getting Americans to think things were going well.

Genx87 thinks own is owing a bank a ton of money and in many cases with the recent glut of "owners" not being able to pay it back.

One only has to look at what the % of equity people *own* in their house to see it's falling steadily since more people don't "own" as much of their house as they used to. This is also going to accelerate as the equity *owned* relative to the entire house that is "owned" declines due to falling housing prices.

Naturally, people like genx87 will fail to see the difference between *owning* and "owning" a house.

You know if I had a dime for every generality you spit out about me, I could retire tomorrow.

I find it amazing you hate the very industry you work within. Probably explains the pure vitriol you spew on these msgboards on a daily basis.

You're the one touting the figures as some type of justification for your beliefs. I don't hate my industry but do question some people's ethics, that is no different than any other job in the world. You're not going to agree with everybody. I just stay out of the areas I don't like, as would any reasonable person.

 

[CaptainGoodnight]

I think this saying applies:

If you owe the bank a little money, then they own you.
If you owe the bank a LOT of money, then you own the bank.


What I don't understand is if China causes a dollar crash, what do they get out of it? From what I see they lose a ton of money.

edit: Also, If the US dollar is worth less, then Amercians might not buy Chinese goods.

edit2: Anyway, I don?t get the point of the article. The US is demanding that China unlink the yuan from the dollar even further, and to retaliate, they threaten to crash the unit that they don?t want to unlink from?

 

[ayabe]

I think Blizzard should step in and threaten to delete all Chinese WoW accounts, that would cause severe civil unrest and could topple the regime.

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: LegendKiller

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: LegendKiller

Originally posted by: dahunan

Originally posted by: Trianon

Originally posted by: Genx87
2. That is why a record % of people in the United States own houses? Because they are unaffordable?

record percent own houses ATM, numbers would be quite different in not so distant future.

Does OWN = Paid for?

No. Bush has parroted to end about "home ownership" in the last 7 years. It's one of his major agendas. Essentially it was just another way of getting Americans to think things were going well.

Genx87 thinks own is owing a bank a ton of money and in many cases with the recent glut of "owners" not being able to pay it back.

One only has to look at what the % of equity people *own* in their house to see it's falling steadily since more people don't "own" as much of their house as they used to. This is also going to accelerate as the equity *owned* relative to the entire house that is "owned" declines due to falling housing prices.

Naturally, people like genx87 will fail to see the difference between *owning* and "owning" a house.

You know if I had a dime for every generality you spit out about me, I could retire tomorrow.

I find it amazing you hate the very industry you work within. Probably explains the pure vitriol you spew on these msgboards on a daily basis.

You're the one touting the figures as some type of justification for your beliefs. I don't hate my industry but do question some people's ethics, that is no different than any other job in the world. You're not going to agree with everybody. I just stay out of the areas I don't like, as would any reasonable person.

I made no claim about my beliefs, simply pointing out the sillyness of stating housing is out of the reach of the middle class when we are at the highest ownership rates in the recent history, possibly ever in this country.