Cheney enters 'torture' memos row

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Sep 12, 2004
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Originally posted by: Lemon law
Finally we have something definitive from TLC, namely, "If GWB and Co are ever dragged into court over this and found guilty then I will gladly admit being in error."

Rest assured TLC, this forum will hold you to that statement you just made!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Meanwhile, the fact that GWB&co officials have, as of yet, escaped punishment will still fail to alter my position that the torture policies of GWB&co have always been wrong.

Perhaps first up on the docket but not a full test, the Senate impeachment to remove Bybee from the Federal bench.
Feel free to hold me to it. Be prepared to admit you were wrong yourself though if it doesn't turn out the way you want it to, assuming they even go to court in the first place. If they aren't dragged into court within the next year I can only assume it's because a case can't be made. If they aren't in court by the end of next April, or the Obama admin announces that it won't happen, be prepared to admit you were wrong as well.
 
Sep 12, 2004
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Originally posted by: eskimospy
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken

How did you address my points? International law, argumentum ad populum, proclamations from human rights agencies, equivocating torture by the Japanese, Nazis, and others to the methods we use when they are nowhere near identical in nature, not to mention your copious displays of condescention and arrogance all along the way?

Maybe you didn't notice, and clearly you haven't, but you didn't prove anything. You threw shit against the wall in the desperate hope it would stick. Didn't happen.

Don't even bother trying anymore because it's plain to see you just don't have anything valid and applicable.

Also, I find it funny that you're now trying to make the argument of 'but look at that guy over there!' to excuse your own behavior. I didn't know that 50 year olds still tried that one.
Shows what little you know about 50 year olds. Wouldn't be the first display of ignorance on that subject you've shown in here though.

No TLC. Just no. You can feel free to dismiss the judgments of legal experts, the judgments of international agencies considered the authority on what constitutes torture and inhuman treatment, precedent for the same technique used in the past, all of it. If you ignore it all long enough, maybe all of the rest of us on here will get tired and it will go away. So long as you keep your fingers in your ears and your eyes tightly shut you'll never have to admit being wrong about anything, no matter how much piles up against you.
I damn sure can dismiss them just like I can dismiss professors, engineers, ex-cia, and scientists claiming that the WTC buildings were brought down by demolitions. They haven't provided compelling proof of their claim either. If you want to rely on a bunch of pronouncements and pontifications from authority figures as proof positive and a presentation of the facts, help youself. I can link you to the truther forum too, if you want. Seems right up your acceptance of facts alley.

Nice comeback on the 50 year old thing by the way, 'you're wrong! 50 year olds ARE immature enough to think that another's behavior excuses their own!' I heartily concede defeat on that one TLC. :)
Don't worry. I'm sure you'll be posting immature responses like the one directly above when you reach 50. It's in your blood. Of course, that assumes you live long enough by avoiding smacking the wrong 50 year old with a newpaper in the first place.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
87,886
55,138
136
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: Lemon law
Finally we have something definitive from TLC, namely, "If GWB and Co are ever dragged into court over this and found guilty then I will gladly admit being in error."

Rest assured TLC, this forum will hold you to that statement you just made!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Meanwhile, the fact that GWB&co officials have, as of yet, escaped punishment will still fail to alter my position that the torture policies of GWB&co have always been wrong.

Perhaps first up on the docket but not a full test, the Senate impeachment to remove Bybee from the Federal bench.
Feel free to hold me to it. Be prepared to admit you were wrong yourself though if it doesn't turn out the way you want it to, assuming they even go to court in the first place. If they aren't dragged into court within the next year I can only assume it's because a case can't be made. If they aren't in court by the end of next April, or the Obama admin announces that it won't happen, be prepared to admit you were wrong as well.

If they weren't dragged into court that could be for one of a hundred reasons and you know it.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
87,886
55,138
136
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken

I damn sure can dismiss them just like I can dismiss professors, engineers, ex-cia, and scientists claiming that the WTC buildings were brought down by demolitions. They haven't provided compelling proof of their claim either. If you want to rely on a bunch of pronouncements and pontifications from authority figures as proof positive and a presentation of the facts, help youself. I can link you to the truther forum too, if you want. Seems right up your acceptance of facts alley.

Nice comeback on the 50 year old thing by the way, 'you're wrong! 50 year olds ARE immature enough to think that another's behavior excuses their own!' I heartily concede defeat on that one TLC. :)
Don't worry. I'm sure you'll be posting immature responses like the one directly above when you reach 50. It's in your blood. Of course, that assumes you live long enough by avoiding smacking the wrong 50 year old with a newpaper in the first place.

Nice attempt to conflate a few people with credentials on the lunatic fringe with the consensus of the legal community and authoritative international organizations. This willful and pathetic attempt to discredit inconvenient information makes the rest of your posts make perfect sense.

You've devolved into threatening to beat up anonymous people on the internet because they keep calling you stupid. Does your kid know you act like this?
 
Sep 12, 2004
16,852
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Originally posted by: eskimospy
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: Lemon law
Finally we have something definitive from TLC, namely, "If GWB and Co are ever dragged into court over this and found guilty then I will gladly admit being in error."

Rest assured TLC, this forum will hold you to that statement you just made!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Meanwhile, the fact that GWB&co officials have, as of yet, escaped punishment will still fail to alter my position that the torture policies of GWB&co have always been wrong.

Perhaps first up on the docket but not a full test, the Senate impeachment to remove Bybee from the Federal bench.
Feel free to hold me to it. Be prepared to admit you were wrong yourself though if it doesn't turn out the way you want it to, assuming they even go to court in the first place. If they aren't dragged into court within the next year I can only assume it's because a case can't be made. If they aren't in court by the end of next April, or the Obama admin announces that it won't happen, be prepared to admit you were wrong as well.

If they weren't dragged into court that could be for one of a hundred reasons and you know it.
Sure. It might not happen due to the fact that some very high placed Democrats could be indicted as well. Hurray for partisan politics.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
87,886
55,138
136
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: eskimospy
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: Lemon law
Finally we have something definitive from TLC, namely, "If GWB and Co are ever dragged into court over this and found guilty then I will gladly admit being in error."

Rest assured TLC, this forum will hold you to that statement you just made!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Meanwhile, the fact that GWB&co officials have, as of yet, escaped punishment will still fail to alter my position that the torture policies of GWB&co have always been wrong.

Perhaps first up on the docket but not a full test, the Senate impeachment to remove Bybee from the Federal bench.
Feel free to hold me to it. Be prepared to admit you were wrong yourself though if it doesn't turn out the way you want it to, assuming they even go to court in the first place. If they aren't dragged into court within the next year I can only assume it's because a case can't be made. If they aren't in court by the end of next April, or the Obama admin announces that it won't happen, be prepared to admit you were wrong as well.

If they weren't dragged into court that could be for one of a hundred reasons and you know it.
Sure. It might not happen due to the fact that some very high placed Democrats could be indicted as well. Hurray for partisan politics.

Yeap, so we agree that it wouldn't prove your point?
 
Sep 12, 2004
16,852
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Originally posted by: eskimospy
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken

I damn sure can dismiss them just like I can dismiss professors, engineers, ex-cia, and scientists claiming that the WTC buildings were brought down by demolitions. They haven't provided compelling proof of their claim either. If you want to rely on a bunch of pronouncements and pontifications from authority figures as proof positive and a presentation of the facts, help youself. I can link you to the truther forum too, if you want. Seems right up your acceptance of facts alley.

Nice comeback on the 50 year old thing by the way, 'you're wrong! 50 year olds ARE immature enough to think that another's behavior excuses their own!' I heartily concede defeat on that one TLC. :)
Don't worry. I'm sure you'll be posting immature responses like the one directly above when you reach 50. It's in your blood. Of course, that assumes you live long enough by avoiding smacking the wrong 50 year old with a newpaper in the first place.

Nice attempt to conflate a few people with credentials on the lunatic fringe with the consensus of the legal community and authoritative international organizations. This willful and pathetic attempt to discredit inconvenient information makes the rest of your posts make perfect sense.
That lunatic fringe is fueled greatly by partisan convictions, as I'm sure many of those in the concensus of the legal community are as well. That's not to mention that it's easy for people to make statements of political convenience based on the prevailing winds of public opinion. With the atmosphere surrounding the entire "TORTURE" row, few that saw things my way would have the nads to state their convictions to the public anyway. Political life and perception is often far more important to them than their personal convictions or beliefs, unfortunately. It's called being PC and it's nothing new.

You've devolved into threatening to beat up anonymous people on the internet because they keep calling you stupid. Does your kid know you act like this?
No, I responded to a condescending ass that threatened to beat me with a newspaper, like a dog. I'm sure my son, who's probably close to your age, would agree with me 100% on that.
 

OrByte

Diamond Member
Jul 21, 2000
9,303
144
106
GWB lowered the standard (or raised it depending upon your POW) to legally remove waterboarding as a legal form of torture. This is the basis of TLCs claims.

I guess to GWB and CO (and TLC) it doesn't matter than everyone before and everyone after GWBs presidency still regards waterboarding as torture.

 
Sep 12, 2004
16,852
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Originally posted by: eskimospy
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: eskimospy
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: Lemon law
Finally we have something definitive from TLC, namely, "If GWB and Co are ever dragged into court over this and found guilty then I will gladly admit being in error."

Rest assured TLC, this forum will hold you to that statement you just made!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Meanwhile, the fact that GWB&co officials have, as of yet, escaped punishment will still fail to alter my position that the torture policies of GWB&co have always been wrong.

Perhaps first up on the docket but not a full test, the Senate impeachment to remove Bybee from the Federal bench.
Feel free to hold me to it. Be prepared to admit you were wrong yourself though if it doesn't turn out the way you want it to, assuming they even go to court in the first place. If they aren't dragged into court within the next year I can only assume it's because a case can't be made. If they aren't in court by the end of next April, or the Obama admin announces that it won't happen, be prepared to admit you were wrong as well.

If they weren't dragged into court that could be for one of a hundred reasons and you know it.
Sure. It might not happen due to the fact that some very high placed Democrats could be indicted as well. Hurray for partisan politics.

Yeap, so we agree that it wouldn't prove your point?
Wouldn't prove yours either. And?
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
87,886
55,138
136
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: eskimospy
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: eskimospy
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: Lemon law
Finally we have something definitive from TLC, namely, "If GWB and Co are ever dragged into court over this and found guilty then I will gladly admit being in error."

Rest assured TLC, this forum will hold you to that statement you just made!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Meanwhile, the fact that GWB&co officials have, as of yet, escaped punishment will still fail to alter my position that the torture policies of GWB&co have always been wrong.

Perhaps first up on the docket but not a full test, the Senate impeachment to remove Bybee from the Federal bench.
Feel free to hold me to it. Be prepared to admit you were wrong yourself though if it doesn't turn out the way you want it to, assuming they even go to court in the first place. If they aren't dragged into court within the next year I can only assume it's because a case can't be made. If they aren't in court by the end of next April, or the Obama admin announces that it won't happen, be prepared to admit you were wrong as well.

If they weren't dragged into court that could be for one of a hundred reasons and you know it.
Sure. It might not happen due to the fact that some very high placed Democrats could be indicted as well. Hurray for partisan politics.

Yeap, so we agree that it wouldn't prove your point?
Wouldn't prove yours either. And?

I never claimed it would, you however did claim it would prove yours.
 
Sep 12, 2004
16,852
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Originally posted by: OrByte
GWB lowered the standard (or raised it depending upon your POW) to legally remove waterboarding as a legal form of torture. This is the basis of TLCs claims.

I guess to GWB and CO (and TLC) it doesn't matter than everyone before and everyone after GWBs presidency still regards waterboarding as torture.
I guess it doesn't matter to you that there's a legal definiton in this country of torture and that a bunch of public proclamations from talking heads don't make for a solid legal case?

It's sad how many in here rely so heavily on the emotional aspects of this issue that all they can do is loudly exclaim "TORTURE" and then wield it around like a club to beat any dissenters into submission.

'Ju vill NOT disagree with our athoritay!' /thwack
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
87,886
55,138
136
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: eskimospy

Nice attempt to conflate a few people with credentials on the lunatic fringe with the consensus of the legal community and authoritative international organizations. This willful and pathetic attempt to discredit inconvenient information makes the rest of your posts make perfect sense.
That lunatic fringe is fueled greatly by partisan convictions, as I'm sure many of those in the concensus of the legal community are as well. That's not to mention that it's easy for people to make statements of political convenience based on the prevailing winds of public opinion. With the atmosphere surrounding the entire "TORTURE" row, few that saw things my way would have the nads to state their convictions to the public anyway. Political life and perception is often far more important to them than their personal convictions or beliefs, unfortunately. It's called being PC and it's nothing new.

You've devolved into threatening to beat up anonymous people on the internet because they keep calling you stupid. Does your kid know you act like this?
No, I responded to a condescending ass that threatened to beat me with a newspaper, like a dog. I'm sure my son, who's probably close to your age, would agree with me 100% on that.

You're still trying to conflate the American legal community with 9/11 truthers. This is getting awfully silly on your part.

It's not my fault you can't be trained. Some people are just like that.
 
Sep 12, 2004
16,852
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Originally posted by: eskimospy
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: eskimospy
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: eskimospy
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: Lemon law
Finally we have something definitive from TLC, namely, "If GWB and Co are ever dragged into court over this and found guilty then I will gladly admit being in error."

Rest assured TLC, this forum will hold you to that statement you just made!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Meanwhile, the fact that GWB&co officials have, as of yet, escaped punishment will still fail to alter my position that the torture policies of GWB&co have always been wrong.

Perhaps first up on the docket but not a full test, the Senate impeachment to remove Bybee from the Federal bench.
Feel free to hold me to it. Be prepared to admit you were wrong yourself though if it doesn't turn out the way you want it to, assuming they even go to court in the first place. If they aren't dragged into court within the next year I can only assume it's because a case can't be made. If they aren't in court by the end of next April, or the Obama admin announces that it won't happen, be prepared to admit you were wrong as well.

If they weren't dragged into court that could be for one of a hundred reasons and you know it.
Sure. It might not happen due to the fact that some very high placed Democrats could be indicted as well. Hurray for partisan politics.

Yeap, so we agree that it wouldn't prove your point?
Wouldn't prove yours either. And?

I never claimed it would, you however did claim it would prove yours.
No, I said I "can only assume." It's certainly not from a lack of trying right now. If it happens that the Dems would rather try to shield their own then pursue this into court and take a risk, oh well. Wouldn't be the first time the Dems are just as guilty as those they accuse. Besides, there something called a presumption of innocence in this country. Unfortunately that hasn't prevented a number of people from already banging down their own gavel in the courthouse in their mind.
 

OrByte

Diamond Member
Jul 21, 2000
9,303
144
106
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: OrByte
GWB lowered the standard (or raised it depending upon your POW) to legally remove waterboarding as a legal form of torture. This is the basis of TLCs claims.

I guess to GWB and CO (and TLC) it doesn't matter than everyone before and everyone after GWBs presidency still regards waterboarding as torture.
I guess it doesn't matter to you that there's a legal definiton in this country of torture and that a bunch of public proclamations from talking heads don't make for a solid legal case?

It's sad how many in here rely so heavily on the emotional aspects of this issue that all they can do is loudly exclaim "TORTURE" and then wield it around like a club to beat any dissenters into submission.

'Ju vill NOT disagree with our athoritay!' /thwack

No it absolutely does matter.

which is why this is an issue to begin with.

And we are not talking about "a bunch of public proclaimations from talking heads"

Once upon a time the US government considered waterboarding as illegal.

Let me ask you this. Why did GWB issue an executive order back in 2002 which changed the definition of torture wrt waterboarding?

If there was never anything wrong with waterboarding, then there should have been no need to issue the order, right?

you are hiding behind the goal posts that GWB moved wrt waterboarding. Its not a very good argument, from a moral standpoint it is a shameful argument.

 

Lemon law

Lifer
Nov 6, 2005
20,984
3
0
Confirm or deny, TLC, did or did you not say "If GWB and Co are ever dragged into court over this and found guilty then I will gladly admit being in error."

You made your own bed, that argument is the argument of a hypocrite, and shows you lack the courage of your own prior convictions.

Maybe I was wrong in an earlier post in saying this thread was just rehashing old points, there is indeed something to be gained when TLC desperation brings out new TLC self contradictions.

I also noted that the TLC should not be time defined, and if some democrats join GWB&co in the docket, its the more the merrier as far as I am concerned.
 
Sep 12, 2004
16,852
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86
Originally posted by: eskimospy
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: eskimospy

Nice attempt to conflate a few people with credentials on the lunatic fringe with the consensus of the legal community and authoritative international organizations. This willful and pathetic attempt to discredit inconvenient information makes the rest of your posts make perfect sense.
That lunatic fringe is fueled greatly by partisan convictions, as I'm sure many of those in the concensus of the legal community are as well. That's not to mention that it's easy for people to make statements of political convenience based on the prevailing winds of public opinion. With the atmosphere surrounding the entire "TORTURE" row, few that saw things my way would have the nads to state their convictions to the public anyway. Political life and perception is often far more important to them than their personal convictions or beliefs, unfortunately. It's called being PC and it's nothing new.

You've devolved into threatening to beat up anonymous people on the internet because they keep calling you stupid. Does your kid know you act like this?
No, I responded to a condescending ass that threatened to beat me with a newspaper, like a dog. I'm sure my son, who's probably close to your age, would agree with me 100% on that.

You're still trying to conflate the American legal community with 9/11 truthers. This is getting awfully silly on your part.

It's not my fault you can't be trained. Some people are just like that.
I'm talking about the core motivations of people and that applies to conspiracy nuts and lawyers alike. I'm not sure you're far enough along in life to recognize things like that though. You still seem to be stuck in the inexperienced belief that everything is black and white, exactly as you interpret it, and anyone that disagree is wrong. Don't worry, you'll get wiser (hopefully) and eventually move away from that sophomoric mindset that so seems to rule over you now.
 
Sep 12, 2004
16,852
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Originally posted by: Lemon law
Confirm or deny, TLC, did or did you not say "If GWB and Co are ever dragged into court over this and found guilty then I will gladly admit being in error."

You made your own bed, that argument is the argument of a hypocrite, and shows you lack the courage of your own prior convictions.
Try reading more carefully, LL. I already answered that question.
 
Sep 12, 2004
16,852
59
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Originally posted by: OrByte
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: OrByte
GWB lowered the standard (or raised it depending upon your POW) to legally remove waterboarding as a legal form of torture. This is the basis of TLCs claims.

I guess to GWB and CO (and TLC) it doesn't matter than everyone before and everyone after GWBs presidency still regards waterboarding as torture.
I guess it doesn't matter to you that there's a legal definiton in this country of torture and that a bunch of public proclamations from talking heads don't make for a solid legal case?

It's sad how many in here rely so heavily on the emotional aspects of this issue that all they can do is loudly exclaim "TORTURE" and then wield it around like a club to beat any dissenters into submission.

'Ju vill NOT disagree with our athoritay!' /thwack

No it absolutely does matter.

which is why this is an issue to begin with.

And we are not talking about "a bunch of public proclaimations from talking heads"

Once upon a time the US government considered waterboarding as illegal.

Let me ask you this. Why did GWB issue an executive order back in 2002 which changed the definition of torture wrt waterboarding?

If there was never anything wrong with waterboarding, then there should have been no need to issue the order, right?

you are hiding behind the goal posts that GWB moved wrt waterboarding. Its not a very good argument, from a moral standpoint it is a shameful argument.
All waterboarding is not equal. I've explained this thoroughly already but apparently it's too inconvenient for people to respond to, so they ignore it instead.

Isn't this argument about what the US considers illegal (for other countries btw) pretty hypocritical? I'm pretty sure the US disagrees with countries like Iran putting their gays to death as well. Oddly enough, many of the same people in here citing US proclamations about other countries using waterboarding are the very same ones that claim we have no right to be interfering in the business of other countries. Allegedly we have no right to tell Iran what to do with their gay population? If an American journalist is imprisoned, that's just karma too.
 

OrByte

Diamond Member
Jul 21, 2000
9,303
144
106
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: OrByte
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: OrByte
GWB lowered the standard (or raised it depending upon your POW) to legally remove waterboarding as a legal form of torture. This is the basis of TLCs claims.

I guess to GWB and CO (and TLC) it doesn't matter than everyone before and everyone after GWBs presidency still regards waterboarding as torture.
I guess it doesn't matter to you that there's a legal definiton in this country of torture and that a bunch of public proclamations from talking heads don't make for a solid legal case?

It's sad how many in here rely so heavily on the emotional aspects of this issue that all they can do is loudly exclaim "TORTURE" and then wield it around like a club to beat any dissenters into submission.

'Ju vill NOT disagree with our athoritay!' /thwack

No it absolutely does matter.

which is why this is an issue to begin with.

And we are not talking about "a bunch of public proclaimations from talking heads"

Once upon a time the US government considered waterboarding as illegal.

Let me ask you this. Why did GWB issue an executive order back in 2002 which changed the definition of torture wrt waterboarding?

If there was never anything wrong with waterboarding, then there should have been no need to issue the order, right?

you are hiding behind the goal posts that GWB moved wrt waterboarding. Its not a very good argument, from a moral standpoint it is a shameful argument.
All waterboarding is not equal. I've explained this thoroughly already but apparently it's too inconvenient for people to respond to, so they ignore it instead.

Isn't this argument about what the US considers illegal (for other countries btw) pretty hypocritical? I'm pretty sure the US disagrees with countries like Iran putting their gays to death as well. Oddly enough, many of the same people in here citing US proclamations about other countries using waterboarding are the very same ones that claim we have no right to be interfering in the business of other countries. Allegedly we have no right to tell Iran what to do with their gay population? If an American journalist is imprisoned, that's just karma too.

yes yes this is the argument where you state that all waterboarding is not equal like some waterboarding belongs in a water park attraction. oy vey.

Lets not bring other countries and their laws into the argument...right TLC? otherwise we would also have to include UN treaties that the US is signatory on.... right TLC?

lets just focus on US law. And the fact that US law once defined waterboarding under the definition of torture...and per GWBs executive order back in 2002 that was changed.

all for the war on terror.




wow you are quick with the deflections!! wtg!!

edit: Id also like to add that legally speaking the arguments have yet to be made before a judge. Morally speaking....waterbaording has never changed since the freaking 1500s....yet you argue that its not torture and its no big deal...thats pretty sad.
 

Lemon law

Lifer
Nov 6, 2005
20,984
3
0
Now TLC tries revisionist history with, "Try reading more carefully, LL. I already answered that question."

Wrong again, TLC, you only added new conditions that try to self justify what you earlier said as an absolute. Not a logically consistent position, but any logically consistent position is something I find is always lacking from TLC. Logic like numbers are sharp things, they will always cut you if you try to juggle them.
 
Sep 12, 2004
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Originally posted by: OrByte

yes yes this is the argument where you state that all waterboarding is not equal like some waterboarding belongs in a water park attraction. oy vey.
Yeah, that's exactly what I said.

:roll:

Lets not bring other countries and their laws into the argument...right TLC? otherwise we would also have to include UN treaties that the US is signatory on.... right TLC?

lets just focus on US law. And the fact that US law once defined waterboarding under the definition of torture...and per GWBs executive order back in 2002 that was changed.

all for the war on terror.
US law is the only law that is binding in this case, in this country.


wow you are quick with the deflections!! wtg!!

edit: Id also like to add that legally speaking the arguments have yet to be made before a judge. Morally speaking....waterbaording has never changed since the freaking 1500s....yet you argue that its not torture and its no big deal...thats pretty sad.
Actually, the legal arguments need to be crafted long before this ever gets in front of a judge.

I don't think you can make the case that waterboarding someone till they pass out - and using it judiciously, with very specific restrictions placed upon it along with monitoring to prevent any harm coming to the person being waterboarded - are the identical thing either. However, I know those distinctions are inconvenient to your argument so keep on ignoring them. Everyone else has.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
87,886
55,138
136
Guys, TLC is now down to claiming that the American legal community thinks his position is crap because of their partisanship. I feel like we should invoke the mercy rule on this thread.
 
Sep 12, 2004
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Originally posted by: Lemon law
Now TLC tries revisionist history with, "Try reading more carefully, LL. I already answered that question."

Wrong again, TLC, you only added new conditions that try to self justify what you earlier said as an absolute. Not a logically consistent position, but any logically consistent position is something I find is always lacking from TLC. Logic like numbers are sharp things, they will always cut you if you try to juggle them.
Let me help you out, LL, since you really can''t seem to read:

"Feel free to hold me to it. Be prepared to admit you were wrong yourself though if it doesn't turn out the way you want it to, assuming they even go to court in the first place. If they aren't dragged into court within the next year I can only assume it's because a case can't be made. If they aren't in court by the end of next April, or the Obama admin announces that it won't happen, be prepared to admit you were wrong as well."

You seem to want this to be a one-way street where you are not willing to admit you were wrong under any conditions. Being logically consistent here is that one of us is wrong. If I end up wrong I'll admit it gladly and admit you were right. If I am right you will acknowledge it, gladly, and admit you were wrong.

In the event the case doesn't go to court then we remain where we are now, like a bastardization of Schroedinger's cat.

Fair enough?
 
Sep 12, 2004
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Originally posted by: eskimospy
Guys, TLC is now down to claiming that the American legal community thinks his position is crap because of their partisanship. I feel like we should invoke the mercy rule on this thread.
Your responses are really getting more and more pathetic. You are really feeling this completely slip away, aren't you, because the desperation in your replies is readily apparent. Mercy needs to be invoked on you.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
87,886
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Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: eskimospy
Guys, TLC is now down to claiming that the American legal community thinks his position is crap because of their partisanship. I feel like we should invoke the mercy rule on this thread.
Your responses are really getting more and more pathetic. You are really feeling this completely slip away, aren't you, because the desperation in your replies is readily apparent. Mercy needs to be invoked on you.

Haha, now we've come to 'I know you are but what am I!?'

And you wonder why I make fun of you.