Chevy Volt Year 1: < 7500 units

[Doppel]

There is no denying that to date the Chevy Volt has been a sales failure, whether from lack of demand or lack of production, it's not moving out of sales rooms.

Through November 6142 of these sold, so I am estimating sales for December. Whether you go with the 25,000 estimated sales mark GM was going with earlier this year or the 10,000 they were talking about through the year, sales are still far shy of estimates. GM continues to talk up incredibly unrealistic sales numbers through 2012, however.

I maintain that this car is on thin ice. If GM cannot cut its cost by at least $8,000 (my estimate) so that it's truly competitive with the competition (which now includes a rapidly expanding Prius line and others like the Leaf), then its sales will never be strong and GM will eventually have to cancel it, as it is a money hemorrhage currently. I don't put much stock in the idea that this car is a halo car used to attract Cruze buyers (nor should a car exist solely to do that).

This analyst claims each Volt so far has cost $50k-250k in subsidies. I have no idea if it's accurate, though. http://www.michigancapitolconfidential.com/16192

The noteworthy thing about this vehicle is that reviewers are generally warm to gushing about it. Also, owners appear to love their cars. The car itself seems pretty decent, it's simply far too expensive.

 

[LTC8K6]

Don't forget that they supposedly spent a lot of money to ramp up production capability greatly, so they could produce 60K per year in 2012.

Some of those 2011 sales were apparently fleet/gov't/GE and even dealer to dealer sales.

One problem is certainly the Cruze. If you go to the lot and you see the Volt and the Cruze, there's little chance you'll buy the Volt, imo, unless you just have to have one and have money to spare.

The Volt's fuel economy with a depleted battery is also not that great.

 

[NAC]

Any analyst who expects GM to recoupe all R&D costs in this model is clearly writing to prove a point other than a business one. The R&D will be used for lots of future models. Some analysts made similar comments about Toyota and the initial Prius &#8211; that they were losing money for each one sold if you factored in R&D. You can&#8217;t. Or at least shouldn&#8217;t. Toyota is ahead in hybrid technology, in part thanks to the early &#8220;money losing&#8221; Priuses.

I also don&#8217;t think GM is losing money on manufacturing. They cost a lot because the parts &#8211; the battery - costs a lot. That&#8217;s reality right now.

So the sales figures have proven that the market for a (not very sexy) $40k electric car isn&#8217;t very big. Really &#8211; should anyone be surprised? Eventually, batteries will get better and cheaper, and perhaps gas will get even more expensive, and more people will buy more plug-in electric cars.

Another point &#8211; GM got a lot of good press and exposure thanks to the Volt.

So I&#8217;d argue that the number of sales really doesn&#8217;t matter. GM will benefit in the long run from having made the R&D, and from having gotten the good exposure.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Any analyst who expects GM to recoupe all R&D costs in this model is clearly writing to prove a point other than a business one. The R&D will be used for lots of future models. Some analysts made similar comments about Toyota and the initial Prius – that they were losing money for each one sold if you factored in R&D. You can’t. Or at least shouldn’t. Toyota is ahead in hybrid technology, in part thanks to the early “money losing” Priuses.

I also don’t think GM is losing money on manufacturing. They cost a lot because the parts – the battery - costs a lot. That’s reality right now.

So the sales figures have proven that the market for a (not very sexy) $40k electric car isn’t very big. Really – should anyone be surprised? Eventually, batteries will get better and cheaper, and perhaps gas will get even more expensive, and more people will buy more plug-in electric cars.

Another point – GM got a lot of good press and exposure thanks to the Volt.

So I’d argue that the number of sales really doesn’t matter. GM will benefit in the long run from having made the R&D, and from having gotten the good exposure.

They've gotten a lot of bad press lately too with the reports of fires after a minor accident.

The problem with the Volt is that it is too god damned expensive.

 

[Dman8777]

My dad loves his but both of my parents are hippies. Ever since they bought a 2nd gen prius 7 years ago, my mom has been nagging my dad to get rid of his fun cars and buy something electric/hybrid. He traded a 135i for the Volt. For someone who rarely drives more then 20 miles in a stretch, the Volt does make sense and he claims it's a lot more fun to drive then a prius. I'm still not sure I would have made that trade though.

 

[The-Noid]

The GM conference call was awesome.

One of the analysts (can't remember the name) went back to a comment by GM CFO about the days of Volt in inventory (was around 46 at the time) and said can you quantify that? is it around 100 or 150 units...in no way realizing what he had asked.

GM claimed the "couldn't quantify it," but somehow knew they had 46 days of inventory.

No one is buying these things. They make no sense. Buy a diesel.

70&#37; of the worlds electricity production comes from fossil fuels. The Volt doesn't fix that. It just makes people feel warm and fuzzy on the inside. The good thing about the Volt is we get some horrible by products in the Lithium that is used in the batteries and the US taxpayers gets to pay you to drive them.

I feel like after 100 years we could come up with a better solution, the simple answer is gas is cheap and the volt isn't that answer.

 

[skyking]

That is not much return for our investment.

 

[exar333]

The GM conference call was awesome.

One of the analysts (can't remember the name) went back to a comment by GM CFO about the days of Volt in inventory (was around 46 at the time) and said can you quantify that? is it around 100 or 150 units...in no way realizing what he had asked.

GM claimed the "couldn't quantify it," but somehow knew they had 46 days of inventory.

No one is buying these things. They make no sense. Buy a diesel.

70% of the worlds electricity production comes from fossil fuels. The Volt doesn't fix that. It just makes people feel warm and fuzzy on the inside. The good thing about the Volt is we get some horrible by products in the Lithium that is used in the batteries and the US taxpayers gets to pay you to drive them.

I feel like after 100 years we could come up with a better solution, the simple answer is gas is cheap and the volt isn't that answer.

Lots of fifth-grade analysis going on here. The Volt is a loss-leader for GM, plain and simple. It will exist to help further their battery and hybrid tech across their line, and no one expects them to recoup their costs on this car.

Regarding efficiency. Using generated electricity is more efficient than an ICE, gas or diesel. This car works pretty well for folks who need to commute a moderate distance and can charge their battery for 90% of their driving.

I don't believe GM ever advised the Volt would replace fossil fuels. If you think this, then you are mistaken.

 

[skyking]

It would work great for my wife, for example. 40 mile round trip to work. We live in the land of hydro so we only kill salmon runs to get our electricity

 

[RavenSEAL]

41K MSRP is insane, they still don't get that if green cars aren't affordable, no one is gonna buy em.

If you can drop 40K+ on a car, then obviously paying for gasoline isn't a problem.

 

[master7045]

70&#37; of the worlds electricity production comes from fossil fuels. The Volt doesn't fix that. It just makes people feel warm and fuzzy on the inside. The good thing about the Volt is we get some horrible by products in the Lithium that is used in the batteries and the US taxpayers gets to pay you to drive them.

This. I don't understand why people don't realize how pointless electric vehicles are. Until we can create clean energy, all your doing is moving the point of combustion further up the chain. It no longer occurs under the hood, but now there is more pressure from power plants to produce more electricity, IE, mine for coal (an already nasty process), then burn more coal. BTW, there is no such thing as clean coal. As a disclaimer, I'm no hippie, I drive a Jeep GC that gets 20mpg on a good highway stretch, but it this topic drives me nuts. I'm off my soapbox now.

Anyway, I'm starting to see a few more volts around the St. Louis area, maybe they are starting to push them a bit more now. 3 months ago, I still hadn't seen one on the road. The past 2 months I can probably count 3 or 4.

 

[Dr. Detroit]

The reason it is a failure is it does not qualify for California Car Pool HOV stickers.

The Leaf does!

Supposedly - the 2012 Volt will qualify as will the Prius Plug-In.

Once this change is made I would expect to see a minimum of 5,000 units sell in this state within the next year. $9,000 in tax credits too!

http://media.gm.com/content/media/u...ntent/Pages/news/us/en/2011/Nov/1116_volt_hov

 

[thedarkwolf]

This. I don't understand why people don't realize how pointless electric vehicles are. Until we can create clean energy, all your doing is moving the point of combustion further up the chain. It no longer occurs under the hood, but now there is more pressure from power plants to produce more electricity, IE, mine for coal (an already nasty process), then burn more coal. BTW, there is no such thing as clean coal. As a disclaimer, I'm no hippie, I drive a Jeep GC that gets 20mpg on a good highway stretch, but it this topic drives me nuts. I'm off my soapbox now.

Yet again even a coal power plant puts out less pollution per watt than your car.

 

[ponyo]

I say double the price. Make it premium car. Telsa is going to be $70k or so for base. Let the rich hippies buy it.

More gasoline for the rest of us.

 

[Mr.IncrediblyBored]

I give GM credit for releasing something that isn't a complete disaster, given the moonshot that it is. This is year one of generation one. People seem to love their Volts, so give credit where credit is due.

I agree it's only major issue is the cost, but the Leaf sure as hell isn't much cheaper. The 2012 costs just under $38,000.

 

[LTC8K6]

The LEAF is selling at about half Nissan's projected rate. So, it's not doing too well either. Plus, about half of LEAF sales were in California.

 

[XZeroII]

The GM conference call was awesome.

One of the analysts (can't remember the name) went back to a comment by GM CFO about the days of Volt in inventory (was around 46 at the time) and said can you quantify that? is it around 100 or 150 units...in no way realizing what he had asked.

GM claimed the "couldn't quantify it," but somehow knew they had 46 days of inventory.

No one is buying these things. They make no sense. Buy a diesel.

70% of the worlds electricity production comes from fossil fuels. The Volt doesn't fix that. It just makes people feel warm and fuzzy on the inside. The good thing about the Volt is we get some horrible by products in the Lithium that is used in the batteries and the US taxpayers gets to pay you to drive them.

I feel like after 100 years we could come up with a better solution, the simple answer is gas is cheap and the volt isn't that answer.

I believe that the number means that if they were to stop production then in 46 days there would be no more left on the lots. I believe that most auto manufacturers try to keep a 60 day supply or so. Anything below that usually means that they are under supplied.

 

[MaxCool]

We can make a really cheap electric car, but the oil companies lobby car manufactures to keep them highly priced.

 

[Drako]

We can make a really cheap electric car, but the oil companies lobby car manufactures to keep them highly priced.

Yep, it has nothing to do with the battery cost at all :hmm:.

 

[ultimatebob]

This car might actually start making sense if gas gets up to $8 a gallon... Even more so if you can get a pre-owned model for under $25k. Right now? Not so much.

 

[PottedMeat]

saw one buried at the back of a gm dealership a few days back, behind all the corvettes, camaros, and cadillacs. had a big red sticker - $42,xxx. i guess it was the dealer demo with 'VOLT' across the sides.

 

[Ronstang]

The saddest part of this car is the government subsidy to buy one. The average income of the people who buy these things is ~$160K which means all the poor working stiffs making $50K are paying so rich hippies can get the car cheaper and Government Motors can make a sale. Obama is really looking out for the little guy....not.

 

[Pariah]

This car might actually start making sense if gas gets up to $8 a gallon... Even more so if you can get a pre-owned model for under $25k. Right now? Not so much.

This is true, but you can't wait until gas is $8 a gallon before you start developing a car like the Volt. By the time $8 gas rolls around, you want a mature platform that doesn't cost $32k or whatever after tax credit for the base model that gets only 30-40 miles on battery. You want to be in the position of market leader so you can take advantage of the market conditions. That's what GM is trying to do, but too many people here are too short-sighted to understand this, or too unrealistic thinking that every step of the process is supposed to be a retail blockbuster in order for the tech to prove itself viable.

 

[LTC8K6]

This is true, but you can't wait until gas is $8 a gallon before you start developing a car like the Volt. By the time $8 gas rolls around, you want a mature platform that doesn't cost $32k or whatever after tax credit for the base model that gets only 30-40 miles on battery. You want to be in the position of market leader so you can take advantage of the market conditions. That's what GM is trying to do, but too many people here are too short-sighted to understand this, or too unrealistic thinking that every step of the process is supposed to be a retail blockbuster in order for the tech to prove itself viable.

There are much better buys, even if gas hits $5 a gallon...

 

[AdamK47]

The saddest part of this car is the government subsidy to buy one. The average income of the people who buy these things is ~$160K which means all the poor working stiffs making $50K are paying so rich hippies can get the car cheaper and Government Motors can make a sale. Obama is really looking out for the little guy....not.

Oh. It's you. Hi.