Cartoon Protesters Rampage in Pakistan

[dahunan]

Originally posted by: Aimster

Originally posted by: ntdz

Originally posted by: Aimster

Originally posted by: ntdz

Originally posted by: Aimster

Originally posted by: ntdz

Originally posted by: Aimster

Originally posted by: ntdz

Originally posted by: Aimster

Originally posted by: ntdz

Originally posted by: Todd33
I guess the Bible is responsible for the Spanish Inquisition and the Crusades too?

How are those "raving lunatics" acting out here in America? That's right they have jobs and own homes. Maybe you should read up on the living conditions of these people before you blame their religion. It just so happens that most of those people acting out live in poverty and oppressed parts of the world. Do you think that if the converted to Mormonism they would suddenly act differently? Oh wait...

http://www.religioustolerance.org/lds_mass.htm

Humans are violent, especially when have no power and nothing to lose.

Do you see Africans, who are in a much worst plight blowing themselves up in the name of their religion? Do you see them rioting over cartoons? No. Poverty is no excuse for that kind of behavior.

Welcome to the education train. I am your driver, Aimster:

There are millions in Africa who are Muslim. 48% of Africa is Muslim.

And how about South America? Are they Muslim too?

Yeah why dont you go to South America and tell people you are from the U.S.

I hope you have a rich family who can pay your randsom.

Are they going to kidnap me in the name of their religion, or are they doing it for the money? Big difference.

They don't kidnap people in the name of their religion. They kidnap people with demands such as "release all hostages" "release all women from prision".

And how do they justify beheading people when the prisoners aren't released? Their religion.

Beheading is how Arabs have been killing people for a longgg time. It has nothing to do with religion. It is supposed to be painless and quick.

How does the method of killing have to do with religion?

The method has nothing to do with it, I'm talking about killing an innocent person, I don't care how. They justify killing innocents using their religion, listen to the Bin Laden tapes...

Bin Laden was disowned by his own family and his own country. That should tell you just how popular his views were. This is coming from a fanatical country like SA too.

People claim to kill in the name of Jesus all the time. They are mentally ill.
Bin Laden is mentally ill.

Just because a man kills in the name of religion doesn't mean the religion says it is right.

Very Well Spoken :thumbsup:

 

[ntdz]

Originally posted by: Aimster
Bin Laden was disowned by his own family and his own country. That should tell you just how popular his views were. This is coming from a fanatical country like SA too.

People claim to kill in the name of Jesus all the time. They are mentally ill.
Bin Laden is mentally ill.

Just because a man kills in the name of religion doesn't mean the religion says it is right.

No, I totally agree that Islam doesn't say it's right. It's all the religious leaders and fanaticals misinterpreting the religion that is creating the problem. Oh, and I've never heard, not once, of anyone killing in the name of Jesus.

 

[Aimster]

Women kills her two sons claming God told her to do it:

http://www.thedailyfarce.com/legal.cfm?..._crazymotherpleaseinsanity_03200400055
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4625603/

Man Claims Jesus told him to kill:

http://www.cbc.ca/stories/2004/01/12/lindh040112

In a world where people will pay thousands to purchase items off ebay that look like the Virgin Mary ... a bunch of wacko crap is possible.

 

[Buck Armstrong]

Originally posted by: Aimster

Originally posted by: Astaroth33

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: Astaroth33

Originally posted by: Rainsford
I think they are a bunch of fvcking wackos who happen to be Muslim.

On the contrary, I tend to this that this is the Islamic world (as a cultural entity) showing its true colors. They are setting themselves up to be the enemy of Western civilization.

Perhaps, but we are doing an awsome job doing the same thing. We're not burning down Muslims businesses (yet), but we aren't exactly going out of our way to make it clear that we don't think of all Muslims as our enemy. Hell, some people probably DO look at it that way. I think such a perception is rather common over there, and we're not really doing much about it.

Well, when Muslims are flying planes into buildings, hanging charred American bodies from bridges, beheading hostages, suicide bombing, and so on and so forth, then my perception is indeed that they are enemies.

Christians/Catholics don't do anything wrong, right?

Go on answer my question.

I 'll answer it. Because the Christians do "wrong" things like claiming the purple Teletubby is gay, we're all going to burn in Hell, Katrina is God's vengeance for Mardi Gras, and so on. But they aren't actually decapitating the Teletubbies! Pat Robertson says, "Chavez should be assassinated", but he doesn't send someone to fvcking kill him! And most of us laugh when they pontificate about such things, rather than rabidly agreeing, foaming at the mouth, and pouring out into the streets to riot and burn Teletubby effigies.

Muslims on the other hand...well...watch the news. Jerking off in a hotel room or calling a children's TV character a lovely human is alot less harmful than beheadings, suicide bombings, and attacking office buildings with hijacked airplanes specifically to kill thousands of civilians. Let's just be honest here; its not the religion, its the fact that their entire culture seethes with hatred of everything different or foreign, religious, racial, political, or otherwise, and they use their archaic religion to provide the excuse.

Many American Muslims, on the other hand, probably live here BECAUSE they wanted to escape that constant turmoil, live and raise their families in peace, and still be free to practice their religion as they choose. I would also wager that, just as you've implied, the American Muslim is head-for-head more educated than his Middle Eastern counterpart.

 

[Whoozyerdaddy]

Soooo far OT... But the headline to this thread gave me a mental image of Mickey Mouse running amok. 😀

Cartoon Protesters Rampage in Pakistan

Back on topic... The rioters are idiots. I don't care for their so-called reasons. There is no reason to burn down buildings and murder people over a CARTOON.

 

[Todd33]

Originally posted by: ntdz
No, I totally agree that Islam doesn't say it's right. It's all the religious leaders and fanaticals misinterpreting the religion that is creating the problem. Oh, and I've never heard, not once, of anyone killing in the name of Jesus.

Originally posted by: ntdz
It's not a coincidence that some of the most violent and unruly countries are Islamic...there is something about, of which I have no idea, that turns their people into raving lunatics that other religions do not.

You have no idea huh? Seems to me you know it's not the religion, but the people. It could be any religion and in the past it has been Christianity.

The use of torture was common at the time and there is a tendency for any medieval torture technique to be automatically attributed to the Spanish Inquisition. Many techniques commonly attributed in popular fiction were probably never used:
Bricking a defendant up to starve to death.
Smashing a defendant's joints with hammers.
Flailing a defendant on the wheel.
Raping female defendants.

Torquemada documented some of his techniques. A favorite was tortura del'agua (water torture), in which the victim was strapped to a rack, his mouth forced open with a rag, and water was then forced down the throat so that the victim felt he was drowning. In another technique, the garrucha, the victim's hands were tied behind his back at the wrists; the victim was then lifted off the ground by the wrists. The 'Spanish chair', a device used to hold the victim while the soles of their feet were roasted, was certainly in existence in Spain during the period of the Inquisition. It is uncertain, however, whether it was actually used by the Inquisition.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_In...uisition_and_the_expulsion_of_the_Jews

That's in the name of Christianity, so before you make ignorant comment about the present, you should gloss over a history book.

 

[5150Joker]

Pakistan is reaping what it sowed for years. It funded terrorists/fundamentalists to fit its own nationalist agenda against Afghanistan and India and now it's backfiring on them. Now that Musharaff has been pushed into a corner by the U.S. to put a lid on terrorist activity, they're turning around and trying to take him out and destablize his government. Musharaff is in a tough spot because if he kills these rioters then the terrorists/fundies that are directing these rampages behind the scene will gain a lot of political momentum with the public and military which could lead to Musharaff being assassinated or removed from power. Pakistan was built on a foundation of fundamentalism, the people in power there have tried to use it for their own gain and now the country is in turmoil. The only cure may be an external power coming in and seperating Islam and state and getting rid of their nukes. For those that are saying Islam itself is reponsible for terrorism, that's a fairly simplistic view of things - it's not so much the religion as it is the people that control these third world countries taking advantage of rampant illiteracy and conservatism to fit their own agendas.

 

[MCsommerreid]

It's not just ignorance or just Islam/religion. It's a combination of the two: A firey religion followed by ignorant people. Combine the two and you get an explosive mess which is reaching critical mass.

The same thing happened during the Salem Witch Trials, the Spanish Inqusition, and any other major religion fueled debacle you could name. People who are ignorant following a generally firey religion using it as a justification of their actions.

Without Islam these riots wouldn't be happening, but also without ignorance they wouldn't be happening either. You have your inteligent Muslims who aren't rioting who are just protesting, writing letters, etc, and you have your general ignorant people who are just sitting around going "doi!".

 

[1prophet]

Originally posted by: Todd33

Originally posted by: ntdz
No, I totally agree that Islam doesn't say it's right. It's all the religious leaders and fanaticals misinterpreting the religion that is creating the problem. Oh, and I've never heard, not once, of anyone killing in the name of Jesus.

Originally posted by: ntdz
It's not a coincidence that some of the most violent and unruly countries are Islamic...there is something about, of which I have no idea, that turns their people into raving lunatics that other religions do not.

You have no idea huh? Seems to me you know it's not the religion, but the people. It could be any religion and in the past it has been Christianity.

The use of torture was common at the time and there is a tendency for any medieval torture technique to be automatically attributed to the Spanish Inquisition. Many techniques commonly attributed in popular fiction were probably never used:
Bricking a defendant up to starve to death.
Smashing a defendant's joints with hammers.
Flailing a defendant on the wheel.
Raping female defendants.

Torquemada documented some of his techniques. A favorite was tortura del'agua (water torture), in which the victim was strapped to a rack, his mouth forced open with a rag, and water was then forced down the throat so that the victim felt he was drowning. In another technique, the garrucha, the victim's hands were tied behind his back at the wrists; the victim was then lifted off the ground by the wrists. The 'Spanish chair', a device used to hold the victim while the soles of their feet were roasted, was certainly in existence in Spain during the period of the Inquisition. It is uncertain, however, whether it was actually used by the Inquisition.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_In...uisition_and_the_expulsion_of_the_Jews

That's in the name of Christianity, so before you make ignorant comment about the present, you should gloss over a history book.

Secularization of those countries that produced those horrors by seperating religion from government and allowing people to openly question things that were once taboo is what allowed the west to escape the religious domination of that age.

Sadly some of the same people who have no qualms about denouncing christianity and their beliefs when it comes to women's rights over their bodies, same sex marriage, education in school (whether it involves sex or evolution), and many other issues that they take offense with are among the most vocal opponents of these cartoons,yet they either are oblivious or ignorant to the fact that none of the things I just mentioned are compatible in an Islamic state.

Are you willing to sacrifice your hard fought freedoms in order to appease someone elses religion?

 

[ntdz]

Originally posted by: Todd33

Originally posted by: ntdz
No, I totally agree that Islam doesn't say it's right. It's all the religious leaders and fanaticals misinterpreting the religion that is creating the problem. Oh, and I've never heard, not once, of anyone killing in the name of Jesus.

Originally posted by: ntdz
It's not a coincidence that some of the most violent and unruly countries are Islamic...there is something about, of which I have no idea, that turns their people into raving lunatics that other religions do not.

You have no idea huh? Seems to me you know it's not the religion, but the people. It could be any religion and in the past it has been Christianity.

It's both the people, and letting their religion take over their lives to the extent they don't even care about their own life. But still, it's ONLY Muslims committing terrorist attacks against us in the name of their religion. There isn't Christians, there isn't Buddhists, there isn't anyone. Cuba has more of a right to hate us than Saudi Arabians, and yet it's the Saudis that fly the planes into the WTC and the Pentagon and the Cubans flocking to the USA to live here. Go figure.

 

[magomago]

Originally posted by: magomago

Originally posted by: Astaroth33

Because there aren't enough of them yet relative to the general population. Like in Europe, we'd see an entirely different picture if there were enough of them to be a legitimate political and social force.

I think it is because those here have a better life. Why should we riot? We are just like other American taxpayers and people will listen to us if we write letters and "show the money".

Do we see the wealthy rioting at all? How about the Saudi Royal Family? Where are they in midst in this? I would think they are the ones leading the charge. Where are the ediotorialists in the paper who condemed this? Where are the huge Eygption riots by their middle class. The rich, or the well off, don't riot. PERIOD. Anyone that isn't dirt poor in the Middle East will not be caught near these riots. Protests maybe, denunciations maybe (even the rich would stay away from this), but they would never be caught near a riot.
Our religious groups here never resort to rioting because we don't need to. When was the last time we had massive Christian/Buddhist/Sikh/Hindu/Muslim or atheist riots? This isn't because America changes our religions, it is because we don't need too because it simply does not help us in any way.

No, its always poor people, because they don't have anything better. Then again the only way to weild any kind of influence or get someone's attention is to resort to this kind of behavior. They do it to try to get attention, and on top of it it doubles as a good way to get free stuff that otherwise you would have to pay for. For them its a win win situation, because they don't have much to lose.

I am not saying I agree with their rioting or I sympathsize, so please don't draw that conclusion. I'm just saying that I, unlike the dirt poor ones in the middle east and parts of Europe, do not have to.

Not pointed directly at you Astaroth -- its for those who think its because they are MUSLIM and their religion that they are attacking a Citibank. Just felt like pointing it out again because it seems it went right over people's heads