In your position i think certs might actually help. I know lots of people who just went through the motion of getting a BS in CS, but are clueless when it actually comes down to it. Your school should have offered lots of certs at discounts. Without experience, certs might be a good idea.
In your position i think certs might actually help. I know lots of people who just went through the motion of getting a BS in CS, but are clueless when it actually comes down to it. Your school should have offered lots of certs at discounts. Without experience, certs might be a good idea.
What kind of unix/linux project do you want to be in charge of? You say you don't want to be coding, but I don't think that leaves you a lot of other options besides help desk work and system administration, really. I'm sure with more time you could become a senior sys admin instead of a junior sys admin, but if you don't want to do system administration, then where do you want to go? Maybe if you gave me a couple examples of projects you'd like to work on I'd better understand what you're trying to get into.
- Feb 1, 2003
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Well I would love to be the head of some large linux project for NASA or something along those lines. I want to use Unix or Linux in a cutting edge environment. I like doing system admin but I dont feel that the pay will be enough for me. Im looking to make around 90 to 100k a year in my dream position. I have never been the fastest learner but I work very hard at what I want. I guess what im saying is I want to be in a lead possition or managment position of a large Linux or Unix project.
Yes, it helps a little to get you that job. Doesn't help much if you have a job already.
MCSE is too easy to get, just a bit tedious...
CCNA is harder...
They don't teach you job experience thou.
Yeah, I agree. I find classroom trainning very boring and didn't really teach you much. Read the books and play with the examples. Right now I am study for MCSD (C# track) and I hope it is really worth it because the software already set me back over 600 + 300 in books
plus however much the exams cost.Originally posted by: Darkstar757
I totally agree but my problem now is getting my foot in the door. I want a mcse but I dont have the money to spend like 3grand on a bootcamp to be able to pass these things.
Ok, since you want to get your foot in the door, and in my opinion those MCSE tests really doesn't mean much anyway, you should go the route of free braindumps. Why waste money on bootcamp when you can just take all the tests and get it over with?
For CCNA, you should take the $1000 class where they give you a voucher for free CCNA test and gurantee that you would pass, else give you another voucher. (hmmm, maybe it was a 3k class? It's been a long time since I took it)
You have high goals, you're going to need much more than a BS for that. Probably a PhD or MBA as well.
What do you think you'd be doing at NASA? Yes, administering the systems; still a systems admin. To be doing things "cutting edge" you're going to need to go beyond what's available, and that requires coding skills.
90k to 100k will most likely be very difficult to achieve working for someone else, but it's not at all impossible if you can build up a client-base and go out on your own. Out of all the top systems administrators I know, I don't believe any of them pull in 6 figures.
A PhD to "use Unix or Linux in a cutting edge environment"? How will education help with that goal? He needs experience more than anything else, imo.
MaxDepth
Diamond Member
- Jun 12, 2001
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Most developers here in RTP, NC suck at managerial experience. Most of the really great IT people pretty muc want to be left alone in a team environment. The only ones that rise to a higher (non-architect) role are those kiss-ass muthahuskers that code for crap. Surprisingly, old blue just left a bunch of them go because they couldn't manage people or development. I am in the running for one of the jobs not because I have the higher skills than the middle developers, but because I have the mgmt skills that they say are needed.
But I see what everyone is saying. If you are already in the particular IT environment you want be in, then plug away and work on getting expereince. However, don't stop working in IT to just take cert classes. Experience wins the day for most shops, realistically.
I know what you mean, and I agree completely. So many in IT seem to want to simply be left alone to hack out code in their cubes (or whatever they do if they're not a programmer). To "rise above" doesn't necessarily mean kissing arse, it's just projecting a level of ambition or interest that exceeds the absolute minimum. I always called this "the love", because there is a small group of developers who do it because they genuinely enjoy it, and they generally accomplish a lot more. These days companies are learning that getting some of these people is more valuable than getting 10 cube monkies, and this is partially why so many ITers are out of work.
- Feb 1, 2003
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I think the saddest thing in IT is the lack inovation. I mean Im no super smart guy by any means. I have great math and problem solving skills. Im sure that if I was taken out of this monkey environment I could develop or improve something in the world of Computers, But due the greed of coperate america I am just a trained monkey.
Define this nebulous "use" in the bolded sentence. What does it mean? You will either be supporting the infrastructure, or you will be a programmer. You could be a software project manager, but you need experience and maybe an MBA to get there.
Sit down and think about exactly what you like and what you want to do. You say you want to make around 90k-100k in your "dream position," but what exactly is that position? What is the job title? What do you do all day long? Why is it worth so much to an employer?
Originally posted by: Darkstar757
I think the saddest thing in IT is the lack inovation. I mean Im no super smart guy by any means. I have great math and problem solving skills. Im sure that if I was taken out of this monkey environment I could develop or improve something in the world of Computers, But due the greed of coperate america I am just a trained monkey.
Not to admonish you, but who's fault is that? If you have ideas, implement them! There's an entire industry of extremely enthusiastic people ready to support you! IT is full or new ideas, and they change literally every single day. The great thing about IT is that you HAVE to be constantly involved, otherwise you quickly fall behind.
Well yeah, if you're selectively reading, then you're right. But he also said he wants to be head of a large linux project, like for NASA. I can guarantee you you'll need serious education for something like that.
Sorry, but I seriously doubt it. What would you be able to study in order to prepare for handling a "large linux project" anyway? There's absolutely nothing scientific about it, and the ability to successfully run a project of significant size would be entirely derived from past experiences.
If we're talking about redesigning some flight control simulation software to run on Linux then we have an entirely different situation, but he clearly stated that he doesn't want to do any of the coding. If you're not willing to do any coding, then you're limited to that which is out of the box; it's systems administration, nothing more. I'm certain NASA has a lot of techies to handle their IT needs, and I can guarantee you few, if any, have PhDs (and if do... in what?).
You've never heard of a PhD in CS or EE???
And i'm sure they have a lot of techies handling their IT needs, but again you're SELECTIVELY READING... he says he would like to HEAD a large linux project like for NASA. You're ignorant if you think just a BS in CS and a couple of certs will get you that kind of qualifications.
I'm saying how in the hell would a PhD in CS or EE prepare someone for running a project which is already successfully done by people everywhere? People roll out Linux in enterprises today that equal or exceed the requirements of NASA as it is, and I doubt any of them have a PhD in CS or EE.
Again, I ask you; what in the hell does a PhD in CS or EE have to do with successfully rolling out a new platform in an enterprise? Absolutely nothing.
I'll go to my local uni and ask the profs why they're aren't out there rolling out Linux in the enterprise as opposed to doing research. NASA is just an enterprise, remember.
Perhaps we need to define what a "large linux project" is, because my idea of one is obvoiusly a lot different than yours. Are we talking redesigning flight control simulation software as I said above, or are we talking about rolling Linux out to the end-users in the enterprise?
You're completely ignorant if you think all you need is certification to head a large project as large as NASA. I never said a PhD was going to guarantee anybody anything, but for something as large as what he's dreaming, you certainly need more education. You're a fool and ignorant of the industry if you believe otherwise.
And yes, he did define what a large project is: leading a project like that of NASA. Man, you need to learn some comprehension skills.
What flavor of Unix are you using? I know Solaris and Hp-UX have certs, so you should look into getting certified for something that directly relates to your job, as you are doing Unix right now.
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