CEO pay in America is fully under control.

[Deudalus]

Where is your outrage about professional athletes and movie stars? These people make far more doing far less.

They are all union members, that's different lol.

They aren't overpaid or under performing. They are middle class Americans. The back bone of our country. They are what makes our country great. They are road builders, construction workers.

We need to get these people back to work (despite the fact they are making millions per year and currently are locked out because they aren't content with a small pay cut).

Talking point, talking point.

 

[her209]

Those are SIGN on bonuses. The rest of their contracts aren't guaranteed, at least in the NFL anyway. They don't get severance bonuses.

Plus players get traded but they still get paid per the contract amount. I don't think athletes are treated as "employees" as it has a legal connotation to it. They're probably more like "contractors" if anything. I mean, how many employees have agents, right?

 

[IBMer]

They are all union members, that's different lol.

They aren't overpaid or under performing. They are middle class Americans. The back bone of our country. They are what makes our country great. They are road builders, construction workers.

We need to get these people back to work (despite the fact they are making millions per year and currently are locked out because they aren't content with a small pay cut).

Talking point, talking point.

Pretty sure this was already covered.

 

[spidey07]

You see who's mind? Where did I say control pay? I said CEO pay is out of control. Where did you read I purpose legislation to control CEO pay? Oh wait, you probably didn't read any of this, you just wanted to spit out more of your Fox News/Conservative nut job talking points.

Your very title and belief that it is "out of control". that directly implies you want to control it. Reading comprehension is always the strong point of conservatives, and the failure of liberals whose mental filter is clouded by failed idealogy. You can see the mind of a liberal on full display in this thread.

Remember how they are acting/thinking American taxpayer and worker. How soon before they want to control your pay? This should motivate you to vote and combat them. The time is drawing near where they are going full bat shit crazy because they know their agenda has been exposed by Obama and the country is quickly putting a stop to that. They are scared for they know Obama has set back their cause a good 20+ years.

So observe the mind of a liberal, it's how they really think and why we MUST defeat them come November 2012. It's your duty as Americans to defeat this.

 

[matt0611]

If you don't like how these businesses pay their employees don't buy their shares and don't do business with them.

If these businesses are wasting so much money on their top employees why doesn't someone buy them up and fire all their overpaid employees?

 

[ElFenix]

Your very title and belief that it is "out of control". that directly implies you want to control it. Reading comprehension is always the strong point of conservatives, and the failure of liberals whose mental filter is clouded by failed idealogy. You can see the mind of a liberal on full display in this thread.

it's out of shareholder control.

 

[Phokus]

If you don't like how these businesses pay their employees don't buy their shares and don't do business with them.

If these businesses are wasting so much money on their top employees why doesn't someone buy them up and fire all their overpaid employees?

Because of Interlocking Directorates you morons, do you guys not know how corporate boards work?

 

[Argo]

Well, there is no wonder hp is doing so "well". Its brilliant decisions like that.

 

[Phokus]

Well, there is no wonder hp is doing so "well". Its brilliant decisions like that.

This isn't really only HP though, it's pretty much all (or almost all) publicly traded companies. The reason for these bad CEO contracts is because of interlocking directorates.

 

[Ausm]

Watch in amazement as people complain about teachers making 50k/yr will stand up to defend a CEO's severance pay.

Pretty pathetic sight indeed

:thumbsup::thumbsup:

 

[Siddhartha]

Watch in amazement as people complain about teachers making 50k/yr will stand up to defend a CEO's severance pay.

They do not value education particularly public education that highly.

 

[matt0611]

Because of Interlocking Directorates you morons, do you guys not know how corporate boards work?

Don't shareholders elect the board? Whats stopping someone from buying up all the shares and firing the board making these bad decisions?

It still stands that if you don't like how a company is doing business, don't do business with them.

 

[rudder]

There are a limited number of individuals who are considered to qualified to be a CEO of a large corporation. To attract these indivduals to your company you need to offer a very attractive compensation package.

I think most people understand this. I think the problem is with CEO's raping a company. Remember Eastern airlines (a while ago), but I knew a lot of pilots who worked for them before Frank Lorenzo ran the company into the ground... and he left with millions.

Compensation packages should be attractive... but I do not understand why boards continually reward failure.

 

[theeedude]

:thumbsup:

he's a job creator. lay off!

 

[Phokus]

More about interlocking directorates:

When i was with IBM back in 2005, the CEO, Sam Palmisano was also the Chairman of the Board of Directors.

Not only that, but he sat on Exxon's board of directors.

Not only that, there was an ex-Exxon executive that sat on IBM's board.

This is probably the most egregious example, typically they aren't this bad, but there still are interlocks by a few degrees of seperation.

There's no independence in corporate governance. This is why in Germany, where, by law, workers/unions are allowed representation on the Board, they have 6% unemployment and booming exports right now while we have absolute shit here in America.

 

[hal2kilo]

Watch in amazement as people complain about teachers making 50k/yr will stand up to defend a CEO's severance pay.

It is amazing isn't it.

 

[Phokus]

Don't shareholders elect the board? Whats stopping someone from buying up all the shares and firing the board making these bad decisions?

It still stands that if you don't like how a company is doing business, don't do business with them.

LMAO, because hostile takeovers are VERY hard to do these days. There are a myriad ways of defending against them (not to mention it's really expensive and risky to buy enough shares to have control):

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hostile_takeover#Tactics_against_hostile_takeover

How the hell do you guys not know this?

 

[matt0611]

Watch in amazement as people complain about teachers making 50k/yr will stand up to defend a CEO's severance pay.

I'm forced to pay for the teachers salary by law. I don't have to pay HP anything if I don't buy their products.

 

[momeNt]

More about interlocking directorates:
When i was with IBM, the CEO, Sam Palmisano was also the Chairman of the Board of Directors.

Not only that, but he sat on Exxon's board of directors.

Not only that, there was an ex-Exxon executive that sat on IBM's board.

This is probably the most egregious example, typically they aren't this bad, but there still are interlocks by a few degrees of seperation.

There's no independence in corporate governance. This is why in Germany, where, by law, workers/unions are allowed representation on the Board, they have 6% unemployment and booming exports right now while we have absolute shit here in America.

If you allow unions to be on the board you get 6% unemployment and booming exports? I didn't realize it was that easy - somebody go write that law asap. Here we all thought it had to do with currency manipulation and regulations.

 

[Phokus]

If you allow unions to be on the board you get 6% unemployment and booming exports? I didn't realize it was that easy - somebody go write that law asap. Here we all thought it had to do with currency manipulation and regulations.

And yet, Germany is doing exceedingly well. It makes sense. Rather than having a hostile relationship, if you have worker representation on the board, you have a bigger stake in the company.

Codetermination in Germany is a concept with a solid history that involves the right of workers to participate in management of the companies they work for. Known as Mitbestimmung, the modern law on codetermination is found principally in the Mitbestimmungsgesetz of 1976. The law allows workers to elect representatives (usually trade union representatives) for almost half of the supervisory board of directors. The legislation is separate from the main German company law Act for public companies, the Aktiengesetz. It applies to public and private companies, so long as there are over 2000 employees. For companies with 500-2000 employees, one third of the supervisory board must be elected.

There is also legislation in Germany, known as the Betriebsverfassungsgesetz, whereby workers are entitled to form Works Councils at local shop floor level.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Codetermination_in_Germany

Shareholder capitalism has been a spectacular failure while Germany has shown stakeholder capitalism has been an incredible success.

And i'm going to keep saying this again: How the fuck don't you guys know this?

 

[matt0611]

Germany historically has a very high unemployment rate and very low GDP growth.
How don't you know this?

 

[Patranus]

Not really sure what the big deal is.
A private company entered into a private contract with a private individual.

The board of directors knew what they were getting into when they hired this guy and had these provisions in the contract.

Guess what, you need provisions like these to attract talent. Sure sometimes they don't work out but to simply get them to do the job you need incentives.

If shareholders don't like these payouts, nothing is stopping them from electing other individuals to the board of directors.

 

[Phokus]

Germany historically has a very high unemployment rate and very low GDP growth.
How don't you know this?

Gee, maybe it took them a while to stabilize because they had to integrate a former soviet puppet state, East Germany, into their economy? How do you not know this?

Their unemployment and exports are the envy of the world right now, kiss their ring.

 

[matt0611]

Gee, maybe it took them a while to stabilize because they had to integrate a former soviet puppet state, East Germany, into their economy? How do you not know this?

Their unemployment and exports are the envy of the world right now, kiss their ring.

Its not just germany, its europe as a whole. They've all had historically high unemployment and low rates of growth compared to the US.

 

[Phokus]

Not really sure what the big deal is.
A private company entered into a private contract with a private individual.

The board of directors knew what they were getting into when they hired this guy and had these provisions in the contract.

Guess what, you need provisions like these to attract talent. Sure sometimes they don't work out but to simply get them to do the job you need incentives.

If shareholders don't like these payouts, nothing is stopping them from electing other individuals to the board of directors.

For the 100th time: Interlocking Directorates you imbecile. You don't have choice.

Also, i probably own a shitload of stocks via my 401k/IRA funds, as do millions of other Americans. Do I have control over the board? Do i even have time to go over every single company in my portfolio to make sure this shit isn't happening? No.