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Cars are a terrible use of money

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gorcorps said:
- Why would you calculate anything per hour of drive time? The mile is a standard unit of distance that fuel economy is based on... and doesn't rely on some arbitrary assumed average speed (how the hell do you get 30mph average anyway?). You should use $/mile, which you could then easily scale based on how far away you are from work and such. (Based on your 30mpg and $4/gal, you get $0.133/mile)
Click to expand...

I calculated the cost per hour in order to compare to Zipcar.

Ideally, one could use the following:
- public transit + bicycle to commute to work
- Zipcar / Uber on weekends for heavy shopping and getting out of town for the day
- car rentals for long trips

Granted, if you are a country bumpkin then this wouldn't work. But if you have halfway-decent bus/train service (less than 1.5 hours from home to work) then it makes so much more sense. While someone else drives the train/bus then you just mess around on your iPhone.

If you live in a big city and have a car then you are a filthy barbarian like Rob Ford.
 
tokie said:
I calculated the cost per hour in order to compare to Zipcar.

Ideally, one could use the following:
- public transit + bicycle to commute to work
- Zipcar / Uber on weekends for heavy shopping and getting out of town for the day
- car rentals for long trips

Granted, if you are a country bumpkin then this wouldn't work. But if you have halfway-decent bus/train service (less than 1.5 hours from home to work) then it makes so much more sense. While someone else drives the train/bus then you just mess around on your iPhone.

If you live in a big city and have a car then you are a filthy barbarian like Rob Ford.
Click to expand...

I live in a suburb of Boston, takes me 3 hours to get to work on public transit, guess I'm a filthy barbarian or something.
 
For most of my life I rarely had to drive. Walk, ride my bike for most stuff, mass transit to get to work for a few years here and there. I'd go weeks without driving anywhere, then forget where I'd parked and have to wander the neighborhood looking for my car.

Now my job has changed and I need to drive about 300 miles/week. I absolutely hate it.

Ride my bike to work and I feel awake and energized when I arrive. Drive to work and I feel angry and logy when I arrive.

Cars suck.
 
I live in a big city and it takes me 45 minutes via public transit, but I still have a car so I can drive around wherever I like on the weekends and not be constrained.
 
tokie said:
I calculated the cost per hour in order to compare to Zipcar.

Ideally, one could use the following:
- public transit + bicycle to commute to work
- Zipcar / Uber on weekends for heavy shopping and getting out of town for the day
- car rentals for long trips

Granted, if you are a country bumpkin then this wouldn't work. But if you have halfway-decent bus/train service (less than 1.5 hours from home to work) then it makes so much more sense. While someone else drives the train/bus then you just mess around on your iPhone.

If you live in a big city and have a car then you're not poor.
Click to expand...

Fixed for you. Two cars and live 3.x miles from downtown chicago.


You're also missing the sunk cost aspect - if I had to pay 10 bucks an hour every time i had to use a car, I wouldn't be far more hesitant to use it. Same goes with cabs/uber.
 
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tokie said:
I calculated the cost per hour in order to compare to Zipcar.

Ideally, one could use the following:
- public transit + bicycle to commute to work
- Zipcar / Uber on weekends for heavy shopping and getting out of town for the day
- car rentals for long trips

Granted, if you are a country bumpkin then this wouldn't work. But if you have halfway-decent bus/train service (less than 1.5 hours from home to work) then it makes so much more sense. While someone else drives the train/bus then you just mess around on your iPhone.

If you live in a big city and have a car then you are a filthy barbarian like Rob Ford.
Click to expand...

What's really wrong with your calculation is that all the variables can't be calculated.

Driving isn't just about what is most economical. Some people, such as myself, enjoy the experience of driving itself. There is added value to my life by having a car that is outside of the economic consideration. You could run all the numbers you wanted, but as long as it is affordable for me to drive, I will continue to do so because I like driving.
 
*Goes to zipcar.com*
*searches for zipcars nearby*
*barely anything available, and nothing close*

Fail.

So with public transport, my morning commute would be like this:

Get up more early, more irrate.
Walk my ass to the bus stop.
Wait.
Get on bus, wait for bus to arrive near work. 45 min to an hour.
Walk my ass to work.
Probably be there early. T_work start - T_arrive = T_Wasted.

VS.

Get up early, irrate.
Use car to drive to work. 20 min.
Done.
 
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I really hate threads like this, I really do. It makes the assumption that everyone is the same, lives the same, has the same "needs". Look, I will be damned if I'm going to take a bus other than as a non-stop route to work every workday. However, when that bus stops service at 8:15a, and I miss it, I'm driving. But, you will never catch me taking the bus on a Saturday (which, btw, doesn't exist in my area of the fourth largest city in this country). But, even if it did, am I supposed to lug my 4 x 8 sheet of plywood from Lowes on the bus? C'mon, people, think before you post this kind of kumbaya crap.

Only time I've taken a regular bus route was in Vegas. I kid you not, it took almost an hour to go 5 miles with all the stops this bus made.
 
of course transit is going to be cheaper. driving is about convenience and comfort.
 
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CPA said:
I really hate threads like this, I really do. It makes the assumption that everyone is the same, lives the same, has the same "needs". Look, I will be damned if I'm going to take a bus other than as a non-stop route to work every workday. However, when that bus stops service at 8:15a, and I miss it, I'm driving. But, you will never catch me taking the bus on a Saturday (which, btw, doesn't exist in my area of the fourth largest city in this country). But, even if it did, am I supposed to lug my 4 x 8 sheet of plywood from Lowes on the bus? C'mon, people, think before you post this kind of kumbaya crap.

Only time I've taken a regular bus route was in Vegas. I kid you not, it took almost an hour to go 5 miles with all the stops this bus made.
Click to expand...

Heh last time I had to take a bus when the battery died on my BMW (headed to autozone to pick up a charger). The 2.5mile cross town distance/ 15 mins car ride turned into hour and half ordeal.

There's a reason why you primarily see the mass transit/bicycle people around "transitional"/hipster areas, their time is worth very little money...
 
PieIsAwesome said:
*Goes to zipcar.com*
*searches for zipcars nearby*
*barely anything available, and nothing close*

Fail.

So with public transport, my morning commute would be like this:

Get up more early, more irrate.
Walk my ass to the bus stop.
Wait.
Get on bus, wait for bus to arrive near work. 45 min to an hour.
Walk my ass to work.
Probably be there early. T_work start - T_arrive = T_Wasted.

VS.

Get up early, irrate.
Use car to drive to work. 20 min.
Done.
Click to expand...

Pretty much this. Gets even more extreme if you factor in anything else you want to do. A car is expensive, but one of the most necessary things a responsible adult should own.
 
cabri said:
Quality of public transit is the biggest factor within that 20 mile radius.
If transit can be less than twice the vehicle time; many will consider it for reasonable cost differential.
Click to expand...

So true. My employer had a survey asking if bus transportation would be used. I typically drive 25-30 minutes. If drove to the closest bus stop, it would take 1 hour to get half-the way to work. If full bus service existed, my 30 minute car commute would probably take 2 hours. I'd only consider a sub-60 minute bus commute.
 
tokie said:
I calculated the cost per hour in order to compare to Zipcar.

Ideally, one could use the following:
- public transit + bicycle to commute to work
- Zipcar / Uber on weekends for heavy shopping and getting out of town for the day
- car rentals for long trips

Granted, if you are a country bumpkin then this wouldn't work. But if you have halfway-decent bus/train service (less than 1.5 hours from home to work) then it makes so much more sense. While someone else drives the train/bus then you just mess around on your iPhone.

If you live in a big city and have a car then you are a filthy barbarian like Rob Ford.
Click to expand...

The zipcar network isn't that great even for big cities like NYC. I live in Brooklyn and my closest zipcar is about 15 min away by public transit.

I don't drive to work (and actually I'd hate to have to drive to work), but even just for the weekends having a car is worth it for me. Is it cost efficient? Not a chance. But I can afford it and it significantly improves my quality of life so why not?
 
That's why I'm kinda happy my only vehicle is now a company car. Don't pay insurance, maintenance or for gas, even on personal time. I have to drive all over and could need to work at any time, so public transpo would do me no good. I would love a self driving car tho.

Can only speak for public transit in SoCal. Never used it myself, but seems like mostly poor people use it, and I often heard of it taking 2-3 hours to get to places it takes an hour or less in a car.
 
CPA said:
I really hate threads like this, I really do. It makes the assumption that everyone is the same, lives the same, has the same "needs". Look, I will be damned if I'm going to take a bus other than as a non-stop route to work every workday. However, when that bus stops service at 8:15a, and I miss it, I'm driving. But, you will never catch me taking the bus on a Saturday (which, btw, doesn't exist in my area of the fourth largest city in this country). But, even if it did, am I supposed to lug my 4 x 8 sheet of plywood from Lowes on the bus? C'mon, people, think before you post this kind of kumbaya crap.

Only time I've taken a regular bus route was in Vegas. I kid you not, it took almost an hour to go 5 miles with all the stops this bus made.
Click to expand...

Myopathy is the ATOT way. Most people can't see beyond their own nose and understand that their personal truths aren't universal.
 
Why own a house, OP? A pup tent in a public park is all you need. I mean, they have drinking fountains and bathrooms in the park, right? Food shops are usually within walking distance.
 
This is what we drive in the SF bay area:

BL7Vyz_CIAEenzd.jpg:large
 
How else am I supposed to pull my snowmobiles into the mountains to run down granola eating cross country skiers?
 
Absolutely brilliant, OP. 1 million people - they can all ditch their cars, and then all of them can use zip cars instead.

So, to use the zip car, since it's not parked outside your residence, all those people have to use public transportation to get to the zip car.

1.5 hours from home to work
Click to expand...
If your commute is 1.5 each way, and you make that commute every day, I hate to be the one to break this news to you, but your life sucks - well, at least 15 hours of it each week. If "I enjoy driving" - if driving ranks that high up on your list of pleasurable things, your life sucks. You need some hobbies or something.
 
If I live in an urban area with good public transportation, I don't need a car. I visited my cousin in Brooklyn, he doesn't own a car. It's a hassle to drive and find parking spaces.
 
I'm literally right across the river from Manhattan, and yet I still feel the need to own a car.

-no ZipCar points close to my house
-having to rely on mass transit to get to places like the grocery store or visiting friends/family would turn a 15 minute drive into an hour

mass transit is great for getting into Manhattan and beyond for work, but it would be silly to do my grocery shopping there where prices are twice as high and I'd be required to lug it all home on a hot, crowded subway car.

I only average about $30-$60/month in gas, though. I only have to fill-up every other week with typical driving (sometimes longer).
 
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