Carrying a concealed handgun

[gingerstewart55]

The only problem with carrying a gun is simply.......if you're not prepared to actually shoot a human being and kill him/her, then the gun is essentially useless. A person committing a felony on you would probably not be too intimidated by just seeing a weapon being waved about.......a LOT of people who have firearms end up being shot and killed by their own firearm. And that's because when crunch time came, the owner of the gun just couldn't shoot and kill......and the felon simply relieved the gun owner of his/her gun and used it on the "owner"....now the victim.

And to jsut say "I'd use it" on the internet is too simplistic......to come face to face with having to take someone else's life in real life is another issue completely. Talk is very cheap on the internet and lots of chest beating takes place here.....but when it comes down to it, very few people can actually look someone in the eye and kill him.

 

[Vic]

Pheer me d00d!

 

[Jack Ryan]

I must be extremely fortunate to go have gone through life and never have been in a situation where carrying a gun would have been necessary. What a sad state this society has become that people feel the need to walk around with guns doing daily chores.

Go to the gym, or learn self-defense. You can "conceal-carry" that with you the rest of your life. Not to mention you will live a longer, healthier life if you lose your fat gut than the remote possibility you are injured as a result of not carrying a gun.

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

Originally posted by: daveymark

I'd be interested in seeing crime rates/instances of road rage in CCW states compared to other states, as well as overall trends over time

I believe there has been no statistically significant change in crime rates in states that have implemented liberal CCW laws. Violent crime has generally been down since about the start of the Clinton administration, largely because there have been fewer people in the high-crime age demographics (~16-25).

 

[Triumph]

i see what you're trying to do with this thread, but i think your poll simply shows the distribution of ages of AT members more than anything else.

 

[tfinch2]

Originally posted by: Jack Ryan
What a sad state this society has become that people feel the need to walk around with guns doing daily chores.

People used to walk around and carry guns all the time and nobody thought anything of it. I've heard stories from my dad and uncle that kids would carry their rifle everywhere they went then go plink cans. You could buy guns at the the drug store.

 

[jlee]

Originally posted by: gingerstewart55
The only problem with carrying a gun is simply.......if you're not prepared to actually shoot a human being and kill him/her, then the gun is essentially useless. A person committing a felony on you would probably not be too intimidated by just seeing a weapon being waved about.......a LOT of people who have firearms end up being shot and killed by their own firearm. And that's because when crunch time came, the owner of the gun just couldn't shoot and kill......and the felon simply relieved the gun owner of his/her gun and used it on the "owner"....now the victim.

And to jsut say "I'd use it" on the internet is too simplistic......to come face to face with having to take someone else's life in real life is another issue completely. Talk is very cheap on the internet and lots of chest beating takes place here.....but when it comes down to it, very few people can actually look someone in the eye and kill him.

http://www.nraila.org/Issues/Articles/Read.aspx?ID=117

In states with widespread gun ownership and tough punishment for gun misuse, criminals surveyed were often unarmed: 54% in Oklahoma, 62% in Georgia, 40% in Maryland, 43% in Missouri, and 35% in Florida. In Massachusetts, however, only 29% of the felon-respondents were unarmed. In that state, it is difficult lawfully to acquire a firearm, and the illegal carrying of a firearm, rather than the criminal misuse of a gun, is subject to the mandatory penalty. The survey data indicate that the criminals' fear of an armed victim relates directly to the severity of the gun laws in the state surveyed. Where gun laws are less restrictive, such as Georgia and Maryland, criminals think twice before running the risk of facing an armed victim; they are much less concerned in Massachusetts.

Fifty-six percent of the felons surveyed agreed that "A criminal is not going to mess around with a victim he knows is armed with a gun;" 74% agreed that "One reason burglars avoid houses when people are at home is that they fear being shot."

A 57% majority agreed that "Most criminals are more worried about meeting an armed victim than they are about running into the police." In asking felons what they personally thought about while committing crimes, 34% indicated that they thought about getting "shot at by police" or "shot by victim."

The data suggest that criminals may be a little more concerned about being caught by police and imprisoned than about being shot, but meeting the armed citizen clearly elicited fears of being shot. That deterrent effect of citizen gun ownership appeared in their responses to questions about actual encounters. Although 37% of those surveyed admitted that they personally had "run into a victim who was armed with a gun," that figure surpassed the 50% mark for armed criminals, an experience shared by 57% of the active gun predators. And 34% of the sample admitted to having been "scared off, shot at, wounded, or captured by an armed victim."

Significantly, almost 40% said there was at least one time when the criminal "decided not to do a crime because [he] knew or believed that the victim was carrying a gun." Clearly, armed citizens represent a real threat to criminals, a threat with which large numbers are personally familiar, or familiar with through the shared experiences of their fellow outlaws.

 

[pontifex]

Originally posted by: Jack Ryan
I must be extremely fortunate to go have gone through life and never have been in a situation where carrying a gun would have been necessary. What a sad state this society has become that people feel the need to walk around with guns doing daily chores.

Go to the gym, or learn self-defense. You can "conceal-carry" that with you the rest of your life. Not to mention you will live a longer, healthier life if you lose your fat gut than the remote possibility you are injured as a result of not carrying a gun.

unless you're chuck norris, your hands and feet and going to do much against an armed opponent.

 

[jlee]

Originally posted by: Jack Ryan
I must be extremely fortunate to go have gone through life and never have been in a situation where carrying a gun would have been necessary. What a sad state this society has become that people feel the need to walk around with guns doing daily chores.

Go to the gym, or learn self-defense. You can "conceal-carry" that with you the rest of your life. Not to mention you will live a longer, healthier life if you lose your fat gut than the remote possibility you are injured as a result of not carrying a gun.

You are speaking as if firearm ownership and self-defense are mutually exclusive. You, sir, are mistaken.

 

[jandrews]

I can understand women wanting to carry a gun frankly, they are weaker and also have to worry about rape which is pretty scary I am sure. For most guys I dont really see the point, it is a huge pain in the butt to haul it around all the time not to mention most stores in my state do not allow you to conceal and carry so you have to leave your gun locked up in your car.

My roomate carries, he is going to school as a police officer but to tell the truth I still think its kinda pointless. He is always annoyed by how often he has to remove it and we live downtown but in a very safe area.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: Soybomb

Originally posted by: Flyback
While it is possible to live in a dangerous area, carrying a gun seems like an unwanted burden and I'd quickly try and figure out what's wrong with my own life that I wouldn't want to take better care of myself and move somewhere more hospitable. That would include upgrading my education and finding a better, higher-paying job.

You're working on the assumption that crime only happens in the bad part of town? Don't criminals want to take things from people with the money to actually have nice things? How about if I am trying to upgrade my education, say sitting at virginia tech, in a class room and someone starts shooting? I think tv and movies have kind of led us to believe that bad things only happen in the bad part of town or to bad people and thats kind of what I'm looking to see demonstrated in this poll. As people get older, do they see more of the bad things in the world and realize there is no safe zone where they won't be victims because they paid $1k a month in rent?

As I've gotten older I find myself less inclined to carry a gun. Carrying a gun is a big responsibility and it's not something that I want to burden myself with (it doesn't help that it's basically impossible to get a CCW permit in California either).

Personally, I'd rather have an unarmed population than everyone walking around packing 24/7. Oh, and I own guns BTW.

 

[pstylesss]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: Soybomb

Originally posted by: Flyback
While it is possible to live in a dangerous area, carrying a gun seems like an unwanted burden and I'd quickly try and figure out what's wrong with my own life that I wouldn't want to take better care of myself and move somewhere more hospitable. That would include upgrading my education and finding a better, higher-paying job.

You're working on the assumption that crime only happens in the bad part of town? Don't criminals want to take things from people with the money to actually have nice things? How about if I am trying to upgrade my education, say sitting at virginia tech, in a class room and someone starts shooting? I think tv and movies have kind of led us to believe that bad things only happen in the bad part of town or to bad people and thats kind of what I'm looking to see demonstrated in this poll. As people get older, do they see more of the bad things in the world and realize there is no safe zone where they won't be victims because they paid $1k a month in rent?

As I've gotten older I find myself less inclined to carry a gun. Carrying a gun is a big responsibility and it's not something that I want to burden myself with (it doesn't help that it's basically impossible to get a CCW permit in California either).

Personally, I'd rather have an unarmed population than everyone walking around packing 24/7. Oh, and I own guns BTW.

In a perfect world that would work, just as communism would, but that fact is, we do not live in a perfect world. I hope that is something that we can all agree on.

In our imperfect world, I would prefer everyone was packing. A criminal would think twice about committing a crime... of course, one bad shot would ensure mass chaos and death - but is that really a bad thing =P

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: Soybomb

Originally posted by: Flyback
While it is possible to live in a dangerous area, carrying a gun seems like an unwanted burden and I'd quickly try and figure out what's wrong with my own life that I wouldn't want to take better care of myself and move somewhere more hospitable. That would include upgrading my education and finding a better, higher-paying job.

You're working on the assumption that crime only happens in the bad part of town? Don't criminals want to take things from people with the money to actually have nice things? How about if I am trying to upgrade my education, say sitting at virginia tech, in a class room and someone starts shooting? I think tv and movies have kind of led us to believe that bad things only happen in the bad part of town or to bad people and thats kind of what I'm looking to see demonstrated in this poll. As people get older, do they see more of the bad things in the world and realize there is no safe zone where they won't be victims because they paid $1k a month in rent?

As I've gotten older I find myself less inclined to carry a gun. Carrying a gun is a big responsibility and it's not something that I want to burden myself with (it doesn't help that it's basically impossible to get a CCW permit in California either).

Personally, I'd rather have an unarmed population than everyone walking around packing 24/7. Oh, and I own guns BTW.

you are never going to have a unarmed population.

 

[adairusmc]

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: Soybomb

Originally posted by: Flyback
While it is possible to live in a dangerous area, carrying a gun seems like an unwanted burden and I'd quickly try and figure out what's wrong with my own life that I wouldn't want to take better care of myself and move somewhere more hospitable. That would include upgrading my education and finding a better, higher-paying job.

You're working on the assumption that crime only happens in the bad part of town? Don't criminals want to take things from people with the money to actually have nice things? How about if I am trying to upgrade my education, say sitting at virginia tech, in a class room and someone starts shooting? I think tv and movies have kind of led us to believe that bad things only happen in the bad part of town or to bad people and thats kind of what I'm looking to see demonstrated in this poll. As people get older, do they see more of the bad things in the world and realize there is no safe zone where they won't be victims because they paid $1k a month in rent?

As I've gotten older I find myself less inclined to carry a gun. Carrying a gun is a big responsibility and it's not something that I want to burden myself with (it doesn't help that it's basically impossible to get a CCW permit in California either).

Personally, I'd rather have an unarmed population than everyone walking around packing 24/7. Oh, and I own guns BTW.

you are never going to have a unarmed population.

There will be civil war long before that happens.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: ZeroIQ

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: Soybomb

Originally posted by: Flyback
While it is possible to live in a dangerous area, carrying a gun seems like an unwanted burden and I'd quickly try and figure out what's wrong with my own life that I wouldn't want to take better care of myself and move somewhere more hospitable. That would include upgrading my education and finding a better, higher-paying job.

You're working on the assumption that crime only happens in the bad part of town? Don't criminals want to take things from people with the money to actually have nice things? How about if I am trying to upgrade my education, say sitting at virginia tech, in a class room and someone starts shooting? I think tv and movies have kind of led us to believe that bad things only happen in the bad part of town or to bad people and thats kind of what I'm looking to see demonstrated in this poll. As people get older, do they see more of the bad things in the world and realize there is no safe zone where they won't be victims because they paid $1k a month in rent?

As I've gotten older I find myself less inclined to carry a gun. Carrying a gun is a big responsibility and it's not something that I want to burden myself with (it doesn't help that it's basically impossible to get a CCW permit in California either).

Personally, I'd rather have an unarmed population than everyone walking around packing 24/7. Oh, and I own guns BTW.

In a perfect world that would work, just as communism would, but that fact is, we do not live in a perfect world. I hope that is something that we can all agree on.

In our imperfect world, I would prefer everyone was packing. A criminal would think twice about committing a crime... of course, one bad shot would ensure mass chaos and death - but is that really a bad thing =P

I'm just not sure I trust most people around guns and I'm sure there would be instances where someone draws a weapon in a situation where it wasn't called for or was questionable. Kind of like that guy who shot and killed some kid because he threw an egg at his SUV.

 

[oddyager]

Originally posted by: ZeroIQ

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: Soybomb

Originally posted by: Flyback
While it is possible to live in a dangerous area, carrying a gun seems like an unwanted burden and I'd quickly try and figure out what's wrong with my own life that I wouldn't want to take better care of myself and move somewhere more hospitable. That would include upgrading my education and finding a better, higher-paying job.

You're working on the assumption that crime only happens in the bad part of town? Don't criminals want to take things from people with the money to actually have nice things? How about if I am trying to upgrade my education, say sitting at virginia tech, in a class room and someone starts shooting? I think tv and movies have kind of led us to believe that bad things only happen in the bad part of town or to bad people and thats kind of what I'm looking to see demonstrated in this poll. As people get older, do they see more of the bad things in the world and realize there is no safe zone where they won't be victims because they paid $1k a month in rent?

As I've gotten older I find myself less inclined to carry a gun. Carrying a gun is a big responsibility and it's not something that I want to burden myself with (it doesn't help that it's basically impossible to get a CCW permit in California either).

Personally, I'd rather have an unarmed population than everyone walking around packing 24/7. Oh, and I own guns BTW.

In a perfect world that would work, just as communism would, but that fact is, we do not live in a perfect world. I hope that is something that we can all agree on.

In our imperfect world, I would prefer everyone was packing. A criminal would think twice about committing a crime... of course, one bad shot would ensure mass chaos and death - but is that really a bad thing =P

True, but would that really outweigh recklessness of the general pop with handguns?

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: Don Vito Corleone

Originally posted by: daveymark

I'd be interested in seeing crime rates/instances of road rage in CCW states compared to other states, as well as overall trends over time

I believe there has been no statistically significant change in crime rates in states that have implemented liberal CCW laws. Violent crime has generally been down since about the start of the Clinton administration, largely because there have been fewer people in the high-crime age demographics (~16-25).

Yep. Despite repeated studies, no correlation has ever been made been gun laws and the overall crime rate. There is, however, very strong correlation between the lack of economic opportunity and crime.

 

[pstylesss]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: Don Vito Corleone

Originally posted by: daveymark

I'd be interested in seeing crime rates/instances of road rage in CCW states compared to other states, as well as overall trends over time

I believe there has been no statistically significant change in crime rates in states that have implemented liberal CCW laws. Violent crime has generally been down since about the start of the Clinton administration, largely because there have been fewer people in the high-crime age demographics (~16-25).

Yep. Despite repeated studies, no correlation has ever been made been gun laws and the overall crime rate. There is, however, very strong correlation between the lack of economic opportunity and crime.

There is a correlation between gun laws and crime. I did a huge project on it in High School. I'll dig it up and post it.

 

[ShawnD1]

Originally posted by: ZeroIQ
There is a correlation between gun laws and crime. I did a huge project on it in High School. I'll dig it up and post it.

Did you also put an overlay of economic indicators to see if that had a correlation as well? It doesn't seem like a simple relation, even if there is one. It seems unlikely that anybody would say "having fewer guns causes (more/less) crime" and have any sort of accuracy in that statement.

I'm 22, I voted that I understand why. I can't carry because it's illegal in Canada.

 

[FoBoT]

i conceal a golden monkey


in my pants

 

[Soybomb]

Personally, I'd rather have an unarmed population than everyone walking around packing 24/7. Oh, and I own guns BTW.

When you figure out how to make criminals be unarmed, we'll talk, but honestly even then it would be a hard sell for me as i want the weak, disabled, women, etc to have a fair chance at self defense too.

True, but would that really outweigh recklessness of the general pop with handguns?

The general population is quite safe with handguns, at least those with concealed carry permits. Several state licensing agencies including though in Florida, Texas, and Oregon publish data about permit holders and revocations. I'd encourage you to look it up, its interesting and shows you just how well behaved and responsible permit holders are.

There is a correlation between gun laws and crime. I did a huge project on it in High School. I'll dig it up and post it.

John Lott says there is, but John Lott's reputation begins as tarnished anyway. Regardless of if there is correlation or not, it isn't evidence of causation. As the others have said, socio-economic factors are responsible for crime rates, not if someone has a concealed handgun or not. And thats perfectly fine. Concealed handguns don't need to benefit all of society, the basic right to effective self defense combined with no evidence of concealed carry holders being a danger to the public is all someone needs to support it.

 

[Triumph]

Ted Kennedy has killed more people than my gun.

 

[adairusmc]

Originally posted by: Triumph
Ted Kennedy has killed more people than my gun.

Blaming guns for crime is like blaming spoons for Rosie O'Donnell's being fat.

 

[Scarpozzi]

I can understand why people carry a gun. However, I'm going to say that it's those who DON'T have permits that I worry about.

It isn't hard to obtain a gun and carry it illegally. I'm considering taking the test and getting certified to carry, but probably won't for another year or so.

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: Triumph
Ted Kennedy has killed more people than my gun.

hahah i seen that as a bumper sticker heh