Question Cat6 over Cat5e for a New Home?

[Fallengod]

Hello.

Just need some help from someone experienced here.

To make a long story short, I bought a new home which I get to pick everything for. One of the wiring options is deciding what rooms to put Ethernet cable in and whether or not to upgrade the whole house to Cat6. They are charging $266 to upgrade cables to cat6. I just want to know if this is worth it to do? Halp!

I am considering installing POE Security cameras which would use power over ethernet as well, so that is part of my thoughts. Past that I dont see myself really "needing" the features of cat6 but maybe better for future proofing to do it now?

 

[JackMDS]

In addition to the Speed take a look at the Bandwidth.

Demystifying Ethernet Types —Difference between Cat5e, Cat 6, and Cat7

Ethernet represents the plumbing pipes of the Internet. Familiarize yourself with the ethernet types: Cat5e and Cat6 cables with RJ45 connectors.

planetechusa.com

 

[JimKiler]

The problem I am going to have is, its the builder doing all this, so if I ask them if its CAT6a and not just 6, and they say no.....what are my options? They do not allow outside contractors to come in to do this stuff. I already asked and they told me no, and if I did it, they would just rip them all out and do it again themselves so....

I am going to ask if its CAT6a but, I am unsure of what I do if they say no its not.

Here is So-Cal, I am at the mercy of the builder kinda so... Right now today I just decided on doing 2 drops to the Great room/Living room where my entertainment center will be, 2 drops to my office and 1 drop to each bedroom (3 bedrooms). I then have 4 drops outside for POE security cameras outside so I can possible add POE cameras at a later date.

Anyways, thats where I am at right now. It costs me $400 per 4 drops so... I am planning on having a total of 12 drops, which will be $1200.

The box for all this stuff is in my closet in my master bedroom. So that is where the router would be. This builder is so cheap they got the box area covered by a metal plate and have an option to add a plastic transparent window for $200 which helps the wireless signal get to the rest of the house. I decided I am not paying that today and will just do that crap myself at a later date.

Most builders do not let you do any work yourself. But I am 90% confident if you do it they would not rip it out. Ripping it out would cost time and money so they will not do it. I have known people who insulate and what not and each time the builder would say when now that it is in they will leave it. I had my builder give me a weekend so my wife and I could paint 7 rooms before ceilings, carpet, and trim were installed. Painting is so much easier when you don't have to worry about trim!

FYI, 9 years ago I know builders would charge $1K for an upgrade from Cat5e to Cat6 so $260 is very reasonable. But ask them if it is Cat6a. I would not worry too much if it is only Cat 6 but ask what the cost would be for Cat6a, it cannot hurt.

 

[Fallengod]

Most builders do not let you do any work yourself. But I am 90% confident if you do it they would not rip it out. Ripping it out would cost time and money so they will not do it. I have known people who insulate and what not and each time the builder would say when now that it is in they will leave it. I had my builder give me a weekend so my wife and I could paint 7 rooms before ceilings, carpet, and trim were installed. Painting is so much easier when you don't have to worry about trim!

FYI, 9 years ago I know builders would charge $1K for an upgrade from Cat5e to Cat6 so $260 is very reasonable. But ask them if it is Cat6a. I would not worry too much if it is only Cat 6 but ask what the cost would be for Cat6a, it cannot hurt.

Yeah. I dunno. That is what they told me.

Yeah we had another meeting with them and they said it is NOT Cat6a so.....It is just Cat6. Whatever. Im just gonna have to live with it. I can have it done later I guess but that seems like it would be a nightmare. They are not going to do Cat6a even if I want them to add it instead.

So that is the end of that. I did do the Cat6 over the Cat5e because its only $266 at least. And I did like 13 drops in the house so....

 

[JimKiler]

Yeah. I dunno. That is what they told me.

Yeah we had another meeting with them and they said it is NOT Cat6a so.....It is just Cat6. Whatever. Im just gonna have to live with it. I can have it done later I guess but that seems like it would be a nightmare. They are not going to do Cat6a even if I want them to add it instead.

So that is the end of that. I did do the Cat6 over the Cat5e because its only $266 at least. And I did like 13 drops in the house so....

I forgot, but the other thing i added to my house was a tech tube from the basement to the attic. Depending on location that might help you add more cable later.

 

[Fallen Kell]

I forgot, but the other thing i added to my house was a tech tube from the basement to the attic. Depending on location that might help you add more cable later.

Yeah, I have thought about adding that myself. The only reason I have not is that I have yet to run lines to my second floor (the only thing up there is a TV, and possibly a game console from time to time, but all the other real electronics are on the first floor or basement). If I had a different style home, I would say this is probably a very smart idea. I would also say a smart idea is to run a conduit from the room/location that your lines enter the home to your centralized network distribution center. I am not sure if they are also running your home's other wiring systems to the same location (i.e. coax cables for TV and twisted pair phone lines), but it is certainly convenient if they are in one spot and usually increases home value a bit since they can all be easily managed instead of needing to crawl around the basement/attic/eaves/crawlspaces to find out that there is cable splitter hidden that went faulty.

 

[cellarnoise]

Any chance you can just have them install 3/4 conduit to the locations you want and then you install whatever cables you want later?

Tech is always changing... Who knows... Maybe we all be running fiber to each room in a year or two.

Cat 5e can do 10 gigs up to a 100 feet? Same as 6? No?

I would research if 6 is really any better than 5e for 10 gigs for over 100 feet.

Conduit allows for the future at 3/4 inch or larger. I'd go 1" as pulling additional lines with existing lines in 3/4 with fish tape can be a pain, but in the end it is really just time unless there are more than 2 or so bends.

I normally only use 1 "drop" in my own home if it is in conduit, but I have been lucky and have never had a problem. In my home theater area it has 1" conduit and two 5e lines, but I still only use one, but I was trying to plan for the future and the future has changed. To that room I also ran an additional 1" conduit for A.V. and I am happy as that HDMI cable is now end of life, though it won't need to be upgraded until I replace the projector and "center console"...

Thank goodness old school speaker cable has not changed much

Editing my own post. I would install 1" conduit and a large enough behind the wall and outlet at each room. Looking back it is so cheap to make future upgrades earlier. I would not do multiple drops if you have this. I would not spend more money than this except for 6A at this point.

The power of the newer HDMI signals in addition to 1 gig is very helpful.

If you are going to have a crazy theater room I would also run enough power to run future upgrades to high powered amplifiers. I only ran two 120 amp lines to my theater room and I should have ran 3. I have not had much problem, but once you add bum shakers, and a few amps to power some large subwoofers and shakers, ect. the power peaks can push things.

Overbuilding or adding large conduit up front is better, as I am finding out coming up on 10 years later.

Though so far my cat 5e on shorter than 100 foot runs has not been a problem even with 2.5 gbe. Though I am not really pushing it yet.

 

[Fallengod]

Good info.

"Any chance you can just have them install 3/4 conduit to the locations you want and then you install whatever cables you want later?"

No, they arnt going to do that....


Ya. I dont know what to do, as this is my first new home where I had to make these decisions....

With that said, you can help me with my logic:

I upgraded to the Cat6 because its only $266 for the entire house. I am only doing it to help "future proof" things. I realize I probably do not need Cat6 over Cat5e, but its only $266... I was considering not doing anything and having someone later come in and install Cat6A instead but I just feel like having to go through walls on a brand new home I just had built and messing with that is not worth it maybe? To save $266? I am not that poor. It is however a single story home, so it might not be that difficult? I dont have much experience with this stuff...

I did 3 drops to the main great room where the TV will be with a 2" conduit. Any reason to go 1" over 2"? Either conduit was the same price($199) so I did 2".

I did 3 drops just because some suggested doing multiple just incase I have a problem with 1 of them or something. Also, if you have a receiver with internet and/or a game console, blu-ray player or something like that which might also work by direct connecting to internet, that could be nice to have. So I did 3.

With hesitation, I did 1 drop to each bedroom(2 bedrooms, 1 master) just to do it, so people wouldnt need to rely on a wireless signal. Do you think I should do conduit for the bedrooms? How is that beneficial really? I dont care if peoples bedrooms have wires hanging down from the wall really, I dunno.... Also, if its on a TV stand, it wouldnt be needed anyways right?

I did 2 drops to my office as well, just in case because that is where my computer will be and you never know. Computer + TV or something like that. Did not do a conduit there either, but I could. The conduit costs $200 per room. Maybe since I spend a lot of time there, if I had a TV mounted or monitor, it would save having wires coming down the wall I guess.

So I didnt do conduits in any other room except for the great room/living room where the main TV home theater will be.


Feedback?

I have 6 days left to decide on any changes to anything in the home, after Tuesday this next week, its final.

 

[Hans Gruber]

Good info.

"Any chance you can just have them install 3/4 conduit to the locations you want and then you install whatever cables you want later?"

No, they arnt going to do that....


Ya. I dont know what to do, as this is my first new home where I had to make these decisions....

With that said, you can help me with my logic:

I upgraded to the Cat6 because its only $266 for the entire house. I am only doing it to help "future proof" things. I realize I probably do not need Cat6 over Cat5e, but its only $266... I was considering not doing anything and having someone later come in and install Cat6A instead but I just feel like having to go through walls on a brand new home I just had built and messing with that is not worth it maybe? To save $266? I am not that poor. It is however a single story home, so it might not be that difficult? I dont have much experience with this stuff...

I did 3 drops to the main great room where the TV will be with a 2" conduit. Any reason to go 1" over 2"? Either conduit was the same price($199) so I did 2".

I did 3 drops just because some suggested doing multiple just incase I have a problem with 1 of them or something. Also, if you have a receiver with internet and/or a game console, blu-ray player or something like that which might also work by direct connecting to internet, that could be nice to have. So I did 3.

With hesitation, I did 1 drop to each bedroom(2 bedrooms, 1 master) just to do it, so people wouldnt need to rely on a wireless signal. Do you think I should do conduit for the bedrooms? How is that beneficial really? I dont care if peoples bedrooms have wires hanging down from the wall really, I dunno.... Also, if its on a TV stand, it wouldnt be needed anyways right?

I did 2 drops to my office as well, just in case because that is where my computer will be and you never know. Computer + TV or something like that. Did not do a conduit there either, but I could. The conduit costs $200 per room. Maybe since I spend a lot of time there, if I had a TV mounted or monitor, it would save having wires coming down the wall I guess.

So I didnt do conduits in any other room except for the great room/living room where the main TV home theater will be.


Feedback?

I have 6 days left to decide on any changes to anything in the home, after Tuesday this next week, its final.

Cat 6 is all you need. Cat6a would be a nice but not necessary feature. There is a big difference between Cat5e and Cat6 but not as big a difference between Cat6 and Cat6a.

 

[VirtualLarry]

Cat 6 is all you need. Cat6a would be a nice but not necessary feature. There is a big difference between Cat5e and Cat6 but not as big a difference between Cat6 and Cat6a.

Guess that you don't care to get your drops "certified".

 

[Hans Gruber]

Guess that you don't care to get your drops "certified".

I am not trying to sound like a dick here. We are talking about residential networking gear. I may sound a bit naive to you networking experts. Should we ask the home owner if he has invested in Doc Brown's flux capacitor. Any homeowner who has bought a new home knows they don't send out the best of the best when it comes to installing networking cable. They are not going to show up with an ethernet speed certification tool for few hundred in Cat6 cable.

 

[VirtualLarry]

I am not trying to sound like a dick here. We are talking about residential networking gear. I may sound a bit naive to you networking experts. Should we ask the home owner if he has invested in Doc Brown's flux capacitor. Any homeowner who has bought a new home knows they don't send out the best of the best when it comes to installing networking cable. They are not going to show up with an ethernet speed certification tool for few hundred in Cat6 cable.

Might as well ask the drywall guy if he can do your plumbing. Obviously, homeowners don't care if things are installed professionally, just that they "basically work", and they save a buck in the process.

 

[Hans Gruber]

Might as well ask the drywall guy if he can do your plumbing. Obviously, homeowners don't care if things are installed professionally, just that they "basically work", and they save a buck in the process.

No, homeowners pay for professional work. Meaning they pay for competence and the results are between good and totally incompetent. There is a difference between a bill of sale and a bill of goods.

 

[mxnerd]

Unless you need 10G over 33meters to 100 meters, then you do need cat6a.

Cat6 although not a real standard, is good for 10Gbps over 33 meters to 55 meters and is used widely. Besides that, security cameras don't even need 100Mbps.

As long as it works, it works. No one is certifying residential low voltage network cables. 10Gbps is good for many years to come for most home users.

 

[Fallengod]

I dont have an option anyways. I cant put in my own Cat6a while the home is being built. They just dont allow it. My only option would be to after I move in, to go through and redo all the Cat6 in the walls and change to Cat6a. I just dont see how that would be easy or really that necessary so, this is my only option.

 

[mxnerd]

You don't have to do anything until you have 10G gears and you prove that your 10G gears can't run at 10G rate with cat6 cables.

 

[Shmee]

While I am not liking the sound of your contractor, realistically cat6 should be fine even for 10G unless there is a very long run.

 

[Fallengod]

While I am not liking the sound of your contractor, realistically cat6 should be fine even for 10G unless there is a very long run.

Its a single story home, 1940 sqft.

 

[Shmee]

Yeah you should be fine then. As mentioned, cat6 can do 10GbE up to 55 meters.

 

[Fallengod]

Yeah you should be fine then. As mentioned, cat6 can do 10GbE up to 55 meters.

Thats why I am not that worried about it. Its just a single story home. Anyways, appreciate the help.

Im still trying to finalize my electrical stuff as well and decide if I need a conduit in the office or just leave it alone. Too many things to decide.

The network box is in the closet of the master bedroom where everything comes to. So this will obviously be my box for the router and/or security system etc. They have a $200 option to widen the box to 42" vs the standard of 30" I think and they add a clear plastic covering to that which the guy told me I should do to help wireless signal pass through. Otherwise the metal plate and 30" is standard. Worth it?

 

[mxnerd]

If you are going to put WiFi router in that metal box, then you definitely need a plastic cover to let the signal to pass through. WiFi signal can't penetrate metal materials.

 

[cellarnoise]

You have done well with the limited options you have been given it sounds like to me.

I would not put up with the beallshit about not using 6A. I would offer to buy a 1000' box of it to hand to the contractor at this point and say that the cable does need to be warrantied. It is so much easier to install up front. Conduit without wire is about the same cost and upgradable, but whatever.

Cat 6 is old school at this point, but should be good for 5 to 10 years?

We all don't really know what will be the next big thing. Wireless keeps getting stronger and wires are really limiting for the latest generation unless they are wanting lowest latency and then they complain. Repeaters and wireless mesh systems work best over Ethernet. Next gen will likely need 2.5 or 5 or 10 real backhaul, but 6 or 6e should be good for up to 150 feet.

I am getting old... techwise and if you plan on being in a home for another 20 years. 20 years ago with home expansion I installed 3/4 and 1 inch conduit and ran cat 5e or maybe cat 5 or whatever was available then and am still using it now. Hard to know what you will need in the future, but I still have some 500' cat 5e box sitting around in a box. Though I may have run through another 500' cat 5e in the past? I truly forget, but I know I don't have any cable better that cat 5e... And back to my router from all runs except from my garage are all under 100'. My garage Cat run I have not ever test for speed over 100 mbs....

The future comes fast. And I will end on that as I recommended conduit for the future. I started out on a 6809e. I hope you live long and prosper as I still think I have my 256 baud model

 

[mxnerd]

My old cat5 (not cat5e) cable at 50ft can even run at 1G rate, why people insist OP should use cat6a when it's not an option and is not needed for his one story home? I really don't get it. And wireless better than ethernet? Gosh.

 

[JimKiler]

If you are going to put WiFi router in that metal box, then you definitely need a plastic cover to let the signal to pass through. WiFi signal can't penetrate metal materials.

I would not put the router in that metal box, maybe on top of or put it on a shelf somewhere else around there.

OP wireless signals will not penetrate metal nor solid wood. Keep it high and open as much as possible.

 

[Fallengod]

I would not put the router in that metal box, maybe on top of or put it on a shelf somewhere else around there.

OP wireless signals will not penetrate metal nor solid wood. Keep it high and open as much as possible.

I was sort of thinking that too. I am not sure I need to spend the $200 to widen the box and for a plastic cover lol. But it is only $200. I dunno. Its in the closet of the master so, I am not sure there is a shelf to put it on but...

 

[JimKiler]

I was sort of thinking that too. I am not sure I need to spend the $200 to widen the box and for a plastic cover lol. But it is only $200. I dunno. Its in the closet of the master so, I am not sure there is a shelf to put it on but...

It is more like $230 since you have to pay interest on it for 30 years. Get the smaller one and put the router outside it.