Chevron-Texaco record earnings beat analysts expectations

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: Lonyo
If you bought more fuel efficient cars, you might not b!tch so much about prices.

It is never economical to replace a car that is in good repair simply in order to save money on fuel. I get 26 mpg highway with my big V8 Lincoln. It's a '95. If I sold it, I would get maybe $7,000. Maybe. A 2000 V6 Accord gets 28 mpg on the highway and with equivalent features and mileage to the Lincoln would cost $15,000 according to KBB. So a 2 mpg improvement would cost me $8,000 (and 90 HP). I drive about 12,000 miles per year. I would save 40 gallons of gasoline per year. Even at $2 per gallon it would take me 100 years for the savings in fuel to break even with the $8,000 initial price premium. Even with good vitamins and regular exercise, I'm not going to make it that long.

ZV

 

[TheBDB]

It is still under $1.80 here in Texas. 😀

 

[Ranger X]

Paying about $2.03-$2.13 here in CA. 🙁

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: ElFenix
all the refineries serving the US are running at or near capacity. some are running over capacity. so much for your theory.

here is a link if you really want to know

of course, you could say that BP intentionally blew up its refinery in texas city, but that is ludicrous

And the last time a refinery was built in the US was... when? 20... 30 years ago?

And woohoo! I'm an "internet malcontent"! 😛

 

[dxkj]

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: Lonyo
If you bought more fuel efficient cars, you might not b!tch so much about prices.

It is never economical to replace a car that is in good repair simply in order to save money on fuel. I get 26 mpg highway with my big V8 Lincoln. It's a '95. If I sold it, I would get maybe $7,000. Maybe. A 2000 V6 Accord gets 28 mpg on the highway and with equivalent features and mileage to the Lincoln would cost $15,000 according to KBB. So a 2 mpg improvement would cost me $8,000 (and 90 HP). I drive about 12,000 miles per year. I would save 40 gallons of gasoline per year. Even at $2 per gallon it would take me 100 years for the savings in fuel to break even with the $8,000 initial price premium. Even with good vitamins and regular exercise, I'm not going to make it that long.

ZV

Perhaps he was talking to SUV drivers who get 18 miles per gallon and could upgrade to a civic/corolla at 40 miles a gallon. The SUV sells for $15, he buys the cheaper compact car because in reality he doesnt need it, and wala! A new car, and half the gas costs....

 

[m2kewl]

Originally posted by: Lonyo
If you bought more fuel efficient cars, you might not b!tch so much about prices.

werd. i see people here b!tch all the time, but no one drives a civic or prius or insight...

you all want lower gas prices, join the cavalry and attack iran.


/puts on thermal resistant undies

 

[ibintegra]

Originally posted by: m2kewl

Originally posted by: Lonyo
If you bought more fuel efficient cars, you might not b!tch so much about prices.

werd. i see people here b!tch all the time, but no one drives a civic or prius or insight...

you all want lower gas prices, join the cavalry and attack iran.


/puts on thermal resistant undies

 

[AvesPKS]

Originally posted by: ibintegra

Originally posted by: m2kewl

Originally posted by: Lonyo
If you bought more fuel efficient cars, you might not b!tch so much about prices.

werd. i see people here b!tch all the time, but no one drives a civic or prius or insight...

you all want lower gas prices, join the cavalry and attack iran.


/puts on thermal resistant undies

I drive an Escort, with a 2.0L 4 cylinder. I can get 35mpg on the highway; the city's a different story. Depending on how traffic is, I can get anywhere from 20 to 28mpg in the city.

When I say that it costs me $21 to fill up, that's for ~10 gallons of gas. I remember a few years ago when gas was $.85 a gallon, and I could fill up for under ten bucks. I also remember a few years ago with gas was $2.25 a gallon, and it cost me $23 to fill up.

 

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: Vic

And the last time a refinery was built in the US was... when? 20... 30 years ago?

And woohoo! I'm an "internet malcontent"! 😛

and who doesn't want a refinery built in their backyard?

the guy is hardly an oil industry shill, he is advocating reduced consumption for chrissake!

 

[Linux23]

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: Lonyo
If you bought more fuel efficient cars, you might not b!tch so much about prices.

It is never economical to replace a car that is in good repair simply in order to save money on fuel. I get 26 mpg highway with my big V8 Lincoln. It's a '95. If I sold it, I would get maybe $7,000. Maybe. A 2000 V6 Accord gets 28 mpg on the highway and with equivalent features and mileage to the Lincoln would cost $15,000 according to KBB. So a 2 mpg improvement would cost me $8,000 (and 90 HP). I drive about 12,000 miles per year. I would save 40 gallons of gasoline per year. Even at $2 per gallon it would take me 100 years for the savings in fuel to break even with the $8,000 initial price premium. Even with good vitamins and regular exercise, I'm not going to make it that long.

ZV

what model Lincoln?

 

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: Linux23

what model Lincoln?

mark viii iirc.

 

[Viper0329]

There is NO shortage of oil. I'm from a city where almost all of the petroleum for the Southern US is refined and processed. My father works at Citcon. There is no shortage what so ever. If there was, I'd definetely know about it. Expect nearly every oil company to post record earnings. They are making a fortune off of us.

 

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: Viper0329
There is NO shortage of oil. I'm from a city where almost all of the petroleum for the Southern US is refined and processed. My father works at Citcon. There is no shortage what so ever. If there was, I'd definetely know about it. Expect nearly every oil company to post record earnings. They are making a fortune off of us.

lake charles may stink but i'd hardly say almost all petroleum for the southern US is refined there. you're forgetting beaumont, port arthur, texas city, etc.

 

[Viper0329]

Originally posted by: ElFenix

Originally posted by: Viper0329
There is NO shortage of oil. I'm from a city where almost all of the petroleum for the Southern US is refined and processed. My father works at Citcon. There is no shortage what so ever. If there was, I'd definetely know about it. Expect nearly every oil company to post record earnings. They are making a fortune off of us.

lake charles may stink but i'd hardly say almost all petroleum for the southern US is refined there. you're forgetting beaumont, port arthur, texas city, etc.

Yeah, it is a very large exageration, but within a 100 mile radius of here isn't exactly a far off claim either.

 

[Amused]

Originally posted by: Viper0329
There is NO shortage of oil. I'm from a city where almost all of the petroleum for the Southern US is refined and processed. My father works at Citcon. There is no shortage what so ever. If there was, I'd definetely know about it. Expect nearly every oil company to post record earnings. They are making a fortune off of us.

:roll:

There doesn't have to be an appreciable shortage of oil for a cut in production by a major oil co-op to raise prices.

Again, LEARN how commodities markets work, PLEASE.

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: Viper0329
There is NO shortage of oil. I'm from a city where almost all of the petroleum for the Southern US is refined and processed. My father works at Citcon. There is no shortage what so ever. If there was, I'd definetely know about it. Expect nearly every oil company to post record earnings. They are making a fortune off of us.

eh, supply and demand.

If there were ample supply, prices wouldn't be going up. But I digress.

I think 2$+/gallon is here to stay, long term(5+year) average. I guess we'll see.

World oil production is not increasing. It is decreasing. That is a problem.

 

[Amused]

Originally posted by: Eli

Originally posted by: Viper0329
There is NO shortage of oil. I'm from a city where almost all of the petroleum for the Southern US is refined and processed. My father works at Citcon. There is no shortage what so ever. If there was, I'd definetely know about it. Expect nearly every oil company to post record earnings. They are making a fortune off of us.

eh, supply and demand.

If there were ample supply, prices wouldn't be going up. But I digress.

I think 2$+/gallon is here to stay, long term(5+year) average. I guess we'll see.

World oil production is not increasing. It is decreasing. That is a problem.

Yep. For over a decade OPEC flooded the market over and over again in waves to drive small producers out of business and shut down independant pumpers. Now that they have largely succeeded, they are cutting production in waves to drive up prices and recoup losses.

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: Lonyo
If you bought more fuel efficient cars, you might not b!tch so much about prices.

It is never economical to replace a car that is in good repair simply in order to save money on fuel. I get 26 mpg highway with my big V8 Lincoln. It's a '95. If I sold it, I would get maybe $7,000. Maybe. A 2000 V6 Accord gets 28 mpg on the highway and with equivalent features and mileage to the Lincoln would cost $15,000 according to KBB. So a 2 mpg improvement would cost me $8,000 (and 90 HP). I drive about 12,000 miles per year. I would save 40 gallons of gasoline per year. Even at $2 per gallon it would take me 100 years for the savings in fuel to break even with the $8,000 initial price premium. Even with good vitamins and regular exercise, I'm not going to make it that long.

ZV

Bad car to replace it with 🙂 Pick a 95 corolla, and you'll save money on the car AND on gas 😀

AmusedYes, prices are the same and the US gov doesn't tax as much. I personally think that if the fed through a half dollar onto each gallon the population would long-term be well served by it. Take that half buck and throw every damn dollar (I mean half dollar!) into R&D for alternative energies. Ultimately people would need less gas to the point where they're not only saving that buck, but mroe importantly to the point where the US isn't at the mercy of much of the rest of the world. Oil plays WAY too much of a role in the foreign relations of the middle eastern governments. If the developed world could cut imports of oil from OPEC massively then it wouldn't be held hostage by those countries to such an extent and it could be more forthright with how it deals with them. For instance, we all know that saudi arabia is a big factory of terrorists, but you don't hear that from bush, do you?

 

[Amused]

Originally posted by: Skoorb

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: Lonyo
If you bought more fuel efficient cars, you might not b!tch so much about prices.

It is never economical to replace a car that is in good repair simply in order to save money on fuel. I get 26 mpg highway with my big V8 Lincoln. It's a '95. If I sold it, I would get maybe $7,000. Maybe. A 2000 V6 Accord gets 28 mpg on the highway and with equivalent features and mileage to the Lincoln would cost $15,000 according to KBB. So a 2 mpg improvement would cost me $8,000 (and 90 HP). I drive about 12,000 miles per year. I would save 40 gallons of gasoline per year. Even at $2 per gallon it would take me 100 years for the savings in fuel to break even with the $8,000 initial price premium. Even with good vitamins and regular exercise, I'm not going to make it that long.

ZV

Bad car to replace it with 🙂 Pick a 95 corolla, and you'll save money on the car AND on gas 😀

AmusedYes, prices are the same and the US gov doesn't tax as much. I personally think that if the fed through a half dollar onto each gallon the population would long-term be well served by it. Take that half buck and throw every damn dollar (I mean half dollar!) into R&D for alternative energies. Ultimately people would need less gas to the point where they're not only saving that buck, but mroe importantly to the point where the US isn't at the mercy of much of the rest of the world. Oil plays WAY too much of a role in the foreign relations of the middle eastern governments. If the developed world could cut imports of oil from OPEC massively then it wouldn't be held hostage by those countries to such an extent and it could be more forthright with how it deals with them. For instance, we all know that saudi arabia is a big factory of terrorists, but you don't hear that from bush, do you?

It's never a good idea to expect the government to do something the private sector could do cheaper, better, and faster.

Also, raising the price of gas would not only cost individual citizens at the pump, but it would destroy the economy. Prices would rise on everything from food to clothing to computers.

The US did not become a superpower by raping it's citizens euro-style.

Don't get me wrong. I agree with the outcome you seek, I just disagree with the method you choose to get it done.

 

[StageLeft]

But this isn't simply an economical issue in which you can hope for the private sector to spur things along. They've no interest in anything but money, so in that regard they can do it better, but from the held-hostage-by-middle-eastern-oil-barons, they don't care. The US gov't does, so only it has a piece of interest in that.

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: dxkj

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: Lonyo
If you bought more fuel efficient cars, you might not b!tch so much about prices.

It is never economical to replace a car that is in good repair simply in order to save money on fuel. I get 26 mpg highway with my big V8 Lincoln. It's a '95. If I sold it, I would get maybe $7,000. Maybe. A 2000 V6 Accord gets 28 mpg on the highway and with equivalent features and mileage to the Lincoln would cost $15,000 according to KBB. So a 2 mpg improvement would cost me $8,000 (and 90 HP). I drive about 12,000 miles per year. I would save 40 gallons of gasoline per year. Even at $2 per gallon it would take me 100 years for the savings in fuel to break even with the $8,000 initial price premium. Even with good vitamins and regular exercise, I'm not going to make it that long.

ZV

Perhaps he was talking to SUV drivers who get 18 miles per gallon and could upgrade to a civic/corolla at 40 miles a gallon. The SUV sells for $15, he buys the cheaper compact car because in reality he doesnt need it, and wala! A new car, and half the gas costs....

21 mpg freeway with my dad's V8 Explorer. You find me a vehicle that has is capable of carrying four adults, four golf bags and 500 pounds of semi-tractor demo units at the same time, can also be called upon to tow at least 4,500 pounds, and that has 4WD or AWD of some form that will get it through 6-18 inches of unplowed snow in northern Michigan that will get better mileage. Otherwise, getting rid of the Explorer is not an option.

ZV

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: Skoorb

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: Lonyo
If you bought more fuel efficient cars, you might not b!tch so much about prices.

It is never economical to replace a car that is in good repair simply in order to save money on fuel. I get 26 mpg highway with my big V8 Lincoln. It's a '95. If I sold it, I would get maybe $7,000. Maybe. A 2000 V6 Accord gets 28 mpg on the highway and with equivalent features and mileage to the Lincoln would cost $15,000 according to KBB. So a 2 mpg improvement would cost me $8,000 (and 90 HP). I drive about 12,000 miles per year. I would save 40 gallons of gasoline per year. Even at $2 per gallon it would take me 100 years for the savings in fuel to break even with the $8,000 initial price premium. Even with good vitamins and regular exercise, I'm not going to make it that long.

ZV

Bad car to replace it with 🙂 Pick a 95 corolla, and you'll save money on the car AND on gas 😀

AmusedYes, prices are the same and the US gov doesn't tax as much. I personally think that if the fed through a half dollar onto each gallon the population would long-term be well served by it. Take that half buck and throw every damn dollar (I mean half dollar!) into R&D for alternative energies. Ultimately people would need less gas to the point where they're not only saving that buck, but mroe importantly to the point where the US isn't at the mercy of much of the rest of the world. Oil plays WAY too much of a role in the foreign relations of the middle eastern governments. If the developed world could cut imports of oil from OPEC massively then it wouldn't be held hostage by those countries to such an extent and it could be more forthright with how it deals with them. For instance, we all know that saudi arabia is a big factory of terrorists, but you don't hear that from bush, do you?

Yeah. It's a nice thought, but.. there quite simply just isn't enough money in alternative energy right now for it to be worth it for anybody to persue it. That's the problem.

If it is true that the Earth has reached its peak in oil production, it is only a matter of time before the Energy Profit Ratio between crude oil and alternative energies become close enough to the point that exploring them becomes seriously worth it.

Oil used to have such a huge EPR that it was virtually free, around 100:1. The EPR of oil is currently about 10:1. That means it takes 1 barrel of oil in energy to extract 10 barrels. Some estimate that we will actually be in a defecit (~0.7:1) in the next 20 years. :Q

The energy crisis is pretty real. I just don't think it's going to be doomsday, we will adapt.. even if it means some hefty lifestyle changes. The only way it would be catastrophic is if it shut off like a tap - and thats exactly what isn't going to happen. Just like the ramp up in oil production took ~60 years, the ramp down in production will take about that long - at worst, something like 30 years. That is plenty of generational time for some pretty dramatic changes.

Of course, to the generation of those times, it will be normal, and we'll be all the old folks goin "Wow.. times sure have changed... I miss the late 90s.".

😛

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: Skoorb

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: Lonyo
If you bought more fuel efficient cars, you might not b!tch so much about prices.

It is never economical to replace a car that is in good repair simply in order to save money on fuel. I get 26 mpg highway with my big V8 Lincoln. It's a '95. If I sold it, I would get maybe $7,000. Maybe. A 2000 V6 Accord gets 28 mpg on the highway and with equivalent features and mileage to the Lincoln would cost $15,000 according to KBB. So a 2 mpg improvement would cost me $8,000 (and 90 HP). I drive about 12,000 miles per year. I would save 40 gallons of gasoline per year. Even at $2 per gallon it would take me 100 years for the savings in fuel to break even with the $8,000 initial price premium. Even with good vitamins and regular exercise, I'm not going to make it that long.

ZV

Bad car to replace it with 🙂 Pick a 95 corolla, and you'll save money on the car AND on gas 😀

A '95 Carolla will have significantly more miles than the Lincoln, far less space, will have no amenities, and the ride comfort will be a joke. Even the Accord was a slight step down, but at least it's comparable. I'd have to sacrifice a hell of a lot if I chose the Carolla (sooner get a Civic anyway) and, quite frankly, it's not worth it.

ZV

 

[Amused]

Originally posted by: Skoorb
But this isn't simply an economical issue in which you can hope for the private sector to spur things along. They've no interest in anything but money, so in that regard they can do it better, but from the held-hostage-by-middle-eastern-oil-barons, they don't care. The US gov't does, so only it has a piece of interest in that.

As Eli pointed out, it is economics that drive the world. Until an alternative is found that is cheaper than internal combustion, internal combustion will reign.

Of COURSE there isn't any intterest but money involved here. There never was, is, or will be any other interest involved. Altruism does not exist.

Trust me, once an alternative is found that is cheaper than internal combustion, it will take off very fast. The problem is, in all the years we've been looking, nothing has come close.

This is not something that can be solved by having the government throw money at it... hell, few things are solved by that. This is something that must be solved by private innovation.

 

[StageLeft]

A '95 Carolla will have significantly more miles than the Lincoln, far less space, will have no amenities, and the ride comfort will be a joke. Even the Accord was a slight step down, but at least it's comparable. I'd have to sacrifice a hell of a lot if I chose the Carolla (sooner get a Civic anyway) and, quite frankly, it's not worth it.

Well then you have to pay for the gas. I could say that stepping down from my H2 to a geo metro has shortcomings too, like not enough room to put my pool table in the back, drive over other cars, and see over the horizon, but that comes with a cost. The vast majority of people could easily make do with econoboxes - they have in England for years. Most people have a car larger and more powerful than they need. It is very simply a luxury. The benefits of that have to be weighed with the costs of moving that luxury around.